World powers call for calm as India and Pakistan trade fire in Kashmir

[webfact]

World powers call for calm as India and Pakistan trade fire in Kashmir

By Alasdair Pal and Fayaz Bukhari

 

Indian soldiers stand next to the wreckage of Indian Air Force's helicopter after it crashed in Budgam district in Kashmir February 27, 2019. REUTERS/Danish Ismail

 

NEW DELHI/SRINAGAR (Reuters) - Indian and Pakistani troops traded fire briefly along the contested border in Kashmir on Thursday morning, a day after the two nuclear powers both downed enemy jets, with Pakistan capturing an Indian pilot.

 

The United States, China and other world powers have urged restraint from the two nations as tensions escalate following tit-for-tat airstrikes in the wake of a suicide car bombing that killed at least 40 Indian paramilitary police in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Feb. 14.

 

Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan has called for talks.

 

"History tells us that wars are full of miscalculation. My question is that, given the weapons we have, can we afford miscalculation," Khan said during a brief televised broadcast to the nation. "We should sit down and talk."

 

Pakistan and India have fought three wars since independence from British colonial rule in 1947, two over Kashmir, and went to the brink of a fourth in 2002 after a Pakistani militant attack on India's parliament.

 

Pakistan has shut its airspace, forcing commercial airlines to reroute. Thai Airways International announced on Thursday that it had cancelled flights to Pakistan and Europe, which left thousands of passengers stranded in Bangkok.

 

On Thursday morning troops from India and Pakistan briefly exchanged fire in Poonch, a district in Indian-occupied Kashmir, according to a statement from the Indian army.

 

"The Indian army retaliated strongly and effectively," said Lieutenant Colonel Devender Anand, a defence ministry spokesman.

 

The firing, that India claims was initiated by Pakistan and lasted for a little over an hour beginning at 0600 local time (0030 GMT), was significantly less elevated than the artillery fire exchanged by the two sides on Wednesday.

 

Pakistan said the firing began overnight.

 

"The firing continued in intervals throughout the night. It was moderate. Even now it's continuing," said Shaukat Yusufzai, an administration official in the Pakistan-controlled part of Poonch.

 

One man was hospitalised after being hit by shrapnel, he added.

 

India is building more than 14,000 bunkers for families in Jammu and Kashmir state living close to the border, hoping to keep them safe near their homes rather than evacuate them.

 

On Wednesday evening India's foreign ministry handed a dossier to Pakistan that it claimed detailed camps of the Paskistan-based militant group that carried out the Feb 14 attack.

 

The conflict comes at a critical time for Indian Prime Minster Narendra Modi, who faces a general election in a matter of months.

 

Late on Wednesday B.S. Yeddyurappa, the leader of Modi's Bharatiya Janata Party in the southern state of Karnataka, said India's strike inside Pakistani territory would help the party to win back power in the state - the first such comment from a member of the ruling party.

 

"This has brought a pro-Modi wave all through the country," he told reporters.

 

"The effect of this will be seen in the elections."

 

INTERNATIONAL CONCERN

The latest escalation marks a sudden deterioration in relations between the two countries. As recently as November, Pakistan's leader Khan spoke of "mending ties" with India.

 

The White House urged "both sides to take immediate steps to de-escalate the situation."

 

U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said in a statement he had spoken separately with the foreign ministers of India and Pakistan and urged them to "prioritise direct communication and avoid further military activity".

 

Pakistan's envoy to the United States, Asad Majeed Khan, said Islamabad would like to see the Trump administration play a more active role in easing the crisis.

 

At the same time, he said the lack of U.S. condemnation of India's strike on Pakistan was "construed and understood as an endorsement of the Indian position, and that is what emboldened them even more”.

 

China, the European Union and other countries also called for restraint. Japan's foreign mininster said on Thursday the country was concerned about the "deteriorating situation".

 

The Chinese government's top diplomat, State Councillor Wang Yi, spoke by telephone with Pakistan Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi and expressed "deep concern", China's foreign ministry said in a statement on Thursday.

