Too much immigration stress

[sirineou]

6 hours ago, rumak said:

7 hours ago, Bournville said:

 

 
I don't find any humour in your remark. 2014.. Military government.. 37 baht to the usd. 2017....death of the Father of Thailand and IMHO.. the decline of hope and happiness with Thai people. Very sad. 2019... Democracy almost gone. 2019.. 30 baht to a USD. Increased cost of goods and rent.

You don't notice these changes? Seriously... Wake up! Get your head out 8f the sand.

Sent from my CLT-L09 using Tapatalk
 

you must be the life of the party.

[Curt1591]

90 day report - pain in the butt, for a day.

Visa extension - pain in the butt, for one day.

TM 30 - pain in the butt when traveling international. 

Foreign funds placed in Thai bank - with the rising baht, a good investment.
 

Last visit to  CW Immigration, did 90 day, re-entry permit, and verification of residence (for drivers license), in under 2 hours.

My life has never been less stressful ...

[Bournville]

12 hours ago, malibukid said:

i get my beach fix on Bali.  lovely people.

I stayed in Sanur for 3 months thus year. I agree.. Lovely genuine.. Kind... Better spoken english people. Their religion is much more authentic.

Sent from my CLT-L09 using Tapatalk
 

Edited October 26, 2019 by Bournville

[Celer et Audax]

Got to agree with you. As I've said a few times before on this forum...what's the problem? All we do is spend spend spend, we get nothin' for nothin' here. We'll never get Thai citizenship or welfare payments and free housing and free medical....all those things that Thais get back in our home countries. So what's it matter if John Doe spends 10 months a year in Thailand ringing the bell in a Pattaya bar or eating a coconut on Patong Beach?

There is no welfare system in Thailand like you would find in most western countries even for Thai nationals, you can however access the health system and the limited social security system if you have worked here and contributed from your salary each month.
My company provides health insurance but I could if I chose to use a government hospital at no charge.
When I retire should I decide to remain in Thailand I will be entitled to the same pension as a Thai national and can also still have access to the government health system by paying the charge which I believe currently is 460baht a month
Why do people who retire here think they should have access to the Thai welfare system(limited as it is) when they have not contributed?
Would I for example be allowed to access the welfare system in Australia if I chose to move there when I retire? Would I even be allowed to retire there? Currently I cannot access the NHS in my home country (UK) apart from emergency treatment as I have been non resident for over 20 years
I do however agree with your comment about it being very difficult to get Thai citizenship
PR is not so difficult though but you do need to be able to show that you have payed taxes here for 3 years or more I think


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[grifbel]

9 hours ago, persimmon said:

Maybe the reception you get from Immigration depends on who you are and what you look like.Last time exiting at Suwan, the female officer in the booth seemed very friendly and smiling when dealing with the young farang woman in front, When it was my turn , her expression changed to a scowl - she made it obvious that I was not welcome.

 

I am 55 yr old white male.

Try showering before you go next time....

[grifbel]

14 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

against our community in many ways. 

Community?  Permit me to paraphrase the great Groucho Marx, I wouldn't want to be a member of any community that would have me as a member.

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by grifbel

[villagefarang]

5 hours ago, rumak said:

7 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

Well please tell us how exactly it is you do live in Thailand and what you plan to do about health insurance long into your late 70's and 80's?

oh god ........ you want to hear his story AGAIN ?    

Edited 5 hours ago by rumak

Hey...Most people love my story but it is too long so I will just post the link.????

 

 

[rumak]

13 minutes ago, villagefarang said:

Most people love my story

A legend in his own mind ....

 

most people   hahahah    the king of boast,  mayor of Chiangrai    hahaa

did you ever meet that guy that you called a loser ?

 

people that always boast ......search google    the explanation is too long as well

[villagefarang]

3 minutes ago, rumak said:

A legend in his own mind ....

 

most people   hahahah    the king of boast,  mayor of Chiangrai    hahaa

did you ever meet that guy that you called a loser ?

 

people that always boast ......search google    the explanation is too long as well

I love you too.????  What would life be without a troll or two for companionship?????

[TigerandDog]

On 10/25/2019 at 9:37 AM, Pilotman said:

I think the OP's attitude  and feelings are not unusual among expats now and are justified. Immigration is inconsistent and the ever changing regulations are annoying at best.  This latest change, to require Health Insurance for an extension to be granted, is the latest and probably the final nail in the coffin for many, including I am very sad to say, my Thai wife and I. At 71 the premium for health insurance for me is over US$20,000 per year, I can pay that, but I refuse to do so, for a near useless policy. As to Thais, I find them friendly and welcoming, part from an isolated  few.  They are not the problem, this xenophobic and economically illiterate government is the problem and nothing expats can do will change that fact.  

