Do you believe in God and why

[Sunmaster]

17 minutes ago, Taboo2 said:

Based on current calculations, God is 38 billion years old....and I could be wrong based on the latest input from James Webb Telescope....so, WTF is he doing?  Playing video games or reviewing everyone who died's life history before sending us to hell?

 

I believe you mean the universe is 38 billion years old, not God. 

 

[save the frogs]

5 hours ago, Taboo2 said:

Based on current calculations, God is 38 billion years old....and I could be wrong based on the latest input from James Webb Telescope....so, WTF is he doing?  Playing video games or reviewing everyone who died's life history before sending us to hell?

 

yes, plausible theory.

god could be plotting to obliterate us all.

possibly waiting for specific planetary alignments. 

[Sunmaster]

This thread has become a bad episode of the Twilight Zone.

"What if God is really a macrocosmic virus, slowly infecting lifeforms across the universe?"
"Yeah, sounds plausible. Somehow I always suspected that."
"I think he came through an interdimensional portal because he was expelled from his own dimension."
"Right on. That would mean he is some sort of Satan!"
"Right!"

????

[Tippaporn]

36 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

This thread has become a bad episode of the Twilight Zone.

"What if God is really a macrocosmic virus, slowly infecting lifeforms across the universe?"
"Yeah, sounds plausible. Somehow I always suspected that."
"I think he came through an interdimensional portal because he was expelled from his own dimension."
"Right on. That would mean he is some sort of Satan!"
"Right!"

????

The irony is that these are the same folks who mock and ridicule actual sensical ideas which, put together, form an intelligent and comprehensive picture of the world in which everything is accounted for and many of the workings shown down to the smallest detail.  Yes, like Seth.  These folks have no clue as to how bizarre their "theories" of life sound.  Let alone they couldn't begin to get into any depth whatsoever as to how these bizarre theories actually work in the practical universe.  And why?  Because those theories have no basis in actual reality and thus can never be shown to work.

They ridicule religion due it's demand for blind belief and yet they blindly believe in their own absurdities without requiring a shred of evidence for it's existence.  And to top it off they're totally blind to their own hypocrisy.  For the life of them they can't see that they do the same as what they ridicule others for doing.  Goes right over their heads.

Humans are a strange species, eh? 

[Tippaporn]

 

On 5/21/2023 at 4:40 AM, Tippaporn said:

Perhaps your best contribution thus far, save the frogs.  I hadn't heard that wonderful tune before.  Mick seems to be struggling for understanding.  He ain't alone.

Human suffering . . . why do we experience it?  For surely if God existed he would never have allowed it.  And since it is allowed and if God does exist then he is either twisted or has created a faulty universe.  So goes the rationale and the conclusions drawn that are often expressed here.

Why is suffering allowed and why do we experience it?  If there's a reason and purpose for everything then must there be a good reason and purpose for suffering as well?  Before I offer my two cents I'll sit back whilst pleasantly enjoying my morning coffee untroubled and observe what answers others come up with. 

This was in response to save the frogs post.  Did he attempt an intelligent, serious reply?  Instead we get nonsense like this:

 

5 hours ago, save the frogs said:

yes, plausible theory.

god could be plotting to obliterate us all.

possibly waiting for specific planetary alignments. 

Methinks he is only capable of clever and sarcastic ridiculing quips so as to appear to be a profound thinker and so much more intelligent than the stupid wannabe gurus here.   But look behind the facade and there's only empty space.

[Tippaporn]

Here's my challenge to @save the frogs.  Be a serious poster.  Can you do it?

If I were capable of predicting the future I would say keep your eye on stage left folks. 

[CharlieH]

reported troll comment removed.

[Hummin]

6 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

The irony is that these are the same folks who mock and ridicule actual sensical ideas which, put together, form an intelligent and comprehensive picture of the world in which everything is accounted for and many of the workings shown down to the smallest detail.  Yes, like Seth.  These folks have no clue as to how bizarre their "theories" of life sound.  Let alone they couldn't begin to get into any depth whatsoever as to how these bizarre theories actually work in the practical universe.  And why?  Because those theories have no basis in actual reality and thus can never be shown to work.

They ridicule religion due it's demand for blind belief and yet they blindly believe in their own absurdities without requiring a shred of evidence for it's existence.  And to top it off they're totally blind to their own hypocrisy.  For the life of them they can't see that they do the same as what they ridicule others for doing.  Goes right over their heads.

