Hi All

 

Is it just me or does Samui seem very quiet this high season? I have been either visiting or living here since the mid/late 90s and do not recall this few people during high season.

 

Yesterday (Xmas Eve!), on a day when I expected to see throngs of people, I saw very few. I was in Bang Po, Mae Nam, Bophut and (to a limited degree) Cheweng. Honestly, at this time of year I expect traffic jams, but the few I saw were caused by construction, nothing else. I was in Tesco and while there were a few more people than before, it really was not crowded, at least not like I recall. I have seen a few groups of tourists at the top of the Sois, but not in the expected numbers. My beach has been quiet, but that may just be the weather. I could go on, but you get the idea.

 

Okay, I don't go to Cheweng, except in the mornings and I don't spend time in bars or being out late late at night, so perhaps I am just not seeing things. That said, anecdotally it seems like the tourist numbers are waaaaaaaaaaay down. And, before anyone says that I am not using empirical data, I agree, but I would remind one and all of the old adage, 'The Plural of Anecdote is Data'. 

 

Anyone else seeing the same? Koh Samui residents/long stayers? Other islanders?

 

Merry Christmas to all, and a Happy New Year!

 

Yes, crazy traffic season has not arrived this year.

Would you think that the compulsory christmas dinners of 2500 a person have anything to do with it?

 

 

Somebody on this site once took me to task for citing quality anecdotal information (about Thai wages as I recall). But I'll believe anecdotal, "boots on the ground" information like yours anytime over wildly boosted propaganda from agencies under pressure to paint a rosey picture.

Talking to my various Thai friends in the north and the south in the last few days, their reports parallel yours.

What's the pricing for Christmas / NYE events like in Ko Samui?

 

In Hua Hin most of the good places ask 4000 - 13,000 THB on NYE!!! Not including drinks, of course, another "low++" package

 

<deleted> it... you can celebrate anywhere in Europe for far less and not drink dog piss of beer and wine.

What's the pricing for Christmas / NYE events like in Ko Samui?
 
In Hua Hin most of the good places ask 4000 - 13,000 THB on NYE!!! Not including drinks, of course, another "low++" package
 
it... you can celebrate anywhere in Europe for far less and not drink dog piss of beer and wine.

Most hotels charge a mandatory fee of 3 to 5 k for a new year's buffet and a crappy thai buffet of rice and ' things "

Total rip off

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

Years ago, when I used to live on Samui, it got so packed during peak season, it was hard to park your motorbike, in Central Lamai. This is the slowest peak season in memory. That is the case all over Thailand. Prayuth has done everything in his power to sabotage the tourism industry, in regard to Western tourism, which used to be the golden egg. He is also sabotaging the goodwill of many ex-pats with his biggest fool, the biggest joke, their xenophobic behavior, and fake nationalism nonsense. 

 

Tourism being down is a bonus for us. But, there are an awful lot of Thai people that are really hurting right now. And do the authorities care? Not one iota.

6 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Anyone else seeing the same? Koh Samui residents/long stayers? Other islanders?

I was heading Maenam-Bo Phut (Tesco) yesterday at 2 pm, very crowded traffic at the Ring Road up till before Fisherman Village, no active roadwork there, and not the Wharf yet, even Monday walking street, but rather seemed like in/out traffic from the resorts; like typical Xmas rush. On the other side up the Makro-hill was road work, which caused little queue. Typically the 24th is a bad day to drive, based on my experience from previous years, but I needed to; however the traffic doesn't tell the true facts about number of tourists.

 

The nightlife I attend was getting quite busy from mid December up till the 21st, but as it was Full Moon Party the 22nd it could be the usual party-crowd coming. That 2,000 or 3,000 folks commuting to Haad Rin on the full Moon night might seem a lot on the beach bars and in the dance venues; so they also don't indicate true facts about number of tourists.

 

I'm walking the beach every day about sunset, with or without company of some dogs, and it's a good time to get impression of habitation in the different resorts, as many of the occupied beachfront bungalows by that time will have light inside. I use to notice it by curiosity, also because I pass both quite affordable and older bungalows, to little more classy, and 5-star luxury in a price level we ordinary people can rent something for a whole year for, instead of a few night there.

