Hundreds of thousands march in London to demand new Brexit referendum

[stephenterry]

3 minutes ago, Forethat said:

I have already addressed the legal issues currently preventing the UK from striking trade deals pre-Brexit. It is not that we cannot do it in a hasty manner, we are bound by legal obligations to the EU not to. 

 

I realise that - I can read and understand the legalities. But it is imperative for the UK to obtain an understanding on how countries would react after the UK left the EU. That's called forward planning - something that this government is incapable of implementing on any level.

 

And that's why parliament is taking over Brexit.

 

 

[Forethat]

2 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

I realise that - I can read and understand the legalities. But it is imperative for the UK to obtain an understanding on how countries would react after the UK left the EU. That's called forward planning - something that this government is incapable of implementing on any level.

 

And that's why parliament is taking over Brexit.

 

 

I don't disagree with you on that one. In fact, if I wasn't restricted by non-disclosure agreements I would add to that complete-lack-of-contingency-planning theory of yours. It'll have to wait until a war-story bragging evening over a couple of dark Beer Laos...very dark.

[Spidey]

1 hour ago, stephenterry said:

The best way forward is for parliament to take back control over Brexit this week, and by resolving a way forward using indicative votes, and telling May to get off the pot and action it, or dissolve the government and hold a General Election. 

Not possible. May is insisting on holding the party whip for the indicative votes. Some Tory MPs have resigned because of this, most haven't. There will be no free vote. They have to vote the way that May trells them to.

 

It's guaranteed that we will be no further forward by tomorrow night than we are now.

 

Just another charade.

[MAGA 2020]

On 3/24/2019 at 7:10 AM, vogie said:

We have had a referendum, they don't like the result.

Exactly......the losers want to vote till they get the results THEY want......lmao

[Cat ji]

I suppose the conspiracy started very soon after the referendum came out to be in favour of leaving.

Reminds me, I think it was Denmark, when the people voted against joining EU, the powers-that-be found a way to hold another referendum. ...Then they "arranged" things more suitably.

[bomber]

29 minutes ago, Cat ji said:

I suppose the conspiracy started very soon after the referendum came out to be in favour of leaving.

Reminds me, I think it was Denmark, when the people voted against joining EU, the powers-that-be found a way to hold another referendum. ...Then they "arranged" things more suitably.

Govts going what they should be going thats why we have them a much better option than mob rule...with brexit it was clear thickhead patriotic idiots would vote for the man waving the union jack and bemoaning germany and slagging off immigrants.

[damascase]

46 minutes ago, Cat ji said:

I suppose the conspiracy started very soon after the referendum came out to be in favour of leaving.

Reminds me, I think it was Denmark, when the people voted against joining EU, the powers-that-be found a way to hold another referendum. ...Then they "arranged" things more suitably.

Well, definitely NOT Denmark: the Danish population voted for membership with 63.3% in favour with a turnout of 90.1%.

[stephenterry]

1 hour ago, Spidey said:

Not possible. May is insisting on holding the party whip for the indicative votes. Some Tory MPs have resigned because of this, most haven't. There will be no free vote. They have to vote the way that May trells them to.

 

It's guaranteed that we will be no further forward by tomorrow night than we are now.

 

Just another charade.

May has been told to offer free voting on the indicative vote. Whether she would or not is another matter, but if she doesn't her reign will be over as more MPs will rebel.

 

So we will be further forward come tomorrow night, IMO. 

[Nigel Garvie]

1 hour ago, stephenterry said:

May has been told to offer free voting on the indicative vote. Whether she would or not is another matter, but if she doesn't her reign will be over as more MPs will rebel.

 

So we will be further forward come tomorrow night, IMO. 

One thing seems pretty sure, No deal Brexit is dead, this from the Health Secretary:-

"The options for Brexit "are narrowing", Health Secretary Matt Hancock has said, after MPs voted to seize control of the parliamentary timetable.  "The idea of having a no deal…the Commons is absolutely clear it won't allow and will legislate against it if necessary." It appears that although not legally binding, the government accepts that a no deal Brexit is against the clearly stated wishes of the house, which -  in the Health Secretary's view anyway - the government will not attempt to overturn.

The humiliation of being British, and thus linked to a land of fools lead by a laughably inadequate and venal parliament may be over soon.

[welovesundaysatspace]

4 hours ago, MAGA 2020 said:

Exactly......the losers want to vote till they get the results THEY want......lmao

How could that be of any relevance for you or “the winners”?

[welovesundaysatspace]

3 hours ago, Cat ji said:

I suppose the conspiracy started very soon after the referendum came out to be in favour of leaving.

Reminds me, I think it was Denmark, when the people voted against joining EU, the powers-that-be found a way to hold another referendum. ...Then they "arranged" things more suitably.

Really? What happened? 

[damascase]

23 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Really? What happened? 

This: the Danish population voted for membership with 63.3% in favour with a turnout of 90.1%. No referendum.