Humans are a strange species, eh? 

To me, it seems no matter what, most behave as you describe, as everyone else is stupid for not seeing the same as themselves, and at same time feel superior to others. 

 

What do you think about that?  

[Sunmaster]

1 hour ago, Hummin said:

To me, it seems no matter what, most behave as you describe, as everyone else is stupid for not seeing the same as themselves, and at same time feel superior to others. 

 

What do you think about that?  

Do you remember the Thai kids trapped in the cave? There was an English cave diver who had decades of experience in diving in enclosed spaces. He knew what he was talking about when he gave his opinion on the danger of the expedition. He had the knowledge and the willingness to explain the situations to those who didn't have his knowledge and experience. 
Then comes Mr Musk, who knows absolutely nothing about cave diving, but who thinks he has the right answers to the problem at hand. When the cave diver pointed out that Musk's solution was completely useless, Musk proceeded to call him a pedo.

As you probably know, this is a true story, but it is also a great analogy of the behaviour of a lot of people when it comes to religion, spirituality and states of consciousness.

How often has Stephen Fry been taken as an authority figure to discredit religion and spirituality? How often has Richard Dawkins been hailed as the voice of reason regarding spirituality? Both of them are just like Musk, in that they don't know the first thing about exploring consciousness. Yet, people will listen to them, thinking they must know since they are famous intellectuals.

But when someone points out that not all opinions are equal (based on direct experiences and knowledge gained thereof), they are quickly labeled as "superior", "know-it-all", "guru", "arrogant" and so on and so forth. 

Should the cave diver have acted differently? Should he have sucked up to Musk and tell him how brilliant his idea was? Maybe stroke his ego a little?
Does experience and knowledge of a given subject not count for anything anymore? Are all opinions equal and equally valuable?

Another fallacy is the argument that since nobody can know about "God" or provide proof of a "higher realm", therefore all opinions are equal. It's interesting that this argument only comes from those who have never even tried to practice meditation or introspection. Because those who actually do practice, know that "knowing thyself is knowing God". 

So, this is what it all comes down to. The naysayers claim that no-one has the capability to know God by knowing themselves. After all, if they can't do it, it must mean that nobody else can.....right? And how dare those arrogant wackos say that they can? They must be out of their minds! They must be smoking some good sh!t! They must be naïve, delusional individuals. 

That being said, I think that those people who do have more experience and knowledge must also try to be patient and compassionate with those who don't. 
If you have a rebellious teenage son (or daughter) who thinks he knows everything better, you as the parent will not try to ridicule and belittle him. You, as the older, wiser, more experienced person, will do your best to direct your son, and you do that out of love for him.
This is the responsibility we as believers and practitioners have towards those who are still unconscious. Not an easy task for sure, but it's an ideal we have to live up to if we take the path seriously and if we want to be taken seriously.


 

Edited May 23, 2023 by Sunmaster

[save the frogs]

8 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

Methinks he is only capable of clever and sarcastic ridiculing quips so as to appear to be a profound thinker and so much more intelligent than the stupid wannabe gurus here.   But look behind the facade and there's only empty space.

who are the wannabe gurus on here? 

 

[Hummin]

30 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

Do you remember the Thai kids trapped in the cave? There was an English cave diver who had decades of experience in diving in enclosed spaces. He knew what he was talking about when he gave his opinion on the danger of the expedition. He had the knowledge and the willingness to explain the situations to those who didn't have his knowledge and experience. 
Then comes Mr Musk, who knows absolutely nothing about cave diving, but who thinks he has the right answers to the problem at hand. When the cave diver pointed out that Musk's solution was completely useless, Musk proceeded to call him a pedo.

As you probably know, this is a true story, but it is also a great analogy of the behaviour of a lot of people when it comes to religion, spirituality and states of consciousness.

How often has Stephen Fry been taken as an authority figure to discredit religion and spirituality? How often has Richard Dawkins been hailed as the voice of reason regarding spirituality? Both of them are just like Musk, in that they don't know the first thing about exploring consciousness. Yet, people will listen to them, thinking they must know since they are famous intellectuals.

But when someone points out that not all opinions are equal (based on direct experiences and knowledge gained thereof), they are quickly labeled as "superior", "know-it-all", "guru", "arrogant" and so on and so forth. 