 

Last evening, the 24th, which some years back equaled "full house" – I was told many years ago by a beach resort owner that they used to close during the monsoon from November 1st til mid December, where tourist began to arrive, and at the 23rd everything would be full; not because of better weather, but because of Xmas – last evening I could see something like 60% occupation in the little better end bungalows. Of course, some rooms could be occupied, but no one inside, and therefore no light switched on, so I should say "at least 60% occupied", and I could see that in the second row bungalows some was also occupied, but I don't try to count, so could be less, or same, or more. In the older and more affordable places, one was around 30% full, based on switched on light inside rooms, and the other seemed pretty empty, at least no light anywhere. The 5-star resort looked like half full beachfront bungalows and busy at the restaurant by the beach; it's a huge are behind and much more affordable rooms, that might be heavily occupied. But that's just some odd observations, and neither true facts about number of tourists.

 

I've noticed during the past few years that the 5-star and better class resorts often are very well booked, whilst the older affordable bungalows stay almost unused, which fit observations of my friends that don't mind the price as much, as they mind the quality of their holiday; i.e. rather spent 3,000 baht a night than the half, for a reasonable quality room, and of course good polite service with a smile. I've also noticed the change in audience, where families with children seem like a majority together with couples. When I began to come here, relative late in 2001, I saw a lot of gentlemen with a local private guide on the very same beach, but they seem to be little rare own on days; the number of beer-bars was also higher at that time. Perhaps Samui is changing to "quality tourists"...????

 

The Joker might be the Chinese, because they should account for about a third in number, and together with similar looking Asians about half or more in total, but apart from some scaring bad motorbike drivers, and a few odd ones in the discos – I presume mainly Koreans – they only appears in number when trying to squeeze onto a Lomprayah catamaran for Koh Tao and Koh Nangyuan, or visiting an Asian rolling sushi-style buffet. Where are they, and do they account for the true facts about number of tourists..?

 

I saw in the news yesterday, that number of Chinese tourists are back at level from last year – the were for a period down by 12 percent, or perhaps more – and a few days ago the news said that the Chinese in total were down 2-point-something percent this year, accounting for a third of the total number of tourist, whilst other nationalities were up by 3-point-something percent, both compared to last year; i.e. if that's true, the number of turists should be in level or slightly up compared to last year; and last year was up compared to two years ago. However, it's a statistic fact that European tourist are some level down over the past few years – perhaps Westerners in general – which for Europeans could be explained with currency exchange rate, and perhaps also that other Asian destinations of interest are opening up. A few of my friends have mentioned that Thailand don't seem to have the same appeal to them as a decade or more ago, but perhaps it's just because they are a decade older now..?

 

Agree, something don't fit with my personal observations and the official statistics, which should be our best source of reliable information, and in other threads some posted about Koh Phangan being quiet – almost same-same as Samui – but also posts about Krabi and Phuket and Pattaya being quiet. Little strange, isn't it?..

16 minutes ago, khunPer said:

I was heading Maenam-Bo Phut (Tesco) yesterday at 2 pm, very crowded traffic at the Ring Road up till before Fisherman Village, no active roadwork there, and not the Wharf yet, even Monday walking street, but rather seemed like in/out traffic from the resorts; like typical Xmas rush. On the other side up the Makro-hill was road work, which caused little queue. Typically the 24th is a bad day to drive, based on my experience from previous years, but I needed to; however the traffic doesn't tell the true facts about number of tourists.

 

The nightlife I attend was getting quite busy from mid December up till the 21st, but as it was Full Moon Party the 22nd it could be the usual party-crowd coming. That 2,000 or 3,000 folks commuting to Haad Rin on the full Moon night might seem a lot on the beach bars and in the dance venues; so they also don't indicate true facts about number of tourists.

 

I'm walking the beach every day about sunset, with or without company of some dogs, and it's a good time to get impression of habitation in the different resorts, as many of the occupied beachfront bungalows by that time will have light inside. I use to notice it by curiosity, also because I pass both quite affordable and older bungalows, to little more classy, and 5-star luxury in a price level we ordinary people can rent something for a whole year for, instead of a few night there.

