Johnson warns EU against any 'Napoleonic' tariffs in no-deal Brexit

[welovesundaysatspace]

21 hours ago, vogie said:

Don't be so defensive all the time when somebody critisizes the mghty EU. From the FT.

 

"Tusk says ‘special place in hell’ for Brexit campaigners"

 

https://www.ft.com/video/80bd4ec7-50d3-4ccf-8a5f-ba34a2257297

 

 

 

 

Again, that’s not true. You apparently don’t know what quotation marks mean or how to use them. 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

Of course there was, Article 50 specifies that a withdrawal agreement should be put in place before membership comes to an end. The withdrawal agreement deals with social and financial matters and has nothing to do with trade.

Theresa May in her usual style tried to circumvent the regulations in an attempt to put it all under one umbrella. When the EU pointed out that was not the Article 50 that the UK had signed up to, the brexiteers as usual blamed the EU.

No. 

 

Article 50 states that the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. 

 

Article 50 also states that treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after notification to withdraw, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

 

But Article 50 does not specify that a withdrawal agreement has to be in place before membership comes to an end.

[CharlieH]

Reported post removed

[CG1 Blue]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

Of course there was, Article 50 specifies that a withdrawal agreement should be put in place before membership comes to an end. The withdrawal agreement deals with social and financial matters and has nothing to do with trade.

Theresa May in her usual style tried to circumvent the regulations in an attempt to put it all under one umbrella. When the EU pointed out that was not the Article 50 that the UK had signed up to, the brexiteers as usual blamed the EU.

I don't think this is correct.  The EU insisted on a withdrawal agreement (including the 'divorce bill') being implemented before trade negotiations could commence, and May went along with it. Article 50 doesn't specify this timetable / sequence as far as I'm aware.  Do you have a link to prove otherwise? 

[evadgib]

Happy for this Brexit related link to be moved if there's a better place for it:

And this one too:

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by evadgib

[CharlieH]

Off topic removed.

[wilcopops]

14 hours ago, Dene16 said:

350,000 new migrants + entering the country every year

More babies being born by migrants than uk nationals in many parts of the country

So in ten years time around another 4 million + non nationals to cripple an already failing NHS, schools, housing

 

Damage to the country is nothing compared to what it would of been for our children

s someone has already said remainers all seem to have a personal reason for their decision with no real thought to the consequences in the future

Possibly the most facile and ill-infirmed post on the whole thread

[wilcopops]

Immigration is not a problem...it is those who fear it and those who twist it to suit their own agenda who are the problem.

Brexit will not change immigration as it is governed by international laws.

One wave of immigrants it will cause will be elderly expats from Spain who suddenly find themselves without access to pension or healthcare.

Apart from them can anyone cite people living in the EU who plan to move to UK because they think Brexit is such a good idea?

[sandyf]

14 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

I don't think this is correct.  The EU insisted on a withdrawal agreement (including the 'divorce bill') being implemented before trade negotiations could commence, and May went along with it. Article 50 doesn't specify this timetable / sequence as far as I'm aware.  Do you have a link to prove otherwise? 

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/brexit/brexit-brief-article-50

 

What Article 50 does not address is the Treaties coming to an end without a withdrawal agreement in place. Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, nauseus said:

No. 

 

Article 50 states that the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. 

 

Article 50 also states that treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after notification to withdraw, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

 

But Article 50 does not specify that a withdrawal agreement has to be in place before membership comes to an end.

Feel free to interpret things any way you want, does not change anything. The EU is in the driving seat and always will be, whatever you say.

"they need us more than we need them" - the brexit myth.

 

In fact I may have come to the conclusion that "no deal" is the best way forward.

 

However, the influential pollster Sir John Curtice has suggested that this might be changing. An overview of polls by the elections expert revealed a marked swing in favour of independence among people who voted to remain in the EU referendum.

Curtice says: “It would seem that the Brexit impasse has motivated some Remain supporters in recent months to re-evaluate their attitudes towards the union.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/politics-explained-independence-brexit-scotland-snp-a8992636.html

[vogie]

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/brexit/brexit-brief-article-50

 

What Article 50 does not address is the Treaties coming to an end without a withdrawal agreement in place. Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

Biased much Sandy?

The EU are so arrogant they though no member state would dare to leave their little jolly boys club.

