Who pumps the septic tank?

[thaisail]

We have lived in this house in Phuket since it was brand new in 2012. No one has lived here before us. So, for 7 years we have maintained a good relationship with our landlord. We pay our rent 6 months in advance to get a discount on the rent. We want to stay in this house. Our 2 year contract ended on September 30th. One year ago, our water pump from the well started to fail and kept shutting down until the motor cooled off and could restart. So when it was time to pay the 6 months of rent, the owner agreed to change the pump with a new one. We were happy about this. About the same time, the electric water heater security system failed, probably do the continual failure of the water pump. So we paid 4000 baht for a new heater and had it installed. The landlord did not agree to pay for that. So, we kept the old heater and told her that when we move out one day, we will take the new water heater with us and refit the one with no security and she did not disagree. However a month later, she asked us if we could give her the old water heater with no security system so that she could fit it in her brother's house. I guess she doesn't like her brother too much. 

 

Now we have a problem starting with our toilet that is starting to be difficult to flush. We assume that the septic tank is starting to fill up because when we went away on holiday for 50 days and the house was empty the toilet was normal when we returned in August. Now the toilet problem is back now that we have been home for about 50 days. What I am asking is:

 

Who is responsible to pump out the septic tank when the tank is full?

Is it the landlord or is it us? 

Is there a compromise possible where we pay half-half? 

 

My Thai wife is telling me that we will loose our deposit if we move out because, the only way to keep the deposit is to repaint the house, change all the old window screens, re-varnish the windows and replace any chipped floor tiles. So it looks like we will loose our deposit because the cost of all that is more than the deposit. I have heard that the laws regarding landlords and renters rights has changed last year so we don't know where we stand and she is on her way to our house to do a new contract for 2 more years and we want to know where we stand. Anyone with experiences regarding the Thai law and Thai custom regarding this, please let us know. 

[CharlieH]

Well, my response would be, whose <deleted> is it ? who filled it ? same as a bin, if you filled it, would you expect the landlord to come empty the trash bin ?

 

I would say, reasonably, its your responsibility to empty out your <deleted>, not hers.????

 

But of course I may be wrong, but the above seems logical to me.

 

 

 

 

 

[colinneil]

Surely the OP is having a laugh did your landlord come round and use your toilet?

Answer would be no, you filled it with your s++t, so surely it is your responsibility to empty it.

[wgdanson]

Just had our two tanks emptied.....Bht 300.

Split the bill 50/50 with the Mrs cos half of it was hers!

Edited October 7, 2019 by wgdanson

[Vacuum]

55 minutes ago, thaisail said:

Who is responsible to pump out the septic tank when the tank is full?

Does it really matter? It's about 250 baht ...

Edited October 7, 2019 by Vacuum

[richard_smith237]

Op: In your contract who is responsible for repairs etc?

 

Are you responsible for 'touchup' at the end of your contract? (is that written). 

 

Usually, a deposit is for 'damage' and not normal wear and tear after living in a house for 8 years. 

 

Regarding the septic tank. Again, it depends what is dictated in your contract. Who has the Air-con serviced ever 6 months or so? (you pay or the landlord), Who pays the yearly maintenance fees?

 

Regardless, having the septic tank emptied is not going to cost much, others will know but for now I'd guess at about 500baht, so its not something really worth worrying about. 

 

With regards to getting your money back after moving out, that depends on wear and tear vs damage. Holes in fly screens equals damage, filling in of holes where you've hung frames etc equals repair to damage. Repainting and refreshing the house after 8 years is touching up normal wear (it would have required the same paint-job had no one lived there for 8 years. 

 

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by richard_smith237

[VocalNeal]

Bung some enzyme stuff down the toilet. Bt60. Available at Big C Mini stores (next to the drain cleaner) and most hardware stores. I lived in a town house for 12 years and never had anything pumped out.

 

 

[Lacessit]

If you are happy with where you live, why wouldn't you just sign the new 2 - year contract?

Presumably you pay for the removal of garbage every week or so. I can't see any difference between that and what goes down the toilet.

As another poster has said, it will cost peanuts to empty the septic tank. or you can try the enzyme fix. Mountain out of a molehill.

The average period for emptying a septic tank is about ten years. Yours is full after seven. That suggests to me something I am not allowed to say on TV.

[Bob12345]

4 hours ago, thaisail said:

Who is responsible to pump out the septic tank when the tank is full?

Is it the landlord or is it us? 

Is there a compromise possible where we pay half-half? 

Unless specified in the contract its the landlords duty to keep the house in shape unless you damaged things which would not fall under normal use.