Should the cave diver have acted differently? Should he have sucked up to Musk and tell him how brilliant his idea was? Maybe stroke his ego a little?
Does experience and knowledge of a given subject not count for anything anymore? Are all opinions equal and equally valuable?

Another fallacy is the argument that since nobody can know about "God" or provide proof of a "higher realm", therefore all opinions are equal. It's interesting that this argument only comes from those who have never even tried to practice meditation or introspection. Because those who actually do practice, know that "knowing thyself is knowing God". 

So, this is what it all comes down to. The naysayers claim that no-one has the capability to know God by knowing themselves. After all, if they can't do it, it must mean that nobody else can.....right? And how dare those arrogant wackos say that they can? They must be out of their minds! They must be smoking some good sh!t! They must be naïve, delusional individuals. 

That being said, I think that those people who do have more experience and knowledge must also try to be patient and compassionate with those who don't. 
If you have a rebellious teenage son (or daughter) who thinks he knows everything better, you as the parent will not try to ridicule and belittle him. You, as the older, wiser, more experienced person, will do your best to direct your son, and you do that out of love for him.
This is the responsibility we as believers and practitioners have towards those who are still unconscious. Not an easy task for sure, but it's an ideal we have to live up to if we take the path seriously and if we want to be taken seriously.


 

Well to be honest, we talking about belief and personal faith as well conviction, where many had similar experiences, but still, no belief system manage to unifie people, instead it kind of diverts people in to groups and tribes. 

 

Stephen Fry attack orginized political abusive religion for most, and I understand his view of point, as well so many claim they have the truth, the rest go to hell, suffer for many lives, or are just stupid for not seeing the same as them, and it becomes mental. 

 

How people experience true situations in life, can be experienced different as many observer's there are, and that is the weakness of humans, we have difficulty with observing the true realm of reality as it happens. I know Seth theory comes up in back of mind as I write, but nevertheless I have my faith in nature as it happens here and now.

 

Cave diving is quite technicall, and also requires alot of experience as well being there in realtime as it happens. Can not compare something physically as cave diving to faith or belief systems. Simple as that.

 

We are living in heaven, just sad, not so many understand that, but thats nature

[Sunmaster]

4 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Well to be honest, we talking about belief and personal faith as well conviction, where many had similar experiences, but still, no belief system manage to unifie people, instead it kind of diverts people in to groups and tribes. 

 

Stephen Fry attack orginized political abusive religion for most, and I understand his view of point, as well so many claim they have the truth, the rest go to hell, suffer for many lives, or are just stupid for not seeing the same as them, and it becomes mental. 

 

How people experience true situations in life, can be experienced different as many observer's there are, and that is the weakness of humans, we have difficulty with observing the true realm of reality as it happens. I know Seth theory comes up in back of mind as I write, but nevertheless I have my faith in nature as it happens here and now.

 

Cave diving is quite technicall, and also requires alot of experience as well being there in realtime as it happens. Can not compare something physically as cave diving to faith or belief systems. Simple as that.

 

We are living in heaven, just sad, not so many understand that, but thats nature

Yes, Stephen Fry mainly attacks organized religion. I, like you, can understand where he comes from. The problem is that a lot of people take that to mean that there is no validity in any subjective spiritual experience, which is something completely different from religious dogma. It is just thrown in in the same bag.

The cave diving is just an analogy, but as flawed as it seems, there are still many similarities that work well in explaining the attitude of some towards spiritual issues. 
You say experiences vary and are as diverse as there are observers. This is true in a way. It is also true that those diverse experiences (of the inner world) follow certain paths and organize themselves in certain structures or frameworks. That's why it is possible to speak of a Yogic Path or teacher-student relationship in the first place. 

The experiences one accumulates when practicing meditation are not random and chaotic, but show challenges and turning points that are common to all practitioners. This is where the teacher comes in and is able to advise the student. Without this framework, there would be no teaching, no learning. It would just be pure randomness and all we could do is hope for the best. 
 

[Hummin]

20 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

 

The experiences one accumulates when practicing meditation are not random and chaotic, but show challenges and turning points that are common to all practitioners. This is where the teacher comes in and is able to advise the student. Without this framework, there would be no teaching, no learning. It would just be pure randomness and all we could do is hope for the best. 
 