 

Last evening, the 24th, which some years back equaled "full house" – I was told many years ago by a beach resort owner that they used to close during the monsoon from November 1st til mid December, where tourist began to arrive, and at the 23rd everything would be full; not because of better weather, but because of Xmas – last evening I could see something like 60% occupation in the little better end bungalows. Of course, some rooms could be occupied, but no one inside, and therefore no light switched on, so I should say "at least 60% occupied", and I could see that in the second row bungalows some was also occupied, but I don't try to count, so could be less, or same, or more. In the older and more affordable places, one was around 30% full, based on switched on light inside rooms, and the other seemed pretty empty, at least no light anywhere. The 5-star resort looked like half full beachfront bungalows and busy at the restaurant by the beach; it's a huge are behind and much more affordable rooms, that might be heavily occupied. But that's just some odd observations, and neither true facts about number of tourists.

 

I've noticed during the past few years that the 5-star and better class resorts often are very well booked, whilst the older affordable bungalows stay almost unused, which fit observations of my friends that don't mind the price as much, as they mind the quality of their holiday; i.e. rather spent 3,000 baht a night than the half, for a reasonable quality room, and of course good polite service with a smile. I've also noticed the change in audience, where families with children seem like a majority together with couples. When I began to come here, relative late in 2001, I saw a lot of gentlemen with a local private guide on the very same beach, but they seem to be little rare own on days; the number of beer-bars was also higher at that time. Perhaps Samui is changing to "quality tourists"...????

 

The Joker might be the Chinese, because they should account for about a third in number, and together with similar looking Asians about half or more in total, but apart from some scaring bad motorbike drivers, and a few odd ones in the discos – I presume mainly Koreans – they only appears in number when trying to squeeze onto a Lomprayah catamaran for Koh Tao and Koh Nangyuan, or visiting an Asian rolling sushi-style buffet. Where are they, and do they account for the true facts about number of tourists..?

 

I saw in the news yesterday, that number of Chinese tourists are back at level from last year – the were for a period down by 12 percent, or perhaps more – and a few days ago the news said that the Chinese in total were down 2-point-something percent this year, accounting for a third of the total number of tourist, whilst other nationalities were up by 3-point-something percent, both compared to last year; i.e. if that's true, the number of turists should be in level or slightly up compared to last year; and last year was up compared to two years ago. However, it's a statistic fact that European tourist are some level down over the past few years – perhaps Westerners in general – which for Europeans could be explained with currency exchange rate, and perhaps also that other Asian destinations of interest are opening up. A few of my friends have mentioned that Thailand don't seem to have the same appeal to them as a decade or more ago, but perhaps it's just because they are a decade older now..?

 

Agree, something don't fit with my personal observations and the official statistics, which should be our best source of reliable information, and in other threads some posted about Koh Phangan being quiet – almost same-same as Samui – but also posts about Krabi and Phuket and Pattaya being quiet. Little strange, isn't it?..

+1

 

The above is why I made the original post; I was curious about observational data from people who live here or are regular, annual visitors who 'winter' here (there are loads of you!).

 

And, I must say, this is simply a case of curiosity on my part...

 

There are numerous observations above, and let me comment on a few of them. 

 

The official statistics. Yes, in theory, they should be a valuable source of primary data, but I simply do not believe them anymore. I freely admit that I am a bit of a 'news-junkie', and in the last few months I have seen published newspaper stories that range from tourism being down 20% to tourism being up 20%, and these can't both be true. Not even remotely. Overall, the 'news' always seems to highlight that tourism and tourism dollars are constantly going up, and I call 'BS'. Do I have empirical evidence to support that? Nope. But, I do have eyes. And, a brain; there is a clear political motive for the Junta to have 'good news' on the economic front and it seems to me that they are ensuring that Thai news outlets are aping the proverbial 'party line'. Finally, if one were to believe the newspapers, the rate of tourism and tourism dollars has been increasing exponentially ("Up 20% from last year!", "Tourism growth of 13% YoY!", etc.) for a long, long time. If this were true, Thailand would be A) a proverbial 'first world country' already and B) the Thai Baht would have replaced the US dollar as the global reserve currency due to its massive usage.

 

Is the 'Khun Per beach walk with or without dogs at sunset to see how many lights are on' index viable data? Yes, I believe that it is. 