[nontabury]

17 hours ago, Spidey said:

Nice piece on parliamentary law. However, totally irrelevant as the SI will be in place by the 29th. It's already before the HoL. We will not be crashing out on 29th, the smart money is on a delay of at least 12 months. During that time, the smart money is on a 2nd referendum, May's deal or remain.

 

Pity that the Brexiteers don't have many smarts amongst their number.

 

 

 Kate Hoey has today in Parliament, forced the undemocratic and biased speaker Bercow, to admit that we are already under the total control of our colony masters the E.u by admitting that E.u. Law overrides our own British law.

I have a horrible feeling that if you take people’s Democratic right away from them, that only leaves them with one alternative.

 

 

[nontabury]

16 hours ago, Spidey said:

Lol. Middle class Southerner? I've never been so insulted in all my life! Born in a council house in the far North of England. Voted Labour all my life and former T.U. official.

 

Thanks for reminding me that Brexiteers, generally, are thick as pigshite. You're comedy gold mate, you really are!

 

 Then you’ll be happy with this-

[7by7]

8 hours ago, sanemax said:

The people should make the decision, ask them in a referendum , just one referendum and the Politicians should act/vote the way the people instruct them to .

   Lets have a referendum asking the people and just one referendum  

 Exactly; MPs can't or wont decide. I heard on the radio today that Rees-Mogg has now said that campaigning to leave without a clear idea of how to handle Brexit was a big mistake. I agree; they should have had at least some idea of how to handle Brexit if they won; if they had then we probably wouldn't be in this mess now!

 

But they didn't and we are; so let us the people make the decision with a legally binding referendum in which we are asked to vote for our first and second preferences out of three options:

1. Brexit with whatever deal has been agreed between the UK and EU,
2. Brexit without a deal, or
3. cancel Article 50 and remain in the EU.

If no option has 50% plus 1 of the first preference votes then the option with the lowest number of first preference votes is eliminated and the second preference votes on those ballot papers allocated to the appropriate option.

 

Obviously, if support for Brexit is still as strong as it was in 2016 then this would favour Brexit as very few, if any, Brexiteers would put remain as their second choice. So I have to wonder why so many Brexiteers are against the idea.

 

Well, there is the obvious reason, of course!

 

[7by7]

9 hours ago, KarlS said:

I do not have an answer but what I do know is that MPs have contrived to make Brexit the most divisive issue ever faced by the UK in modern times. 

Who do you think should make the decision? There is no modern-day precedent for the 'people' enacting law. 

 

There is a precedent.

 

Constitutionally Parliament is sovereign and referendums therefore cannot be legally binding.

 

But, of course, as Parliament is sovereign it can decide to make a referendum legally binding if it so wishes. This was done for the 2011 alternative vote referendum by means of the Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Act 2011.

 

There is no reason why the same cannot be done for any referendum on the final deal with the EU.

[nontabury]

16 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 

There is a precedent.

 

Constitutionally Parliament is sovereign and referendums therefore cannot be legally binding.

 

But, of course, as Parliament is sovereign it can decide to make a referendum legally binding if it so wishes. This was done for the 2011 alternative vote referendum by means of the Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Act 2011.

 

There is no reason why the same cannot be done for any referendum on the final deal with the EU.

Especially if the Bureaucrats in Brussels and the British establishment in London agree with it.

[7by7]

1 hour ago, nontabury said:

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

<snip>

There is no reason why the same cannot be done for any referendum on the final deal with the EU.

Especially if the Bureaucrats in Brussels and the British establishment in London agree with it.

The bureaucrats in Brussels have absolutely no say in the matter.

 

British Establishment? People like Jacob Rees-Mogg.

[kiwikeith]

4 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

The bureaucrats in Brussels have absolutely no say in the matter.

 

British Establishment? People like Jacob Rees-Mogg.

3.30 am in the morning Thailand and the Brexit is arguing on TV.

It is sad that politicians call referendums that are not legally binding , spend a fortune on them, then waste millions of tax payers money, terrorise the population financially just to get what is good for the rich and not the poor.

Greece was a prime example.

The first thing that happened after the Brexit result was the crashing of the pound.

This pissed all the expats off, it also sent the aussie and the nz down to very low levels and that remains at present and peeves me off.

If Britain exits Brexit I would place my money on the currency stabilising at a higher rate.

 

Politicians are creating havoc with Britains economy, terrorising the people who are now almost rioting, as what happened in Greece.

Then a second referendum will be called and there will be NO BREXIT>

Madame Merkyl wins again, Britain won the war but has lost control of there finance.

[Spidey]

4 hours ago, nontabury said:

 

 Then you’ll be happy with this-

If you've read my posts you'd know that neither am I a Corbyn supporter. Keep trying.

[wilcopops]

4 hours ago, nontabury said:

 

 Then you’ll be happy with this-

It seems you don't understand the cartoon.

[nontabury]

51 minutes ago, wilcopops said:

It seems you don't understand the cartoon.