I completely follow your observations, vision and conclusions, but as fast someone say, those patterns can be achieved by manipulation using commonly known techniques, and served as truths, as well other technics can achieve different views and served as truths. Our brain is a wonderful universe with a chemistry factory giving us strenght, feelings, desire and wonderful experiences in another level for those who searching. It can manipulate us to see things and happenings that never happened or existed in real life. Hold on, I still keep someones message and teachings clear in my backhead, and also my own experiences as my own conclusions. 

 

I am now quite interested in our own chemistry combined with fungus and how It interact with us, especially when living with it where it have not been destroyed by human activity. Im sure you know where Im heading, back to the nature where it all started. Most poeple have disconnected and distanced themselves to their true nature, because they distanced themselves to the true Nature. 

 

As much we have to look inwards for answers, we also need to connect back to the pure Nature, where the connection still exists.

 

[Tippaporn]

Someone posted this meme elsewhere and I provided my commentary.  I repost it here as it is fitting.

 

The difference is this: The official news that everyone watches is assumed to come from an objective and trusted, and therefore accurate, source of information.  No one watching the TV need do any of their own investigating or analysis because the news sources have supposedly done it all for them.

 

The individual doing his or her own investigations and making their own analysis does not enjoy the status of being a source of objective and accurate information.

 

The entire propaganda scam rests on the earned trust of the news organizations.  The problem is that they've been thoroughly corrupted and thus, like a con artist whose scam relies solely on gaining the trust of his mark, they take extreme advantage of the trust they've earned through the decades.  Unlike the con artist whose first mission is to gain trust of the mark the news media have had it already.

 

Regardless, even in the best, or most honest, of times I would not mindlessly rely on another's information and willy nilly accept it as truth. That holds true for me not only regarding the news but for any information which is, in a sense, being "sold" to me. Of all the commerce in goods in the world the one which by far is the greatest in quantity is ideas. Everyone is in the market buying and selling continuously.

 

Going to a deeper level on this issue I see this "Great Awakening," whereby people are waking up to the fact of how things actually work versus how they've been told they work, as being a small representation of an even greater issue. That larger issue is that we've been told how things work in every facet of life. And to a large degree we've accepted, willy nilly, as truth what we've been told by our parents, teachers, friends and all those "trusted" souls in life who have provided us with information as to how life and the world works. And we're all guilty of believing much of what we've been told as true without ever investigating or analyzing it ourselves. I can guarantee that much of that information is as untrue as the information put out by the MSM.

 

We have all here come to recognize that we need to think for ourselves and thoroughly examine that information which is sold to us by the "trusted" MSM as to it's veracity. What we haven't come to recognize thus far though, in my humble opinion, is that we need to go back and re-examine much of what we've already come to believe as being true regarding how life works and reconsider the veracity of those ideas.

 

All of us here imagine, from time to time, the shock which must befall those "suckers" who have been misled by the MSM and others as the unvarnished truth can no longer be ignored or denied and must be accepted. That shock would be the same for anyone who re-examined currently held personal ideas as being true when they discover, to their dismay and horror, that they are equally false.

 

I'm hinting at a much greater awakening than the "Great Awakening" that is upon us now. That greater awakening is waking up to the fact that in many critically important respects the world we've been "sold" is NOT the world as it truly is.

 

Sorry if I took you further than you want to go.  Just food for thought, is all.

As I've been saying from day one, our temporal reality is a literal physical translation, or mirrored reflection, of our subjective reality.  Nothing in this world exists without first existing as an idea in subjective reality.  Until that idea is at least given some consideration as to it's validity any understanding as to the true workings of this world will escape those who are currently convinced that life happens to us rather than life being created by us.  For that realisation is the ultimate realisation which is the key that unlocks all of the true answers to life.  And which leads us back to a true understanding of the nature of ourselves - who and what we really are.  As Seth has pointed out, it is impossible to understand our world without an understanding of who we are.  For how can one understand how the world works if the premise is entirely wrong?  And the current premise is that we have naught or little to do with the creation of our very existence. 

As Seth has stated on several occasions throughout his writings, the world is at a juncture where the old ideas we accept as being true on a mass level can no longer solve our current problems.  For false ideas can never work in practicality as they have no basis in reality and must therefore result only in the manifestation of problems.  Lots and lots and lots of problems.  Our problems today are massive.  Personally, I do not see any solution other than a return to those ideas which are a true and accurate reflection of who and what we are and the true nature of our world and it's workings.

