Is a TM 30 still a requirement if you have a retirement visa

[localexpat]

hello

 

Noted there are a number of topics on TM 30 but could not find a clear enough answer to my question.

 

I have had a Retirement Visa for a number of years.

 

I stay with my girlfriend in her house which she owns.

 

I have never submitted a TM 30

 

On my last Retirement Visa extension I had to add a copy of my girlfriends ID card.

 

My question : Is a TM 30 still a requirement if you have a retirement visa

 

Just one more question, should I get a yellow book?

 

Thanks in advance

 

[jackdd]

5 minutes ago, localexpat said:

My question : Is a TM 30 still a requirement if you have a retirement visa

Yes, your girlfriend has to report you

[ubonjoe]

It depends upon the office you report to. Every office can have a different policy about the TM30 reporting.

[Enzian]

I'm in same situation, live in my girlfriend's condo, on a "retirement visa", and she nor I have ever filed a TM30 that I know of. But we recently went to the amphur, got me put in her blue book, got a yellow book for me, and to boot, without us asking, they fixed me up with a Thai ID "pink card". I've read reports that all this makes me exempt from filling the TM30, and my attitude is that they can bite me; a 2000 baht fine is next to nothing, but if and when that happens then I'll go ahead and file one of the damn things. Of course I might have to when we go to Chang Wattana to apply for my next extension later this year.

[IvorBiggun2]

11 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

It depends upon the office you report to. Every office can have a different policy about the TM30 reporting.

May be so, but what about the financial penalty for failing to submit one. Is there a grading as to how much they can charge? ie minimum to maximum. After 13 years here they done my wife 500 Baht for failing to fill out a TM30. Cash, no receipt. I'd rather she'd have paid the max with receipt, which I believe to be 2,000 Baht, than to see money go into their tea fund jar. 

 

14 minutes ago, Enzian said:

we recently went to the amphur, got me put in her blue book, got a yellow book for me, and to boot, without us asking, they fixed me up with a Thai ID "pink card". I've read reports that all this makes me exempt from filling the TM30

I have the Yellow Book, Pink ID card, driving license etc but it cut no ice.  

[Curt1591]

I live with my wife, in her house. Curious how they will handle this.

[IvorBiggun2]

1 minute ago, Curt1591 said:

I live with my wife, in her house. Curious how they will handle this.

She is supposed to register you and she is responsible in paying the fine.

[Curt1591]

7 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

She is supposed to register you and she is responsible in paying the fine.

Interesting in that in all the 90 day reports, and all the extensions, same address, this has never come up.

Got a 90 day next week. We'll see what happens. 

Edited July 21, 2019 by Curt1591

[wgdanson]

29 minutes ago, Enzian said:

But we recently went to the amphur, got me put in her blue book, got a yellow book for me, and to boot, without us asking, they fixed me up with a Thai ID "pink card".

My Amphur in Bang Rakam says we must be married to get a yellow book/pink id card.

Can a falang go in a blue book?

However, never done a TM30 in six years here until this year when I was the one who asked about it.

Edited July 21, 2019 by wgdanson

[IvorBiggun2]

2 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

Can a falang go in a blue book?

Yes. The number you get from the Blue Book is the number used in your government hospital ID card.

[tgeezer]

I think that they could piss a lot of people off , Thais pride themselves on the word Thai meaning free.  I am in the same situation and there is no intention of reporting because the fact that Immigration refuse to put 2+2 together and make four is laughable. 

The Immigration Act does not have to be interpreted in this way at all, it could be interpreted as the authorities wanting to know where you are. The landing card tells them where you are staying.  The law says if you move from there you must report it. Your extension application tells them that ‘in spades’ especially if you provide photos sketches etc. Your 90 day report tells them that! A quick glance at the computer tells them all they need to know if they care to look. 

 

 

 

[ThaiBunny]

4 minutes ago, tgeezer said:

A quick glance at the computer tells them all they need to know if they care to look.

Go on, stamp your foot as well

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

24 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

She is supposed to register you and she is responsible in paying the fine.

 

But that won't matter much if the wife or GF doesn't do it, even though required, because SHE doesn't have to go and apply for anything at Immigration.

 

So, if the wife or GF doesn't do it and the local Immigration office requires it, it's the farang applicant they'll be fining the next time he goes to apply for an annual extension

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, tgeezer said:

I think that they could piss a lot of people off , Thais pride themselves on the word Thai meaning free.  I am in the same situation and there is no intention of reporting because the fact that Immigration refuse to put 2+2 together and make four is laughable. 

The Immigration Act does not have to be interpreted in this way at all, it could be interpreted as the authorities wanting to know where you are. The landing card tells them where you are staying.  The law says if you move from there you must report it. Your extension application tells them that ‘in spades’ especially if you provide photos sketches etc. Your 90 day report tells them that! A quick glance at the computer tells them all they need to know if they care to look. 

 

Try telling your local Immigration officer all of that the next time you're applying for anything, if they're asking you why you don't have a TM30 on file. And see how far that gets you....

 

[jackdd]

12 minutes ago, tgeezer said:

I think that they could piss a lot of people off , Thais pride themselves on the word Thai meaning free.  I am in the same situation and there is no intention of reporting because the fact that Immigration refuse to put 2+2 together and make four is laughable.  

The Immigration Act does not have to be interpreted in this way at all, it could be interpreted as the authorities wanting to know where you are. The landing card tells them where you are staying.  The law says if you move from there you must report it. Your extension application tells them that ‘in spades’ especially if you provide photos sketches etc. Your 90 day report tells them that! A quick glance at the computer tells them all they need to know if they care to look.  

