Survey: Is Thailand’s appeal declining for Western Tourists?

[Destiny1990]

1 hour ago, possum1931 said:

I am not saying that if things get worse it will not affect this website, but what percentage of Thaivisa members do not live in Thailand?

The majority doesn’t live here. however the current trend with visitors going downwards isn't helping  the traffic to this site.

 

[Destiny1990]

16 minutes ago, shy coconut said:

There will always be the regular booze prohibited days threads to keep the cash tills

jingling, plus the army of disillusioned expats venting their intolerable frustration at

being stuck in a country that they dislike.

Yeah but so many of us aren’t stuck instead they have left.

less traffic means less income from adds its that simple Coconut.

[bkkgriz]

I will probably come as a tourist every couple of years, but my thoughts about retirement there have changed. I lived in Bangkok for almost a decade, but I have seen a sharp decline in quality of life for foreigners there. I will start looking for a new retirement destination.

[wisperone]

1 hour ago, nong38 said:

You may come here 2 or 3 times then want to try somewhere else,

I think it is becoming more of a 1 and done destination for the normal tourist. Excluding sexpats who can get cheap sex in Thailand and no sex at home.

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

If Patts is becoming family friendly why is tourist numbers measured by the dark side activity. If families was coming why is the numbers 30% down? If something is not broken why try to fix it, that is what they tried to do. Now the tourist is going elsewhere and the Thais are suffering. The dig at world class was TAT that was high again on something strong.

What does world class mean? Do contributors really think quoting this phrase is a sophisticated dig at Pattaya....or the Junta? Is london world class? Is Paris world class? Pattaya is becoming much more family orientated and many more couples are visiting, unfortunately. The hot spots in Pattaya remain very busy all year round and it is the only cosmopolitan and international city left in Thailand.

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[hugocnx]

I think it is all to easy to vote for #1. 

Times are'a changing and modern tourists have new idea's and many options.

I went to Beijing already more than 20 years ago when they opened borders. Maybe today Russia is appealing; who knows, at least I don't have the data about that. Visa even harder.

Long time ago as well, Thailand was synonym for a holiday country for dirty (old) men. I still retired here (dirty and old) lol. What's on a man's mind. 

This is an incident, not a trend and I believe it will work out in a while. A sudden decline is a bit fantastic in economical waves. It is not the stock exchange where people panic at any fart. TAT is panicking now I guess.

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

In actual fact you are wrong. It was the Brits that came first and it was mostly elder married couples. Thats why Thais still have a certain amount of respect for Brits. The backpackers came afterwards. The war also played its part on the sex tourism development.

I concur....
 
European tourists "discovered" Thailand years ago, many originally as backpackers, I guess. Many of those returned for years, going a bit more upmarket as they moved up in their careers. They enjoyed the experience..... loyal customers, they saw little incentive in taking a punt on elsewhere for their couple of weeks package holiday break from winter each year. Additionally, despite the powers that be taking little notice of them, Thailand has remained on the backpacker trail for generally younger, independent travellers.
 
With other places around SE Asia and elsewhere starting to open up, there was some drift to them starting a decade and a half or so ago, but the big move away for Europeans came with the arrival of the the 2014 coup makers. Their policies regarding the beaches and other things made Thailand less attractive, and loyal customers have been more inclined to look elsewhere since then. 
 
Tourists from nearby, more authoritarian countries have come in to fill the hotels, but not the beaches, markets, smaller restaurants and bars that have relied on European tourists. 

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[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, SOUTHERNSTAR said:

In actual fact you are wrong. It was the Brits that came first and it was mostly elder married couples. Thats why Thais still have a certain amount of respect for Brits. The backpackers came afterwards. The war also played its part on the sex tourism development.

 

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The first were the merchant seamen and they mostly visited Klong Toei in the 1950's 

https://mythailand.blog/2018/10/30/bangkoks-infamous-mosquito-bar/   Unless you are talking about WWII and then it was the Brits Indians who occupied Thailand in 1946  

[RocketDog]

IN MY OPINION the survey is intrinsically skewed toward negative responses. In fact, all possibilities are negative with only one nominally neutral. I declined to vote. This is amateur nonsense.

 

What the survey does however is provide a platform for those unhappy with their lives in Thailand to feel that a majority of people feel as they do, thus allowing them to vent.

 

SoilSpoil, response #6, hit on it precisely. If such a survey were done on every country in the world the result would be that most people are not happy in any country. If the citizens of any country are happy, appealing to foreigners' alien proclivities is a fool's game.

