Do you believe in God and why

[Skeptic7]

 

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

I never said anyone was going to burn in hell forever. That's what I learned , yes, but no one knows what hell will be like. It might be you in a room all by yourself. You won't have your body, so how would you burn? Mentally tortured? There are really nice people that don't believe in God, for one reason or another. Will they be in the same situation as Hitler? As far as I've learned, one sin is as bad as any other, although I don't think that myself, but it's what was taught. Will hell exist after Jesus comes again and brings all God's followers to heaven? Or will God destroy Satan and hell because there won't be any need for it anymore? I understand people say how could a loving God do such a thing? Some of us might believe the criminally insane, like Hitler, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, Qaddifi, and Jeffrey Dahmer, to name a few, belong there forever. I believe God will not let all non believers stay in such a place forever, but that's my opinion. But again, I don't make the rules.

No one knows what any of it will be like. You make all these proclamations like you consider yourself the expert on "god" and "Satan" and Heaven and all the other BS, including all the "wrong" beliefs. You proclaim all these unknowable silly things and act like you have all the answers, yet suddenly...and i quote...no one knows what hell will be like. The real truth...

 

YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT ANY OF IT WILL BE LIKE. Not a clue. None of us do. So stop playing authoritative judge, jury and executioner. You haven't a clue about any of it. You have Christian "faith". And faith is a lazy and unreliable path to truth.  

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, Mike Teavee said:

That's a lot more pragmatic view than the one I read a few pages back which I may have ascribed to you in my reply so I apologise if I was harsh.

 

I just find the view that people like Gandhi, Buddha & somebody's gay child will go to hell despite living a "Good Life" but peadophile priests will go to heaven as they didn't commit the sin of not believing in / giving up on God & repent on their death beds abhorrent. 

 

You weren't harsh enough IMO.  

[Skeptic7]

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

I have a gay son so I know. I could only hope everyone would change while they're here, including my son. As far as priests that molest, they're sick and need help, and to be kept away from any children. Why do they do this to children? Maybe it happened to them. I don't think people are born crazy, but that their childhood traumas brought them there. Some learn from a bad past, and some victimize others to get back at their abusers. If anyone ever hurt my child, I know what I would probably do, and it's not turning the other cheek, so I pray it will never happen.

Here's what your book...your god...says about your son:

 

Leviticus 20:13
If a man lies with a man as with a woman, they have both committed an abomination. They must surely be put to death.

[fredwiggy]

Just now, Skeptic7 said:

 

No one knows what any of it will be like. You make all these proclamations like you consider yourself the expert on "god" and "Satan" and Heaven and all the other BS, including all the "wrong" beliefs. You proclaim all these unknowable silly things and act like you have all the answers, yet suddenly...and i quote...no one knows what hell will be like. The real truth...

 

YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT ANY OF IT WILL BE LIKE. Not a clue. None of us do. So stop playing authoritative judge, jury and executioner. You haven't a clue about any of it. You have Christian "faith". And faith is a lazy and unreliable path to truth.  

I never said I was an expert. I know what I learned, like most everyone else who is a believer. I never said I knew what heaven or hell was going to be like. Again, I repeated what I learned along the way. If you spent more time learning how to react to a post and less assuming, you might come across as more than a troll. Don't tell others what they can or cannot do. You have no authority over anyone. I'm not judging anyone. I repeated God's rules. I didn't make them. He did. You have no idea what I do or do not know about God. Faith is all we have, and faith is enough. The post asked Do you believe in God and why. I told it like I see it. You'll find out when you die, just like everyone else. Believers have something to look forward to. Calling it all BS is your way of looking at this life as all there is, with no hope for more than what you have experienced. Why did you turn away from God, or did anyone in your childhood teach you about him? Using caps shows arrogance and disrespect. I'm guessing you learned that from the same people?

[fredwiggy]

Just now, Skeptic7 said:

Here's what your book...your god...says about your son:

 

Leviticus 20:13
If a man lies with a man as with a woman, they have both committed an abomination. They must surely be put to death.

Please refrain from assuming I don't know about the Bible's and Jesus' teaching. Read the post before replying, and look at your own life before you judge others. I don't judge. That's God's job.

[fredwiggy]

9 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

You weren't harsh enough IMO.  

Actually, unlike yourself, he was respectful, and understood what I was saying.

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I don't think people are born crazy, but that their childhood traumas brought them there.

Medical opinion differs as mental illness has been proven to run in families.

[fredwiggy]

10 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Medical opinion differs as mental illness has been proven to run in families.

