Johnson on track for 24-seat majority - Focaldata

[JonnyF]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

So are you really trying to say that parliament would be dangerous under Corbyn?

Well obviously if Labour had a massive majority with Corbyn as leader, then Yes that would be very damaging for the UK given Corbyn's communist leanings. 

 

Fortunately the electorate knows exactly what a threat Corbyn is to the country so Labour will be massacred at the election on Thursday and won't have the numbers to do very much at all. He'll probably be gone by New Year.

[sandyf]

2 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Well the EU can include their "values" and "standards" in the trade deal if they like. Having values and standards does not mean you cannot trade or have a trade deal with other countries. For example, the EU trades with the USA and China without a trade deal and without regulatory alignment.

 

You responded to this comment

"now explain why the EU should agree to a FREE trade deal, "

 

You now talk about the US and China trading with the EU without a trade deal, make your mind up.

There is no EU trade deal with the US or China because the EU will not accept the US or Chinese way of doing things, and the UK may well suffer the same fate.

 

[dunroaming]

10 hours ago, steve187 said:

lets wait til Thursday evening, early Friday morning, these polling companies are good at getting it wrong, but lets hope the pensioner does'nt win.

And right on cue the new poll today says that the Tories lead has been slashed!  I think we have all given up listening to polls as they swing one way and then the other.  

 

I think the Tories will win, or rather Labour will lose.  A lot of holding your nose voting will go on.  Interesting that my sister, who is a committed leaver and lifetime Conservative  is really struggling this time. She says "How can I vote for a despicable liar like Johnson.  It will be endorsing someone I detest and who is clearly not fit to lead our country?"  Yet she and I know she will do exactly that in the end, as the alternatives are just as onerous to her.  

[sandyf]

11 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Well obviously if Labour had a massive majority with Corbyn as leader, then Yes that would be very damaging for the UK given Corbyn's communist leanings. 

 

So you agree your initial statement was incorrect and you are now telling us that every Labour MP would be a communist.

[melvinmelvin]

17 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Let's see how long that lasts when the UK stops buying their products because the tariffs are too high. Germany is on the brink of recession.

 

 

hmm, ???

 

not sure I understand that sentence, doesn't look sound to me

 

whether or not costs calculated according to some tariff should be levvied on goods imported from EU is a

UK decision

if the levvied costs are so high that people don't buy - that is due to UK choices

 

[JonnyF]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

So you agree your initial statement was incorrect and you are now telling us that every Labour MP would be a communist.

You'll have to excuse me, I prefer to debate with people who are capable of using logic. I really don't understand what you're talking about most of the time, it's like you're replying to the wrong post or something ????.

 

Have a pleasant evening.

 

 

[JonnyF]

3 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

hmm, ???

 

not sure I understand that sentence, doesn't look sound to me

 

whether or not costs calculated according to some tariff should be levvied on goods imported from EU is a

UK decision

if the levvied costs are so high that people don't buy - that is due to UK choices

 

That's correct, it will be the UK's decision if/when to apply import taxes to EU goods.

 

If the EU refuse to do a trade deal then the UK will obviously apply import duties to some EU goods. Otherwise there would be no incentive for the EU to sign a trade deal. The UK isn't going to allow the EU to tax our goods and then let all their goods come over tax free.

 

The UK wants a good trade deal. If the EU refuses then taxes will be applied both ways. The difference is that they have a 94 Billion pounds trade surplus on goods with the UK.

[billd766]

9 hours ago, stephenterry said:

...which is what will happen if (when) johnson sells us down the river with brexit. Yeah, sure, go on and vote for his party and at the same time press the destruction button.  

I have lived under a few Labour governments and distrusted all of them. I can clearly remember the "Winter of Discontent".

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_of_Discontent

 

The Winter of Discontent was the winter of 1978–79 in the United Kingdom, during which there were widespread strikes by public sector trade unions demanding larger pay rises, following the ongoing pay caps of the Labour Party government led by James Callaghan against Trades Union Congress opposition to control inflation, during the coldest winter for 16 years.[1]

The strikes were a result of the Labour government's attempt to control inflation by a forced departure from their social contract with the unions by imposing rules on the public sector that pay rises be kept below 5%, to control inflation in itself and as an example to the private sector. However, some employees' unions conducted their negotiations within mutually agreed limits above this limit with employers. Public sector employee strike actions included an unofficial strike by gravediggers working in Liverpool and Tameside, and strikes by refuse collectors. Additionally, NHS ancillary workers formed picket lines to blockade hospital entrances with the result that many hospitals were reduced to taking emergency patients only.

