EU may need to extend deadline for trade talks with UK: von der Leyen

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, samran said:

The Canadian EU FTA took about 7 or 8 years from memory. Australia has been going at it with the EU for a similar amount of time with still no deal signed. 
 

 

So what would you say is the common denominator there?

[Chelseafan]

1 minute ago, Pattaya46 said:

Probably not. What as been suggested until now is a very small general increase of contributions, but mainly lower spending and subventions.

I doubt that will happen, the EU cannot be seen to scale back initiatives as that would signify weakness of the EU ideal.

Bureaucracies all across the world vie for more money. More money translates as more power.

 

[Chelseafan]

2 hours ago, samran said:

The Canadian EU FTA took about 7 or 8 years from memory. Australia has been going at it with the EU for a similar amount of time with still no deal signed. 
 

 

These negotiations took time as both parties started from positions of being poles apart. The EU and UK are negotiating from a point of alignment which is why it shouldn't take too long to resolve.

 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, david555 said:

Already centuries the Scot's had Kings and Queens  different from England , fought some wars between each other …. and then saying they are not sovereign nations , because a treaty …… strange that E.U. treaty seems different handled ( not useful to the cause intended by U.K. , same double tongue standards ...over and over again ) ….. meeting 15 januari for first wake-up call for Boris ...

No comparison - the EU is neither a nation nor sovereign. 

[Laughing Gravy]

2 hours ago, samran said:

Don’t worry, you were never in danger of being mistaken for someone who was writing one...

Maybe if you have written a few you would understand. Obviously not or I guess you are trying to be smart and not the intellectual use of the word.????

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, david555 said:

That's counting in full on your side ….. let's see if that can be settled with our democracy , that's the hot point … I don't think the E.U. go step of from alignment , freedom of peoples and the other mantras ….good luck in hoping "Boris the messiah"go open the North Sea ,as in the Bible tale ….5555

From The Book of Brussels?

[Chelseafan]

2 hours ago, samran said:

As much as it may appeal to the engineer in you to have a ‘challenging me deadline, and how appealing this may sound to those who are still beating their chests from Boris’ recent win, the fact remains that the reason these thing are slow is there is usually a lot of ongoing background consultations with industry. 
 

These things take time for positions to be developed, presented and the for trade discussions to be digested and for recalibrations on positioning to happen.

 

Then add the political aspect. Which constituencies and industries will Boris throw under the bus so can get an outcome in other areas of trade. So the politicians will be working furiously to see that none of their interests are degraded for someone up the road. 
 

And I’m only talking about the British side. Lord help you if the Italian tomato farmers decide to hold up your discussions, like they have the Australians the past 12 months. And not amount if shouting ‘BUT WE ARE BRITISH’ is going to hurry that up. 

These things take time because bureaucrats tell you so, there's very rarely any timescales to get things done.

 

It's a good job private industry doesn't work at their pace otherwise we would still be living in mud huts.

 

 

 

[evadgib]

As Scotland features so heavily in this thread I guess this is as good a place as any to post this snippet from Gorgeous George:

 

 

(Content not poster to the usual culprits please, & that includes the bloke doing the talking in this link)

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, samran said:

As much as it may appeal to the engineer in you to have a ‘challenging me deadline, and how appealing this may sound to those who are still beating their chests from Boris’ recent win, the fact remains that the reason these thing are slow is there is usually a lot of ongoing background consultations with industry. 
 

These things take time for positions to be developed, presented and the for trade discussions to be digested and for recalibrations on positioning to happen.

 

Then add the political aspect. Which constituencies and industries will Boris throw under the bus so can get an outcome in other areas of trade. So the politicians will be working furiously to see that none of their interests are degraded for someone up the road. 
 

And I’m only talking about the British side. Lord help you if the Italian tomato farmers decide to hold up your discussions, like they have the Australians the past 12 months. And not amount if shouting ‘BUT WE ARE BRITISH’ is going to hurry that up. 

Yes, UVDL wants an extension already because she fears the Italian tomatoes may start to go rotten! 

[david555]

8 minutes ago, nauseus said:

No comparison - the EU is neither a nation nor sovereign. 

