Are big bikes worth it?

[webfact]

Are big bikes worth it?

By Kingsley Wijayasinha
The Nation

 

 

Thailand’s market for “big bikes”, or motorbikes larger than 400cc, has been enjoying tremendous growth as well as notoriety due to several outrageous accidents that have been making headlines on a daily basis.

 

With their attractive design and powerful engines, big bikes are a dream machine for many men and even some women. According to the Land Transport Department, nearly 165,000 big bikes have been registered in Thailand so far, and the number is expected to near the 200,000 mark by the end of this year.

 

Big bikes are usually considered a luxury item, with many models crossing the Bt1-million line, compared to the Bt30,000 starting price for entry-level 110cc entry-level bikes. This also explains why there is such large coverage of accidents involving big bikes, as they are usually ridden by wealthy, well-known individuals. 

 

According to Thai RSC, 9,961 road deaths have been reported in the first seven months of this year, with over 554,000 people injured. Even though a small number of these deaths have been caused by big bikes compared to smaller motorcycles, the death rate of big bikers has risen dramatically at 34 per cent this year, according to the Road Accident Victims Protection Co Ltd.

 

 

Separately, the Thailand Accident Research Centre has been working with top motorcycle manufacturers, Honda and Yamaha, to study 1,000 big bike accidents that took place in Thailand since 2017. So far, up to 600 cases have already been studied and the top cause for the accident has been found to be a lack of skill in perceiving hazards, vehicle control and ability to make a split-second decision in emergency situations. 

 

Assistant Prof Kunnavee Kanitpong, manager at the Thailand Accident Research Centre (TARC), said: “From the data we collected, it would be correct to say that big bike riders in Thailand lack the basics, causing them to have low riding skills and a higher risk of accidents. Another factor is that most riders have no understanding of situations that could cause an accident. We often see riders who do not know or are unaware of dangers that could take place. They are unable to make a quick decision or evade obstacles when in an emergency situation.” 

 

 

She added that the only way to swiftly reduce the number of accidents and casualties is to develop riding skills in three areas: accident prediction, correct decision making and safe vehicle control.

 

Many are also calling on the Land Transport Department to require big bike owners to hold special licences and undergo thorough training before they can be allowed on road. 

 

Currently anybody above the age of 15 can apply for a licence for a 110cc bike, while those above the age of 18 can legally ride bikes that have an engine displacement of more than 110cc. 

 

“We want the legal age for a big bike licence to be raised to 21,” said Thanapong Jinvong, manager of Road Safety Group Thailand.

 

 

“Riders should be required to take advance classes with hazard perception [taught using simulators] so they can learn to judge possible dangers,” he added. “Most importantly, we must strictly enforce regulations concerning legal age, driving licence testing method and speeding problems, as offenders are difficult to catch because the licence plate is usually hidden under the rear mudguard.”

 

Also, just one day of training is not enough. “You need to take a three-day course and pass every exam. There is so much to learn,” Akkapol Sutthapinthu, who rides a 600cc Kawasaki, said. “Taking a one-day course is good, but in order to get a big bike license, there should be several tests that you have to pass. Otherwise you’ll become a hazard to yourself and to others.”

 

 

Source: https://www.nationthailand.com/news/30374080

 

-- © Copyright The Nation Thailand 2019-08-02

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[gunderhill]

42 minutes ago, webfact said:

a lack of skill

and  how  about  the  freakin potholes,  some 12  inches  deep  or  more,  or  the  changes  of  elevation  where  the  road  can  almost  have u  out  of  the  seat  airborne, no warnings.

[Justgrazing]

Nothing wrong with the bikes .. But you have to be super experienced and exercise great restraint with the throttle wrist on one to not end up dead .. 

[smedly]

90% of accidents in Thailand someone is breaking the law - it doesn't matter whether motorbike or car - it doesn't matter the size of the car or motorbike - someone is doing something wrong, who is there to stop them - nobody

 

and 90% of them know they are doing something wrong and they will keep doing it until the risk of being caught increases 

[Oziex1]

Big bikes can be a problem in inexperienced hands but I see little to be gained by targeting this particular issue. A broader approach is required on road safety in Thailand, to put it mildly. 