 

Food for thought, indeed. 

[Red Phoenix]

31 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

Personally, I do not see any solution other than a return to those ideas which are a true and accurate reflection of who and what we are and the true nature of our world and it's workings.

A quest for truth, essentially boils down to 'Know Thyself'.

In Ancient Greece, the philosopher Socrates famously declared that the unexamined life was not worth living. Asked to sum up what  all philosophical commandments could be reduced to, he replied: ‘Know yourself.’

Sri Mooji beautifully explains what this self-awareness means and how it can be achieved.

 

 

[Tippaporn]

13 hours ago, save the frogs said:

who are the wannabe gurus on here? 

 

There are none.  Other than the ones you falsely accuse.

save the frogs, you are an intelligent being.  Why, then, so many empty posts?

[Tippaporn]

2 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

A quest for truth, essentially boils down to 'Know Thyself'.

In Ancient Greece, the philosopher Socrates famously declared that the unexamined life was not worth living. Asked to sum up what  all philosophical commandments could be reduced to, he replied: ‘Know yourself.’

Sri Mooji beautifully explains what this self-awareness means and how it can be achieved.

 

 

As Sunmaster can attest to, since he's read Carlos Castenada, "know yourself" has been echoed by don Juan as the ultimate human endeavour.  I could not get the quote verbatim but it is roughly as follows:

There is no other task more worthy to take up than to know yourself.

 

When you understand who you are only then can you understand who is creating the entirety of your experience and the world in which that experience is framed.  And once you understand that it is you who creates your life in every facet . . . both large and seemingly insignificantly small . . . then and only then can you begin to play your true role in this world.  Only then can you begin to create with full conscious awareness.

[save the frogs]

43 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

There are none.  Other than the ones you falsely accuse.

save the frogs, you are an intelligent being.  Why, then, so many empty posts?

well, i was just being silly.

but not even sure the comment can be completely dismissed as silly nonsense.

the story of noah's ark in your bible is about god obliterating everyone, isn't it?

the answer to your question is sometimes i'm not that smart.

and also i don't have as much time and energy to devote to this thread as you do.

 

[Tippaporn]

40 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

well, i was just being silly.

but not even sure the comment can be completely dismissed as silly nonsense.

the story of noah's ark in your bible is about god obliterating everyone, isn't it?

the answer to your question is sometimes i'm not that smart.

and also i don't have as much time and energy to devote to this thread as you do.

Just so you understand, it's not my bible and it's not my God.  I do not subscribe to the bible as Christians do.  I admit that there is a great deal of wisdom within it but there is much . . . too much . . . that I do not agree with.  Much of it is, to me, a children's tale.  As to God, I do not see him as depicted in the bible or theology.  I believe in an entity which is our source but my concept of that entity is quite a departure from the usual accepted idea of what God is.  As humans I'm not sure we are even capable of wrapping our heads around what that entity truly is.

There are basically two routes to go when considering the creation of life.  Either it was all created either by happenstance with no rhyme or reason or purpose or it was intentionally created.  The latter is what I subscribe to for there is overwhelming evidence for it . . . despite that evidence being unsatisfactory to anyone else.  The former is pathetically wanting in pasting together a cohesive picture in which every facet of existence is accounted for.  Many who subscribe to the former do not seem to mind the gaping holes in the overall picture that theory presents because they do not attempt to unify all of the divergent pieces of the picture puzzle which were given to them.  The important part of that last statement is "given to them."  Whatever your views of how the world works and what ii is were not your original ideas.  They were ideas "sold" to you at some time in your life which you accepted without examination.  And those ideas became your conviction which you now, in turn, sell to others.

You're smart enough.  It's only a matter of applying yourself in an honest and objective examination of the ideas you believe to be true.  Are they truly true or are they not?  That's the never ending question for everything you hold to be true.  But undertaking that endeavour is entirely your choice.  You can make as many excuses for yourself as you like but any excuses you make are not to fool others but only yourself.

[Tippaporn]

1 hour ago, save the frogs said:

<snip>

the story of noah's ark in your bible is about god obliterating everyone, isn't it?

<snip>

 

Noah's  Ark is actually factual.  It provides the explanation as to why there are no unicorns in the world.

