Phoenix finally risen from seabed

[happy chappie]

1 hour ago, NamKangMan said:

 

No effect on me whatsoever, at this stage.  Just making a comment on an internet forum, as you are.  Does my comment personally effect you? 

 

Come the next election, we may see BJ make a move into politics. 

Oh no no no please,I cant take it anymore.dont this guy ever take a holiday.

[happy chappie]

1 hour ago, NamKangMan said:

 

No effect on me whatsoever, at this stage.  Just making a comment on an internet forum, as you are.  Does my comment personally effect you? 

 

Come the next election, we may see BJ make a move into politics. 

Oh no no no please,I cant take it anymore.dont this guy ever take a holiday.sorry double post....maybe I can get ol bj up here to sort out my internet service.

Edited November 18, 2018 by happy chappie

[Emster23]

I thought dropping visa charges was supposed to bring them back. You know, the "fee nix" plan

Perhaps when they rechristen the boat change name to "Dodo" or maybe "Doodoo". Up to you....

[lensta]

2 hours ago, NamKangMan said:

 

No effect on me whatsoever, at this stage.  Just making a comment on an internet forum, as you are.  Does my comment personally effect you? 

 

Come the next election, we may see BJ make a move into politics. 

Yes yes yes, he could start a BJ party. "Free BJ's for everyone" that would be a real vote getter and Thailand could the become the hub of BJ's. Oh wait, it.......

[katatonic]

2 hours ago, Old Croc said:

It may give the grieving relatives some comfort to know that the safety aspects (shortcomings) of the vessel will be examined and transgressors prosecuted.

It should also help to reassure future visitors that safety procedures will not be ignored in the same way again.

 

Under normal circumstances there's no way a relatively modern vessel of this design should have sunk in a squall. It's not an old wooden ferry in Malawi with hundreds of people hanging off it

So you really reckon that a passenger vessel in Thailand has had a stability survey, with compliance to International Maritime Organisation (IMO) internationally adopted regulations, and a commercial (i.e. passenger) Class certification from RINA, Lloyds or Das Norske Veritas? It should, by international maritime law, have had a stability booklet on board stating how many passengers could be on each deck and stability curves showing the effect of them all moving to one side at the same time, for instance...  And watertight compartments? High capacity bilge pumps? Would it pass a SOLAS survey - safety of life at sea: regulations developed after the Titanic sank..?

[Old Croc]

29 minutes ago, katatonic said:

So you really reckon that a passenger vessel in Thailand has had a stability survey, with compliance to International Maritime Organisation (IMO) internationally adopted regulations, and a commercial (i.e. passenger) Class certification from RINA, Lloyds or Das Norske Veritas? It should, by international maritime law, have had a stability booklet on board stating how many passengers could be on each deck and stability curves showing the effect of them all moving to one side at the same time, for instance...  And watertight compartments? High capacity bilge pumps? Would it pass a SOLAS survey - safety of life at sea: regulations developed after the Titanic sank..?

I can't recall saying any of that.

I think one of us is having an extreme pensioner moment.

[Redline]

Confidence?  They may be unruly, but they are not idiots.  There is a whole world out there to explore, and they know China isn’t the center of the universe. 

[beechbum]

6 hours ago, ThreeEyedRaven said:

 

Maybe you should actually read the story then. The Phuket news story in the original story says "

At each stage the emphasis was on maximum safety to the recovery team. No other personnel were allowed to enter into an area of 1km around the site. For transparency, each stage of the operation was captured on video by the Singaporean team."
Read more at https://www.thephuketnews.com/phoenix-finally-risen-from-seabed-69377.php#tjP5KRWJhr6AfOrI.99

Singapore equipment, Singapore crew, so I think you will find that there probably were some Singaporeans on board.

 

Maybe you should spend more time around Jurong and Loyang, Then you might actually know <deleted> your talking about.

[Media1]

There's nothing to restore. Somchai will still be behind the wheel and the jet ski thugs will be trackside lol. Dream on Joke. Stick to overstay and online romance

[Maitdjai]

Keep Idiots away from a task (better let them just (!) talk), everything works fine and quick!

[Ulic]

The right crew for the job. They could have saved a lot of time money and embarrassment if they had just contracted these guys in the first place. Job well done as far as raising the Phoenix is concerned. Now the investigation as to what happened can continue to completion. 

[Tug]

Glad they got it done btw the going rate for that barge and crew is probably around 10 million thb pr day port to port that’s why they weren’t called in the first place the other team were trying to do it on a shoe string for profit a standered 55 gal drum will lift approx 500 pounds and if you leave the bungs facing down  they are a ready made pressure relief fill valve they gave it a good try and lost a man try to think of wrestling and securing all those drums and filling them I’m going to give them an a for effort given the resources they had

[crankshaft]

That boat looks too small for 100 people...I never would have got on board that small of a boat with 100 people...a disaster in waiting if the seas turn rough...which is what happened...