Where did you read that you need health insurance for an extension to be granted? As far as I know, and UbonJoe can confirm this, the health insurance requirement is ONLY for new O-A visa applications, and they can only be acquired outside of Thailand. At this point in time, there is no requirement for health insurance for an extension, to the best of my knowledge. Also I play golf with an IO and he tells me the same thing.

[Pilotman]

2 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

Where did you read that you need health insurance for an extension to be granted? As far as I know, and UbonJoe can confirm this, the health insurance requirement is ONLY for new O-A visa applications, and they can only be acquired outside of Thailand. At this point in time, there is no requirement for health insurance for an extension, to the best of my knowledge. Also I play golf with an IO and he tells me the same thing.

It was a 'pre clarity'  post from me.  I agree with you and Ubon Joe.  Since that time we have had some clarity from our local IO. The panic has passed, at least for now. 

[Old Croc]

17 hours ago, Henryford said:

I can't say i find it all that stressful. I go to immigration one a year for my visa extension, 15 minutes. I go for my 90 day report 5 minutes. I never expect thais to welcome me with open arms. Most are civil and happy to do business.

A popular refrain, particularly for those living in areas where their local IOs are business like, organized and don't treat their clients as enemies or potential scam targets.

I (and wife) have been stuffed around by the local IOs on numerous occasions. Refusal to accept documentation until some new requirement is met is common. The most annoying prank they pulled was the personal information form that required details like banking and other personal financial dealings, social contacts, venues patronized and even the name and address of my "headman" in my home country.

However, Immigration is not always the worse part of the extension process. This year the visit to my bank to simply have the bankbook updated, get a statement of my account and a short letter about funds, took about 1 1/2 hours.  When my turn for service came the only available customer officer went to lunch, leaving me sitting there fuming. When I was finally served, the lengthy process involved taking several copies of my passport, the filling in of numerus forms, many signatures, much photocopying and payment of several fees amounting to hundreds of baht.  

The extension process is not just about the time taken when Immigration is finally satisfied with the documentation. The banks (and now insurance companies) are co-conspirators in the scams.

 

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by Old Croc

[Old Croc]

 

 

31 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

35 minutes ago, TigerandDog said:

Where did you read that you need health insurance for an extension to be granted? As far as I know, and UbonJoe can confirm this, the health insurance requirement is ONLY for new O-A visa applications, and they can only be acquired outside of Thailand. At this point in time, there is no requirement for health insurance for an extension, to the best of my knowledge. Also I play golf with an IO and he tells me the same thing.

It was a 'pre clarity'  post from me.  I agree with you and Ubon Joe.  Since that time we have had some clarity from our local IO. The panic has passed, at least for now. 

I hope you are right, but fear they will be asking for insurance from people on extensions also.  There is some evidence they will. Time will tell.

[Pilotman]

2 hours ago, Old Croc said:

 

 

I hope you are right, but fear they will be asking for insurance from people on extensions also.  There is some evidence they will. Time will tell.

I am sure you are right, which is why my wife and I are still going to research and plan for a back stop position of moving out.  Neither of us want to, but we may be forced to.  She is Thai and yet feels like she is being forced out of her own country by an unfeeling, uncaring government, in order to preserve her family intact. 

[pookondee]

53 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

I am sure you are right, which is why my wife and I are still going to research and plan for a back stop position of moving out.  Neither of us want to, but we may be forced to.  She is Thai and yet feels like she is being forced out of her own country by an unfeeling, uncaring government, in order to preserve her family intact. 

I do feel for the guys with wives, families, kids going through all this uncertainty.

 

Throughout the whole thing though, one thing i cant understand is why more of the Thai mothers and families dont speak up to the government?

 

I guess the government will hardly listen, but thats not the point.

 

I suppose the Thais will all just

 "mai pen rai" it off until the husbands and providers have been finally forced out, then they will realise they are left pennyless..

and then they will be screaming blue murder.

 

I know it sounds callous, but i really hope the family guys who are forced out NEVER send 1 more satang back into this country for ANY reason.

 

If they dont want us here, let THEM support the families of farangs forced out.

