Move to make health insurance mandatory for long-stay visas

[tpthai2]

In the "Nation" today. (Sunday-Dec. 23.)

"Move to make health insurance mandatory for long-stay visas"

Anyone with more information in this regard?

[Pilotman]

Only that it's inevitably the next step for (against?) expats. although I have heard nothing definite, just rumours.  Knowing the way things get structured here, if it does come to pass, it may also come with an option to increase the 800K required for an extension of stay, to some other figure, say 1.5 million, to cover any unexpected health costs. Just a guess.  

Edited December 23, 2018 by Pilotman

[OneMoreFarang]

4 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

Only that it's inevitably the next step for (against?) expats. although I have heard nothing definite, just rumours.  Knowing the way things get structured here, if it does come to pass, it may also come with an option to increase the 800K required for an extension of stay, to some other figure, say 1.5 million, to cover any unexpected health costs. Just a guess.  

I think it's only sensible that Thailand does not want to pay the medical bills of foreigners who can't pay them.

Why should that be Thailand's responsibility?

[ubonjoe]

I found the story and this is the first paragraph.

"Foreigners with one-year Non-Immigrant Visa “O-A” (Long Stay) will have to compulsorily arrange health insurance, according to new proposals of a key committee."

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30360990

So it is not for those applying for extension based upon retirement or others.

It is already required for the 10 year Non-OX visa.

" 7. Copy of evidence stating that applicants have insurance as per stipulated by the  Office of Insurance Commission and health insurance of Thailand which has insurance money for outpatient not less than 40,000 Baht and for inpatient not less than 400,000 Baht.
Please check < http://longstay.tgia.org > for more information regarding the insurance requirement."
 

 

Edited December 23, 2018 by ubonjoe
OX visa requirement inserted

[pontious]

The report says 400,000 in patient and 40,000 out patient. The out patient seems crazy as most people pay there own way for this as the costs are prohibitive.

[MRToMRT]

The big question is will it be from a Thai insurance company only? Many of us international health insurance already but the OX for example does not recognize insurance except from 3 Thai companies.

[Mitkof Island]

And what happens if you are too old to apply ?

[ubonjoe]

4 minutes ago, MRToMRT said:

The big question is will it be from a Thai insurance company only? Many of us international health insurance already but the OX for example does not recognize insurance except from 3 Thai companies.

Yes

"Those already having overseas insurance policies that meet the minimum requirement would be exempted from subscribing to Thai insurance policies. They will be able to apply for long-stay visas using their foreign insurance policies, he said."

[glegolo]

5 minutes ago, Mitkof Island said:

And what happens if you are too old to apply ?

I dont think Thailand gives you a free pass anyway. I think you are gone and have to leave..

 

glegolo

[wazzadg44]

Having lived in Thailand for nearly 10 years and having had recent treatment for mouth cancer,paid for at my expense because I am now 74 and have been refused insurance since age 70. Thank goodness I still maintain my Australian health insurance even though I can afford to pay for treatment here. I hope you are right Joe. (Sorry you always are )

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, Mitkof Island said:

And what happens if you are too old to apply ?

You cannot be to old if under 100 years old according to this insurance company participating in the insurance for the OX visa.

https://www.viriyah.co.th/en/longstay-form.php#.XB9lTFwzaUk

 

[Sheryl]

29 minutes ago, pontious said:

The report says 400,000 in patient and 40,000 out patient. The out patient seems crazy as most people pay there own way for this as the costs are prohibitive.

It is utterly crazy. Outpatient insurance is unnececessary  and 400K is way, way too low for inpatient.

 

In order to get that 40K of OPD cover most people would have to pay 50% higher premium. Completely ridiculous, one wonders where they got this from.  and one suspects specific Thai companies and that this describes specific Thai policies.

 

Only a matter of time until someone with this insurance has to go on "gofundme" because it doesn't begin to cover their hospital bill...and Thai hospitals will still have problems being out of pocket because of the low level of cover.

 

My policy covers 1 million USD (32 million baht) per year inpatient -- but nothing for outpatient so would not be considered adequate! (A non issue for me since I do extensions of stay, but the point is valid).

[swineninety9]

Could this have something to do with the girl who broke her neck diving into a pool, and had to crowdfund 60k pound to medevac her to the UK?

[Mavideol]

32 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I found the story and this is the first paragraph.

"Foreigners with one-year Non-Immigrant Visa “O-A” (Long Stay) will have to compulsorily arrange health insurance, according to new proposals of a key committee."

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30360990

So it is not for those applying for extension based upon retirement or others. 

It is already required for the 10 year Non-OX visa.

