Old habits die hard: Stores try to cut down on plastic bags, but shoppers remain stubborn

[giddyup]

Just now, banagan said:

Easy fix, just charge 2 - 3 baht per bag, they'll change their tune quick enough.

 

 

Problem is, people are just too bloody lazy to bother. They put a toothbrush already encased in plastic into another plastic bag, totally unnecessary.

[Brigand]

Plastic is a super useful thing, especially in the medical field and some others. Yes, plastic bags are not necessary and an alternative can be found (packaging too) with the right amount of political/social will. One of the main problems is the disposal of plastic (especially bags/bottles) and the uneducated dimwit attitude from your average person.

 

A multi-pronged approach needs to be adopted along the lines of a serious "Keep Thailand Tidy" media campaign (same as they had in the UK in the 80s), people charged/taxed heavily to have them at point of issue, make it illegal for the bags to not be bio-degradable/composting type, give incentives to bring your own cotton bag, only use recycled paper bags etc. Also, there needs to be education of all levels of society on how important the environment is to our and nature's well-being too. Something else that can be changed is that societies need to move away from this instant use and disposable style of everything. You used to be able to buy things that would last and if they went wrong you could repair them ... that unfortunately has mostly gone as now things are only designed to last so long and then you have to buy them again (repair often not possible) so that countries can keep their economies going. Our whole attitude towards disposal of things needs to be rethought.   

[patsfangr]

Let's inject a bit of reality and practicality into this discussion. What about the problems of dealing with water and bulk? 

 

The unfortunate fact is that water is the enemy of packaging. Whether it be purchases or trash, items that are wet (or generate water through melting or condensation) will destroy the bottom of a paper bag within a very short time. The result of that, of course, is groceries or trash all over the ground. In the case of groceries, breakage is also a problem. The trash challenge can certainly be met by using only permanent metal containers. But that creates a most inconvenient requirement for frequent cleaning of same. 

 

Yes, as truly inconvenient as it is, we can all bring our own cloth bags for all purchases ... at least for purchases in small batches. But what about the bulk problem? Can we carry 8 -10 cloth bags into a supermarket for a major shopping trip? Where do we put them while shopping? They'd take up half the space in a shopping cart. ... OK, so we double or triple our shopping trips to keep the loads small. Not to mention the personal inconvenience, what would that do to traffic on the roads?

 

I'm a nature lover. I absolutely hate placing creatures in danger by spewing plastic of all kinds into their environment. Not to mention the ugliness it creates throughout our streets and countryside. But the plastic problem is not as easy to deal with in modern society as some believe. I wish I could present a practical total solution. Unfortunately, I can't.  

[djayz]

If customers were to be charged B 5, 10, 15, 20 / per bag, as is the case in some countries, like many countries in Europe for example, then many customers would simply bring their own resuable bags and baskets. This would result in an immediate reduction in the use of these bags. Money is a great motivating factor for many people, especially in poorer regions. 

 

That having been said, I find it unfair to solely lay the blame on customers. I purchased a relatevely big, expensive toy at a toy store recently and after having paid for it, the cashier girl gave me a big reusable bag. I was absolutely speechless to see that this environmentally friendly cloth bag was 1) packed in a plastic bag and 2) the cashier girl then placed this in yet another plastic bag. Now I'm standing at the counter with 2 (!!!) plastic bags for one product, which really didn't need to be packed at all. 

Another case in point of stores not taking a more practical and environmentally friendly approach is places which put certain products, like bananas, in plastic bags (7/11). Then you go to the cashier desk and they want to put that in another bag! 2 plastic bags for 1 banana!?!? I can't understand why bananas need to be packed in bags in the first place. These stores carry an equal share of the blame.

 

Fact of the matter is, this is an extremely ignorant people who are so stuck in their ways that a really new, radical approach has to be introduced if we want to see more customers - and businesses - saying no to plastic. 

 

I can just imagine the chaos at these "green lanes" at TescoLotus now: customers standing there with purchased products demanding bags so they can carry the stuff home. TL staff giving in with a smile and a wai and packing the groceries for them into as many bags as the customer wants. Who's to blame? The customers for not having the foresight / being too lazy to take reusable bags with them to the store or the staff and store for not pointing out that it's a green lane and refusing to hand out bags? 