 

So he pays to clean the AC, he pays for new light bulbs, and he pays for the septic tank. 

 

If a compromise is possible you need to discuss with the landlord, how can we know?

 

(Info based on a lecture by my Thai business law professor at chula uni. Good luck starting a court case over a 500 baht septic tank cleaning though)

[Jeffrey346]

IMO, it's the landlords responsibility to pump the septic tank. In addition, if the house needs painting, That's the landlords responsibility as well.

[chilly07]

Clearly the septic tank is the tenants responsibility to maintain including emptying periodically as is cleaning and maintaining the Aircon. Repainting and cleaning is also the tenants responsibility as it's condition will be worse than at occupancy. On a commercial tenancy a schedule of condition should be drawn up- not a bad idea on residential tenancies as Thai's often use residential properties commercially.

[dotpoom]

4 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Just had our two tanks emptied.....Bht 300.

Split the bill 50/50 with the Mrs cos half of it was hers!

Guessed it was cheap...don't understand why the OP was concerned about who pays for it to be pumped.

Maybe could even get paid for it...the very best of manure ...for sure.

[nervona81732]

Call your local honey wagon guy. Their all over.

[wgdanson]

1 hour ago, chilly07 said:

Clearly the septic tank is the tenants responsibility to maintain including emptying periodically as is cleaning and maintaining the Aircon. Repainting and cleaning is also the tenants responsibility as it's condition will be worse than at occupancy. On a commercial tenancy a schedule of condition should be drawn up- not a bad idea on residential tenancies as Thai's often use residential properties commercially.

The Tenant pays for cleaning yes, re-painting no, maintenance no.

[spetersen]

6 hours ago, CharlieH said:

Well, my response would be, whose <deleted> is it ? who filled it ? same as a bin, if you filled it, would you expect the landlord to come empty the trash bin ?

 

I would say, reasonably, its your responsibility to empty out your <deleted>, not hers.????

 

But of course I may be wrong, but the above seems logical to me.

 

 

 

 

 

During the time we were renting the house that we bought a year later we always paid for cleaning the tank and we do it once a year , 1000 THB in Pattaya

[boonchu]

I have lived in our house since new and never had to have the septic tanks pumped out. We have 3 tanks. What I do every 6 months is to put the enzymes in each toilet, this seems to solve these problems and I believe it also helps eliminate smells.

[Lacessit]

6 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Just had our two tanks emptied.....Bht 300.

Split the bill 50/50 with the Mrs cos half of it was hers!

Women are usually more constipated than men. She probably got a raw deal.

[hugocnx]

6 hours ago, Vacuum said:

Does it really matter? It's about 250 baht ...

That cheap. Not in Chiang Mai. Where you live?

[hugocnx]

2 hours ago, chilly07 said:

Clearly the septic tank is the tenants responsibility to maintain including emptying periodically as is cleaning and maintaining the Aircon. Repainting and cleaning is also the tenants responsibility as it's condition will be worse than at occupancy. On a commercial tenancy a schedule of condition should be drawn up- not a bad idea on residential tenancies as Thai's often use residential properties commercially.

Repainting the house? No way tenants responsibility. But if the landlord will do it????

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by hugocnx

[Captain 776]

I would NOT pay to fix or replace anything.

Either landlord does it or deduct any expenses from rent.

They are crazy to lose a good tenant that pays rent on time 7 yrs.

[Kwasaki]

7 hours ago, thaisail said:

Is it the landlord or is it us?

Well work it out for yourself, we rent to tenants we don't fill the septic tank the tenants do. 

[55Jay]

There might be some wiggle room if other tenants lived there before but that's not the case, it's "all yours", so agree with others - empty the tank and be done with it.

 

I sense your growing anxiety having moved into a sparkling new house and after 6 to now 7 years on, things are starting to happen, as they do.   From the bit you've said in OP, sounds like your Thai landlord is in the middle attitude range, but if she's quibbling about a cheap, busted water heater, that's an indication she's tight, and her disposition might get weirder as more of these things start to happen.  Especially if the rent is low and stable thus far. 

 

I'd say try your best to discuss things with L/L (via your wife, I presume) without coming across as confrontational.   Be cool and reasonable and don't start nickle and diming her on every little thing that comes up....  especially if your rent is low and stable, and you still like living there and enjoy life.  Have your Mrs. ascertian the L/L's mindset about "normal wear and tear" in a long-term rental scenario like yours.

 

The acid test is when it comes times to leave, of course, but don't go down the rabbit hole conjuring worst case scenario and fretting about it now. 