Yes, but bipolar , not crazy. Crazy is learned.

[luckyluke]

In fact we are all the same, well I believe the majority of us. 

 

We eat, drink, love, enjoy the earthly pleasures and so on. 

 

It is our thinking which is different; and in this thinking there are some who believe they are the only ones who are right. 

 

This intolerance, fanatisme, haughtiness ( some are even proud of it) is sad for many. 

 

Living with those people, when  one is not as mentioned here before, needs a lot of love. 

 

Sorry to be personal fredwiggy but I am afraid that your wife and children don't have an easy living. 

Loving their husband and father and at the same time being confronted with your zealotry. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by luckyluke

[Sujo]

45 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Yes, but bipolar , not crazy. Crazy is learned.

From people who preach religion.

[fredwiggy]

4 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

In fact we are all the same, well I believe the majority of us. 

 

We eat, drink, love, enjoy the earthly pleasures and so on. 

 

It is our thinking which is different; and in this thinking there are some who believe they are the only ones who are right. 

 

This intolerance, fanatisme, haughtiness ( some are even proud of it) is sad for many. 

 

Living with those people, when  one is not as mentioned here before, needs a lot of love. 

 

Sorry to be personal fredwiggy but I am afraid that your wife and children don't have an easy living. 

Loving their husband and father and at the same time being confronted with your zealotry. 

Don't assume. It makes you look ignorant. You have absolutely no idea about my life, or how I act as a Christian in my home or around my friends. They actually are the same way. Believers that teach their children about God. It's our job as believers to spread the word. You wouldn't understand that. My wife is lucky she has a good man that isn't a chauvinist or user. My children all believe in God because I taught them about him and brought them to church, as I will do with my little one here. I'm not near a bible thumping zealot just because I have some convictions about my beliefs. Either you believe or you don't. There is only one God, and I'm right about him. Doesn't make sense to an atheist because they don't believe in God anyway. I don't see how you or a few others, who aren't believers anyway so really have no opinion on the subject of belief, can label someone if you are steadfast against God anyway. Yes, I, and all the billions like me who believe in God, feel in our hearts that God exists and is there waiting for us. You believe that when you die, there is nothing. You and everyone who thinks like you will find out, but by then it will be too late. Your first three lines are right on. After that, it's your opinion and only that because you don't live the life and don't know what goes on in anyone's life but your own. Again, I'm am NOT a bible thumping zealot but a believer. I've cursed God many times and want questions answered also, but since he's in charge, I don't doubt he knows what's best for us, and always come back to square one because my doubts mean little, as long as my faith is there.

[Sujo]

9 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Don't assume. It makes you look ignorant. You have absolutely no idea about my life, or how I act as a Christian in my home or around my friends. They actually are the same way. Believers that teach their children about God. It's our job as believers to spread the word. You wouldn't understand that. My wife is lucky she has a good man that isn't a chauvinist or user. My children all believe in God because I taught them about him and brought them to church, as I will do with my little one here. I'm not near a bible thumping zealot just because I have some convictions about my beliefs. Either you believe or you don't. There is only one God, and I'm right about him. Doesn't make sense to an atheist because they don't believe in God anyway. I don't see how you or a few others, who aren't believers anyway so really have no opinion on the subject of belief, can label someone if you are steadfast against God anyway. Yes, I, and all the billions like me who believe in God, feel in our hearts that God exists and is there waiting for us. You believe that when you die, there is nothing. You and everyone who thinks like you will find out, but by then it will be too late. Your first three lines are right on. After that, it's your opinion and only that because you don't live the life and don't know what goes on in anyone's life but your own. Again, I'm am NOT a bible thumping zealot but a believer. I've cursed God many times and want questions answered also, but since he's in charge, I don't doubt he knows what's best for us, and always come back to square one because my doubts mean little, as long as my faith is there.

Child abuse then saying god makes you do it.

[luckyluke]

10 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Don't assume

I don't anymore, you just proof you are a zealot. 

Sad in my eyes. 

You, of course, are proud of it. 

If your god exist and is agree with what you do and think, he is definitely a bad god. 

Even hell must be better than to live with him in such a case. 

But ok, I am done with you, I hate bigotry. 

You don't deserve any respect, even attention. 

 

[Sunmaster]

4 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

I don't anymore, you just proof you are a zealot. 

Sad in my eyes. 

You, of course, are proud of it. 

If your god exist and is agree with what you do and think, he is definitely a bad god. 

Even hell must be better than to live with him in such a case. 