 

Other (more developed albeit) countries have managed to noticeably reduce the need for these bags. Can the same be achieved here? I just don't see it happening anytime soon. 

 

 

[patsfangr]

43 minutes ago, Crash999 said:

Plastic bags have other uses. Trash bags. Protective packaging. And so on. Can’t be replaced by paper.  

 

A solution is using compostible bioplastic bags. They break down into natural materials quickly when exposed to the elements. But the cost is three times as much as regular bags, around 1.5 Baht each. So retailers haven’t adopted them. 

Still, Crash, that additional cost may be the only way to reach a truly practical solution, and eliminate plastic packaging forever. We humans will have to bear the cost of our modern society. Imagine if we actually took responsibility for ALL of our actions? What a crazy idea, huh?

[ThePioneer]

3 hours ago, quandow said:

I shopped at Tesco this week on one of their "No plastic bags" days. I had a backpack in my motorbike storage and didn't need any bags. Before I knew it, the cashier had put my stuff in a plastic bag. So much for THAT policy.

 

Same same Big C extra in Pattaya on their no plastic day last month. Where the previous months the plastic bags were under the counter, but you still could get them if you asked, last month they were just in full use on the no plastic bag day.

 

What bothers me the most at that shop is that if you buy 8 items, most likely you will have 10 -11 bags.

 

 

[IraqRon]

If no plastic bags how will the folks in my area be able to show others what they have in their bag while walking home from the store?  It is customary to do that up north here, an amusing trait.

[patsfangr]

37 minutes ago, zydeco said:

I was recently caught in Tops on one of their bag free days. This policy is idiocy. Three quarters of the store is packaged in plastic or supplied with plastic bottles. And they want to attack plastic bags, which are reused most often as trash can liners?  Stupid. When I got to the check out line, Tops said no bags and offered me cardboard boxes. Cardboard boxes? How was I supposed to walk around the mall with cardboard boxes doing the rest of my shopping? A couple of plastic bags is easily manageable. But three or four unwieldy cardboard boxes is not, especially when one arm is already full of a large container of repaired shoes. I just left the food items on the Tops checkout counter and walked out. This is nothing but a virtue signalling feel good policy that has zero effect on a clean environment. If they meant it, they would be using glass bottles with return deposits. 

The fact is that plastic BAGS cause more harm to animals than any other type of plastic containers. Yes, other actions can be taken; but that doesn't minimize the need or the value of eliminating plastic bags. 

[patsfangr]

36 minutes ago, giddyup said:

We take our own re-useable bags to Makro every time we shop there. You only have to leave them at the desk and pick them up just before you go through the check-out, hardly a chore.

And if literally everybody did that, giddyup? Got that picture in your mind?

 

[metisdead]

A post containing content from Bangkok Post has been removed as per forum rules. 

[patsfangr]

35 minutes ago, giddyup said:

We take our own re-useable bags to Makro, Big C, Tesco and 7/11, but we must be the only people in Pattaya who do. Never seen one other person bring their own bags, Thai or falang alike.

I do so for small quantity shopping; such as to my local Tops and Fresh markets on the Darkside. But, as I noted earlier, it's impractical to a supermarket. Not impossible, however. We could do as we must at Macro. Take everything out to the car in the cart, and pack it into our own bags at the trunk. 

[mikebell]

1 hour ago, blackcab said:

Some branches of Homepro in Bangkok have completely stopped giving out plastic bags for free. You can buy a plastic bag for 1 baht each.

On Saturday I bought my lunch at a WH Smiths store in Heathrow.  (4.99 UKP meal deal.)  I was asked if I wanted a bag & thoughtlessly said yes.  My final bill came to 5.09.  I won't do that in a hurry.

[giddyup]

5 minutes ago, patsfangr said:

And if literally everybody did that, giddyup? Got that picture in your mind?

 

We'd have less plastic floating in the ocean for a start.