 

IN MY OPINION  mankind has brought itself to a crisis point in a number of areas vital to happiness and well-being. And we know it consciously.

 

Unfortunately we face issues that have no win-win solutions. These issues manifest in one form or another everywhere. Think Prayut is not a suitable leader? Name any leader that is suitable and appeals to the majority of his country's population. If in doubt about how far things have deteriorated just look at the sad excuse for a human being that currently leads(?) the  most powerful country on earth. If that doesn't give you nightmares then you aren't paying attention.

 

We all feel in our bones that things are going the wrong way and that none of our leaders have any solutions that truly represent the way forward for the majority of people.

 

In short, we are all anxious, bewildered, and fearful for our own futures and those of our progeny to some degree or another.

 

Thailand is not significantly different from any country in those respects.

 

Unlike traditional prophets of doom, I do not believe the end is near. The world won't end with a bang, but with a whimper and this long, slow agony of decline will go on for a long time. A train wreck in slow motion and we're all both passengers and spectators.

 

All of that said, I still choose Thailand over the rat race my home country represents.

I try to enjoy life every day and generally don't even try solve the world's problems.

My time is close to done so I just try to make the small part of the world directly around me a bit better.

 

To paraphrase a popular aphorism:

 

Stop thinking globally, but act locally.

[habanero]

6 hours ago, brommers said:

Thailand has yet to learn a few basic lessons in the world of today.

 

It is no longer a quaint exotic destination for westerners. They have seen beyond the smiles and wais and it isn't so attractive.

 

Regional tourists are much more fickle than long haul & can switch to new destinations quickly & easily.

 

Social media has accelerated to speed of bad news, and there is plenty here to feed the social media machine.

 

There are many more regional alternatives than even 10 years ago and the comparisons are less in Thailand's favour these days.

 

The strength of the baht is a convenient issue to hide behind & is less of an issue than many believe.

 

Sadly those in government responsible for tourism are as inept as the Trump administration. They have no strategies, only a naive short term promotion fixation. They also do not realise the speed and power of the storms that will engulf tourism here.

Then why is the United States of America the most visited country?

 

The World's Most Visited Countries

• United States - 76.9 million visitors.
• China - 60.7 million visitors. ...
• Italy - 58.3 million visitors. ...
• Mexico - 39.3 million visitors. ...
• United Kingdom - 37.7 million visitors. ...
• Turkey - 37.6 million visitors. ...
• Germany - 37.5 million visitors. ...
• Thailand - 35.4 million visitors. ...

[totally thaied up]

3 hours ago, possum1931 said:

People will try to rip you off in tourist parts of any country, I live up country and all  have see mostly is honesty, especially in the markets, I have never had any feelings of been ripped off.

I laughed my guts out over this. I go get a drink from a vendor in my wifes mothers market, I will get charged 10 baht for it and I have been going to this market for three years. If it is my wife, she gets charged 5 for the same drink. This is Thailand after all. I have had several attempts in my local markets at schemes like this so I just don't bother anymore buying anything from them and my wife shops mostly from Makro these days. It is a scam most the time if your a farang and you have not got a Thai in tow with you double check the real price. FIve baht does not worry me but in the real world,I am being over charged just because of who I am.

 

You get sick of this stuff after a while. Much like many reasons why people are not coming back for a second trip these days is there are better alternatives now then this place with the Australian dollar being worth shit. I just came back from a Holiday in Australia and I saved money when I went back home. I actually came back to Thailand after a three month holiday back in my home Country with MORE money in my pocket then when I left. Now that tells you something about prices. 

Edited July 15, 2019 by totally thaied up

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, wisperone said:

I think it is becoming more of a 1 and done destination for the normal tourist. Excluding sexpats who can get cheap sex in Thailand and no sex at home.

Plenty of places to get cheap sex, but never at home.

[marquis22]

The smoke haze hazard will prevent returnees. 

[ThaiRebound]

Infuse more Chinese DNA. Problem, solved. 

[newnative]

1 hour ago, wisperone said:

I think it is becoming more of a 1 and done destination for the normal tourist. Excluding sexpats who can get cheap sex in Thailand and no sex at home.

True--and that's normal.  Most tourist places for me are also one and done.  If I hadn't moved to Thailand to live I would have likely only visited once as there are lots of other places in the World that I still haven't visited.

[ivor bigun]

To all expats who seem to get ripped off,whats wrong with me ,nobody ever overcharges me ,what have i done wrong? In fact the other day i bought a t shirt in mikes shopping mall and the girl charged me less because i am local,its not fair .