No interpretation required, the law clearly says that if a foreigner (with temporary permission to stay) stays somewhere, the housemaster / possessor has to report this to immigration police, very clear, was just not enforced for many years.

 

26 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

Can a falang go in a blue book?

Only if you have permanent residency status.

Some amphoes might add a temporary staying foreigner as "housemaster" in a blue book, but not as resident. So actually this doesn't prove residency. But because other government workers have no idea what they are doing they might accept this as proof of residency.

People with a temporary permission to stay are supposed to be registered in a yellow book.

 

6 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

But that won't matter much if the wife or GF doesn't do it, even though required, because SHE doesn't have to go and apply for anything at Immigration.

 

So, if the wife or GF doesn't do it and the local Immigration office requires it, it's the farang applicant they'll be fining the next time he goes to apply for an annual extension

But they can't legally fine you, so you could just refuse to pay. Problem is that they might then refuse to process your extension or whatever you wanted from them.

Edited July 21, 2019 by jackdd

[IvorBiggun2]

Just now, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Try telling your local Immigration officer all of that the next time you're applying for anything, if they're asking you why you don't have a TM30 on file. And see how far that gets you....

 

I did ask the question earlier on. It would be nice if someone was to show a copy of the law regarding the TM 30 and the penalties imposed, min to max, for not logging it and whose responsibility to  pay the fine. I know my wife is liable but I've never seen it in script.

[tgeezer]

I am assuming that they don’t have any files or if they have they have no system of finding them, do they not give a receipt for that reason? 

I would reason that it is my hosts duty and I have no idea why it hasn’t been done. 

I would then expect to have to take a message to my host on behalf of Immigration. 

[Matzzon]

According the the general rules a TM 30 is required to be made from all foreigners that do not stay at hotels the report their guests. Can vary from Immigration Office to another.

 

Yellow book? That is your own free choice.

[jackdd]

1 minute ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

I did ask the question earlier on. It would be nice if someone was to show a copy of the law regarding the TM 30 and the penalties imposed, min to max, for not logging it and whose responsibility to  pay the fine. I know my wife is liable but I've never seen it in script. 

http://library.siam-legal.com/thai-law/thai-immigration-act-temporary-stay-in-the-kingdom-sections-34-39/

Section 38

Somewhere at the end of the immigration act you find the max fines, in this case the max is 2000 THB

[IvorBiggun2]

3 minutes ago, jackdd said:

But they can't legally fine you, so you could just refuse to pay. Problem is that they might then refuse to process your extension or whatever you wanted from them.

Easiest option is then to get on to the 'Immigration Hot-line' and ask them. What they say goes. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, jackdd said:

No interpretation required, the law clearly says that if a foreigner (with temporary permission to stay) stays somewhere, the housemaster / possessor has to report this to immigration police, very clear, was just not enforced for many years.

 

Only if you have permanent residency status.

Some amphoes might add a temporary staying foreigner as "housemaster" in a blue book, but not as resident. So actually this doesn't prove residency. But because other government workers have no idea what they are doing they might accept this as proof of residency.

People with a temporary permission to stay are supposed to be registered in a yellow book.

 

But they can't legally fine you, so you could just refuse to pay. Problem is that they might then refuse to process your extension or whatever you wanted from them.

 

Immigration saying, we're not going to consider youre annual extension application until you go and file a TM30 and pay the fine for not having done so previously is a pretty motivating inducement.

 

 

[Snow Leopard]

1 hour ago, Enzian said:

I'm in same situation, live in my girlfriend's condo, on a "retirement visa", and she nor I have ever filed a TM30 that I know of. But we recently went to the amphur, got me put in her blue book, got a yellow book for me, and to boot, without us asking, they fixed me up with a Thai ID "pink card". I've read reports that all this makes me exempt from filling the TM30, and my attitude is that they can bite me; a 2000 baht fine is next to nothing, but if and when that happens then I'll go ahead and file one of the damn things. Of course I might have to when we go to Chang Wattana to apply for my next extension later this year.

Which amphur is that please? I am having issues. 

[scorecard]

34 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Yes. The number you get from the Blue Book is the number used in your government hospital ID card.

If you have / get PR your name goes in the typical dark blue Tabien Baan book. 

[RJRS1301]

 

370

TM.30: Immigration chief tells foreigners: Report where you are and who is staying with you

 

 

[Enzian]

16 minutes ago, Snow Leopard said:

Which amphur is that please? I am having issues. 

Din Daeng Bangkok in my case, but I would think you have to go to the one that covers your address.

[Snow Leopard]

5 minutes ago, Enzian said:

Din Daeng Bangkok in my case, but I would think you have to go to the one that covers your address.

Yes i am just in Samut Prakan and they want a shed load of documents. What did you hand over in the way of documentation? 

[Enzian]

6 minutes ago, Snow Leopard said:

Yes i am just in Samut Prakan and they want a shed load of documents. What did you hand over in the way of documentation? 

Just my passport, two photos, copy of passport data page and copy of recent visa page, her ID and blue book.

[Snow Leopard]

8 minutes ago, Enzian said:

Just my passport, two photos, copy of passport data page and copy of recent visa page, her ID and blue book.

Wow my amphur wants certified copies of my passport and birth certificate.

[Enzian]

6 minutes ago, Snow Leopard said:

Wow my amphur wants certified copies of my passport and birth certificate.

We were lucky, because we went in knowing that that those might be required, but the girl was nice and went with what I said. That's the problem, every office and officer can be different. 

[Snow Leopard]

5 minutes ago, Enzian said:

We were lucky, because we went in knowing that that those might be required, but the girl was nice and went with what I said. That's the problem, every office and officer can be different. 

did you certify yours at the Thai Embassy in your country?