" 7. Copy of evidence stating that applicants have insurance as per stipulated by the  Office of Insurance Commission and health insurance of Thailand which has insurance money for outpatient not less than 40,000 Baht and for inpatient not less than 400,000 Baht.
Please check < http://longstay.tgia.org > for more information regarding the insurance requirement."
 

 

""So it is not for those applying for extension based upon retirement or others."" is it correct not for extensions?

[Sheryl]

6 minutes ago, swineninety9 said:

Could this have something to do with the girl who broke her neck diving into a pool, and had to crowdfund 60k pound to medevac her to the UK?

No, it has been under discussion for years.

 

It does have something to do with the many, many cases of foreigners unable to pay their hospital bills over the years but the insurance being mandated won't help most in that sort of situation, with  bills of way over 1 million baht.

 

The concept is sound but the design of it is seriously flawed and won't serve the purpose.

 

There is also the issue of those expats with pre-existing conditions which is not at all uncommon in retirees....they can't get private insurance.

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

""So it is not for those applying for extension based upon retirement or others."" is it correct not for extensions?

Not according the news article. It only mentions the OA long stay visa issued by embassies and official consulates.

[OneMoreFarang]

44 minutes ago, Mitkof Island said:

And what happens if you are too old to apply ?

Then you better have a lot of money at your disposal.

[GalaxyMan]

If they actually do something, and they should, there will most likely be a monetary on-deposit amount to account for the self-insured, over and above the 800K.

 

I'm actually surprised that Thailand and other countries don't require proof of some sort of health insurance to get any kind of a visa.

Edited December 23, 2018 by GalaxyMan

[OneMoreFarang]

19 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

There is also the issue of those expats with pre-existing conditions which is not at all uncommon in retirees....they can't get private insurance.

Maybe they can get private insurance. But that insurance will likely not cover the preexisting conditions.

So even if Thailand insist that people have to have a health insurance there will be cases for which the insurance will not pay - preexisting conditions.

[Thaidream]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Then you better have a lot of money at your disposal.

I wouldn't get too excited about this as the news link states several ministries need to work out the details and then it would be forwarded to the cabinet. I also believe it may need the approval of the National Assembly. Since there is an election in February- I doubt the same people will even be in power.

 

If by chance something like this became law- I doubt many people would ever  opt for the O-A Visa as the requirement of 40K outpatient is ridiculous.  I have never heard of even one person who has the O-X Visa which also has an insurance requirement.

 

The better way to handle this would require a buy in to the Thai Social Security scheme which provides healthcare via the Government Hospitals all for a decent cost .

[Mickmick]

1 minute ago, Thaidream said:

I wouldn't get too excited about this as the news link states several ministries need to work out the details and then it would be forwarded to the cabinet. I also believe it may need the approval of the National Assembly. Since there is an election in February- I doubt the same people will even be in power.

 

If by chance something like this became law- I doubt many people would ever  opt for the O-A Visa as the requirement of 40K outpatient is ridiculous.  I have never heard of even one person who has the O-X Visa which also has an insurance requirement.

 

The better way to handle this would require a buy in to the Thai Social Security scheme which provides healthcare via the Government Hospitals all for a decent cost .

Yes, I've always thought that making people on a retirement visa/extension contribute to the Social Security fund would be a sensible option. As I understand it, the normal contribution is on a sliding scale capped at 750 baht/month ? As people on the retirement extension are supposed to have an income from home equivalent to 65000B/m just add whatever the payment is at that level to your visa extension fee. And if a government hospital is not good enough for you and you want to go to Bumrungrad then take out private insurance.

[bkk6060]

20 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

I wouldn't get too excited about this as the news link states several ministries need to work out the details and then it would be forwarded to the cabinet. I also believe it may need the approval of the National Assembly. Since there is an election in February- I doubt the same people will even be in power.

 

If by chance something like this became law- I doubt many people would ever  opt for the O-A Visa as the requirement of 40K outpatient is ridiculous.  

 

The better way to handle this would require a buy in to the Thai Social Security scheme which provides healthcare via the Government Hospitals all for a decent cost .

 

I am in my 60's and have full insurance coverage here as I value my health and life.

Gee, it costs about $120 bucks a month I know way too much for many.

 

But, There it is..

Another person who wants the Thai government to provide some "decent cost" benefit because they live here.

The problem is all the fat, unhealthy, disgusting smokers and drinker ex-pats.

I would say the majority actually.  Was in Chiang Mai recently and could not believe all who fit this profile.

10 am starts.

The Thai government does not want to provide foreigners who abuse themselves with any type of benefit it will just cost too much money in the long run.  I do not blame them..

