Teenager who joined IS group in Syria to lose UK citizenship

[roo860]

The council wanted a high standard and professional job, that's why we were there. Do you live or work in the UK?

Does not make it a Muslim only area.
 
And, unless you are a Muslim, the fact you were there is evidence of that.

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[Bluespunk]

Just now, roo860 said:

The council wanted a high standard and professional job, that's why we were there. Do you live or work in the UK?

 

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

I have lived and worked in the UK.  Also lived and worked in Kuwait Saudi Arabia, Upper East region of Ghana, Thailand.

 

Visit Bradford, Birmingham and Luton when go back to UK for summer.

 

Not seen any evidence of the propaganda lies spread by the "Muslim only areas' liars.

 

Though that's hardly surprising, as they are lies.

 

[alfieconn]

3 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

I have lived and worked in the UK.  Also lived and worked in Kuwait Saudi Arabia, Upper East region of Ghana, Thailand.

 

Visit Bradford, Birmingham and Luton when go back to UK for summer.

 

Not seen any evidence of the propaganda lies spread by the "Muslim only areas' liars.

 

Though that's hardly surprising, as they are lies.

 

Why would you want to do that ?

 

[Bluespunk]

4 minutes ago, alfieconn said:

Why would you want to do that ?

 

A better question might be why would someone want to ask that question?

 

Though, being honest {and having read your posts} I think I know the answer in this case.

[roo860]

I lived with 4 Muslim guys in India, stayed with their families as well in Kashmir.

Does not make it a Muslim only area.
 
And, unless you are a Muslim, the fact you were there is evidence of that.
 
I've lived and worked in majority Muslim areas and Non-Muslim areas.
 
I felt equally safe in both.

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[Bluespunk]

10 minutes ago, roo860 said:

I lived with 4 Muslim guys in India, stayed with their families as well in Kashmir.
 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

 

 

Good for you.

 

Care to get back on topic?

Edited February 20, 2019 by Bluespunk

[Chelseafan]

7 hours ago, ezzra said:

A good decision by the May government,

I wonder that a labour government under Corbyn leadership would have done with this woman that said she was 'ok with beheadings'...

Yes but this is just lip service by Javid. She will appeal and be allowed to return as per International law.

Why not save all the legal fees and allow her to keep 'UK citiizenship' but barr her from UK soil.

 

If she wasn't living in a camp and IS on the verge of being defeated she would be quite happy staying where she is. She has shown no remorse whatsoever even implying that she is a victim.

 

 

[Chelseafan]

7 hours ago, BB1958 said:

Yes

I think you used all the right letters, just not necessarily in the right order ????

 

[stevenl]

8 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

Yes but this is just lip service by Javid. She will appeal and be allowed to return as per International law.

Why not save all the legal fees and allow her to keep 'UK citiizenship' but barr her from UK soil.

 

If she wasn't living in a camp and IS on the verge of being defeated she would be quite happy staying where she is. She has shown no remorse whatsoever even implying that she is a victim.

 

 

What international law? If, as is now claimed, she has Bangladeshi nationality, there is no international law that forbids the UK to take away her UK nationality.

If she were allowed to retain her UK nationality, there is no barring her from return to the UK.

Edited February 20, 2019 by stevenl

[MalandLee]

6 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

I think you used all the right letters, just not necessarily in the right order ????

 

Yes

[BB1958]

2 minutes ago, MalandLee said:

Yes

Why did you steal my thunder????

[Chelseafan]

5 hours ago, Emdog said:

Has anyone considered she was a minor (15) when she went off to jihad? Should she be tried as an adult or a minor (if any trial were to happen)?

Old enough to reproduce doesn't mean old enough to be tried as an adult. One could argue that a mature mind might interfere with decision to pop out little jihadis, so from evolution view lacking sense could be seen as greater likelihood to pass on DNA

IMHO this isn't about her age and incidentally a 15 year old is intelligent enough to make an informed decision. This is about her ideology which is polar opposite to ours. 

[Chelseafan]

11 minutes ago, stevenl said:

What international law? If, as is now claimed, she has Bangladeshi nationality, there is no international law that forbids the UK to take away her UK nationality.

If she were allowed to retain her UK nationality, there is no barring her from return to the UK.

If she has dual nationality then it's a no-brainer but it's not been confirmed that this is the case yet as far as I can tell.

 

Sky News

 

Islamic State bride Shamima Begum can have her UK citizenship revoked because it is believed she is a dual British-Bangladeshi national, Sky sources say.

 

 

[Oxx]

1 hour ago, telboybk said:

Mayor of London ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Birmingham ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Leeds ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Blackburn ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Sheffield ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Oxford ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Luton ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Oldham ... MUSLIM
Mayor of Rochdale ... MUSLIM
Over 3,000 Muslim Mosques
Over 130 Muslim Sharia Courts
Over 50 Muslim Sharia Councils
Muslims-Only No-Go Areas Across The UK
Muslim Women ... 78% don't work and are on FREE benefits/housing
Muslim Men ... 63% don't work and are on FREE benefits/housing
Muslim Families ... 6-8 children planning to go on FREE benefits/housing
... and now all UK schools are ONLY serving HALAL MEAT!