[khunPer]

10 hours ago, thaisail said:

Who is responsible to pump out the septic tank when the tank is full?

Is it the landlord or is it us? 

Is there a compromise possible where we pay half-half?

When I was renting, the septic tank was the landslord's responsibility, but might be it's a fifty/fifty thing.

 

However, a well working septic tank don't need to be drained, but might need little bio-active maintenance – liquid, powder or tabs – and care taken that no harmful waste is dropped in the toilet, including cleaning liquids. Du check that rain-water can not access the tank, or the tank-system, as it might fill it up; same with a water leaking toilet. I use to add some bio-active before the rainy season, and after the rainy season; the small bags available in Home Mart or HomePro is 49 baht, or a small bottle enough for twice for 60 to 80 baht.

 

If a septic tank is drained, some bio-active should be added to the tank, as it otherwise might need to be emptied regularly (that seems to be what some Thais do).

 

In general it seems like the tenant rules in Thailand are similar to the ones in our Western home countries – at least my home country, and with the two landlords I've been renting from here – i.e. the landlord is responsible for outside maintenance, the tenant is responsible for inside maintenance. In other words, a leaking roof is the landlord's responsibility, whilst a broken water heater is the tenant's responsibility, if the water heater worked when the rent periode began. Normal conditions are that the rented shall be returned in same good and working condition, as it was when the rent began, but disregarding aging during the rental period.

 

For example, the outer aircon unit's service and liquid refill my landlord did, the inside unit's cleaning and service was my responsibility. I damaged a fridge when I rented, and told my landlord that I would buy a new to replace it; he asked me to buy same low energy grade (A-label), and was very happy I told him, and would replace it...????

 

Edit: PS: To empty a tank is often somewhere between 250 baht and 500 baht – I would never argue about anything in that price level with a landlord, but kindly ask a landlord to please help me get the tank drained, and say I gladly pay.

Cheap amount to avoid a problem, and be happy...

Edited October 7, 2019 by khunPer

[Kalasin Jo]

10 hours ago, Vacuum said:

Does it really matter? It's about 250 baht ...

Exactly. And it's your stuff in there so I would say your responsibility. If it's gone that long without being pumped out you have a very good one too. I wouldn't upset your landlady over it. The water heater though is different. If she wants the previous one, which I assume works but has no working cutout, I would put it to her that she pay you for the new one and she can have the old one.

[poohy]

Isnt there a saying about sorting your own <deleted> out

[topt]

19 hours ago, khunPer said:

In other words, a leaking roof is the landlord's responsibility, whilst a broken water heater is the tenant's responsibility, if the water heater worked when the rent periode began.

UK is I think therefore different. If an electric shower breaks with no sign of misuse from the tenants then it would normally be up to the landlord to replace - same as a dripping/faulty tap, pipe connection etc. Should be fairly clear from the contract however.

 

19 hours ago, khunPer said:

 I use to add some bio-active

Do you have a picture by any chance - and do you add directly to the tank or via one of the toilets?

[Skeptic7]

On 10/7/2019 at 5:19 PM, boonchu said:

I have lived in our house since new and never had to have the septic tanks pumped out. We have 3 tanks. What I do every 6 months is to put the enzymes in each toilet, this seems to solve these problems and I believe it also helps eliminate smells.

Do you get them locally? Online? Any further info would be much appreciated! ????

[khunPer]

4 hours ago, topt said:

Do you have a picture by any chance - and do you add directly to the tank or via one of the toilets?

I use this brand, available as both minitabs in a small plastic bag (one portion) for 49 baht in Home Mart and HomePro; or as liquid in HomePro in two bottle sizes, a small for about 60 baht, and 1000 cc (1 liter) for around 160 baht (might be 180 baht now)...

 

 

Put 100 cc – a about a small cup – in the toilet and flush. It can also clean stopped pipes.

 

I use it both for black water septic tanks, grey water tanks, and rain water tanks, as they all can have organic content that makes them drain slower, whilst when liquid the tanks works well.

 

There are other brands available, also in 1 kilogram cans as powder to be mixed with water; the latter might be little cheaper in use per 100 cc.

[jackdd]

In my opinion, if something has to be done by the landlord or the tenant does imho depend on how often it has to be done.

Something which has to be done at least every few months is the tenants responsibility (for example cleaning the house, cutting the grass etc.)

Stuff which has to be done only once a year or less than that (for example cleaning the aircon, or as in this case the septic tank, buying a new water heater etc.) is the responsibility of the landlord.