 

“Oh” I understand only to well. In the meantime you keep your head,Stuck in the sand.

And while your there,think not what the E.u. is now, which Is bad enough,but think very hard in which direction it is going.

Edited March 26, 2019 by nontabury

[damascase]

42 minutes ago, nontabury said:

 

“Oh” I understand only to well. In the meantime you keep your head,Stuck in the sand.

And while your there,think not what the E.u. is now, which Is bad enough,but think very hard in which direction it is going.

Tax rates imposed by Brussels - just another blatant lie. 

[malagateddy]

Well damascase..you could always ask your mep for a copy of the 24 page document re Macron's " way forward " for the eu.
Wanting member eu nations to surrender a lot of their respective powers to brussels.
Please open your eyes..what do you honestly think is the ultimate end game objectives of brussels????

Tax rates imposed by Brussels - just another blatant lie. 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Spidey]

39 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

Well damascase..you could always ask your mep for a copy of the 24 page document re Macron's " way forward " for the eu.
Wanting member eu nations to surrender a lot of their respective powers to brussels.
Please open your eyes..what do you honestly think is the ultimate end game objectives of brussels????

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

Macron isn't Brussels. He's the President of France, the leader of 1 of 28 member states. He has one vote amongst 28, if the UK leaves, that will be 27. You give him far too much credit, he's struggling to sell his ideas to his own people, let alone 27 member states.

[malagateddy]

He is trying..he sees himself as the new " boss " as merkel is on the way out.
He is also a globalist

Macron isn't Brussels. He's the President of France, the leader of 1 of 28 member states. He has one vote amongst 28, if the UK leaves, that will be 27. You give him far too much credit, he's struggling to sell his ideas to his own people, let alone 27 member states.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Spidey]

13 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

He is trying..he sees himself as the new " boss " as merkel is on the way out.
He is also a globalist

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

He can try all he likes, he can see himself as whatever he likes, the new Napoleon, whatever. His popularity in France has all but disappeared. He won't have a seat at the table after the next French presidential election. He's lost all respect in the EU, just a little bird twittering in the corner.

[malagateddy]

Sorry but you're wrong imo

He can try all he likes, he can see himself as whatever he likes, the new Napoleon, whatever. His popularity in France has all but disappeared. He won't have a seat at the table after the next French presidential election. He's lost all respect in the EU, just a little bird twittering in the corner.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Spidey]

5 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

Sorry but you're wrong imo

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

Have you heard of "Les Gillets Jaune" a massive popular reaction to Macron's failed policies for a "new France", from all sides of the political spectrum. He's done.

[Nigel Garvie]

8 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Exactly; MPs can't or wont decide. I heard on the radio today that Rees-Mogg has now said that campaigning to leave without a clear idea of how to handle Brexit was a big mistake. I agree; they should have had at least some idea of how to handle Brexit if they won; if they had then we probably wouldn't be in this mess now!

 

But they didn't and we are; so let us the people make the decision with a legally binding referendum in which we are asked to vote for our first and second preferences out of three options:

1. Brexit with whatever deal has been agreed between the UK and EU,
2. Brexit without a deal, or
3. cancel Article 50 and remain in the EU.

If no option has 50% plus 1 of the first preference votes then the option with the lowest number of first preference votes is eliminated and the second preference votes on those ballot papers allocated to the appropriate option.

 

Obviously, if support for Brexit is still as strong as it was in 2016 then this would favour Brexit as very few, if any, Brexiteers would put remain as their second choice. So I have to wonder why so many Brexiteers are against the idea.

 

Well, there is the obvious reason, of course!

 

Well the first obvious reason is this:-

"Brexit has ceased to be the “will of the people”, analysis of British Social Attitudes Survey respondents has suggested. National Centre for Social Research data found 55 per cent of Brits would vote Remain in a second referendum, with just six per cent of respondents saying they now think the UK will secure a good Brexit deal – a massive reduction from the 33 per cent who were optimistic about the outcome of negotiations when the Article 50 process was triggered in March 2017. The findings have prompted the centre’s senior research fellow Sir John Curtice to warn MPs discussing Brexit in Parliament that: “There is seemingly room for debate about whether leaving the EU is still the ‘will’ of a majority of voters in the UK.“Perhaps the key message for the politicians as they decide what to do is that those on all sides of the argument might be best advised to show a degree of humility when claiming to know what voters really want.” Of the 70 polls conducted since the 2017 General Election only two have given Leave the edge (+1), with five ties and 63 Remain leads. Recent averages for Remain have been between seven and eight points. There also hasn’t been a single poll in almost a year now with Leave lead."

 

The reason that - given the overwhelming number of polls saying the same thing - there is a fall in the support for leave, may be due to people waking up to the very high likelihood  that it will be damaging to the Economy and their pockets. These figures are from the department that is supposed to be in favour of Brexit.

Edited March 27, 2019 by Nigel Garvie
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