 

Is the SB Mark 1 eyeball index viable data? Yes, I believe that it is. Let me add two additional data points. I have now started to pay attention to motorcycle rental places, specifically to how many bikes they seem to have on display. Observational data is that they aren't renting many. Perhaps, as KP theorized above, that Samui's visitors have changed and perhaps the motorcycle rental business does not appeal to the new, 'quality' tourist? Or, more likely in my view, there are simply fewer visitors. And, may I add as someone who rides a motorcycle daily, while I like the Chinese people very much, as motorcycle riders they scare the hell out of me.

 

The second data point is that I live in a small compound of 6 houses, 3 of which are for rent to visitors. I have been here, off and on, for almost a decade and never once has a high season gone by without at least some rental for some period of time. I often assist the Thai family who owns them (language) and on an average year I chat with...25 people(?) asking price, availability, etc. This year there has not been a single person. Not one. Again, is this KP's changing, 'quality' tourist? Perhaps, but as above I would suggest that the tourism numbers are down.

 

Any other Samui residents, islanders or long-term stayers willing to contribute observations? They'd be much appreciated!

 

My observations on traffic are similar to KhunPer. Lots - and I hate it. I have enough food/drink in the house so that I do not have to go out until next year.

 

As I do not live in a town, I do not go to Chaweng and do not frequent bars I am not qualified to make observations about those.

 

However, I manage holiday homes. We are more busy than ever. All villas occupied (again). This is not just the villas that I manage, but also the neighbouring ones. With an average of 5 - 6 guests per villa. Sometimes as many as 10 guests plus kids to a villa. That is a lot of tourists.

 

I think that there are a number of reasons for the perceived 'low' numbers.

 

1 The EUR and GBP are way down. Thailand is currently too expensive for the 'usual' European tourist. These have been replaced by Asian tourists. Indians, Chinese, Mongolian, and even Eastern Europeans (Ukrainian, Estonian etc). This my view anyway.

 

2 The number of hotels and holiday rentals has increased significantly in later years - with more being built. Especially top end ones. The number of flights to the island is still the same. Ergo - occupancy percentages MUST be lower. This has been happening for years. Same with restaurants and bars. More every year, but the number of tourists cannot be increased by flights onto Samui direct. So, less customers per business.

 

3 Asian tourists have a different holiday 'style' to Western tourists. They stay in their villa/hotel much more. Many travel in family packs with young kids. They do not hit the bars/restaurants. They shop and then cook at home, then playing in the pool until the wee hours of the morning. They then sleep late. When they go out during the day, they go on pre-booked tours. We are seeing a large increase in 'in-villa' services. Cooking, massages, yoga etc. Also, the 'stay for two weeks' brigade has almost died the death. Most villas now are 3 to 4 nights per booking.

 

Anyway, that is my 2 baht's worth. I genuinely believe that tourist numbers are slightly up but they are not in cars, bars or restaurants. They are in minibuses, on tours or at their holiday home.

 

Mind you, with the number of hotels still under construction and the amount of private villas being built, the 'golden goose' may not have long to live.  Unless we make it easier for the guests to get here. Most Asians will put up with the 4 to 5 hours extra journey time from Suratthani, but most Westerners will not. There are now cheaper places nearer to their home.

6 hours ago, Tropicalevo said:

However, I manage holiday homes. We are more busy than ever. All villas occupied (again). This is not just the villas that I manage, but also the neighbouring ones. With an average of 5 - 6 guests per villa. Sometimes as many as 10 guests plus kids to a villa. That is a lot of tourists.

Thanks. I didn't mention it in my long enough posts, but that's also my impression, and I've often said it when posting other places about tourism on the island.

 

I have friends working with serviced villa rental a couple of places, even including a private cook, and they are normally very busy. One of my Danish friends also used a luxury villa for his stay with an extended family.

 

Next to my house are two villas used for rental, and first I thought that 100,000 baht a month for a two-bed, plus a small child room, villa was expensive. But the guests, two pairs and one with children, said that the alternative would be two smaller old bungalows for 1,700 baht each without pool area; i.e. 3,400 x 30 = 102,000 baht excluding the extra fee for children in same room, and now they got a new build villa with also kitchen and living room, and a private pool, all on the same beach as the used to stay 50-100 meter further down, same restaurants and same facilities.

