Any stats avail on the number of expats returning home?

[smutcakes]

I feel sorry for Vietnam ???? Give it a few years and they will get bored of all the whingy self entitled expats as well. Not exactly sure what these people feel any of these countries owe them.

[madmen]

I dont think getting Thailand's rejects and financially insecure expats is what Vietnam had in mind. I'm sure when their hospitals are jammed up with uninsured old men it to will look at tightening its visas as well, just a matter of time really .

[meand]

I am guessing, number of people full force threatening to leave @ 90%.

 

Number of people actually leaving, 0.07%. 

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, emptypockets said:

Australia is a very big place.North Queensland , Northern WA or the NT have climates similar to Thailand. 

I have a place in NQ if you interested.  House and twenty acres,  offers around 500,000 AUD will receive consideration.

That's probably the going rate for houses in Australia. One can probably buy one just as good in Chiang Mai for 150,000 AUD, admittedly not with twenty acres of land.

Even with the depressed exchange rate, 500,000 AUD should last a retiree 10 - 15 years in Thailand. Combined with a part OAP, almost indefinitely.

The last time I was in those areas was some time ago. Permit me to doubt they are now brimming over with beautiful women like Thailand has.

Cairns or Atherton? The Atherton climate is quite tolerable.

[Lacessit]

I don't think it's possible on a thread like this to get factual data on who is deserting Thailand, only anecdotal statements and opinions.

My best guess is many who don't meet the financial requirements have found other methods to ensure they can stay here. While Thailand is not as farang-friendly as other SE Asian nations, it's hard fact that it has the best infrastructure of the affordable destinations for retirees.

I do know two Americans in my condo who have recently done their retirement extensions. I also know neither were within a bull's roar of being able to meet the financial requirements.

[bkk6060]

5 hours ago, Kurtf said:

I too am completely fed up with the moving goal posts. I feel unwelcome here now. After living here 7 years I am ready to return to my home country. But the problem is with the declining economy in Thailand, I am finding it almost impossible to sell the house I built and without that happening, I am financially STUCK here.

Blame it on the economy, but you are the one who bought a house in a foreign country.

I certainly never understand why people buy a house here or in any foreign country. Then complain how much they dislike the place and cannot sell it so are stuck. 

Especially when rents are so darn cheap here.

Lesson learned I guess 

[bkk6060]

40 minutes ago, madmen said:

I dont think getting Thailand's rejects and financially insecure expats is what Vietnam had in mind. I'm sure when their hospitals are jammed up with uninsured old men it to will look at tightening its visas as well, just a matter of time really .

Right on.

Should be interesting if any significant numbers are going.  Which I doubt is the case..

[CGW]

1 hour ago, Toany said:

It all depends on the immigration officer you see. They obviously don't apply all the rules to you.
You are lucky
In Thailand goal posts have wheels

Lucky! in what way? - I follow their fairly simple rules for staying here, I have had 15 retirement visa's - non have been a problem.

[gamini]

9 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

A sense of pending economic turmoil is palpable worldwide. In addition to its vulnerability to a potential global slowdown, Thailand's economy also appears to be extremely vulnerable to climate change because of its impact on both the agricultural and tourism sectors. This year, with little rain and the fall armyworm wreaking havoc in corn and rice fields, is not going to be very prosperous in rural Thailand. Might be partially what's behind the pickup in freelancers you observed down in BKK.

 

I'm planning on repatriating in the future, but am in 'wait-and-see' mode as there is likely to be a lot of volatility in asset prices, interest rates, inflation, exchange rates, and entitlement program dependability when the shoe drops.

 

My sense is that maybe there's been between a smattering to one or two thousand expats in total who have actually left. The truth, I suspect, is that had not housing costs skyrocketed exponentially in the West since 2008 as a result of central bank quantitative easing, far more would have left or would be planning to repatriate. When the stock market and real estate market bubble in the West bursts it will be interesting to see how this affects repatriation rates.

 

A lot of sexpats will be leaving because they cant afford the bar girls any more

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, gamini said:

A lot of sexpats will be leaving because they cant afford the bar girls any more

I can still afford them, but have become too old to do anything so it's sort of pointless.

[greeneking]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

I dont think getting Thailand's rejects and financially insecure expats is what Vietnam had in mind. I'm sure when their hospitals are jammed up with uninsured old men it to will look at tightening its visas as well, just a matter of time really .