 

The United States, Britain and France proposed the United Nations Security Council blacklist Azhar Masood, the head of Pakistan-based Jaish-e-Mohammad, the group that claimed responsibility for the Feb. 14 attack. China is likely to be oppose the move.

 

FLIGHTS CANCELLED

Thai Airways said it had cancelled more than a dozen flights to Europe due to Pakistan's move, along with all flights to and from the country.

 

Several airlines including Emirates and Qatar Airways, suspended flights to Pakistan on Wednesday, while others such as Singapore Airlines and British Airways were forced to reroute flights.

 

Singapore Airlines said on Thursday all of its Europe-bound flights would continue as planned, avoiding the affected airspace as necessary.

 

Flights from the Middle East and India were also affected. Air Canada said on Wednesday it has temporarily suspended service to India.

 

(Reporting by Alasdair Pal, Fayaz Bukhari and Abu Arqam Naqash, additional reporting by Panarat Thepgumpanat and Michelle Nicholls; Editing by Michael Perry and Simon Cameron-Moore)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-02-28

[malagateddy]

Hopefully it will not " kick off " but if it does..I hope India " wipes the floor " with Pakistan.

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[TopDeadSenter]

Makes you wonder. Going back 25 years or so, Imran Khan was a top-flyte English cricketer. He lived a decadent life, hobnobbing with royalty, the rich and the famous. He even marryied the daughter of Sir James Goldsmith, one of the world's richest men. No luxury or vice was spared this man. Then what happened? He became head of one of the strictest Islamic nations on earth, and now seems destined to spark a nuclear conflict with the long suffering Indians next door. Just what in that book is so powerful? What could turn a "moderate" man such as Khan into a apocalyptic warrior? 

 Good luck to the Indians in taming the mad beast next door. And let's hope the winds are not blowing in the Thai direction when it all goes kaboom.

[Topdoc]

To understand this conflict, you have to ask the question:

Is the water from the rivers fairly divided between these 2 countries?

"Pakistan is one of the most water-stressed countries in the world. One recent estimate suggests that Pakistan will face a shortage of 31 million acre-feet of water by 2025. [Pakistan uses about 104 million acre feet every year for agricultural irrigation.] Its underground aquifers are critically depleted from the over-extraction of groundwater, and the two largest dams—the Tarbela and the Mangla—have seen a decline in their storage capacity due to excessive deposits of silt. As such, any diminution in water flow will have serious consequences for the livelihoods of Pakistan’s farmers, who have already faced, over the past few years, a dearth of fresh water during the critical season—just before the monsoon, when the summer crop is planted."

 

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/02/25/are-india-and-pakistan-on-the-verge-of-a-water-war-pulwama-kasmir-ravi-indus/ 

[malagateddy]

Think China will quietly send a message to Pakistan to sort out their terrorists on the border..OR ELSE!!!

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[simple1]

31 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Makes you wonder. Going back 25 years or so, Imran Khan was a top-flyte English cricketer. He lived a decadent life, hobnobbing with royalty, the rich and the famous. He even marryied the daughter of Sir James Goldsmith, one of the world's richest men. No luxury or vice was spared this man. Then what happened? He became head of one of the strictest Islamic nations on earth, and now seems destined to spark a nuclear conflict with the long suffering Indians next door. Just what in that book is so powerful? What could turn a "moderate" man such as Khan into a apocalyptic warrior? 

 Good luck to the Indians in taming the mad beast next door. And let's hope the winds are not blowing in the Thai direction when it all goes kaboom.

Khan has an extremely difficult job with containing hardliners and reducing bloodshed. Pakistani military and civilians have suffered enormously from combating Islamic extremism.

 

BTW Khan has already called for de escalation talks - undermines your blah, blah

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/02/imran-khan-calls-talks-urges-india-avoid-miscalculation-190227103704010.html

[TopDeadSenter]

3 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Khan has an extremely difficult job with containing hardliners and reducing bloodshed. Pakistani military and civilians have suffered enormously from combating Islamic extremism.