[bkk6060]

17 minutes ago, smedly said:

90% of accidents in Thailand someone is breaking the law - it doesn't matter whether motorbike or car - it doesn't matter the size of the car or motorbike - someone is doing something wrong, who is there to stop them - nobody

 

and 90% of them know they are doing something wrong and they will keep doing it until the risk of being caught increases 

Extremely naive and makes no sense.

Where are they suppose to be?

Posted at every accident scene before it happens?

[canuckamuck]

 The number of deaths went up because the number of bad riders that switched from riding small bikes to big bikes went up.

Those people would have likely killed themselves on the small bikes, but since there were more big bikes available, they died on a big bike. The fault is not the bikes, but the missing sense of caution and culture of safety among the citizens. If they could just get a little more situational awareness, the deaths would go down substantially.

Maybe a big bike license would help, but I took the regular bike license here and it was a complete joke.

[smedly]

7 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Extremely naive and makes no sense.

Where are they suppose to be?

Posted at every accident scene before it happens?

what ?

 

totally lost me

 

you obviously don't understand the concept of law enforcement and effective policing especially on the roads - maybe you have some magic solution to make people obey the law - e.g.  you think people don't know what a red light means 

[Worldplus]

I Have a Kwasaki Z800..  I have had it for 6 years..  I ride it alot round Pattaya...  Only time I have dropped it was doing a u turn at walking pace and went down a <deleted> pothole..  Road conditions here are very bad.. 

 

Big bikes are much better than riding a 110CC bike.. They can stop quicker and get out of trouble quicker..

 

Its down to these idiots riding them at high speed and usually without a skid lid..  

 

I have ridden big bikes since I was 17..  Much prefer them than anything else..

[MaxYakov]

Big bikes should be restricted to racetracks. The ordinary motor vehicle infrastructure was not designed with them in mind. You don't see formula 1 cars on the roads very often. Big bikes are just splendid for dramatic, horrific demonstrations of suicide on ordinary roads.

Edited August 1, 2019 by MaxYakov

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Oziex1 said:

Big bikes can be a problem in inexperienced hands but I see little to be gained by targeting this particular issue. A broader approach is required on road safety in Thailand, to put it mildly. 

Big  bikes a tiny percentage of the motorcycle  deaths, a pointless exercise ( as  usual) 10 year olds on bikes and the sheer ineptitude of the Thais are the  reasons..............but we cant be saying those sort of things as its well  known Thais are the master race ...in their very very small eyes and until they acknowledge this there will be no change.

[leeneeds]

Having a skill set that avoids dangerous situations on big bikes is just the same as smaller bikes except the quickness of acceleration , fulcrum weight in stopping distance,

this takes time to learn on each idiosyncrasy the bikes have, knowing your limits of your skill set is never considered when a purchase is made.

It should be mandatory to do a track riding day that teaches how to look through corners, that one day lifts the skill set so much, dealers and governments should be proactive in coming together in this,

18 years to get a 250cc licence and have a years experience riding on the road, + a track day.  

 

19 years to get over a 250cc licence,  a track day as part of the package on purchase of the SAME  bike, Demo bikes are available they are just not used in the all encompassing way from the  dealer and to the  purchaser.

 

[gunderhill]

42 minutes ago, smedly said:

you think people don't know what a red light means 

advisory?

[UKresonant]

18 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

Big bikes should be restricted to racetracks. The ordinary motor vehicle infrastructure was not designed with them in mind.

Difficult to going touring, if restricted to a racetrack.....

Perhaps they could just fill in a form, and then everything will be  O.K.

 

Perhaps the folk on 650 road race bikes, wearing flip flops & Tshirts. exceeding the speed limit in town, could watch, high speed video close-ups of a mosquito hitting a windscreen for a few hours, to perhaps get the message.