What hospital is jammed up with uninsured old men?

Many of us are hoping Thailand will see it is causing great and unnecessary problems for expats and itself.  Posts like this really do not help.

 

[madmen]

What hospital is jammed up with uninsured old men?

Many of us are hoping Thailand will see it is causing great and unnecessary problems for expats and itself.  Posts like this really do not help.

 

I think it's clearly not a coincidence that Thailand is imposing mandatory health insurance for non O visas of 400k and 400k seasoning for OA

 

Why are they doing it is pretty obvious. Stop blaming the Thais and start blaming expats who abuse the system

 

And what is your problem exactly? The 800k or the 65k or health insurance?

 

If you have them then why are you complaining?

[rickudon]

Stats are hard to come by and anyway not really available until next year. Many of us retirees came to Thailand at a time when exchange rates were good, locals friendly and many easy visa options. Now, a lot of us have a Hobson's choice of visas,  and wives and sometimes children to support. A lot have been hanging on hoping for better times, but it is obvious now that that is a pipe dream. Personally, out of the 8 good friends i have i know 2 of them may not be able to legally get visa extensions next year. I will survive - just - assuming no new hurdles.

 

How many will leave i do not know, but there is a lot of pessimism.

 

Cheaper in the UK? I am back there visiting family currently. Yes, food is overall cheaper in the shops, but that is about it. Rents sky high, and if you own need council tax, insurance and repairs (never cheap). Electricity, gas and water not much different, except in winter when your heating is on. Running a car more expensive. Other travel? I have a bus pass, but all other road and rail travel expensive - I have spent about 150 GBP in the last month. Beer in the pub may be better quality but also more expensive, only cheaper if drinking at home. Eating out? I reckon prices in UK have gone up nearly 50% in the last 5 years, i just cannot afford it, asked 5 GBP just for a burger from a takeaway yesterday. Have spent £200 on eating out in last month, not sustainable. I mainly eat in if i can. Most of that expenditure will be out of savings, family still need money in Thailand.

 

I thought i was pretty bullet proof, but even i am considering if i have any alternatives when the next screw is turned.

[Toany]

Lucky! in what way? - I follow their fairly simple rules for staying here, I have had 15 retirement visa's - non have been a problem.

I've had 14 retirement extensions without any problems. Now I'm told to do a TM 30 twice a week. You were lucky that you did not have a problem over TM30 and maybe lucky you were not asked. Some of us are not so lucky. Some immigration officers apply the rules differently

In Thailand goal posts have wheels

[Jingthing]

You're not going to find stats for this.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[jimn]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Council tax, electricity, water, rent (or house purchase price), car tax, car repairs, house repairs, heating bills ....... all cheaper in Thailand.

Assuming you're an adult and not living with mom.

 

If the UK is that cheap,

Find me a fairly new 3 bedroom house in the UK, nice area, for less than 40,000 pounds or 300 pounds a month?

Link to estate agent advert will do.

As I split my time I pay council tax anyway so I agree with you there. As do I with water and car related expenses. I own my house UK outright and my wife does via me in Thailand. Electricity can work out much more expensive running aircon etc. I pay 3,500 baht £90 monthly in the UK I pay 1,500 baht or £38. I was, as was a previous poster talking about everyday expenses, not occasional spend like car and house repairs. Cheese, tea bags, bread, jam, butter, cerials, milk, shampoo, washing powder, beef, bacon, towels, beer, spirits, wine etc etc all cheaper in the UK because of the exchange rate. But again I agree if no one has to exchange currency they will not feel the effect.

Edited June 29, 2019 by jimn

[ericthai]

6 hours ago, Toany said:

Sorry, it goes against the grain for me to join in with the corruption here. It is not about affording it

In Thailand goal posts have wheels
 

Thailand corruption has not changed in 20 years

[BritManToo]

8 minutes ago, jimn said:

As I split my time I pay council tax anyway so I agree with you there. As do I with water and car related expenses. I own my house UK outright and my wife does via me in Thailand. Electricity can work out much more expensive running aircon etc. I pay 3,500 baht £90 monthly in the UK I pay 1,500 baht or £38. I was, as was a previous poster talking about everyday expenses, not occasional spend like car and house repairs. Cheese, tea bags, bread, jam, butter, cerials, milk, shampoo, washing powder, beef, bacon, towels, beer, spirits, wine etc etc all cheaper in the UK because of the exchange rate. But again I agree if no one has to exchange currency they will not feel the effect.