 

And even my neighbor's big 3-bed luxury villa for 15k baht a day is actually relative affordable compared to staying beachfront in a high-end resort, if you can fill two or three bedrooms.

 

Thanks for your post @Tropicalevo, that explains a lot a lot about the "missing tourists"...????

And PS:
Bangkok Air got permission to expand from 36 to 50 operations a day in Samui Airport last year, with could be another 14 roundtrips with some 140 pax each, i.e. up to 2,000 more incoming guests a day.

Well, I thought Hua Hin quieter too than before. Seeing or hearing  Brits this year here is as rare as snow in Issan. Thailands currency too high for Brexit Brits as the UK sinks into poor currency status and unpredictability.

light rainy season was heavier than usual, rainy season was fairly dry, and sometimes more like hot season... seasons change... maybe tourist season is the same? Turn turn turn... climate change and all... 

What really annoys me is the inflated prices for Christmas and New Year meals/events. In the U.K. I can understand it as the Staff have too be paid double time etc to work over certain holiday days.

Here in Thailand I doubt very much the Staff get enhanced rates for working over the holidays so why inflate the prices, simple greedy restaurant owners trying too cash in and I find the U.K. owners the worst offenders.

Bangkok Air's stranglehold monopoly on air travel to and from Samui is killing Samui. They charge so much more per flight kilometer than any other flight in Asia if it involves Samui. They've also got so few direct flights to Samui from anywhere but Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur, and Singapore. It's a pain in the ass and expensive to get to Samui. But that's not the real problem. The real problem is no Chinese. Last year they were swarming the island and the year before that even more. This week Nikki Beach Samui has 57% occupancy through New Year's. The difference is NO CHINESE this year. Last year they were full of Chinese. Another stellar job by the government. I haven't seen it this quiet at Christmastime since I started coming here in 1983.

1 hour ago, peter48 said:

Well, I thought Hua Hin quieter too than before. Seeing or hearing  Brits this year here is as rare as snow in Issan. Thailands currency too high for Brexit Brits as the UK sinks into poor currency status and unpredictability.

 

Maybe your ear is only attuned to London accents, or maybe it is just wishful thinking on your part.

 

I have lived in Hua Hin full time since March. High Seasoon started quietly, but over the last week more people have arrived, and plenty of them have British accents of various types.

 

I lived on Samui from 2013-17. In the last three years or so there had been a gradual decline in numbers, although there had also been a change in the type of tourists coming: more young families and Asians.

 

The 60 day millionaires who blew their money on booze, birds and late breakfasts have been slowly disappearing, and that was happening before the Brexit referendum in June 2016.

 

One of my friends, who lives on Samui has just sent me this comment:

 

“I went to Macro Christmas Eve...about 10 shoppers in the entire place...can it be the high prices they are charging... or this new government hiking all the taxes onto the stratosphere...? Cigarettes have gone from 23 Baht a pack to 99 Baht...beer, 89 Baht a bottle from 27 a few years back...do people feel like they are being f***ed, and have ventured over to Vietnam by any chance...?”

Everywhere 'seems' quieter, but that does not necessarily mean than numbers are down, it could well be that as the demographics have changed so have tourist habits, and while they were out and about now they are staying in.

12 minutes ago, GalaxyMan said:

Bangkok Air's stranglehold monopoly on air travel to and from Samui is killing Samui. They charge so much more per flight kilometer than any other flight in Asia if it involves Samui. They've also got so few direct flights to Samui from anywhere but Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur, and Singapore. It's a pain in the ass and expensive to get to Samui. But that's not the real problem. The real problem is no Chinese.

And Bangkok Air got nothing to do with Chinese tourists staying away.

 

In my opinion we Samuians shall be happy for Bangkok Air are saving "our" island. If we had cheap affordable airplane tickets Samui had been "killed" long time ago with overloads of package tourists, many fold more than even working incinerators could handle garbage from, not to forget water and power supply, and the traffic on the Ring Road.

 

If the tourists were available, could you imagine what Samui would be like, if the number doubled..?

22 minutes ago, khunPer said:

And Bangkok Air got nothing to do with Chinese tourists staying away.