But ok, I am done with you, I hate bigotry. 

You don't deserve any respect, even attention. 

 

That's quite a statement from one who never fails to preach how equal all religious/spiritual opinions are. 

Seems your opinion is more equal than fredwiggy's. Hmmm, interesting...????????????

[luckyluke]

Just now, Sunmaster said:

That's quite a statement from one who never fails to preach how equal all religious/spiritual opinions are. 

Seems your opinion is more equal than fredwiggy's. Hmmm, interesting...????????????

Not surprised you don't understand that zealotry is not an opinion. 

[fredwiggy]

25 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

I don't anymore, you just proof you are a zealot. 

Sad in my eyes. 

You, of course, are proud of it. 

If your god exist and is agree with what you do and think, he is definitely a bad god. 

Even hell must be better than to live with him in such a case. 

But ok, I am done with you, I hate bigotry. 

You don't deserve any respect, even attention. 

 

And again you are wrong. If you read what I wrote and not just skim through mine and others posts, you'll see I'm not a fanatic. Uncompromising? Yes, because if you aren't. that leaves room for doubt that there isn't a God. I'm not 8 and just learning about God. I've learned from day one straight through to now, and have never wavered. Why? Because a creator makes sense to me, and to everyone else that doesn't use science as an excuse for everything. Why? Because yes, I want to go to heaven and understand that God is in charge and he sets the rules. Why? Because a creator wouldn't create man and then let him die and have nothing. That's where your soul comes in, but you don't believe in that anyway. I didn't prove anything besides the  fact I'm a believer. I'm not proud of anything I do, just happy I can help others. My God does exist and understands my heart is for him. If you don't believe, GOD says, through his word, you'll go to hell, not I. Everyone deserves respect, and with that statement, you prove what you really are. All Christians agree with me, including the 6 that I talk to on the phone regularly and that read these posts. You can have your opinion and I have my belief. I hope for your sake you change your thinking soon.

[fredwiggy]

42 minutes ago, Sujo said:

Child abuse then saying god makes you do it.

Child abuse is done by those that have been abused themselves. It has nothing to do with God.

[Sunmaster]

50 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

Not surprised you don't understand that zealotry is not an opinion. 

What you call zealotry is obviously not zealotry for him. Who are you to judge? 

For all you know, he might be right and you're wrong. ????

 

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, fredwiggy said:

...

It's our job as believers to spread the word. You wouldn't understand that.

...

Spreading the word by your acts and behavior, is fine and the best way to 'preach' as it is not intrusive and shows respect for the beliefs of others.

Spreading the word by going door-to-door peddling your beliefs or worse - trying to convert the heathens from cultures with different belief-systems is both arrogant and ignorant.

 

[Tagged]

23 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

And again you are wrong. If you read what I wrote and not just skim through mine and others posts, you'll see I'm not a fanatic. Uncompromising? Yes, because if you aren't. that leaves room for doubt that there isn't a God. I'm not 8 and just learning about God. I've learned from day one straight through to now, and have never wavered. Why? Because a creator makes sense to me, and to everyone else that doesn't use science as an excuse for everything. Why? Because yes, I want to go to heaven and understand that God is in charge and he sets the rules. Why? Because a creator wouldn't create man and then let him die and have nothing. That's where your soul comes in, but you don't believe in that anyway. I didn't prove anything besides the  fact I'm a believer. I'm not proud of anything I do, just happy I can help others. My God does exist and understands my heart is for him. If you don't believe, GOD says, through his word, you'll go to hell, not I. Everyone deserves respect, and with that statement, you prove what you really are. All Christians agree with me, including the 6 that I talk to on the phone regularly and that read these posts. You can have your opinion and I have my belief. I hope for your sake you change your thinking soon.

Using science is not a excuse, but it is a drive to understand more, and even if it is just theoretical science it inspire and science have given us a better life, but I have to admit, religion have been a great political tool to collect people, and give them a drive To cooperate and go the same direction, but also been shameless in many negative things to. 

 

Science inspire and make people curious about who we are, where we come from, and what connects all of us. To me religion is just a tool with many rules that makes sense for the time being when written, and also many things that also matters today and make us more connected. However, it is also a dangerous tool that we have many proof of trough the time. We are animals who live in hierarchy no matter religion, heritage you come from or political colour you are. All religion is connected, and the major one I believe inspired every other cultur and god spirits must have been Hinduism, but there have been spiritualism and religions before Hinduism as well. Religion is a plague where everyone who believe in some way, think they are right, and everyone else is wrong! It becomes psycothic at the end, and often influenced and Often driven And fueled by people with severe dissorders. I understand it is lifesaving for some who need something to hold on to, but for others, who do not see the same, hear the same, or understand the same, it can be a huge problem, for individuals, family and society in all, and whole regions becomes a warzone for who belive in which brother or in which god. There is no common sense when religion are given to much space and it needs to be controlled. Heavely controlled. 