 

BTW Khan has already called for de escalation talks - undermines your blah, blah

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/02/imran-khan-calls-talks-urges-india-avoid-miscalculation-190227103704010.html

Thank you, but I do wish you would dispense with the condescending and aggressive attitude. I am particularly familiar with Khan and can remember after he married Jemima and forced her to wear islamic clothing and essentially kept her trapped in their Lahore mansion. Nice try, but no sale. There is much info available on his life as a younger man, you might want to read it before blindly defending him. The moderate facade was just that.

 And of course, good luck with de-escalation talks. And yes, he surely has a hard job. But I do not trust this man at all, thanks to knowing his history. 

[Jingthing]

Both sides have nukes and are in wind blowing range of Thailand.

Better keep track of this one. 

[thaibeachlovers]

26 minutes ago, Topdoc said:

To understand this conflict, you have to ask the question:

Is the water from the rivers fairly divided between these 2 countries?

"Pakistan is one of the most water-stressed countries in the world. One recent estimate suggests that Pakistan will face a shortage of 31 million acre-feet of water by 2025. [Pakistan uses about 104 million acre feet every year for agricultural irrigation.] Its underground aquifers are critically depleted from the over-extraction of groundwater, and the two largest dams—the Tarbela and the Mangla—have seen a decline in their storage capacity due to excessive deposits of silt. As such, any diminution in water flow will have serious consequences for the livelihoods of Pakistan’s farmers, who have already faced, over the past few years, a dearth of fresh water during the critical season—just before the monsoon, when the summer crop is planted."

 

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/02/25/are-india-and-pakistan-on-the-verge-of-a-water-war-pulwama-kasmir-ravi-indus/

As populations increase beyond their resources to support them, water wars are going to start in many places. Look how Egypt reacts when countries up stream on the Nile want to dam it.

 

The pity of the Kashmir situation is that it is completely unnecessary. Had Britain not stuffed up the separation of India into India and Pakistan ( they should have defined Kashmir properly, even giving it independence ) there would have been nothing to fight over now, IMO. I gather it was rushed, and rushing something of such importance is never a good idea.

[RichardColeman]

That's all we need. mad muslims needing more excuses to kill

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, RichardColeman said:

That's all we need. mad muslims needing more excuses to kill

To be fair, India sports some heinous Hindus as well. 

[TopDeadSenter]

19 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Both sides have nukes and are in wind blowing range of Thailand.

Better keep track of this one. 

As I alluded to yesterday. A certain master of deal making will be flying over that area after delivering peace to the Korean peninsula. I wonder if he has the energy to drop in and smooth everything over for the Indians and Pakistanis? And if Trump can't fix it, well let they may as well warm up the minutemen ????

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, TopDeadSenter said:

As I alluded to yesterday. A certain master of deal making will be flying over that area after delivering peace to the Korean peninsula. I wonder if he has the energy to drop in and smooth everything over for the Indians and Pakistanis? And if Trump can't fix it, well let they may as well warm up the minutemen ????

Bizarre POV. 

[simple1]

1 hour ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Thank you, but I do wish you would dispense with the condescending and aggressive attitude. I am particularly familiar with Khan and can remember after he married Jemima and forced her to wear islamic clothing and essentially kept her trapped in their Lahore mansion. Nice try, but no sale. There is much info available on his life as a younger man, you might want to read it before blindly defending him. The moderate facade was just that.

 And of course, good luck with de-escalation talks. And yes, he surely has a hard job. But I do not trust this man at all, thanks to knowing his history. 

Not defending the man, stating the really tough pragmatic decisions he has to face with a portion of the population led by hardline Islamists, whilst reducing the death toll. Thanks, but being a Londoner (BTW taught to play chess by a Pakistani in London). I am well aware of Khan's past life. Jemima trapped in their Lahore home. yep she really hated him after their separation....

 

https://www.smh.com.au/world/jemima-khan-joins-pakistan-protests-in-london-20071119-gdrmvz.html

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jemima_Goldsmith

 

You may wish to call out my post as aggressive, but really??? Pot, kettle black when you 'like' a post wishing for the destruction of Pakistan. 

