tax residency certificate

[kiever]

hi for all. i need tax residency certificate from RD to give my home country tax department. i will stay more than 183 days in one calender year in LOS. Currently i have 6 months multiple Entry tourist visa and im planning to buy 20 years elite visa . my visa already doesnt allow me to work in LOS so i dont work in thailand and i have no income in thailand.this is certiticate i want : https://www.rd.go.th/publish/21978.0.html

 

anyone has experience to get it ? can i get this certificate with no income in thailand ? i must apply this document after i spend 183 days in Thailand ? can i get this certificate with tourist visa ?

[OJAS]

3 hours ago, kiever said:

i need tax residency certificate from RD to give my home country tax department.

Is this something which they have specifically asked you for? I have now lived in Thailand for 10 years now on retirement extensions - so, like you, I derive no income here. And HMRC back in the UK have never (to date, at least) asked me for such a certificate!

[kiever]

Tax office in my home country  and my bank in Turkey demanded it. I work online and I have Multiple incomes from overseas, not from Thailand. If I cannot provide tax residency certificate, I must pay tax on Turkey. I already live in Thailand. How I can get this document on tourist visa ? I can send money from overseas to my Thai bank account and pay its tax. This is good idea ? I need help for that. Agencies such as tiktok and maneerat cannot help me for this. Do you know an agency to arrange me this certificate?

Edited May 26, 2019 by kiever

[userabcd]

You really need to do some basic research first on the tax laws of your country and the tax treaty between Turkey and Thailand. 

 

Where do you pay tax whilst earning income whilst resident in Thailand, do you have a work permit to conduct your online work from Thailand?

 

You can contact one of the bigger international accounting firms (mazars, PWC, or others) and get them to analyse your situation and give you a written opinion report.

 

Residency in Thailand is spending over 183 days a year here. Maybe you are also tax resident in another jurisdiction?

 

I think RD will not give you a tax residence certificate if you have never registered for, or paid tax in Thailand.

 

You could always yourself go down to the nearest revenue department office and discuss your situation with them.

 

 

Edited May 26, 2019 by userabcd

[jackdd]

2 hours ago, kiever said:

Tax office in my home country  and my bank in Turkey demanded it. I work online and I have Multiple incomes from overseas, not from Thailand. If I cannot provide tax residency certificate, I must pay tax on Turkey. I already live in Thailand. How I can get this document on tourist visa ? I can send money from overseas to my Thai bank account and pay its tax. This is good idea ? I need help for that. Agencies such as tiktok and maneerat cannot help me for this. Do you know an agency to arrange me this certificate?

I think you don't undestand how doing business / tax works (at least in most countries).

Usually you need to have your business registered somewhere to be allowed to do business. Proabably right now you have some kind of personal business registered in Turkey?

[kiever]

i am a trader, invest stock markets and get dividents and also i have bond interests  from my bank in switzerland. my bank asks me tax residency certificate and Turkey tax department also want to see this document. basically my home country says if im not a tax resident anywhere else, i must pay tax in my home country. i have no work permit in thailand but i live here with tourist visa. i have no registered business anywhere and my only  residency address in thailand.

Edited May 26, 2019 by kiever

[userabcd]

I think your home country tax department does not consider you to be non resident if you are using tourist visas to live in a foreign country.

 

How long have you been in Thailand and how many days for each tax period?

Are your dividends, income etc.. being paid back to a Turkey bank account?

Which bank is asking for the tax resident certificate; Turkey or Switzerland?

 

Do you still have ties in Turkey such as a home, bank accounts and other things which tie you back to your home country?

 

You say you want to pay tax in Thailand, then why not pay tax in Turkey?

 

From a brief web search below for Turkey:

 

Residence status for tax purposes

Residents include individuals with legal permanent residence in Turkey and those who reside in Turkey for more than six months during one calendar year. Temporary absence does not interrupt the continuity of residence in Turkey.

The civil law defines residency as an "intention to settle down permanently." The law does not specify any objective criteria for the determination of residency. However, factors, such as purchasing an apartment in Turkey, closing business operations abroad or having vital social and economic interests in Turkey, may be considered in determining Turkish residency.

An exception to the 6-month rule described above applies to expatriates such as businesspersons, scientists, experts, employees of governments or journalists who come to Turkey to perform temporary and predefined work as well as those who have arrived for the purpose of education, medical treatment, rest and travel. Such persons are considered to be non-residents even if they stay in Turkey longer than 6 months in a calendar year.

In general, if an individual is a non-resident of Turkey under these rules, the individual is also a non-resident for purposes of the application of Turkey's tax treaties. This may affect the taxation of non-Turkish income in the source country.

Edited May 26, 2019 by userabcd

[kiever]

thank you for your answer.
- i will be in thailand more than  183 days in july. i am spending in turkey less than 90 days each year. i want tax residency certificate from thailand, because i will pay no tax in thailand unless i bring my overseas incomes same year to thailand. therefore i want to obtain that document. that document is demanded by my bank in switzerland, not a bank in turkey and all incomes is paid in swiss bank. but banks in switzerland share our informations with Turkish tax departments.  and i also must report my overseas and abroad bank accounts to goverment. i have no income in Turkey but our tax system make me responsible to pay tax for all world incomes, not only incomes in Turkey - unless i have a tax residency in another country.
to make it short, i need that document and i dont know how to get it.

Edited May 26, 2019 by kiever

[userabcd]

The only place you will obtain such a tax residency certificate is from the tax department in Thailand .

 

I suggest you speak to someone at the Thai tax department or to get advice from someone at one of the big international accountancy firms as I suggested before.

 

 

[kiever]

I sent some mails but no answer ????

[Briggsy]

Do you have a Thai tax number? Have you ever completed a Thai tax return? I suspect not. I would advise you to just hang on a moment before opening a can of worms.