 

There is more if anybody wants to read it.

[billd766]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

You were quite specific.

"but Labour are downright dangerous under Corbyn."

If Labour is still in hock to the trade unions and they win the elections, then expect union leaders to take tea and sticky buns in 10 Downing Street within 3 months. Also expect the nation debt (that will put taxpayers in debt for their childrens and perhaps grandchildrens lifetime.

[Hugh Cow]

As a bystander from Oz, whoever wins will make things interesting. If Boris wins will he leave with no deal? Then it will be interesting to see who is right regarding a post no deal British economy. The remainers or the brexiters. I personally think Britain will end up fine.  If Corbyn wins how long will it take for the economy to crash and burn or will many of the economists also get that wrong and the Uk ends up with a more even society? Somehow I doubt it. Like with most things, the truth normally lies somewhere in the middle. If finance still lends business borrows and consumers spend, the economy will still burble along. The remainers cant lose. If the economy goes down they will blame Brexit. If the economy goes up they will argue it would've gone up more if Britain had remained.

[Dumbastheycome]

It has been interesting to note that  info  from international exchanges has  been as mixed in opinion as the  commentary here.

As of today it seems most are holding their breath.

The status quo of a hung parliament remains a possibility.

Then what ho for the UK if it is?

[dunroaming]

1 hour ago, Hugh Lao said:

As a bystander from Oz, whoever wins will make things interesting. If Boris wins will he leave with no deal? Then it will be interesting to see who is right regarding a post no deal British economy. The remainers or the brexiters. I personally think Britain will end up fine.  If Corbyn wins how long will it take for the economy to crash and burn or will many of the economists also get that wrong and the Uk ends up with a more even society? Somehow I doubt it. Like with most things, the truth normally lies somewhere in the middle. If finance still lends business borrows and consumers spend, the economy will still burble along. The remainers cant lose. If the economy goes down they will blame Brexit. If the economy goes up they will argue it would've gone up more if Britain had remained.

Fair assessment.  If the Tories get a majority then it would allow Johnson to extract himself from the ERG and the hard Brexiteers and then push through his "fantastic" deal.  That would then be the beginning of a long drawn out negotiating process for a trade deal with the EU.  Johnson's deal is actually just a re-hashed version of May's so we would be half in and half out.  No deal won't happen if Boris is PM.

[david555]

55 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Fair assessment.  If the Tories get a majority then it would allow Johnson to extract himself from the ERG and the hard Brexiteers and then push through his "fantastic" deal.  That would then be the beginning of a long drawn out negotiating process for a trade deal with the EU.  Johnson's deal is actually just a re-hashed version of May's so we would be half in and half out.  No deal won't happen if Boris is PM.

As a E.U. subject and supporter , I like definitely this Boris deal...., "wit draw agreement" is the right name for it , explaining about what your U.K. "leaving" means by him ....

But now I am in contradiction with my liking to see Boris loose , or J.C winning who highly need to shaking up the U.K.'s establishment ...

 

Lucky not to be a voter as it is really twisting my choices ….. as Boris give us E.U. a nice  "wit draw agreement" a nice starting position on the Brexit chessboard 

 

The E.U. thanks you Boris 

Edited December 11, 2019 by david555

[dunroaming]

Barnier has said today that there is no way that trade agreements can be made by the end of 2020. An extension will need to be agreed by June 2020 and probably be until 2021/2022.  Johnson is lying to the public and taking them for fools.  No surprise there! 

[Rookiescot]

Yeah vote Conservative to give the Conservative party the chance to repair the damage done to the UK by the Conservative party.

 

If Johnson was not a politician and was just a guy down your local pub almost all of us would avoid him given he is a compulsive liar and a clown.

 

So why on earth would anyone vote to make him a Prime Minister?

 

Can anyone tell me how many kids he actually has?

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Yeah vote Conservative to give the Conservative party the chance to repair the damage done to the UK by the Conservative party.

 

If Johnson was not a politician and was just a guy down your local pub almost all of us would avoid him given he is a compulsive liar and a clown.

 

So why on earth would anyone vote to make him a Prime Minister?

 

Can anyone tell me how many kids he actually has?