By excluding housing costs you're just being silly. Everyday expenses are trivial compared to housing and tax.

All the food costs in Thailand are cheaper if you're careful and choose local equivalent products.

Nobody forces you to use aircon, you won't die from the heat, but in the UK you have to buy heating or you'll die.

My Thai electricity bill is 1,500bht/month inc careful use of aircon, mostly at night.

Edited June 29, 2019 by BritManToo

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

I can still afford them, but have become too old to do anything so it's sort of pointless.

Too old when you are a decade younger than me? What has happened to the peerless pussy plunderer?

[BritManToo]

5 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Too old when you are a decade younger than me? What has happened to the peerless pussy plunderer?

My best pal died of AIDs earlier this month after 6 months of slowly rotting away in a UK hospital, puts me off a bit, it could have just as easily been me.

PS. He must have banged every bar and massage girl in Chiang Mai without a condom in the past 15 years, while infected but undiagnosed.

Edited June 29, 2019 by BritManToo

[seasia]

I know quite a few people that have left Thailand over the last few years, not just recently.

In the majority of cases not for financial reasons.

One very good friend of mine left after 23 years in Thailand, been away about 5 years now.

No money issues involved at all ( that I know as fact ) Just tired of Thailand.

 

Another one left 6 years ago, seems he does not plan to return. No money issues, also took his Thai wife, she does not want to return to Thailand.

 

I know of one Brit ( thru another friend of mine) who has returned stating financial issues.

I know of several people who used to visit Thailand regularly, some " snow birds ", reducing their Thailand time.

3 of those were actually heading to South America locations.

 

Myself I am already in the process of reducing  time in Thailand, after 20 years exposure to the country, initially on tourist visits then 10 years of living there. No current visa issue, have  permission extension through to next year.

 

I am undecided whether I will bother to apply for another.

 

Edited June 29, 2019 by seasia

[dode57k]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Council tax, electricity, water, rent (or house purchase price), car tax, car repairs, house repairs, heating bills ....... all cheaper in Thailand.

Assuming you're an adult and not living with mom.

 

If the UK is that cheap,

Find me a fairly new 3 bedroom house in the UK, nice area, for less than 40,000 pounds or 300 pounds a month?

Link to estate agent advert will do.

Add to that internal travel, hotel prices, the availability and low cost of medicines etc. Whilst I agree places like Lidl are ensuring competition, the well known phrase "rip off Britain" is an apt one.

[marcusarelus]

On 6/28/2019 at 1:36 PM, Small Joke said:

If blokes can hang in there, somehow, until the greatest economic world collapse in history happens (it is so tantalizingly close) and assuming China don't invade or the Thais don't kick out the U.S. base here, then immigration will be doing some reassessment, because tourism will fall off a cliff, for at least a decade. We can only hope.

What US base here?  I thought the Thais kicked the USA out in 1976.  

[Number 6]

I need the following to happen or we'll go back when I hit 62:

 

Thb needs to return to 34-36.

 

The tedious regulations about leaving and returning the country need to be self reported or done away with. I'm not going to CW every time I return from abroad.

 

Air pollution in Bangkok needs to be resolved. I'm from LA I can put up with a lot but this past year was just TOOOO much. It was obvious the junta did not care and it will be back next year. If you need to wear a face mask, that's no place to live and it's certainly no where to opt to retire!!!

 

My wife and myself need affordable, solid health insurance. Thailand needs quality HMO PPO.

 

BTS MRT is at breaking point. It's expensive and inefficient. Peasants need to be taught how to commute.

 

The streets have become filthy with water seepage from garbage trucks. This has got better in last two months but is a serious health issue. It's unpleasant, revolting really. Just done with it.

 

Democracy must be restored. I'm not going to live the balance of my life in other people's misery simply because it gives me better financial effiency.

 

Finally, condo prices will need to drop 40-60% and rents 15-20%

 

It's not so much the cost, it's Thailand is a piss poor quality experience now. Poor value for money.

 

The fun of this country ran out long ago with the Taksin coup. I'm lucky I met my now wife ten years back. It's the only thing that's kept me here.

 

So many options including Medicare for a few hundred dollars a month. Florida condos near waterfront for half the price a coffin in Bangkok.

 

 

Edited June 29, 2019 by Number 6

[Number 6]

Reading back on all the posts - yeah, I think we all know it's more expensive back in our homes. At the same time were getting something for our money.