 

Your goal is to convince the Turkish tax authorities that you are non-resident for tax purposes. That should be your area of focus.

[userabcd]

19 minutes ago, kiever said:

I sent some mails but no answer ????

As expected, they do not know who you are.

[mshs]

You can't be tax-resident in a country where you are a tourist.

Tax-residencies are available for sale, but that you would be beyond the reach of "digital nomads" living in Thailand.

 

My suggestion to you is to make your peace with the authorities right away.

You could then look into buying residence (work-permit) in Qatar and living in Thailand and hope Turkish tax authorities waste your taxes in 2020 and beyond by putting scrutiny to your countrymen ????

But in all likelihood, they  have painted a a target on your chest, sorry.

 

[JimGant]

14 hours ago, kiever said:

i have no income in Turkey but our tax system make me responsible to pay tax for all world incomes, not only incomes in Turkey - unless i have a tax residency in another country.

Sounds like the situation with Norwegians living in Thailand: Show that you paid Thai tax on all the income that would also be subject to Norwegian tax, then, you're exempt from Norwegian taxes. Good deal, if Thai taxes are lower than Norwegian taxes.

 

The old days of, "thailand doesn't tax me, 'cause I bring the money in in a later year" and "my country doesn't tax me 'cause I live 180 days plus in Thailand" are gone. The OECD has, of late, been rewriting tax boilerplate treaties to preclude "duel NO taxation", meaning, you're now going to pay taxes to either mother country, or resident country. So, it sounds like that "tax residency certificate" from Thailand equates to a filed Thai income tax statement. Welcome to the new world of -- you're gonna pay somebody to fix potholes.

[Crisu]

Tax office in my home country  and my bank in Turkey demanded it. I work online and I have Multiple incomes from overseas, not from Thailand. If I cannot provide tax residency certificate, I must pay tax on Turkey. I already live in Thailand. How I can get this document on tourist visa ? I can send money from overseas to my Thai bank account and pay its tax. This is good idea ? I need help for that. Agencies such as tiktok and maneerat cannot help me for this. Do you know an agency to arrange me this certificate?

  Your first step would be to apply for a Tax ID in Thailand, since this is a condition to apply for this certificate

 

In order to apply for a Tax ID you must have taxable income e.g. a Job in TH with work permit.

 

If you dont have a job or other taxable income/business you can apply for a TIN by the way of investing some money in a bank account for which the bank will deduct some withholding tax. The next year you can ask the Thai Revenue Department to refund you this withholding tax by a tax declaration. To be able to make a Tax declaration you will need to apply for a Tax ID.

This is how i received my Thai Tax ID this year, but i did not filled a Tax declaration to ask for the refund of the withholding tax because it was only little THB and not worth the effort.

 

So if you are in the position to apply for a Tax ID and you stay longe than 180 days in Thailand, then you just have to fill a tax declaration and can apply for a Certificate of Rsidence from the Thai Revenue Department accoring to their own website.

As you can see there is no condition regarding which kind of Visa you have or you must have a Job or other kind of business.  You just need to fill a tax declaration in which you only declare the withholding tax on your bank interest.

 

 

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/21978.0.html

 

 

 

 

Edited May 27, 2019 by Crisu

[Crisu]

 

 

[topt]

12 hours ago, kiever said:

I sent some mails but no answer ????

Not unusual in Thailand.

 

@Crisu gave you the most relevant answer for your situation.

 

You may still be able to get a tax ID without any bank interest if you go and talk nicely to your local revenue office. Especially as normally you have to file between January 1 and the end of  March.

 

I would strongly suggest that if you don't speak Thai to make sure you have someone with you who can translate and understands what you are trying to do.

[kiever]

I have another idea 

 

I will go rd and ask Thai tax id (TIN) because I want to send money from overseas to my Thai bank account and I want to pay tax for this money. I believe RD will give me tax id for that purpose  ? 

 

And then I will really send some money and make tax declaration to pay its tax by an accountant agency. 

 

And after that I can get tax residency certificate? 

 

This idea will work ?

Edited May 28, 2019 by kiever

[Crisu]

2 hours ago, kiever said:

I have another idea 

 

I will go rd and ask Thai tax id (TIN) because I want to send money from overseas to my Thai bank account and I want to pay tax for this money. I believe RD will give me tax id for that purpose  ? 

 

And then I will really send some money and make tax declaration to pay its tax by an accountant agency. 

 

And after that I can get tax residency certificate? 

 

This idea will work ?

 

Interesting idea, because in general there is no duty to pay tax on money that you just send from abroad to thailand.

Only if it is some kind of income from abroad that is taxable in thailand but for that you have to prove it is really taxable  income

 

 

But anyway you will have to wait until next year to make your tax declaration and try it this way. I dont know if this works but i would also recommend to you to also put some money in a thai bank fixed deposit accout and the bank is deducting some withholding tax that you can claim back later, because i know that this way it really works to obtain a Thai Tax ID which would also enable you to make a tax declaration later and if you stayed more than 180 days in TH you can apply for the CoR from the revenue department

 

Ah, and bay the way, i had a thai friend with me, who assisted me with the revenue department in Bangkok. I dont know, where you stay, but you could just try to contact them personally and ask them (not by email) if and what you need to obtain a Tax ID right now. Maybe they are more flexible.

 

I know about the issue with some banks asking for a TIN. Usually the banks are satisfied just with a TIN and they not ask for a CoR from the Thai Reveneue department. Maybe you should also consider to change your bank to make your life more easy.

Edited May 28, 2019 by Crisu

[kiever]

thanK you for your answers. i will go RD with my gf and post here the results.

[YT3k72Em]

It's possible all they need is a TIN and not a certificate.