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[lespaulTV]

I like less tourists.

[Scutty]

4 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

I have 3 mates that visited Thailand annually for their vacations, Bangkok, Phuket, and yes Pattaya, they had been doing this for about 5 or 6 or maybe even 7 years, and really enjoyed it.

 

Sadly now they have all now stopped coming, and their reasons are that they got sick and tired of being ripped off, even for the smallest things, that said, I was at a food court having lunch today, took the card back to get my change and I noticed later on that I got ripped off 20 baht, my fault, the wife didn't tell me how much I should expect to get back, but when she asked me later on, I told her and she said, no you should have got 325 baht back, not 305 baht and showed me the receipt, with my reply being, you just can't help stupid can you ????

 

Been living here close to 4 years now and where there is an opportunity Thai's will have a go at trying to rip me off, part of their culture behind their smiles, I don't know, but I do know this, what I have seen here for those years living here, has really turned my stomach, much so that I am starting to seriously look at plan B, i.e. to return to my homeland in maybe 3 or so years, because I don't see things getting any better for those who live in a country that has no self respect. 

I got attempted ripped off 5 minutes in the country ,food court in Don Muang . Sneaky little toerags so they are ...Welcome to Thailand

[Ulic]

With litter and garbage everywhere, untreated sewage piped into klongs and dumped into the sea, immigration rules being interpreted in a whimsical manner by immigration staff, nonsensical hoops to jump through, silly reporting rules which are enforced in an arbitrary manner depending on which immigration office you go to. An extremely strong baht, everything to increase in price substantially as the the minimum wage is increased to 425 a day (election promise). Police and government officials squeezing every baht possible from entertainment areas causing beer/alcohol/entertainment to become uncompetitive with other options for tourists. Neighbouring countries are cheaper and cleaner (but not perfect alternatives by any means). I really believe Thailand needs a thorough review and overhaul in its tourist/long stay visa rules if it is going to reverse this downward spiral. We shall see.

[DrTuner]

28 minutes ago, lespaulTV said:

I like less tourists.

The basic idea of fewer tourists is good, but it also means a lot of the existing infrastructure starts to disappear (restaurants, massages, etc) leading to slow business, which makes the locals sour and increases petty crimes. Takes time for the balance to find itself again, maybe decades after. I think something like that is now happening in Spain.

Edited July 15, 2019 by DrTuner
Did a favor for the lesser grammar nazis

[mlmcleod]

DUh!  All you need to see is the exchange rate to make up your mind.  Immigration activism is also a black hole.

[ThomasThBKK]

39 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

The basic idea of fewer tourists is good, but it also means a lot of the existing infrastructure starts to disappear (restaurants, massages, etc) leading to slow business, which makes the locals sour and increases petty crimes. Takes time for the balance to find itself again, maybe decades after. I think something like that is now happening in Spain.

Pretty much on Ibiza, i saw the decline there going over the last 4 years. 
Spain itself is fine, Barcelona and co are booming - but Ibiza and Mallorca - they are old coffee.

Way too many hotels for the small areas, they are building too much, it reminds me pretty much of samui and phuket in that regard.

 

But this is not the main issue. The goverment there is also as messed up as on samui and phuket, they force bars to close down early, forbid loud music... both the same on Ibiza and Mallorca... The music on ibiza beachbars has to be capped at 65 decibel, which is less loud than a vacuum cleaner far away...

When that started the locals where happy to have some more peece, all was good but badaboom now it's cry me a river, people aren't coming anymore ohh surprise and tons of restaurants shut down, hotels can't renovate, beach bars are closing - pretty much like phuket and samui ...

45% percent of the GDP in those 2 islands are from Tourism, they spectaculary managed to screw themselves in a super elegant way.

 

The new Ibiza is Mykonos, people didn't go there already x times and it looks new and fresh - a bit like Vietnam. On Mykonos, no one gives  a damn about loudness and closing times.

 

Airbnb forbidden on Ibiza - yes. On Mykonos? No one gives a damn.

Rippoff taxis on Ibiza? Yes. Mykonos? No.

 

You know what Mykonos really isnt? It's not cheaper. It's super expensive, Ibiza is already expensive, but Mykonos can easily be more expensive due to the lack of lower class hotels. Still it's way fuller - so it can't be the money aspect there, i would assume it's the fun and adventure aspect.

 

You can't have your cake and eat it too, i guess.