Edited August 1, 2019 by UKresonant

[MaxYakov]

19 minutes ago, UKresonant said:

Difficult to going touring, if restricted to a racetrack.....

If one wants to do "touring" in Thailand and better avoid an early death one should rent a car or, better yet, take the bus. These spectacular crashes we've been seeing are not done with "touring" bikes but with racing bikes that don't strike me as being the best tour bikes such as the Honda Gold Wing, for example.

 

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by MaxYakov

[mikebell]

I agree with a poster above who bemoans the lack of policing.  Chonburi (AKA Pattaya) is 2nd only to BKK for road deaths despite the disparity in population size.

Why?  Because Pattaya Plod is only interested in making money NOT keeping death off the roads.

[Myaimistrue]

1 hour ago, canuckamuck said:

 The number of deaths went up because the number of bad riders that switched from riding small bikes to big bikes went up.

Those people would have likely killed themselves on the small bikes, but since there were more big bikes available, they died on a big bike. The fault is not the bikes, but the missing sense of caution and culture of safety among the citizens. If they could just get a little more situational awareness, the deaths would go down substantially.

Maybe a big bike license would help, but I took the regular bike license here and it was a complete joke.

Not totally true that they would have died on smaller bikes.  Sh#t happens a lot faster on a big bike, with just a slight twist of the wrist.  If you are not experienced you can get yourself in way over your head in a split second.  Plus the speeds you are going are more likely to cause more serious injuries than on a small bike.  No, it’s not the fault of the bikes, that’s for sure!

[legend49]

2 hours ago, Justgrazing said:

Nothing wrong with the bikes .. But you have to be super experienced and exercise great restraint with the throttle wrist on one to not end up dead .. 

Agree with you other countries do not experience the failings in this country. Its just the Thai idiots riding the bikes all about " ME" first.

[inThailand]

Another misplaced initiative that does little to address the problem. So typical here.

 

[jlwilliamsjr18]

This is not something to be studied, but must be implemented. The majority of buyers have little experience, in fact, I'd bet few even rode a lesser motorbike before owning a big bike. 

"Many are also calling on the Land Transport Department to require big bike owners to hold special licenses and undergo thorough training before they can be allowed on road. "

[findlay13]

32 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

advisory?

Yep a guideline

[findlay13]

12 minutes ago, jlwilliamsjr18 said:

This is not something to be studied, but must be implemented. The majority of buyers have little experience, in fact, I'd bet few even rode a lesser motorbike before owning a big bike. 

"Many are also calling on the Land Transport Department to require big bike owners to hold special licenses and undergo thorough training before they can be allowed on road. "

So many don't have ANY licence to begin with and as you can't get them to even wear helmets ......Good luck with "special licences" .More "Tea money" flowing?

[dundas]

In Australia, I ride a CB500x, a learner-legal bike in Australia, but considered a big bike in Thailand. For me, it's comfortable, it's got enough power to get me out of trouble and it turns and stops OK as well. 

 

When I come to Thailand I'm happy to paddle around the local area on a Honda Wave, but don't venture beyond that much. A big bike might be more fun, but even though the roads where I stay in Chiang Mai are OK, motorcycle riding here is way more dangerous. Zero policing of crazy drivers/riders is the major reason. If there was decent policing, then raising the bar for a 'big bike' licence might make more sense. 

[wtfracing]

57 minutes ago, leeneeds said:

Having a skill set that avoids dangerous situations on big bikes is just the same as smaller bikes except the quickness of acceleration , fulcrum weight in stopping distance,

this takes time to learn on each idiosyncrasy the bikes have, knowing your limits of your skill set is never considered when a purchase is made.

It should be mandatory to do a track riding day that teaches how to look through corners, that one day lifts the skill set so much, dealers and governments should be proactive in coming together in this,

18 years to get a 250cc licence and have a years experience riding on the road, + a track day.  

 

19 years to get over a 250cc licence,  a track day as part of the package on purchase of the SAME  bike, Demo bikes are available they are just not used in the all encompassing way from the  dealer and to the  purchaser.