What relevence has "how many children he has" got to with it? Remember 6 months ago the Tories were polling in 4th place, now sadly for you it would seem they are ahead of all the parties, thanks to the charisma of Boris.

"Why would anyone vote to make him prime minister" I would have thought that was blatently obvious, he is more popular than the rest of the contenders, why is he more popular surely you don't need me to tell you.

I know a Labour government would suit the SNP, but god forbid that happening, what a coalition that would be for the Union.????

[david555]

35 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Barnier has said today that there is no way that trade agreements can be made by the end of 2020. An extension will need to be agreed by June 2020 and probably be until 2021/2022.  Johnson is lying to the public and taking them for fools.  No surprise there! 

sssttt Barnier…. why o why talking now ????….don't be so honest ? Keeping silent is not lying..????. as for now the cards or chess pieces are promising ! 

 

Barnier is always still hoping   that a U.K. stay in the E.U. ….not possible anymore now

Edited December 11, 2019 by david555

[kingdong]

16 hours ago, z42 said:

What kind of person would vote for more Tory blundering? Surely almost a decade has been ghastly enough.

These establishment parties are truly nauseating ????

Least we haven,t had any wars unlike Labour's 3 terms,and they still haven,t found the famous "weapons of mass destruction"

[kingdong]

14 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

This is a joke, right? Remember Quantitative Easing, and the transfer of public cash to a few wealthy people who caused the global financial crash? Remember the decade of unnecessary austerity which took billions from the pockets of working class people and put them in the pockets of rich friends of David and Gideon? Have you seen the growth in food banks (more now than McDonald's), the rise in UK personal debt or the number or professional people who are forced to take two jobs just to survive? The tories have fleeced us blind, and the most galling part is that so many still meekly doff their caps and swear blind allegiance to these corrupt parasites.

It was Labour under Brown who introduced quantitative easing to bail out his banking buddies in the city in the 2007/8 crash,remember brown? " they,'ll be no more boom and bust"

[dunroaming]

47 minutes ago, david555 said:

Barnier is always still hoping   that a U.K. stay in the E.U. ….not possible anymore now

It's not over until the fat lady sings and I think that could be some time yet!

[3NUMBAS]

stepto and abbot is the horror scenario in your worst dreams ,a pair of blockheads.they rely on voters who cant think for themselves ,cos their granny used to vote labour in 1920

[Rookiescot]

7 hours ago, vogie said:

What relevence has "how many children he has" got to with it? Remember 6 months ago the Tories were polling in 4th place, now sadly for you it would seem they are ahead of all the parties, thanks to the charisma of Boris.

"Why would anyone vote to make him prime minister" I would have thought that was blatently obvious, he is more popular than the rest of the contenders, why is he more popular surely you don't need me to tell you.

I know a Labour government would suit the SNP, but god forbid that happening, what a coalition that would be for the Union.????

Wrong.

A Conservative government suits the SNP. Independence is almost guaranteed in the event of that. 

[JAG]

8 hours ago, dunroaming said:

Barnier has said today that there is no way that trade agreements can be made by the end of 2020. An extension will need to be agreed by June 2020 and probably be until 2021/2022.  Johnson is lying to the public and taking them for fools.  No surprise there! 

M Barnier is a senior EU official.

M Barnier is a French Politician

M Barnier is a "Gaullist".

France has a large, extremely inefficient yet politically influential farming sector, which is part of the core support for the "Gaullist" faction in French politics. That farming sector relies heavily upon subsidies from the EU Common Agricultural Policy(C.A.P), The UK's withdrawal from the EU will leave a very large hole in the money pot which funds the C.A.P. The French reaction to the prospect of having to find funds to make up that hole is illustrated below, and is the probable primary driver to the French reaction to "Brexit".

 

Perhaps M Barniers intervention in the main debate of the UK General Election, on the eve of polling, is an attempt to influence the result - if so it is somewhat lacking in traditional French "subtilité et finesse politique"!

 

Edited December 11, 2019 by JAG

[luckyluke]

^

An iconic picture:

 

"French civilian weeps as Nazi troops occupy Paris." 

 

Other historical pictures can be found at :

 

"Important Pictures Throughout History" 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[stephenterry]

12 hours ago, billd766 said:

If Labour is still in hock to the trade unions and they win the elections, then expect union leaders to take tea and sticky buns in 10 Downing Street within 3 months. Also expect the nation debt (that will put taxpayers in debt for their childrens and perhaps grandchildrens lifetime.