[Cory1848]

28 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

As I alluded to yesterday. A certain master of deal making will be flying over that area after delivering peace to the Korean peninsula. I wonder if he has the energy to drop in and smooth everything over for the Indians and Pakistanis? And if Trump can't fix it, well let they may as well warm up the minutemen ????

Not much "delivering peace" on the Korean peninsula; the talks just collapsed. As for India and Pakistan, I don't think Trump could find them on a map. Your tabloid knowledge about Imran Khan is impressive though --

[alanrchase]

1 hour ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Makes you wonder. Going back 25 years or so, Imran Khan was a top-flyte English cricketer. He lived a decadent life, hobnobbing with royalty, the rich and the famous. He even marryied the daughter of Sir James Goldsmith, one of the world's richest men. No luxury or vice was spared this man. Then what happened? He became head of one of the strictest Islamic nations on earth, and now seems destined to spark a nuclear conflict with the long suffering Indians next door. Just what in that book is so powerful? What could turn a "moderate" man such as Khan into a apocalyptic warrior? 

 Good luck to the Indians in taming the mad beast next door. And let's hope the winds are not blowing in the Thai direction when it all goes kaboom.

I gave up when you claimed he was a top-flyte English cricketer. He played in England but never represented England.

[Purdey]

The USA funds Pakistan, hence the American weapons and passivity at this time. Yet Pakistan protects terrorists ("Oh, we didn't know Bin Laden was living in Abbottabad!") and its Inter-Services Intelligence is believed to actively help them. India has contempt for Pakistan but would not have carried out an attack unless it knew the terrorists had entered Kashmir from Pakistan. It is not likely to lead to nuclear war but is more of a bloody nose.

 

[Baerboxer]

5 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Makes you wonder. Going back 25 years or so, Imran Khan was a top-flyte English cricketer. He lived a decadent life, hobnobbing with royalty, the rich and the famous. He even marryied the daughter of Sir James Goldsmith, one of the world's richest men. No luxury or vice was spared this man. Then what happened? He became head of one of the strictest Islamic nations on earth, and now seems destined to spark a nuclear conflict with the long suffering Indians next door. Just what in that book is so powerful? What could turn a "moderate" man such as Khan into a apocalyptic warrior? 

 Good luck to the Indians in taming the mad beast next door. And let's hope the winds are not blowing in the Thai direction when it all goes kaboom.

 

Hmmm. If you notice, it's Khan whose calling for restraint and dialogue. Modi, facing an election is sabre rattling.

 

Btw Modi was governor of Gujerat when rioting Hindus murdered many many Muslims as the Gujerat state police did nothing to stop them. A police general and his own police commandos had to be brought in from the Punjab to restore order. Modi kept a low profile, avoiding the press and federal government at the time and then emerged to lead the BJP nationally. A right wing Hindu extremist who will do whatever to win the upcoming election. A dangerous man.

[Baerboxer]

2 minutes ago, Purdey said:

The USA funds Pakistan, hence the American weapons and passivity at this time. Yet Pakistan protects terrorists ("Oh, we didn't know Bin Laden was living in Abbottabad!") and its Inter-Services Intelligence is believed to actively help them. India has contempt for Pakistan but would not have carried out an attack unless it knew the terrorists had entered Kashmir from Pakistan. It is not likely to lead to nuclear war but is more of a bloody nose.

 

 

The Pakistani ISI is a powerful entity that seemingly acts without the accountability to government at times. Pakistan has and is dominated by its military.

 

India is a democracy, and its military does obey its government. But, Modi is very right wing Hindu nationalist with an upcoming election.

 

There are always "happenings" around the line of control. One side usually has other reasons for reacting more to them.

[observer90210]

Even fools are aware that Pakistan is a well known terrorist sponsoring nation.

 

However, there are nut cases and extremists on both sides of this never ending conflict, but Pakistan did start the hostility in the first place, few weeks ago.

[Scott]

Off-topic post reported and removed.  

[oznomad]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Thai Airways said it had cancelled more than a dozen flights to Europe due to Pakistan's move, along with all flights to and from the country.