[emptypockets]

I ticked option 3. When/if the exchange rates turn around western tourists will flood back. It's the economy, stupid, as some guy with a zipper problem once said. 

I don't believe most tourists care about all the problems that expats identify.  They come here for wine, women and song.  Come here for a good time not a long time. 

[Number 6]

The questions are not definitive, there is not one overriding answer. There is no answer = pervasive government polices have led to decline be it saftey, indifference, inherent corruption or unfriendliness.

 

I'm not a tourist so I really have no idea what issues they face.

 

With the baht sky high this should be no mystery. People might make a one off trip (which they do). But returning at these prices when the world has similar options - maybe not. My suspicion is that Spain is about the same price. Certainly East Europe.

 

Thailand likes to boast all it's visitors. Bangkok most visited city in the world. Yeah. Everyone has done it and doesn't feel a need to return. The question is what will Thailand do to encourage that?

 

A strong baht, a coup with a follow up govt looking very sketchy, wholly unfriendly visa regiment, mystery application of "law" at airport. Excessive airport fees and very mediocre experience. Tiresome quarreling with taxi drivers.

 

As mentioned in previous threads expats not traveling bc tm30. Count me in on this one!!! We just go abroad.

 

Very low quality attractions at high prices.

 

For westerners the nation is mired in pollution. Air pollution, the ocean is filthy, the marine life dead. Trash everywhere. Bangkok streets reek of garbage truck leakage it's just foul.

 

Retail stores sell old merchandise at full retail value. International goods have additional import taxes.

 

Thailand is doing exactly what Indonesia did and it literally killed their tourism industry. Indo is hot, dirty and no one's returned.

 

Global economy. Like Thais guess what, economy sucks for most middle class people. What is Thailand doing to offer a trip of a lifetime for families? 

 

Does it welcome frequent returnees? It shuns and deports them. This alone will kill the goose. No one wants to go through this hassle and expense. More hapless, vague and arbitrary law.

 

Forced insurance. Remember that one? Isn't it New Zealand that covers accident insurance for all tourists free?

But mainly, it's economy. The baht has been manipulated by bot to a point there is repercussions. Exports suffering. Not rocket science actually.

 

When a government is run by a few, it serves only a few.

Edited July 15, 2019 by Number 6

[joecoolfrog]

7 hours ago, WeekendRaider said:

some say Thailand is no longer an exotic destination.

there are not many desirable destinations anywhere anymore.  "overtourism" is not just a Thai thing.   

 

but living here is still quite good, in the rural areas.  fresh and healthy food, local.  not crowded, not expensive leaving money for important things we will all need to adjust to going forward.  and on that too.... not just in Thailand, not at all.

And how many international tourists visit your area , what facilities are in place for them ?

[Number 6]

Something else occured to me. If I came here to party and was told no alcohol for two days I'd be really, really unhappy.

 

If that person then told me - yeah, Thailand has a dozen of these 'holidays' each year. I most definitely would not visit during that time and maybe not at all fearing I could not be exactly certain when these dozen holidays might occur.

 

Something else...if I had to wait an hour in an immigration queue in a developing country only to be met by questions and negativity I wouldn't return.

 

It's a mix of absolutely deadly policies. The junta is in no mood to favor liberal, open attitude. Therefore, the nation's economy will suffer.

Edited July 15, 2019 by Number 6

[Soikhaonoiken]

Western tourist have, and always will want value for money, and due to the strong Baht Thailand doesn't give value for your money now

[Perhaps2more]

The overall experience you can get in Thailand at such competitive price is not easy to surpass. The flow of bad behaviour Chinese tourists is not good for Thailand but they are improving and people learn to avoid what they do not want. Thailand is clean enough, easy to travel around, food is great and easy to find a good place to stay. Other countries in South East Asia have a lot more restriction to visitors. The decline in western visitors has more to do with the currency depreciation but that will change.

[wisperone]

4 hours ago, ivor bigun said:

To all expats who seem to get ripped off,whats wrong with me ,nobody ever overcharges me ,what have i done wrong? In fact the other day i bought a t shirt in mikes shopping mall and the girl charged me less because i am local,its not fair .

Maybe she just felt sorry for you.

[Perhaps2more]

44 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

Something else occured to me. If I came here to party and was told no alcohol for two days I'd be really, really unhappy.

 

I think it is no selling of alcohol in the area when it is Song Kran because they used to fight a lot and cause troubles. On only 2 Buddhist days of the year, selling of alcohol is not allowed but you can buy in advance and drink at home or perhaps give your liver and kidney a rest.