 

Many will surely speak up when the rice bowl is empty. but it will be to late.

 

 

[Pilotman]

35 minutes ago, pookondee said:

I do feel for the guys with wives, families, kids going through all this uncertainty.

 

Throughout the whole thing though, one thing i cant understand is why more of the Thai mothers and families dont speak up to the government?

 

I guess the government will hardly listen, but thats not the point.

 

I suppose the Thais will all just

 "mai pen rai" it off until the husbands and providers have been finally forced out, then they will realise they are left pennyless..

and then they will be screaming blue murder.

 

I know it sounds callous, but i really hope the family guys who are forced out NEVER send 1 more satang back into this country for ANY reason.

 

If they dont want us here, let THEM support the families of farangs forced out.

 

Many will surely speak up when the rice bowl is empty. but it will be to late.

 

 

It's just not in the Thai culture, at least not for the run of the mill village people.  My wife is angry beyond words, but you would never really know it unless you knew her well.  She sees no point in complaining even if she knew how to do it and who to contact. She goes with the situation, but she is as unhappy about it all as I am. 

[Tomahawk21]

i think it really depends on who you mix with and where you spend your time. i have lived here 20 years and still very happy. i have as least to do with Thai people as possible, try that, you may start to enjoy yourself more.

[BritManToo]

17 minutes ago, Tomahawk21 said:

have as least to do with Thai people as possible, try that, you may start to enjoy yourself more.

Good advice!

(Excluding the ones you're sleeping with)

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, pookondee said:

Throughout the whole thing though, one thing i cant understand is why more of the Thai mothers and families dont speak up to the government?

The Thai government doesn't deal nicely with those who dissent.

I completely understand why everyone has learned to keep their mouths shut.

[bwpage3]

9 hours ago, villagefarang said:

Hey...Most people love my story but it is too long so I will just post the link.????

 

 

We have all seen your photos. To which any tourist to Thailand has seen and experienced.

 

How about your plan for health insurance into your 70's and 80's?

[pookondee]

2 hours ago, Pilotman said:

It's just not in the Thai culture, at least not for the run of the mill village people.  My wife is angry beyond words, but you would never really know it unless you knew her well.  She sees no point in complaining even if she knew how to do it and who to contact. She goes with the situation, but she is as unhappy about it all as I am. 

Well i know we farangs are used to doing things differently in the west, and can write letters to ombudsmen and MPs and such.

But even good old Mr Prem constantly told people (on his television appearances) to contact the relevant department if they have problems. 

He also reported "what the people told him" so there must be some feedback that the government gets from the people about issues.

 

If a group made a petition about how impractical and unworkable this insurance issue will be..got signatures..

 

let them know the issues such as the older folks who will not even be able to get cover..

 

at least there is a slight chance you will get heard??

 

Its possible they are not even aware of all the issues, since pollies (the world over) rarely know what its like in the real world.

 

They were talking about charging a small fee (for some sort of basic cover)

to everyone entering Thailand, but i havent seen any more about that.

 

Its still possible they will come up with some basic fee, accross the board that will cover their so-called "losses".

 

Anyway. knowing the thirst for clickbait on..errr...certain sites, i would not take anything to serious until it actually happens.

[villagefarang]

33 minutes ago, bwpage3 said:

We have all seen your photos. To which any tourist to Thailand has seen and experienced.

 

How about your plan for health insurance into your 70's and 80's?

I'm okay, how about you?  How is your health?

 

I am pleased to hear you have been everywhere and experienced everything I have.  Perhaps you could share some of your adventures and the details of your health plans.????

[Suradit69]

On October 25, 2019 at 8:16 PM, wtfracing said:

I totally agree with you I thought this was a forum to help expats express their opinions and observations, not to get criticized or ridiculed when they have something to say because long term members dont like it

" ... to help expats express their opinions ..."

 

You're confusing this forum with the Salwation Army drop-in center for  the perpetually perplexed and chronically gobsmacked.

 

Help them express their opinions. I'm sure your comment introduced some comic relief in the midst of all this stress-induced drama and masturbatory release from the slings and arrows of outrageous whatever.

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by Suradit69

[fhickson]

if you really need that kind of feedback from the locals expatriation may not be for you.

 

key for me is to find somewhere cheap with necessities and get involved as little as possible while still being happy.

 

otherwise, your going to spend your life trying to fit in somewhere where its just not going to ever budge that much.

 

if you want to fit in 100% your home country is the way to go. serious topic.