 

[dick dasterdly]

42 minutes ago, vogie said:

Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

Biased much Sandy?

The EU are so arrogant they though no member state would dare to leave their little jolly boys club.

 

And even after the brits. voted to leave, were arrogant enough to decide the 'best way forward' was to continue - rather than accepting any kind of reform ☹️.

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, wilcopops said:

Immigration is not a problem...it is those who fear it and those who twist it to suit their own agenda who are the problem.

Brexit will not change immigration as it is governed by international laws.

One wave of immigrants it will cause will be elderly expats from Spain who suddenly find themselves without access to pension or healthcare.

Apart from them can anyone cite people living in the EU who plan to move to UK because they think Brexit is such a good idea?

Possibly the most facile and ill-informed post on the whole thread.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

Feel free to interpret things any way you want, does not change anything. The EU is in the driving seat and always will be, whatever you say.

"they need us more than we need them" - the brexit myth.

 

In fact I may have come to the conclusion that "no deal" is the best way forward.

 

However, the influential pollster Sir John Curtice has suggested that this might be changing. An overview of polls by the elections expert revealed a marked swing in favour of independence among people who voted to remain in the EU referendum.

Curtice says: “It would seem that the Brexit impasse has motivated some Remain supporters in recent months to re-evaluate their attitudes towards the union.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/politics-explained-independence-brexit-scotland-snp-a8992636.html

This is not an interpretation. That's your job! 

[Loiner]

Possibly the most facile and ill-infirmed post on the whole thread

Yet possibly the truest and most accurate. The combined B.liar and EU policies over past twenty years or so have left the UK with a massive overpopulation problem due to rampant immigration.

[Dene16]

14 hours ago, wilcopops said:

Possibly the most facile and ill-infirmed post on the whole thread

Possibly the most ignorant statement in the whole thread

[nontabury]

7 hours ago, wilcopops said:

Immigration is not a problem...it is those who fear it and those who twist it to suit their own agenda who are the problem.

Brexit will not change immigration as it is governed by international laws.

One wave of immigrants it will cause will be elderly expats from Spain who suddenly find themselves without access to pension or healthcare.

Apart from them can anyone cite people living in the EU who plan to move to UK because they think Brexit is such a good idea?

 

It may not be a problem for you, however for many people who actually live in the U.K. it’s a very big problem,examples being employment,housing 

medical treatment, schooling and crime. But don’t you worry yourselfish self,as I’m sure these will not effect you.

Edited July 9, 2019 by nontabury

[sandyf]

6 hours ago, vogie said:

Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

Biased much Sandy?

The EU are so arrogant they though no member state would dare to leave their little jolly boys club.

 

You are perfectly free to believe that leaving without an agreement would be an outcome from rational thinking, obviously biased that way but time to face reality. Brexit is not and never has been in the interests of the UK public. Gatt 24, another unworkable theory.

 

“If there is no agreement, then Article 24 would not apply, and the standard WTO terms would,” said Mr Azevedo.

Standard WTO terms involve tariffs of anything up to 10 per cent on cars and 35 per cent on dairy products. If the UK were to waive tariffs unilaterally for EU exporters under these terms, it would have to do the same for all 164 WTO members around the world or face charges of breaching fair access rules.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-brexit-business-wto-gatt-24-article-eu-trade-leave-a8996001.html

 

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, nauseus said:

This is not an interpretation. That's your job! 

I don't have a job.

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, Loiner said:

Yet possibly the truest and most accurate. The combined B.liar and EU policies over past twenty years or so have left the UK with a massive overpopulation problem due to rampant immigration.

As far as some brexiteers are concerned, foreigners are foreigners even if they are born in the UK.

 

A pensioner who told a black woman “when Brexit comes you will be gone” has been fined £600.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/brexit-hate-crime-black-woman-gone-london-pensioner-a8983321.html

 

 

The report said hate crime was one of the consequences “unleashed upon many minority communities” by the 2016 EU referendum, after which there was a spike in reports.

“The nature of the attacks was serious – characterised by physical assaults, threats to life and stabbings,” it added. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-hate-crime-muslims-jews-rising-uk-suicide-attacks-report-extremism-a8763816.html

Edited July 9, 2019 by sandyf

[transam]

4 minutes ago, sandyf said:

As far as brexiteers are concerned, foreigners are foreigners even if they are born in the UK.