[wotsdermatter]

13 hours ago, stevenl said:

"As has been clearly proven, hiring clowns on such a sensitive issue, to try to save a few lousy bucks, and trying to save some face as in "Yeah! We can do this" , when you clearly can't, ends up with you looking like laughable clowns yourself. "

If taken to court, their defence would be that they were only following the advice offered by Judy Collins and her hit song, "Send in the clowns" but without thinking through to the possible scorn they would deserve if they failed, especially when the "advanced technology" they publicly displayed failed to produce any results other than one dead person.

 

'nuf sed

Edited November 18, 2018 by wotsdermatter

[stevenl]

10 hours ago, xylophone said:

You appear to be very knowledgeable in this area stevenl, and I certainly am not (nor are many others by the look of their posts), so would you please give a more in-depth reason(s) why this boat sunk, as I thought that the post by neeray was pretty close to the mark.

Still not known why it sunk, apart from tv experts.

But the boat was not overloaded, there were no weather warnings and afaik there were no basic marine safety regulations violated that caused the sinking.

[1duckyboy]

The Chinese are waiting for a quick resolution to the tragedy with the wrongdoers punished. The Thais will blame wind and high seas just as they blame wet roads when a bus goes sliding off a road in the rain. 

Edited November 18, 2018 by 1duckyboy

[bluesofa]

2 minutes ago, 1duckyboy said:

The Chinese are waiting for a quick resolution to the tragedy with the wrongdoers punished. The Thais will blame wind and high seas just as they blame wet roads when a bus goes sliding off a road in the rain. 

Blaming the whether again - whether the driver/captain was competent and paying attention.

[stevenl]

15 minutes ago, 1duckyboy said:

The Chinese are waiting for a quick resolution to the tragedy with the wrongdoers punished. The Thais will blame wind and high seas just as they blame wet roads when a bus goes sliding off a road in the rain. 

The main wrongdoer has been in China ever since. If they want to punish they can any time.

[NamKangMan]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

The main wrongdoer has been in China ever since. If they want to punish they can any time.

 

"Still not known why it sunk, apart from tv experts."  -  "The main wrongdoer has been in China ever since." - huh????  

 

If it's still not known why it sunk, how do we have a "wrongdoer?"

 

"But the boat was not overloaded, there were no weather warnings and afaik there were no basic marine safety regulations violated that caused the sinking." - so, once again, how do we have a "wrongdoer." 

 

[mickmac]

How is this act going to restore confidence...................by telling the tourists" come to Thailand, at least we will send your body back"   I very much doubt it. 

[neeray]

23 minutes ago, mickmac said:

How is this act going to restore confidence...................by telling the tourists" come to Thailand, at least we will send your body back"   I very much doubt it. 

Anybody who thinks the raising of this death trap will restore one iota of confidence to foreign or domestic tourism is highly delusional.

[bluesofa]

3 hours ago, NamKangMan said:

4 hours ago, stevenl said:

The main wrongdoer has been in China ever since. If they want to punish they can any time.

 

"Still not known why it sunk, apart from tv experts."  -  "The main wrongdoer has been in China ever since." - huh????  

 

If it's still not known why it sunk, how do we have a "wrongdoer?"

 

"But the boat was not overloaded, there were no weather warnings and afaik there were no basic marine safety regulations violated that caused the sinking." - so, once again, how do we have a "wrongdoer."  

As an alleged "tv expert", am I the only person who seems to remember reports about an alleged argument between the captain and the Chinese owner about putting to sea due to a weather warning?

I can only guess that "the main wrongdoer has been in China ever since" referred to above is the owner?

 

"According to Daily News Online report, the young Chinese survivor who was not identified said there were five of them in the same group on board the Phoenix dive boat and two of them died and another injured while he and another friend survived.

He said when the boat left Phuket, it was raining and there was no warning of venturing out into the open sea.  He added that, while on board the vessel, no crews gave a demonstration of how to properly wear a life vest and they were not told where were the fire exits"

source: https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1046985-survivors-claim-they-were-not-warned-to-wear-life-jackets/

 

 

"The Phoenix was among several boats that appeared to have ignored a warning in place since Wednesday not to take tourists on daytrips to the islands off Phuket because of "strong winds and storms", officials said.

An investigation has been ordered into why a number of boats went out despite the severe weather warnings."

source: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-44728478

 

[stevenl]

2 hours ago, bluesofa said:

As an alleged "tv expert", am I the only person who seems to remember reports about an alleged argument between the captain and the Chinese owner about putting to sea due to a weather warning?

I can only guess that "the main wrongdoer has been in China ever since" referred to above is the owner?

 

"According to Daily News Online report, the young Chinese survivor who was not identified said there were five of them in the same group on board the Phoenix dive boat and two of them died and another injured while he and another friend survived.