[Tippaporn]

This one is for one of my friends on this thread.  You know who you are.  5555555555555555555

[Tippaporn]

18 hours ago, Hummin said:

To me, it seems no matter what, most behave as you describe, as everyone else is stupid for not seeing the same as themselves, and at same time feel superior to others. 

 

What do you think about that?  

I think you're a clever one, Hummin.  That's why you're one of my favourite posters. 

It's a matter of your perspective.

 

Edited May 24, 2023 by Tippaporn

[mauGR1]

7 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

As Seth has stated on several occasions throughout his writings, the world is at a juncture where the old ideas we accept as being true on a mass level can no longer solve our current problems.  For false ideas can never work in practicality as they have no basis in reality and must therefore result only in the manifestation of problems.  Lots and lots and lots of problems.  Our problems today are massive.  Personally, I do not see any solution other than a return to those ideas which are a true and accurate reflection of who and what we are and the true nature of our world and it's workings.

Yes, it's a world of lies, and in recent years, i guess that some of us find increasingly difficult to deal with it.

Individualism is good, and so is the sense of community, and every single human being should be free to find his own balance between the 2 polarities, without coercion. 

Easier said than done.

These times though, are not going to last forever, there's a light at the end of the tunnel. 

[Hummin]

6 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Yes, it's a world of lies, and in recent years, i guess that some of us find increasingly difficult to deal with it.

Individualism is good, and so is the sense of community, and every single human being should be free to find his own balance between the 2 polarities, without coercion. 

Easier said than done.

These times though, are not going to last forever, there's a light at the end of the tunnel. 

Comfortable numb comes to mind, 

 

How deep should we be digging? Is it just randomly happenings, being covered up, or is it conspiration from top to bottom world wide and we all being fooled? 

 

somehow the system works well enough to keep people busy, and most people out of trouble? or is that another illusion? 

[mauGR1]

2 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Comfortable numb comes to mind, 

 

How deep should we be digging? Is it just randomly happenings, being covered up, or is it conspiration from top to bottom world wide and we all being fooled? 

 

somehow the system works well enough to keep people busy, and most people out of trouble? or is that another illusion? 

Well, i guess it's subjective. 

While i am slightly uncomfortable to be ruled by liars, i find also a lot of joy in meeting people who are tired of the lies and look for solutions. 

Looking things in a spiritual way, we have been warned aeons ago that while our physical reality is a reflection of spiritual reality, it can be quite deceiving.

Good questions btw.

[Tippaporn]

26 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

<snip>

These times though, are not going to last forever, there's a light at the end of the tunnel. 

Tyranny is always doomed to fail.  It's inevitable.  Why?  It defies the laws of existence.  By it's very nature tyranny creates untold suffering and sooner or later the spirit inherent in man rises up to crush it.  But I do believe it's possible for a civilisation to destroy itself.

Powerlessness is one of the main root causes.  If people understood the true power they are imbued with they could bring it to a halt literally overnight.  But as you can see, even on this thread it is extremely difficult for people to accept that they have any power.  The idea that life happens to you, for instance, is an idea that robs a people of their true power.  And the idea that life happens to you is directly related a lack of understanding about who you are.

We live in interesting times, indeed. 

[mauGR1]

7 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

The idea that life happens to you, for instance, is an idea that robs a people of their true power.  And the idea that life happens to you is directly related a lack of understanding about who you are.

That's well spotted. 

Actually i find extremely interesting to try to find out where ideas come from. 

I believe there are a lot of powerful forces at play, and one has to deal with them, and choose wisely. 

Perhaps we are part of a minority who prefer some uncomfortable truth rather than comfortable lies, but, as I'm finding out quite often recently, many folks simply don't want to hear different opinions, and they are just ok with their daily materialistic routine. 

How to deal with them, that's something i have to work out everyday, not always with a lot of success ????

[Tippaporn]

17 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Comfortable numb comes to mind, 

 

How deep should we be digging? Is it just randomly happenings, being covered up, or is it conspiration from top to bottom world wide and we all being fooled? 

 

somehow the system works well enough to keep people busy, and most people out of trouble? or is that another illusion? 

What is happening is easy to follow if one knows where the truth is being told.  Where accurate information is being given.  And if one is willing to do their own homework.  If nothing else life demands responsibility for it and so it is the inherent responsibility of each of us, and it is indeed inherent, to determine for ourselves what is true and what is false.  Most receive their information from "trusted" sources, "trusted" institutions, and therefore believe what they are being told without question.  They do not do any homework whatsoever and only repeat what they are told.