 

Thailand used to be a great balance of worry free, devil may care, caution to wind. A great counterbalance to the home country where there's a law and a tax for everything. It's now come to be true here now but here you are not safe from harm, no due process, live under a junta, constantly taxed, idiot bureaucrats don't even know their own laws. Traffic no better than 30 years ago, air pollution worse. Violent crime up. Times to buy alcohol, dry days.

 

Airport hassles!!

 

It's just a shitty experience now.

 

[marcusarelus]

5 hours ago, jimn said:

Its not utter nonsense I am afraid to say. I spend 7 months in Thailand and 5 months in the UK. I am now in the UK and can confirm that the UK is cheaper for almost everything. The only things that are cheaper in Thailand is eating out, petrol and the Thai markets. The UK now has some high quality low cost supermarkets like Lidl and Aldi which sell excellent products. It has forced the large chains to compete. Beer and spirits are also cheap as is wine that is a crazy price in Thailand. Drinking out is cheaper especially Wetherspoons. Clothes are good value from Primark, H&M and Butons. This is all based on the really poor exchange rate. Of course if you work and keep your money in Thailand full time you will have a different view, but if you bring money in now especially from the UK, it is more expensive in Thailand.

Indices Difference

Consumer Prices in United Kingdom are 31.85% higher than in Thailand

Consumer Prices Including Rent in United Kingdom are 41.01% higher than in Thailand

Rent Prices in United Kingdom are 70.10% higher than in Thailand

Restaurant Prices in United Kingdom are 193.48% higher than in Thailand

Groceries Prices in United Kingdom are 1.02% higher than in Thailand

Local Purchasing Power in United Kingdom is 149.98% higher than in Thailand

[scotinsiam]

Thanks for the good wishes [emoji16] It's true the method I get my extension with hasn't altered much. For me it's a combination of dozens of rules and regulations relating to life in general here.
I loved living here and now my feelings have changed, I think as I get older I dislike constant change and uncertainty about the future. Who knows maybe in a few years it will improve. For me personally it doesn't feel like home anymore. I don't feel any resentment but I think for me it's time for a change.

If you are on retirement via the 800k method, I am not aware that anything has changed except the spending profile which I am sure does not bother you seeing as money is no issue.
 
Other than that, it was good to hear your account, Vietnam is not for me but I wish you good many years there.

Sent from my FLA-LX2 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[madmen]

The answer back on topic is no stats .

 

However lets  cut n paste from another 50 off topic  'Thailand sucks Im not loved' threads onto here and see if this can run for 100 pages.

 

 

[marcusarelus]

20 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

Traffic no better than 30 years ago, air pollution worse. Violent crime up. Times to buy alcohol, dry days.

 

Airport hassles!!

 

It's just a shitty experience now.

There are 200 dry counties in America. Dry - no booze.  Drive by shootings and arson have made some neighborhoods unlivable.  TSA at the airports insult and grope the old, sick and handicapped.  You can have it.  Today I went shopping added 1000 baht and an hour to my grocery bill for ..... The motorcycle drivers all know where I live so I don't even have to talk to them - just get on and ride 20 baht.  

[Dene16]

7 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

please feel free to provide some stats yourself as a counter argument to his "outlandish statement" (if you can find any..)

I do not need to provide any stats as do many others who live both in the UK and Thailand

I own and rent 2 houses in the UK and always like to keep abreast of the market situation.

To rent a one bedroom flat in the south of England (the north is cheaper) will cost a minimum of 19,000 baht a month a 3 bed house 32,000 baht regardless of condition.

London !!, do not even go there, that price is per week (have a friend who owns 3) Obviously cheaper the further you move away

Add to this a monthly charge for council tax of 5,000+ baht and a high cost of electric versus Thailand 

I have always maintained that you need to allow 10,000+ baht for all utilities gas, electric, water, tv licence, council tax, insurance etc but this is the minimum

If you are going to rent a nice studio in thailand for 15,000 baht per month or mediocre house (ie: Pattaya) while eating moderately,then Thailand is still the cheaper option (especially if you own your condo or house) 

However if your expectations are grander then the difference starts to diminish

The big difference is quality of life.

In the UK, especially for people returning, they will be virtually isolated, as apposed to an active social life in Thailand  

I have always said that Thailand is as cheap or expensive as you want to make it. What aspects of life do you deem important?