 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2018 by bkk6060

[Tweedle dee]

I have seen all sorts of knee jerk panic dramas here over 15 years.. a few bucks in the old brown envelope will always pay the way..trust me,i have a bridge for sale.

[Firefan]

This one gonna get really tricky; as they will not only go for OA visas, but more likely all long stay visas and extensions - except probably extensions based on work(work permit) as they will already be covered by at least Thai social security in most (but not all) cases. It makes no sense to JUST go for the OA visa and not other retirement "visas"/extensions - the risk is exactly the same. Same applies to student visa, investment visa, elite visa, taking care of dependent, marriage visa and so on. (Correct term in most cases is not visa but; extension).

 

With pre-existing conditions and old age the cost of the insurances will go through the roof (with many exclusions obviously - so the unfunded claims can happen anyway). The above linked insurance cost about 250k Baht/year for the 400k/40k cover when in your 90ties!

 

As Cheryl said; 400k is just not enough - I would say MINIMUM 3M Baht (no outpatient needed) if on a budget. Using round numbers the above outpatient probably doubles the premium - so lets say that person in his 90ties had no outpatient cutting his annual premium for a year to 125k/year for 400k - multiply that with 7.5 to get cover around the 3M mark and the poor bastard will have to pay close to 1M baht/year! (a bit more if out patient of 40k is maintained).

 

This will be interesting to follow. The alternative is as somebody mentioned to let long stay visa holders buy into the Thai social security health care. A lesser alternative could be to at LEAST demand accident insurance (from AXA, AIA Etc.) for a fairly high level, as most acute cases seem to fall under that category. Accident insurance is much cheaper and does also not sky rocket with old age. Not the perfect solution, but would be easier to manage.

 

Cheers!

[Olmate]

4 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

I am in my 60's and have full insurance coverage here as I value my health and life.

Gee, it costs about $120 bucks a month I know way too much for many.

 

But, There it is..

Another person who wants the Thai government to provide some "decent cost" benefit because they live here.

The problem is all the fat, unhealthy, disgusting smokers and drinker ex-pats.

I would say the majority actually.  Was in Chiang Mai recently and could not believe all who fit this profile.

10 am starts.

The Thai government does not want to provide foreigners who abuse themselves with any type of benefit it will just cost too much money in the long run.  I do not blame them..

 

 

 

Guessing your a slim,healthy non smoking non drinker,then why you need insurance, now that’s a problem! 

[KhunFred]

Being a cancer survivor who has also had a life threatening brain cyst, at age 68, the cost of medical insurance would negate any cost advantage of living in Thailand. I will be 69 in April, I can't imagine trying to get a reasonable premium with my history and at my age. Add to this the current stress of not knowing whether I can get an extension of stay is almost too much to deal with. I can't imagine trying to live in the United States again. Maybe my original plan of living in Mexico is what I need to concentrate on. It piles up and does not get any better. Kick em out, starve em out, throw em out any way you can. Thai way or the highway.

[Thaidream]

6 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

The problem is all the fat, unhealthy, disgusting smokers and drinker ex-pats.

I would say the majority actually.  Was in Chiang Mai recently and could not believe all who fit this profile.

10 am starts.

The Thai government does not want to provide foreigners who abuse themselves with any type of benefit it will just cost too much money in the long run.  I do not blame them..

 

For the record I have never asked the Thai Government to pay one Satang for me and my family.

 

You make alot of assumptions in your post- and show a lack of civility= I don't smoke and not much of a drinker. I am in my 70s and in perfect health except for the normal aches and pains.

I have no idea who may be a smoker or who drinks to much and I don't care and nether should you.

A medical insurance policy for someone my age in Thailand costs 103.000 Baht per year.  When my  wife was treated for cancer by chemo and radiation the bill came to 3 Million Baht which I paid.  

You may want to avoid all Expats as obviously you don't like them.

 

[Aforek]

5 minutes ago, Olmate said:

Guessing your a slim,healthy non smoking non drinker,then why you need insurance, now that’s a problem! 

No need to be fat, smoker, alcoholic to be sick; just have a road accident, heart problem, cancer … even slim people can have these sort of problems

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, swineninety9 said:

Could this have something to do with the girl who broke her neck diving into a pool, and had to crowdfund 60k pound to medevac her to the UK?

No, she had insurance.

[Firefan]

3 minutes ago, Aforek said:

No need to be fat, smoker, alcoholic to be sick; just have a road accident, heart problem, cancer … even slim people can have these sort of problems

Also; BKK6060; being in your 60ties and having "full cover" for $120/mth ($1440/year) sounds fairly cheap? What is your cover/what insurance company? any deductible/self pay? Presume no out-patient? Cheers!