This is what brexit would do, Bill.

[RuamRudy]

8 hours ago, kingdong said:

It was Labour under Brown who introduced quantitative easing to bail out his banking buddies in the city in the 2007/8 crash,remember brown? " they,'ll be no more boom and bust"

Fair point about the decision to implement QE, but the bust was global, not the result solely of Brown's fecklesness.

 

The really cruel blows came later - the relentless pursuit of Tory and Lib Dem MPs to punish the poor for not being rich.

[JonnyF]

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Fair point about the decision to implement QE, but the bust was global, not the result solely of Brown's fecklesness.

 

The really cruel blows came later - the relentless pursuit of Tory and Lib Dem MPs to punish the poor for not being rich.

Those cruel blows were the Tories fixing the mess that Labour left the economy in. Again.

 

However, if you thought it was bad under Brown, that's nothing compared to the destruction Corbyn would leave behind. If Corbyn actually hands out all the "free stuff" he's promised to try to buy the votes required to worm his way into Number 10, we'll be fixing it for decades. His free broadband promise reminds me of Thaksin/Yingluck's free iPad promise. Little more than buying the votes of the poor and uneducated with other people's money. 

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, JonnyF said:

Those cruel blows were the Tories fixing the mess that Labour left the economy in. Again.

 

However, if you thought it was bad under Brown, that's nothing compared to the destruction Corbyn would leave behind. If Corbyn actually hands out all the "free stuff" he's promised to try to buy the votes required to worm his way into Number 10, we'll be fixing it for decades. His free broadband promise reminds me of Thaksin/Yingluck's free iPad promise. Little more than buying the votes of the poor and uneducated with other people's money. 

The meltdown was caused by global financial institutions - everyone cries about the so-called 'socialist' policies of Corbyn while neatly forgetting that it was the fetid, corrupt form of capitalism we currently utilise which brought the world to is financial knees. 

 

And what was the Tory response? They showered those responsible for the situation with taxpayers' cash, paid for by the most vulnerable in society. This was not a correction, this was an ideology of greed and arrogance being exercised to the max.

 

Ian Duncan Smith, a man so arrogantly self entitled that he felt justified to charge the taxpayer £35 for his breakfast while slashing support for those least able to defend themselves - more than 120,000 people are dead as a direct result of his decisions. Every single tory politician and every single tory voter, whether they like it or not, enabled that to happen. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by RuamRudy

[JonnyF]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

The meltdown was caused by global financial institutions - everyone cries about the so-called 'socialist' policies of Corbyn while neatly forgetting that it was the fetid, corrupt form of capitalism we currently utilise which brought the world to is financial knees. 

 

And what was the Tory response? They showered those responsible for the situation with taxpayers' cash, paid for by the most vulnerable in society. This was not a correction, this was an ideology of greed and arrogance being exercised to the max.

 

Ian Duncan Smith, a man so arrogantly self entitled that he felt justified to charge the taxpayer £35 for his breakfast while slashing support for those least able to defend themselves - more than 120,000 people are dead as a direct result of his decisions. Every single tory politician and every single tory voter, whether they like it or not, enabled that to happen. 

Labour took us into the illegal Iraq war with GW Bush, at an official cost of 20 Billion (in reality much more) and hundreds of thousands of innocent lives taken, leading to the expansion of ISIS and years of instability in the Middle East.

 

And you're worried about a 35 quid breakfast? ????

[transam]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

The meltdown was caused by global financial institutions - everyone cries about the so-called 'socialist' policies of Corbyn while neatly forgetting that it was the fetid, corrupt form of capitalism we currently utilise which brought the world to is financial knees. 

 

And what was the Tory response? They showered those responsible for the situation with taxpayers' cash, paid for by the most vulnerable in society. This was not a correction, this was an ideology of greed and arrogance being exercised to the max.

 

Ian Duncan Smith, a man so arrogantly self entitled that he felt justified to charge the taxpayer £35 for his breakfast while slashing support for those least able to defend themselves - more than 120,000 people are dead as a direct result of his decisions. Every single tory politician and every single tory voter, whether they like it or not, enabled that to happen. 

MP's get a very nice daily food allowance, they can spend it on what they like, but leftist like to wallow in the mire to detract from the important stuff....????