 There are definite parallels between what is happening on the world stage today and the adoption process of many of the private beliefs of men and women.  In the case of information and narratives regarding world events the masses are fed propaganda from trusted sources.  And as this information comes from trusted sources so a great many believe what they are told without question.  In the case of private beliefs we are groomed from the cradle about who we are and what the world is and how it works from trusted sources as well.  Parents, teachers, and all those who attempt to educate us about the world.  And similarly, as the explanations are given by trusted sources we are prone to believe what we are being told as being true without question also.

A person who has been fed propaganda and believes the propaganda to be true without question then repeats it to others as being true.  The ideas about us and the world which we've been fed since birth and which we no longer question as to their veracity are also repeated by us to the next generation as being true.  A cycle which repeats from generation to generation.

The lesson here is to show the detrimental effects which follow from the abdication of one's true responsibility in life - to determine what is true and what is false for ones self.  In the case of news that abdication comes in the form of unquestioned acceptance of what is being told.  In the case of many of the beliefs which an individual adopts throughout his or her life the same holds true.  The unquestioned acceptance of what is being told.

No one questions "the truth," whatever that truth may be.  It is the height of absurdity to question a "truth" once convinced that it is true.  And hence we have the astute observation by Mark Twain:

“It is easier to fool the people, than to convince them they have been fooled."

Once a person is convinced of a "truth" it is neigh on impossible to convince them otherwise.  Most of the world's problems can be attributed to people ceasing to question their beliefs.  Over a lifetime people collect untold unassimilated beliefs which are damaging to one's well being.  Many of them contradictory, I might add.  Yet going through the contents of one's mind to see what's actually there and begin the process of "cleaning house" and throwing out the rubbish is, unfortunately, not an appealing task to most.  For it means changing ones self.  And most abhor change as it requires personal effort.

It's kind of comical.  People generally want the world around them to change to their pleasing satisfaction without having to change themselves whatsoever.  When in reality all change comes from within.  It comes from examining one's beliefs and tossing those which are not to one's benefit while adopting those which are.  Then, and only then, does the outside world change it's effects.

[Tippaporn]

54 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

That's well spotted. 

Actually i find extremely interesting to try to find out where ideas come from. 

I believe there are a lot of powerful forces at play, and one has to deal with them, and choose wisely. 

Perhaps we are part of a minority who prefer some uncomfortable truth rather than comfortable lies, but, as I'm finding out quite often recently, many folks simply don't want to hear different opinions, and they are just ok with their daily materialistic routine. 

How to deal with them, that's something i have to work out everyday, not always with a lot of success ????

"Perhaps we are part of a minority who prefer some uncomfortable truth rather than comfortable lies, . . . "

Someone buy this man a drink! 

 

Free speech is everywhere under attack at the moment.  Only a single version of the world is being heavily promoted and allowed these days.  Anything which opposes the chosen narrative is quickly labeled conspiracy theory.  A term, BTW, which is said to have been created by the CIA to discredit those who were questioning the Kennedy assassination.  The label "conspiracy theory" is used to prevent people from questioning and to discredit those who do.  Which is wholly antithetical to this thread.  Which is precisely to question everything.

[mauGR1]

1 minute ago, Tippaporn said:

"Perhaps we are part of a minority who prefer some uncomfortable truth rather than comfortable lies, . . . "

Someone buy this man a drink! 

 

Free speech is everywhere under attack at the moment.  Only a single version of the world is being heavily promoted and allowed these days.  Anything which opposes the chosen narrative is quickly labeled conspiracy theory.  A term, BTW, which is said to have been created by the CIA to discredit those who were questioning the Kennedy assassination.  The label "conspiracy theory" is used to prevent people from questioning and to discredit those who do.  Which is wholly antithetical to this thread.  Which is precisely to question everything.

 

31 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

It comes from examining one's beliefs and tossing those which are not to one's benefit while adopting those which are.  Then, and only then, does the outside world change it's effects.

Basically, we have very limited power to change other people's mind, but truly unlimited power to change and improve our own.

I find Plato's allegory of the cave enlightening in this regard, we have some sort of moral duty to warn those who are chained in the darkness, but we should not expect a medal for that effort.. instead we are often treated as fools, well, I'm getting fairly used to that ????