[recom273]

4 hours ago, bdenner said:

Our local Tesco has tried to introduce large brown paper bags on 3 occasions I know of. Customers seem to be OK with them but the checkout staff get very frustrated trying to unfold and pack them.

 

Stores like Makro will not allow you to carry reusable carry bags with you into their stores so one has to go through their bullshlt method of placing items from one trolley into another as they are being checked out then repacking in the boot of the car. These effin wackers are not trying to help the situation

Yes, this is my experience too. They don’t let you carry in reusable bags I the store to use at the checkouts because you might fill them with items.

 

I have been chased around stores by security guards - please put your empty backpack in the bag check, I presume they think that it would be good to pack the stuff in plastic bags, then carry those back to my backpack and then hand the plastic back (as I have seen) to the cashier to throw away, because Thai people don’t like used things (apparently)

 

Big c, tesco, HomePod, watsadu - the only people who can apply logic is tops.

[giddyup]

3 minutes ago, patsfangr said:

I do so for small quantity shopping; such as to my local Tops and Fresh markets on the Darkside. But, as I noted earlier, it's impractical to a supermarket. Not impossible, however. We could do as we must at Macro. Take everything out to the car in the cart, and pack it into our own bags at the trunk. 

Why impractical? No difference in packing your own re-useable bag than the checkout girl putting in a plastic bag. In fact, the checkout girls will quite happily pack it into your own bags. You don't have to take the goods out to your car at Makro, they will put it into your own bags at the checkout if you want.

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, recom273 said:

Yes, this is my experience too. They don’t let you carry in reusable bags I the store to use at the checkouts because you might fill them with items.

 

I have been chased around stores by security guards - please put your empty backpack in the bag check, I presume they think that it would be good to pack the stuff in plastic bags, then carry those back to my backpack and then hand the plastic back (as I have seen) to the cashier to throw away, because Thai people don’t like used things (apparently)

 

Big c, tesco, HomePod, watsadu - the only people who can apply logic is tops.

God, how many times do I have to say it. you leave your own bags at the front desk at Makro and pick them up just before you go through the checkout. Big C Extra and Tesco we take our empty bags in the trolley without a problem.

[spidermike007]

I see more and more stores making an effort. We have to contribute on our own. 

 

A change in consciousness must start at the most basic level. Most Thais think plastic is the best thing ever invented, and the percentage of Thais that even consider the negative ramifications of plastic is incredibly small. This requires some education. I always do two things to avoid the consumption of plastic.

 

1. I bring re-usable bags with me every time I go shopping. I use the larger shopping bags I buy in the US, which are made of recycled materials. Most of the clerks have to be dealt with. Even when they see my bag, they still start putting the stuff in plastic. I always mai sai toom. No plastic! Then they start loading up my bag. Most look at me like I am from Mars. Do I care? Not one iota. About 10% thank me, and get it. Not many do. My Thai wife does not like bringing the bags to the store. I beg her to. By now, she expects it, and sometimes even asks if I have any bags in the car, or on the motorbike. Same with the water bottles. It used to embarrass her. Now, it is second nature, as I have been doing this for so long, she expects it. So, if a Thai can be conditioned to follow these simple principals, then anyone can. 

 

2. I bring a bottle of water with me, every time I go to a restaurant. I refill my plastic bottles from the 20 liter bottles at home. It is easy. I never buy bottled water at a restaurant. This saves 300-600 bottles a year. I use a BPA free plastic bottle dozens of times. I never get any flack from the restaurants. Only once did someone say something to me. She said you cannot bring you own water. My response was if you serve the water in a glass bottle, and I do not have to consume a plastic bottle, I am happy to pay for that. It is not about saving 10 or 20 baht. She was lost. I told her to leave and get me my food. She went away. 

 

We simply cannot say we are concerned about the environment, and then do nothing about it. Action demonstrates commitment. Lack of action demonstrates nothing.

 

Lastly, restaurants can demonstrate their commitment, by serving drinking water from the 20 liter bottles. It saves alot of plastic. They lose a small amount of revenue, by not selling thousands of bottles of water. But, their operation is still profitable, and they are making a real difference. There really is not need to be consuming water in plastic bottles. At least not often. There are alternatives. Those damn bottles are a real culprit, when it comes to fouling the environment. What can we do to help, and be part of the solution, if we say we really care?