He said when the boat left Phuket, it was raining and there was no warning of venturing out into the open sea.  He added that, while on board the vessel, no crews gave a demonstration of how to properly wear a life vest and they were not told where were the fire exits"

source: https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1046985-survivors-claim-they-were-not-warned-to-wear-life-jackets/

 

 

"The Phoenix was among several boats that appeared to have ignored a warning in place since Wednesday not to take tourists on daytrips to the islands off Phuket because of "strong winds and storms", officials said.

An investigation has been ordered into why a number of boats went out despite the severe weather warnings."

source: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-44728478

 

"

"The Phoenix was among several boats that appeared to have ignored a warning in place since Wednesday not to take tourists on daytrips to the islands off Phuket because of "strong winds and storms", officials said.

An investigation has been ordered into why a number of boats went out despite the severe weather warnings.""

Yes, that was the official story after the fact. However there was no weather warning, only the following day did they issue one.

[metisdead]

Some troll posts and replies have been removed. 

[lvr181]

Whatever the cause of the sinking of the boat and the confirmation of that, it is highly unlikely to restore confidence for tourists.

 

What may help would be world standard regulations regarding marine safety and licensing (waterborne craft, their skippers and owners) and crew training PLUS the STRICT ENFORCEMENT of these!

 

Not rocket science TAT! Learn from the airline industry.

[neeray]

11 minutes ago, lvr181 said:

Whatever the cause of the sinking of the boat and the confirmation of that, it is highly unlikely to restore confidence for tourists.

 

What may help would be world standard regulations regarding marine safety and licensing (waterborne craft, their skippers and owners) and crew training PLUS the STRICT ENFORCEMENT of these!

 

Not rocket science TAT! Learn from the airline industry.

Or even closer to home, learn from Big Brother, the "real" cruise ship industry.

The many cruises that I have been on undertook very regular safety exercises. We always knew where the life vests were available, what to do in case of an emergency .......

No need to reinvent the wheel, just observe, or enlist some skilled help to develop safety measures.

[katatonic]

20 hours ago, Old Croc said:

I can't recall saying any of that.

I think one of us is having an extreme pensioner moment.

You said this: Under normal circumstances there's no way a relatively modern vessel of this design should have sunk in a squall. 

I was pointing out that it's actually fairly likely.

[NamKangMan]

3 hours ago, stevenl said:

"

"The Phoenix was among several boats that appeared to have ignored a warning in place since Wednesday not to take tourists on daytrips to the islands off Phuket because of "strong winds and storms", officials said.

An investigation has been ordered into why a number of boats went out despite the severe weather warnings.""

Yes, that was the official story after the fact. However there was no weather warning, only the following day did they issue one.

 

"However there was no weather warning," - if this was the case, there would appear to be no need for an alleged argument between the Chinese owner, and I assume, a Thai captain.  

 

Even if an argument took place for other reasons, perhaps overloading, it is still the captain's responsibility NOT TO set to sea, yet you say the the "wrongdoer" is the Chinese guy. 

 

In any case, wasn't the official owner of the company a Thai women? 

 

Seems like they do not blame the Thai captain.  Do not blame the Thai company owner.  So the blame must lay with the Chinese investor.  

 

Confidence in safety here is one thing, but if they chase a Chinese scapegoat, confidence in Chinese investment may disappear, followed shortly after by the Chinese tourists. 

[Old Croc]

1 minute ago, katatonic said:

You said this: Under normal circumstances there's no way a relatively modern vessel of this design should have sunk in a squall. 

I was pointing out that it's actually fairly likely.

Perhaps if you had used those words instead of the diatribe you attributed to me you would make more sense.

I still consider that it's not at all likely that a new vessel of 38 metres (8 metres wide) would sink in a squall.  I've driven that 18.3 ft boat in my avatar from 10 miles out at sea in similar storm conditions. (not recommended and never repeated!)

I consider it much more likely it sank as a result of operator error and design (or construction) faults. I look forward to the official examination of the wreck to see if earlier reports are correct.

Reports such as only 1 of 5 pumps were installed, a truck engine was used for propulsion instead of the correct marine engine, that the engine room doors was either smashed or left open to allow ingress of water, if the passengers were told to remove their lifejackets after snorkeling because water may drip on the new teak floors.  If there was no safety/ lifejacket drill as reported by passengers. Did the underpowered vessel turn to run with the waves allowing the heavy seas to enter the engine room.

 

[bluesofa]

5 hours ago, stevenl said:

"

"The Phoenix was among several boats that appeared to have ignored a warning in place since Wednesday not to take tourists on daytrips to the islands off Phuket because of "strong winds and storms", officials said.

An investigation has been ordered into why a number of boats went out despite the severe weather warnings.""

Yes, that was the official story after the fact. However there was no weather warning, only the following day did they issue one.

Where does the information come from that there was no weather warning, but it was issued the following day?

If I understand you correctly, are you saying they effectively backdated a weather warning by one day?