 

Several airlines including Emirates and Qatar Airways, suspended flights to Pakistan on Wednesday, while others such as Singapore Airlines and British Airways were forced to reroute flights.

 

Singapore Airlines said on Thursday all of its Europe-bound flights would continue as planned, avoiding the affected airspace as necessary.

The easy path. You go home now.

[connda]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

"History tells us that wars are full of miscalculation. My question is that, given the weapons we have, can we afford miscalculation," Khan said during a brief televised broadcast to the nation. "We should sit down and talk."

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This is the voice of reason.

 

7 hours ago, webfact said:

Late on Wednesday B.S. Yeddyurappa, the leader of Modi's Bharatiya Janata Party in the southern state of Karnataka, said India's strike inside Pakistani territory would help the party to win back power in the state.

^^^^^^^^^

This is not.

So who's hanker for war here?  Pretty obvious I'd say. 
Hope everyone downwind has their supply of Potassium Iodide on hand.  "Hello Thailand!"  ????

 

[FarangDoingHisThing69]

 
Hmmm. If you notice, it's Khan whose calling for restraint and dialogue. Modi, facing an election is sabre rattling.
 
Btw Modi was governor of Gujerat when rioting Hindus murdered many many Muslims as the Gujerat state police did nothing to stop them. A police general and his own police commandos had to be brought in from the Punjab to restore order. Modi kept a low profile, avoiding the press and federal government at the time and then emerged to lead the BJP nationally. A right wing Hindu extremist who will do whatever to win the upcoming election. A dangerous man.

Name every Hindu terrorist attack that has occurred in the west.


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[Emmess]

20 minutes ago, connda said:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This is the voice of reason.

 

^^^^^^^^^

This is not.

So who's hanker for war here?  Pretty obvious I'd say. 
Hope everyone downwind has their supply of Potassium Iodide on hand.  "Hello Thailand!"  ????

 

Voice of reason, unfortunately, it's just "TALK". They have been 'talking' like that for decades. BUT with NO action.

Have they done anything about all the terrorists who roam there freely, many a times appearing on stages with the politicians and top army brass of Pakistan.

[katana]

13 hours ago, alanrchase said:

14 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Makes you wonder. Going back 25 years or so, Imran Khan was a top-flyte English cricketer. He lived a decadent life, hobnobbing with royalty, the rich and the famous. He even marryied the daughter of Sir James Goldsmith, one of the world's richest men. No luxury or vice was spared this man. Then what happened? He became head of one of the strictest Islamic nations on earth, and now seems destined to spark a nuclear conflict with the long suffering Indians next door. Just what in that book is so powerful? What could turn a "moderate" man such as Khan into a apocalyptic warrior? 

 Good luck to the Indians in taming the mad beast next door. And let's hope the winds are not blowing in the Thai direction when it all goes kaboom.

I gave up when you claimed he was a top-flyte English cricketer. He played in England but never represented England.

He played county cricket for Worcestershire 1971-76.

[simple1]

9 hours ago, FarangDoingHisThing69 said:

Name every Hindu terrorist attack that has occurred in the west.

Irrelevant in the context of the OP. However, there have been Hindu murders of Christians in India. There was a Sikh downing of an Air India flight over the Atlantic. Yes, the Sikh faith is affiliated to Hinduism. Plus of course a fair amount of domestic abuse, honour killings, forced marriages and so on by the Hindu communities in the West, but dictated by culture, not religion. largely ignored in Western media with preference to focus on Muslims.

[IAMHERE]

The Pakistan military controls the Nukes in Pakistan, not Imran Khan. I would not put it passed Pakistan to let off a nuk or two on India, just to showcase them to Saudi Arabia.

[malagateddy]

And in turn they will be nuked back to the stone age.
Seriously..watch China make moves behind the scenes to quieten things down and possibly move against the scum who are causing the troubke in the kashmir area

The Pakistan military controls the Nukes in Pakistan, not Imran Khan. I would not put it passed Pakistan to let off a nuk or two on India, just to showcase them to Saudi Arabia.

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