[patsfangr]

6 minutes ago, giddyup said:

We'd have less plastic floating in the ocean for a start.

I'm referring to the room needed at the checkout stand to store all those customers' bags; not to the move to eliminate plastic I'm just questioning the practicality your method; not the goal. 

[Ramdas]

Thai people need and must be educated if not disciplined altogether or else charged for it if they insisting on taking plastic bags from the stores.

As far as I’ve noticed, Tesco and 7/11 are the worst giving away tons of bags even for each item, I always tell them no need and I don’t want it, ignored, they smile  at me and then they just keep giving it out to the next customers ???? 

As for me, I only use two big bags  which I brought over from Tesco and Makro in the UK, I never take any plastic bags back home, I hate the unnecessary plastic ????

Sadly,  my girlfriend won’t stop this bad practice no matter how many times I’ve told her to reduce or not take it at all..I told her soon you will eat plastic fish,  Is anybody listening ? Nope ????

 

[ThaiBunny]

3 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Most Thais think plastic is the best thing ever invented

Most people think that and they are correct. It's the end-to-end life-cycle we haven't got right

[giddyup]

2 minutes ago, patsfangr said:

I'm referring to the room needed at the checkout stand to store all those customers' bags; not to the move to eliminate plastic I'm just questioning the practicality your method; not the goal. 

AFAIK Makro is the only store that makes you leave empty bags at the desk, everywhere else we don't have a problem putting them in the empty trolley.  Backpacks and small cases etc might be a problem, but I don't see that with an empty shopping bag. They do it in most western countries so why not here?

[rkidlad]

I’ve seen foreigners on twitter complaining some supermarkets don’t have plastic bags on certain days. Suck it up. Get into a good habit of taking canvas bags when you need them. It’s really not that hard and it’s for good reason. 

[theonetrueaussie]

I refuse to shop at any of the stores that refuse to give away plastic bags. If bigc or tesco want to be stupid and ban plastic bags then people will just shop at their competitors instead. Because people are always trying to get them banned I ALWAYS ask for plastic bags now I don't care if it is just 1 bottle of milk or something that I will eat straight away I get a plastic bag for it anyways!! THIS IS WAR PEOPLE!!!! Don't let the no plastic bag whimps win ????

[Beggar]

It will increase the lines at the cashiers since the people will take longer to pack their stuff themselves. I will save money because I will only buy something if I can carry it. I also will buy less. But I will buy plastic bags for my garbage since I don't have the ones from shopping anymore like now. 

 

 

[RJRS1301]

Why not bags made from either hemp or bamboo fibre? Strong, durable, inexpensive and sustainable

Same with fast food containers and utensils, and drinking containers, also 100 % compostable

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, Beggar said:

It will increase the lines at the cashiers since the people will take longer to pack their stuff themselves. I will save money because I will only buy something if I can carry it. I also will buy less. But I will buy plastic bags for my garbage since I don't have the ones from shopping anymore like now. 

 

 

Excuses, excuses, excuses. Another one who's stuck in a plastic rut.

[Beggar]

1 minute ago, giddyup said:

Excuses, excuses, excuses. Another one who's stuck in a plastic rut.

They should improve the recycling. 

[RJRS1301]

7 minutes ago, theonetrueaussie said:

I refuse to shop at any of the stores that refuse to give away plastic bags. If bigc or tesco want to be stupid and ban plastic bags then people will just shop at their competitors instead. Because people are always trying to get them banned I ALWAYS ask for plastic bags now I don't care if it is just 1 bottle of milk or something that I will eat straight away I get a plastic bag for it anyways!! THIS IS WAR PEOPLE!!!! Don't let the no plastic bag whimps win ????

I looked up the definition of uncaring and illogical, found "theonetrueaussie" listed there

[ThaiBunny]

Just now, RJRS1301 said:

I looked up the definition of uncaring and illogical, found "theonetrueaussie" listed there

Next to me, I hope

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, Beggar said:

They should improve the recycling. 

Put the blame elsewhere, typical of attitudes here.