 

In my opinion we Samuians shall be happy for Bangkok Air are saving "our" island. If we had cheap affordable airplane tickets Samui had been "killed" long time ago with overloads of package tourists, many fold more than even working incinerators could handle garbage from, not to forget water and power supply, and the traffic on the Ring Road.

 

If the tourists were available, could you imagine what Samui would be like, if the number doubled..?

 

Perhaps for some residents its better but I don't think the investors agree with you.

40 minutes ago, silver sea said:

 

Maybe your ear is only attuned to London accents, or maybe it is just wishful thinking on your part.

 

I have lived in Hua Hin full time since March. High Seasoon started quietly, but over the last week more people have arrived, and plenty of them have British accents of various types.

 

I lived on Samui from 2013-17. In the last three years or so there had been a gradual decline in numbers, although there had also been a change in the type of tourists coming: more young families and Asians.

 

The 60 day millionaires who blew their money on booze, birds and late breakfasts have been slowly disappearing, and that was happening before the Brexit referendum in June 2016.

 

One of my friends, who lives on Samui has just sent me this comment:

 

“I went to Macro Christmas Eve...about 10 shoppers in the entire place...can it be the high prices they are charging... or this new government hiking all the taxes onto the stratosphere...? Cigarettes have gone from 23 Baht a pack to 99 Baht...beer, 89 Baht a bottle from 27 a few years back...do people feel like they are being f***ed, and have ventured over to Vietnam by any chance...?”

"“I went to Macro Christmas Eve...about 10 shoppers in the entire place:

 

I went on Christmas day, the busiest I've ever seen it, an absolutely horrendous experience.

1 hour ago, Jumbo1968 said:

What really annoys me is the inflated prices for Christmas and New Year meals/events. In the U.K. I can understand it as the Staff have too be paid double time etc to work over certain holiday days.

Here in Thailand I doubt very much the Staff get enhanced rates for working over the holidays so why inflate the prices, simple greedy restaurant owners trying too cash in and I find the U.K. owners the worst offenders.

 

Those taxi prices posted on Twitter for Koh Samui are they real?

 

On 12/25/2018 at 12:21 PM, spidermike007 said:

Years ago, when I used to live on Samui, it got so packed during peak season, it was hard to park your motorbike, in Central Lamai. This is the slowest peak season in memory. That is the case all over Thailand. Prayuth has done everything in his power to sabotage the tourism industry, in regard to Western tourism, which used to be the golden egg. He is also sabotaging the goodwill of many ex-pats with his biggest fool, the biggest joke, their xenophobic behavior, and fake nationalism nonsense. 

 

Tourism being down is a bonus for us. But, there are an awful lot of Thai people that are really hurting right now. And do the authorities care? Not one iota.

Wait for the 70 and over retiree crowd being required to buy 400K THB worth of unnecessary insurance for 100K/year.  That will thin the expats out.  An no, they won't care.  However, the families left behind will be back to poverty and trying to earn a living by going back into tourist related service industries isn't going to pan out.  The Thai government seems to be on course to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

Beach walk update: Some peak-season customers seem to arrive little later, today the 5-star resort if full in both front row and 2nd row. Also my neighboring affordable boutique resort says the are full – hard to believe, but so the manager says – and they even expanded their room capacity by 12 percent for this season, and 40 percent a few years back...????

20 minutes ago, connda said:

Wait for the 70 and over retiree crowd being required to buy 400K THB worth of unnecessary insurance for 100K/year.

The mandatory insurance suggestion was for (the newer) non-o long-stay visas, not for extension of stay based on retirement.

Koh phangan is dead also.

 

41 minutes ago, l4ml4m said:

Koh phangan is dead also.

 

I can confirm that.
The lowest peak season I have experienced here since 20 years.

I was never that impressed with Samui anyway.  I first went in '94 and again in '99.  Huge change in those five years.  I can only imagine what it is like now.  

3 hours ago, yimlitnoy said:

 

Those taxi prices posted on Twitter for Koh Samui are they real?

 

 

No, they are not.

2 hours ago, l4ml4m said:

Koh phangan is dead also.

 

 

They anounced the other day that they had over 30,000 attend the recent full moon party.

Why should we care how many tourists are in Thailand or not in Thailand? Ridiculous to analyse or to observe. It's simply not a Falang issue.