 

so ditch caring what the thais are doing, IF you can avoid them, and do your own thing. everything else is just peacock and paperwork. is it still doable for you?

[BigStar]

On 10/26/2019 at 10:43 AM, Old Croc said:

A popular refrain, particularly for those living in areas where their local IOs are business like, organized and don't treat their clients as enemies or potential scam targets.

I (and wife) have been stuffed around by the local IOs on numerous occasions. Refusal to accept documentation until some new requirement is met is common. The most annoying prank they pulled was the personal information form that required details like banking and other personal financial dealings, social contacts, venues patronized and even the name and address of my "headman" in my home country.

However, Immigration is not always the worse part of the extension process. This year the visit to my bank to simply have the bankbook updated, get a statement of my account and a short letter about funds, took about 1 1/2 hours.  When my turn for service came the only available customer officer went to lunch, leaving me sitting there fuming. When I was finally served, the lengthy process involved taking several copies of my passport, the filling in of numerus forms, many signatures, much photocopying and payment of several fees amounting to hundreds of baht.  

The extension process is not just about the time taken when Immigration is finally satisfied with the documentation. The banks (and now insurance companies) are co-conspirators in the scams.

 

 

Not only did you have to get out of your armchair and waste a trivial amount of time when your time is SO critical to the survival of the world economy, but you also spent "hundreds of baht," which of course represented a "scam." ???? OMG. What I could do with hundreds of baht . . . .

 

So tragic. How can we alleviate some of this suffering? I filled in the forms years ago on my computer and just change the dates and print out fresh copies. My phone number is also preprinted on the forms. When I learn about a new form, I do the same. What with signing, that takes about 10 minutes, once a year.

 

On my way to the Immigration office I stop by an ATM and update my passbook if need be. Went to the bank the day before and BTW withdrew some good spending money. I bring along a music player, tablet, Kindle, or good book to pass pleasantly any waiting time. I might also have lunch and/or beers in a nearby resto. ???? I'm dressed neatly in long pants and golf shirt, not that stupid "checked shirt (shirt out and hanging over fat gut) and cargo pants" uniform. I smile and greet the IO when my number is called, he/she gets my neatly typed, easily read copies, spends a minute looking them over and I'm done for that day. Time to relax! Which can take many forms here in LOS.

 

I seldom go for 90 day reports as I pay a motorcy man to go do it for me or use other means.

 

Now this HUGE effort and having to do something new once in a while is infinitely small compared to dealing w/ paperwork and paying bureaucrats back in the West. Remember? Types of Tax in UK. Oh, you wish it was "hundreds of baht" not thousands of pounds and not a scam. ????

 

Note we never compare Thailand w/ the most comparable country in the region with a similar level of development, Malaysia. Why's that? Malaysia is SO expat-friendly. You're loved purely for your wonderful self there, true loved. Lovely beaches, friendly people, food, lovely women. Check out that retirement program just to lure in expats, unlike hostile Thailand. Yeah, MM2H, bee's knees. Then you notice the, ah, paperwork and financial requirements for all that love. ???? But, of course, no health insurance required, right? Whoops.

 

Quote

MM2H will have certain eligibility requirements they need to meet like passing a medical evaluation and showing proof of financial stability. Additionally, approved applicants and all dependents must be covered by international health insurance that is valid in Malaysia.

 

And try opening a bank account if you're not in the program or don't have work permit. Whoops.

 

I think I'll just continue living here, LOL. It's so manageable with so many conveniences. ????

 

Edited October 27, 2019 by BigStar

[Grumpy John]

OK,  I'll agree the balongne with Immigration is annoying but not to the point I would leave LOS.  And if I left it would be to Laos as the wife has family there and can claim residency.   The fact that a permanent residence category for long stayers isn't readily available annoys me  more than anything else.  Unless the government kicks me out I will live here till I die.  So,  considering I  get a Australian pension and have no need for any freebies from Thai government....what's the problem? The main reason my guess is that the govt wouldn't make as much money.  And as said 10000 times before "Money #1 in Thailand "

[Old Croc]

14 hours ago, BigStar said:

Not only did you have to get out of your armchair and waste a trivial amount of time when your time is SO critical to the survival of the world economy, but you also spent "hundreds of baht," which of course represented a "scam." ???? OMG. What I could do with hundreds of baht . . . .