All this achieved by just 4 million Muslims out of the 66 million population!

 

This viral posting is both inflammatory and substantially inaccurate.  It's debunked at https://fullfact.org/news/muslims-uk-viral-poster-factchecked/

 

[Baerboxer]

7 hours ago, stevenl said:

Since she apparently also is Bangladeshi, an understandable and imo correct decision. Appeals probably won't amount to much.

 

She was born in the UK and has apparently never been to Bangladesh. Her mother has Bangladeshi citizenship and apparently under Bangladeshi law that entitles her to Bangladeshi citizenship.

 

She comes across in interviews as being totally indoctrinated into the ISIS propaganda.

 

No way should she be allowed back. If the government weaken and let her back she must be tried in court.

 

Her 'family lawyer" btw is a Muslim radical scumbag who is on record for saying the murderers of Fuslilier Rigby were created by the treatment they received from the state! He's also urged Muslims not to cooperate with the Police. Time scum like him were barred from office.

[ChipButty]

She's certainly not doing herself any favours with her comments, choice of baby's name, etc.

Here's some comment on what might be legally possible https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/20/shamima-begum-could-the-plan-to-revoke-her-citizenship-be-stopped 

I suspect, like others have mentioned, that Britain will try to block her and her son's return, but will be overruled and they'll become a liability and a welfare cost; let's hope the son grows up to be a genius who benefits British society - it's possible.

Edited February 20, 2019 by ChipButty

[sanemax]

5 hours ago, Emdog said:

Has anyone considered she was a minor (15) when she went off to jihad? Should she be tried as an adult or a minor (if any trial were to happen)?

Old enough to reproduce doesn't mean old enough to be tried as an adult. One could argue that a mature mind might interfere with decision to pop out little jihadis, so from evolution view lacking sense could be seen as greater likelihood to pass on DNA

Although she was 15 when she went , she stayed there of her own free will and now she is 19 and she would have stayed where she was, had I.S. been successful in creating a caliphate . She only now wants to come back to the UK for a better life , she hasnt changed her ideals .

   She conceived when she was 18/19 , which makes her an adult at the time .

She participated in I.S. doings when she was an adult  

[Baerboxer]

31 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

Yes but this is just lip service by Javid. She will appeal and be allowed to return as per International law.

Why not save all the legal fees and allow her to keep 'UK citiizenship' but barr her from UK soil.

 

If she wasn't living in a camp and IS on the verge of being defeated she would be quite happy staying where she is. She has shown no remorse whatsoever even implying that she is a victim.

 

 

 

Indeed she and her lawyer and family are trying to portray her as a victim.

 

Her lawyer even claimed she was "traumatized like a WW1 soldier"! He also blamed the state, police and her old school for failing to prevent her running off to join ISIS.

 

British people are actually famously tolerant and welcoming to foreign immigrants in the past. But now many are becoming increasingly angry at the way Muslims disrespect, insult and attack anything they don't like or agree with. 

 

 

[Baerboxer]

Just now, sanemax said:

Although she was 15 when she went , she stayed there of her own free will and now she is 19 and she would have stayed where she was, had I.S. been successful in creating a caliphate . She only now wants to come back to the UK for a better life , she hasnt changed her ideals .

   She conceived when she was 18/19 , which makes her an adult at the time .

She participated in I.S. doings when she was an adult  

 

Her husband, and her son's father, is Dutch. Why don't they go back and live in the Netherlands?

[stevenl]

8 minutes ago, ChipButty said:

She's certainly not doing herself any favours with her comments, choice of baby's name, etc.

Here's some comment on what might be legally possible https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/20/shamima-begum-could-the-plan-to-revoke-her-citizenship-be-stopped 

I suspect, like others have mentioned, that Britain will try to block her and her son's return, but will be overruled and they'll become a liability and a welfare cost; let's hope the son grows up to be a genius who benefits British society - it's possible.

Good article from The Guardian.

 

So it appears it is not clear cut she has Bangladeshi citizenship, or can apply for it. That makes this decision to revoke very, very contentious, and by the looks of it based on public outcry.

[bert bloggs]

57 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

I have lived and worked in the UK.  Also lived and worked in Kuwait Saudi Arabia, Upper East region of Ghana, Thailand.

 

Visit Bradford, Birmingham and Luton when go back to UK for summer.

 

Not seen any evidence of the propaganda lies spread by the "Muslim only areas' liars.

 

Though that's hardly surprising, as they are lies.

 

Well i know 2 of these areas very very well and while yes you can walk around them and shop during the day , try putting up an advertizing poster with a woman not covered all over , try open a shop and sell pork , they have shops that sell religious material that is close to what i would call terrorist material , Luton they closed down the bingo hall ,why because it was called "Mecca" i could go on ,but so many have their heads in the sand , as i have said before ,not a lot i would trust .