 

Just drive anywhere in Thailand, be it in the city or in the provinces every day and you will see the problem, it's not going to change until the 70% of the idot drivers/riders change their attitudes and skill sets. When they realize there are other people on the roads beside themselves and that they are not gods gift to driving/riding them maybe (but highly unlikely) things might change. But then again you can't  put brains on dummies or educate mugs but I'm sure there will be some paperwork or rule involving money that can fix it (pun intended).

 

[Nickymaster]

Where to begin.  The bikes are not the problem.  The problems are riders who have no sense of safety. Getting a driving license is a joke. Law enforcement is joke. The roads are a joke. It will never change.  This is Thailand. This is how things are done here. You have to take care of yourself. Protect yourself and hope that no idiot will kill you. Nothing is going the change... ever. Accept the risks associated with living here or move on to another place. No I am not bashing Thailand but like I stated above, this is Thailand. 

Edited August 2, 2019 by Nickymaster

[LivinLOS]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Separately, the Thailand Accident Research Centre has been working with top motorcycle manufacturers, Honda and Yamaha, to study 1,000 big bike accidents that took place in Thailand since 2017. So far, up to 600 cases have already been studied and the top cause for the accident has been found to be a lack of skill in perceiving hazards, vehicle control and ability to make a split-second decision in emergency situations. 

 

Assistant Prof Kunnavee Kanitpong, manager at the Thailand Accident Research Centre (TARC), said: “From the data we collected, it would be correct to say that big bike riders in Thailand lack the basics, causing them to have low riding skills and a higher risk of accidents. Another factor is that most riders have no understanding of situations that could cause an accident. We often see riders who do not know or are unaware of dangers that could take place. They are unable to make a quick decision or evade obstacles when in an emergency situation.” 

...

3 hours ago, webfact said:

She added that the only way to swiftly reduce the number of accidents and casualties is to develop riding skills in three areas: accident prediction, correct decision making and safe vehicle control.

 

Rare accurate and perceptive advice.. Which extends 100% the same to the car drivers also.. 

 

The issues faced are not road rules (tho they are often abused causing accidents) road speeds (same) or even entirely down to terrible road design. Although all these factors do contribute. 

 

The biggest by far problem is, a population of drivers with terrible driving skills, poor analytical / risk skills, even basic cause and effect thinking. The constant 'brake failure' after coasting a loaded commercial vehicle down a steep hill on the brakes, the 2 tonne SUV owner driving 4 meters behind someone in the wet, etc etc etc.. Its driver failure we see constantly, in all vehicles, motorcycles are, as the famous saying goes "Motorcycling, is not, of itself inherently dangerous. It is, however, extremely unforgiving of inattention, ignorance, incompetence, or stupidity." all 4 of which seem on prime display. 

[M71]

Never seen a big bike run into a post on it's own. There needs to be someone riding it - advanced riding classes should be mandatory here and in every country the accident rate WILL drop dramatically.

[2long]

Personally, even if everyone was abiding by the law and there were no potholes, I still would not have a big bike in Thailand. I have had lots of big bikes over many years and I love them. But it's necessary to wear more-protective gear than when riding a scooter, and in this climate .. no thank you!

Add to that the cost of the things, plus would you really trust Somchai (even at your main dealer) to fit and service the tyres and brakes?

Oh, and you're not allowed in the 'fast lanes'.

And then finally, there's the fact they with so many who ignore the law and road safety it's impossible to enjoy riding or cornering at any speed with the confidence that someone won't pull out or be blocking the road around that blind corner with the perfect asphalt. 

I love big bikes, but in Thailand it's scooter or car all day long.

[dinsdale]

I wonder how much of the above stats were due to idiot car drivers?

[waxon]

1 hour ago, MaxYakov said:

Big bikes should be restricted to racetracks.

You do not seem to be a big bike rider based on this statement. 

 

If if you don’t ride, all you have is an uninformed opinion. Obviously you are nervous and do not like big bikes. Fine. Good thing you are not in charge.