 

So tragic. How can we alleviate some of this suffering? I filled in the forms years ago on my computer and just change the dates and print out fresh copies. My phone number is also preprinted on the forms. When I learn about a new form, I do the same. What with signing, that takes about 10 minutes, once a year.

 

On my way to the Immigration office I stop by an ATM and update my passbook if need be. Went to the bank the day before and BTW withdrew some good spending money. I bring along a music player, tablet, Kindle, or good book to pass pleasantly any waiting time. I might also have lunch and/or beers in a nearby resto. ???? I'm dressed neatly in long pants and golf shirt, not that stupid "checked shirt (shirt out and hanging over fat gut) and cargo pants" uniform. I smile and greet the IO when my number is called, he/she gets my neatly typed, easily read copies, spends a minute looking them over and I'm done for that day. Time to relax! Which can take many forms here in LOS.

 

I seldom go for 90 day reports as I pay a motorcy man to go do it for me or use other means.

 

Now this HUGE effort and having to do something new once in a while is infinitely small compared to dealing w/ paperwork and paying bureaucrats back in the West. Remember? Types of Tax in UK. Oh, you wish it was "hundreds of baht" not thousands of pounds and not a scam. ????

 

Note we never compare Thailand w/ the most comparable country in the region with a similar level of development, Malaysia. Why's that? Malaysia is SO expat-friendly. You're loved purely for your wonderful self there, true loved. Lovely beaches, friendly people, food, lovely women. Check out that retirement program just to lure in expats, unlike hostile Thailand. Yeah, MM2H, bee's knees. Then you notice the, ah, paperwork and financial requirements for all that love. ???? But, of course, no health insurance required, right? Whoops.

 

 

And try opening a bank account if you're not in the program or don't have work permit. Whoops.

 

I think I'll just continue living here, LOL. It's so manageable with so many conveniences. ????

 

Thanks Bigstar for the sarcasm and ill informed guesses about my personal thoughts and situation.

Firstly, just getting out of my armchair and into my wheelchair is quite an ordeal for me, but getting it and me to my local bank just to get stuffed around by the staff there is quite a painful experience (literally). 

Also, there was more to the story in the bank that I didn't discuss. They made several errors in completing the simple tasks I listed. The fact they I permanently keep between 2 and 3 million in their bank I consider should entitle me to slightly more professional treatment. The couple of hundred baht is chump change, but is part of a fee structure that shouldn't exist for valued customers simply getting a statement.

Money isn't an issue for me. I'm in my 70s and have never applied for the old age pension and never will. Two days ago I paid a hospital bill of 23,500baht for a Thai child who nearly died from infection. He was too sick to get to the government hospital and the bill from the nearest (private) hospital was way outside the parent's ability to pay. I don't expect to get that money back. 

Your comprehension skill is lacking, else you would have noticed what my beef was with my local Immigration.  I preprint the required forms as well. However, it is the ever changing extras my local office often decide they require that rankles. Apart from the one form I mentioned, other requirements outside the normal application have been pictures of self outside the house and maps to there that suddenly become necessary. All require an extra trip.

Your obsession with clothes and your belief that your golfing attire and sycophantic attitude make you special is somewhat sad, as is your guesses about what I wear.

As an Australian, I don't give a stuff about UK's tax situation. I've paid tax in my country for 55 years and continue to do so.

I've stated this elsewhere on the forum, but for your edification, I comfortably self insure and do resent the prospect of being forced to pay high premiums for insurance that will fail to pay out on my existing ailments.

I have no idea why you started babbling about Malaysia in your post. 

[Curt1591]

On 10/26/2019 at 5:06 AM, Curt1591 said:

90 day report - pain in the butt, for a day.

Visa extension - pain in the butt, for one day.

TM 30 - pain in the butt when traveling international. 

Foreign funds placed in Thai bank - with the rising baht, a good investment.
 

Last visit to  CW Immigration, did 90 day, re-entry permit, and verification of residence (for drivers license), in under 2 hours.

My life has never been less stressful ...

Just did the math. In the last year, with the rise in the baht, the 800K in the bank netted me over $2,300! 

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, Curt1591 said:

Just did the math. In the last year, with the rise in the baht, the 800K in the bank netted me over $2,300! 

There is no profit until you have turned it back to $$$$s.

 

 

Edited October 28, 2019 by BritManToo

[Gweiloman]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

There is no profit until you have turned it back to $$$$s.

 

 

Not quite true. If he had to transfer 65k each month, it would have cost him that $2,300 more.