[Chelseafan]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

Good article from The Guardian.

 

So it appears it is not clear cut she has Bangladeshi citizenship, or can apply for it. That makes this decision to revoke very, very contentious, and by the looks of it based on public outcry.

If we do have to take her back lets hope that we can drag this out in the courts for many years to come before she is let back on UK soil...after all it's taken nigh-on 20 years to get another runway at Heathrow so we're obviously good at it.

 

 

[sanemax]

Just now, stevenl said:

Good article from The Guardian.

 

So it appears it is not clear cut she has Bangladeshi citizenship, or can apply for it. That makes this decision to revoke very, very contentious, and by the looks of it based on public outcry.

Did you read the article ?

 

The home secretary cannot revoke citizenship “if he is satisfied that the order would make a person stateless”, but can do with “reasonable grounds for believing that the person is able, under the law of a country or territory outside the United Kingdom, to become a national of such a country or territory”. 

 

  As her Parents are Bangladeshi , she is able to apply for Bangladeshi citizenship

[Bluespunk]

Just now, bert bloggs said:

Well i know 2 of these areas very very well and while yes you can walk around them and shop during the day , try putting up an advertizing poster with a woman not covered all over , try open a shop and sell pork , they have shops that sell religious material that is close to what i would call terrorist material , Luton they closed down the bingo hall ,why because it was called "Mecca" i could go on ,but so many have their heads in the sand , as i have said before ,not a lot i would trust .

They are still not Muslim only areas.

 

That claim is untrue and used to create fear and prejudice.

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, bert bloggs said:

shop Well i know 2 of these areas very very well and while yes you can walk around them and shop during the day , try putting up an advertizing poster with a woman not covered all over , try open a and sell pork , they have shops that sell religious material that is close to what i would call terrorist material , Luton they closed down the bingo hall ,why because it was called "Mecca" i could go on ,but so many have their heads in the sand , as i have said before ,not a lot i would trust .

As of last week, Mecca bingo hall in Luton is still there

 

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g190747-d4367905-Reviews-Mecca_Bingo_Luton-Luton_Bedfordshire_England.html

[sungod]

6 hours ago, Emdog said:

Has anyone considered she was a minor (15) when she went off to jihad? Should she be tried as an adult or a minor (if any trial were to happen)?

Old enough to reproduce doesn't mean old enough to be tried as an adult. One could argue that a mature mind might interfere with decision to pop out little jihadis, so from evolution view lacking sense could be seen as greater likelihood to pass on DNA

She is now 19 years old and showing zero remorse.

[bert bloggs]

4 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

They are still not Muslim only areas.

 

That claim is untrue and used to create fear and prejudice.

did i say they were ? no ,but i can only talk about areas i have worked in .

as for fear and prejudice , be afraid be very afraid .maybe not yet ,but beware the wolfe is at the door

[bert bloggs]

6 minutes ago, sanemax said:

As of last week, Mecca bingo hall in Luton is still there

 

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g190747-d4367905-Reviews-Mecca_Bingo_Luton-Luton_Bedfordshire_England.html

rubbish it was turned into a gospel hall years ago ,dont know what it is now ,but its NOT called Mecca,at least not in the muslim part of town,dont know if the built another one somewhere else .

ps ,that is not the one the muslims closed down.

Edited February 20, 2019 by bert bloggs

[stevenl]

7 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Did you read the article ?

 

The home secretary cannot revoke citizenship “if he is satisfied that the order would make a person stateless”, but can do with “reasonable grounds for believing that the person is able, under the law of a country or territory outside the United Kingdom, to become a national of such a country or territory”. 

 

  As her Parents are Bangladeshi , she is able to apply for Bangladeshi citizenship

Yes, I read the article in full. Besides your quote it e.g. also states

Quote

By contrast, many other British Isis recruits have been allowed to return. The home secretary may be asked at any appeal to explain why those suspected of fighting have been allowed back into the UK, while Begum – who is not thought to have been a combatant – has been stripped of her citizenship.

and

Quote

This is a relatively rare case, although one legal source claimed the government had tried this before and lost. Most cases have featured those who are dual nationals.

and

Quote

The head of MI6 said last Friday that Britons like Begum who have gone to join Isis could not be stopped from returning to the UK. David Gauke, the justice secretary, said on Sunday: “We can’t make people stateless.” And Bernard Hogan-Howe, the Metropolitan police commissioner when Begum fled in 2015, said she and her fellow fugitives should be treated as grooming victims as long as no evidence emerges that they committed offences. However, the current Met police commissioner, Cressida Dick, suggested that judgment may have changed now that four years have elapsed.

Your conclusion is premature at best, and judging from the article most likely incorrect.

Edited February 20, 2019 by stevenl

[stevenl]

4 minutes ago, bert bloggs said:

did i say they were ? no ,but i can only talk about areas i have worked in .

as for fear and prejudice , be afraid be very afraid .maybe not yet ,but beware the wolfe is at the door

Somebody else did, hence the reaction.