[luckyluke]

14 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

What you call zealotry is obviously not zealotry for him. Who are you to judge? 

For all you know, he might be right and you're wrong. ????

 

I know I can be wrong,

he will never admit he may be wrong.

Which  is zealotry.

One can of course questioning every value. 

[Sunmaster]

19 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

I know I can be wrong,

he will never admit he may be wrong.

Which  is zealotry.

One can of course questioning every value. 

The thing is, you can't have it both ways.

For 550 pages you constantly banged on about "all opinions are equal" when it comes to spirituality, because "no one can possibly know what's what".

So, you either stick to your favourite precept, be consistent and accept fredwiggy's point of view, or you renounce your previous statements and do what you found so abhorrent up to this point: place your opinion above someone else's. 

 

 

Edited June 16, 2020 by Sunmaster

[pineapple01]

Wont be long before BLM attack The God Squad.  Jesus was Black probably, just as a warm up.

[Trujillo]

If God is all-powerful, can he make a cubical sphere? 

[luckyluke]

1 minute ago, Sunmaster said:

The thing is, you can't have it both ways.

For 550 pages you constantly banged on about "all opinions are equal" when it comes to spirituality, because no one can possibly know what's what.

So, you either stick to your favourite precept, be consistent and accept fredwiggy's point of view, or you renounce your previous statements and do what you found so abhorrent up to this point: place your opinion above someone else's. 

 

 

I am thinking, I may indeed be wrong.

 

Fredwiggy has indeed right to his opinion.

 

I only have problems with it because it is so extreme ( well at least for me ).

 

So sorry Fredwiggy, I am totally not agree with you,

but your opinion is as good ( or bad )than mine is.

 

Thanks Sunmaster to point it to me.

 

Time for me to relax and cogitate by listening to some classical music ( Erik Satie this time )

 

 

 

[Tagged]

32 minutes ago, pineapple01 said:

Wont be long before BLM attack The God Squad.  Jesus was Black probably, just as a warm up.

Every blond blue eyed jesus pic and statues, have to be taken down, and replaced with correct colours

[thaibeachlovers]

22 hours ago, VincentRJ said:

The topic of the thread is not about spirituality but about God. Have you forgotten that, after 556 pages of comments?

LOL.

Have you read so few posts that you don't see how many times God is mentioned in connection with spirituality?

How can anyone even try to make a distinction between God and spirituality- there is none. God and spirit are one and the same. Even the Christian religion recognizes that- father son and Holy Ghost ( spirit ), three parts of one whole.

 

22 hours ago, VincentRJ said:

The issue for me, is the apparent capacity or tendency of so many people throughout the world to firmly believe in something for which there is no sound evidence.

Do you not believe in "love"? There is no evidence for the existence of "love". Have you never experienced Deja Vu? There is no evidence that it exists, but many of us experience it.

Can't be bothered with writing all the dozens of other inexplicable things that I've experienced in my life, but they exist.

Have a nice day.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Trujillo said:

If God is all-powerful, can he make a cubical sphere? 

Of course. God isn't a gender, but God can make anything God wants. However God isn't going to do party tricks to impress the non believers. Creating the universe is about as cool as it gets in anyone's opinion.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, pineapple01 said:

Wont be long before BLM attack The God Squad.  Jesus was Black probably, just as a warm up.

Rubbish. The Semitic race isn't black.

[fredwiggy]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

Spreading the word by your acts and behavior, is fine and the best way to 'preach' as it is not intrusive and shows respect for the beliefs of others.

Spreading the word by going door-to-door peddling your beliefs or worse - trying to convert the heathens from cultures with different belief-systems is both arrogant and ignorant.

 

I never have or would go door to door, I'm not a Jehovah's witness. Trying to convert is saving their souls, with their agreement of course, and is neither arrogant or ignorant. If you knew there was a God, wouldn't you do the same? Maybe not. You don't know there's a God, and you think I can't prove there's one, so maybe I shouldn't do anything. I choose to do otherwise. But I'm not pushy. I haven't told anyone you HAVE to convert, I just told them the consequences as I see them. What you do is your choice.