 

A pensioner who told a black woman “when Brexit comes you will be gone” has been fined £600.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/brexit-hate-crime-black-woman-gone-london-pensioner-a8983321.html

 

 

The report said hate crime was one of the consequences “unleashed upon many minority communities” by the 2016 EU referendum, after which there was a spike in reports.

“The nature of the attacks was serious – characterised by physical assaults, threats to life and stabbings,” it added. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-hate-crime-muslims-jews-rising-uk-suicide-attacks-report-extremism-a8763816.html

What a daft post...I am for Brexit and two of my chums of near forty years family are from the Caribean..Think you ought to sort your head out  before you post more crap...

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, nontabury said:

 

It may not be a problem for you, however for many people who actually live in the U.K. it’s a very big problem,examples being employment,housing 

medical treatment, schooling and crime. But don’t you worry yourselfish self,as I’m sure these will not effect you.

Of course it is all down to EU immigrants who have single handedly decimated UK services. Absolutely nothing to do with government policy and underfunding.

[CG1 Blue]

8 hours ago, wilcopops said:

Brexit will not change immigration as it is governed by international laws.

You shouldn't really call somebody else "ill-infirmed", and then immediately after write this nonsense. Epic fail Mr Pops ????

[sandyf]

16 minutes ago, transam said:

What a daft post...I am for Brexit and two of my chums of near forty years family are from the Caribean..Think you ought to sort your head out  before you post more crap...

Time you faced reality and accept there is hate crime being carried out by brexiteers, and there are brexiteers that blame everything on immigrants.

I will however apologise for omitting the word 'some' and have edited the post.

I should point out that the initial comment was in respect of the article and not general.

Edited July 9, 2019 by sandyf

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Time you faced reality and accept there is hate crime being carried out by brexiteers, and there are brexiteers that blame everything on immigrants.

I will however apologise for omitting the word 'some' and have edited the post.

I should point out that the initial comment was in respect of the article and not general.

Brexiteers are also responsible for global warming as well and they all put their rubbish into the sea to kill all the fish 

[CG1 Blue]

7 hours ago, sandyf said:

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/brexit/brexit-brief-article-50

 

What Article 50 does not address is the Treaties coming to an end without a withdrawal agreement in place. Probably thought that no member state would ever be mad enough to take that route.

Article 50 doesn't stop the two parties from negotiating a withdrawal agreement and a trade agreement at the same time. You seemed to suggest that May wanted this, but it would have been breaking the rules.

In any case, it's clear that May let the EU negotiators set the pace and dictate the rules of engagement from the outset. A strong UK PM wouldn't have let that happen. 

[Jip99]

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Of course it is all down to EU immigrants who have single handedly decimated UK services. Absolutely nothing to do with government policy and underfunding.

 

 

You think EU (and other) immigrants don’t put pressure on UK services ?

[petemoss]

1 hour ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

You think EU (and other) immigrants don’t put pressure on UK services ?

Not as much as Brexiteers and haters of anyone not of British descent would like to make out. I have several family members working in the NHS. They all agree that the NHS is at breaking point. Not one of them blame immigrants, they all put the blame squarely on a spectacular lack of funding by the government.

[Loiner]

As far as some brexiteers are concerned, foreigners are foreigners even if they are born in the UK.
 
A pensioner who told a black woman “when Brexit comes you will be gone” has been fined £600.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/brexit-hate-crime-black-woman-gone-london-pensioner-a8983321.html
 
 

The report said hate crime was one of the consequences “unleashed upon many minority communities” by the 2016 EU referendum, after which there was a spike in reports.

“The nature of the attacks was serious – characterised by physical assaults, threats to life and stabbings,” it added. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-hate-crime-muslims-jews-rising-uk-suicide-attacks-report-extremism-a8763816.html

As far as many nations are concerned, place of birth does not confer their nationality. Think horses and stables.
Trying to paint Brexiteers as racist also does not cut it. You also do not even know the Brexit leanings of any of those concerned in your points. They could have easily been young middle class left wing graduate southern Remainers.
The problem of UKs overpopulation is still with us, no matter how you try to vilify those who raise the issue. Our EU membership contributes to the problem.

[wilcopops]

4 hours ago, Dene16 said:

Possibly the most ignorant statement in the whole thread

would you care to elucidate?