I am not talking about the E.U. . my reply was about Scotland being for ages a nation , another pointing to E.U "smokescreen producing" using to divert from that frightening growing Scottish independence  reality, which Scotland is becoming 

 

Anyway the E.U . seems to be in any case a reality you cant win from …. with or whiteout Boris , why you just go on WTO   it is perfect for U.K...... not 1 opposition allowed , follow the trade rules or be on your own …. perfect solution 

Edited December 30, 2019 by david555

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, david555 said:

Your point of view , not the E.U. one ,you don't understand we have now an adversary who is convinced to leave (with PM May the E.U. had some hopes  for a second referendum or revoke ..) but now the cards are clear and E.U. can go for it , no considerations for collateral damage to remainers as they lost …. now they can go ahead for a Brexit in full ...

 

It is same as your point from U.K. confronting E.U.

Ours is just same as yours now but coming to your U.K. side , like mirroring yourself , that's different as with Pm. May before 

Yes, the EU are already going for it at flank speed - extra time for negotiations, I mean.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, david555 said:

"EU is the party that needs more time."

 

Only if the U.K. wish all that Christmas list , not that we need time..., as from beginning they let understand all is complicated and need long time  , that is what they mean , not all that can be negotiated in 11 months , as you compare it with other country's negotiating time ….

 

Just see clear in Boris , he opted for  a E.U. surrender or... to his " no deal " (JRM favorite ), for me  …. you can have the WTO option , WTO rules are clear and no negotiation the rules are there and if not follow  ...you are all alone on that big blue Earth 

Project Fear in Wonderland (tis the season).

[Rookiescot]

2 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

The security council effectively rule any actions of the UN. The rest is just bla bla bla.

 

Link - read your passport!

You obviously do not understand how the UN works and is structured.

 

My passport says European Union on it. Did the UK stop being a sovereign nation when it joined the EU?

Following your logic it must have.

[nauseus]

52 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

The bottom line is that the EU could probably replace UK trade over time but they are going to have to find £9b a year from other member states just to stand still. Other than Germany and France, who is going to pick up the tab ?

Security will be discussed as part of an ongoing agreement. The UK contributes around 16% of the EU budget, again who is going to cover the shortfall?

 

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/uk–eu-defence-and-security-cooperation

 

The Greeks? Oh wait a minute.

[david555]

5 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Yes, UVDL wants an extension already because she fears the Italian tomatoes may start to go rotten! 

She is making it clear to U.K. that the Christmas list U.K. want can not be negotiated ALL in 11 months ….. giving Boris the excuse for no deal a la JRM …., so expect the WTO to become your deal .Perfect fit  for U.K. like a Savile Row suit...

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

So the UK is ready, more or less, but the EU is the party that needs more time. They have had over 3 years under Teresa May and have done little or nothing, and now they have a year to prepare for Brexit.

 

The negotiators could always work an 8 working hour day and a 5 day week. They could even work overtime if they need to.

So Johnson did not have an oven ready deal after all as both sides need to agree on any deal.

Another of his lies exposed for all to see but for many to ignore.

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

What did the world economists say about the 2008 banking crash, or how after the referendum the UK economy will crash, millions of people will be jobless and homeless and thousands of businesses will fold to send the UK into bankruptcy?

Newsflash. This just in.

 

We are still in the EU.

[Chelseafan]

4 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Newsflash. This just in.

 

We are still in the EU.

Fake news. @billd766 said

 

"or how after the referendum the UK economy will crash, millions of people will be jobless and homeless and thousands of businesses will fold to send the UK into bankruptcy? "

[Rookiescot]

5 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

Fake news. @billd766 said

 

"or how after the referendum the UK economy will crash, millions of people will be jobless and homeless and thousands of businesses will fold to send the UK into bankruptcy? "

Fake news. Economists said the economy will suffer after we leave.

[OneMoreFarang]

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

I said 1 year is a very tall order. But you need a stretching target. Or they'll still be talking drivel about what color text and font size to use for the treaties in 12 months! They need to focus and show progress. 

And that is exactly why they had that "End of 2020" date and the option to extend it if necessary.

[Chelseafan]

8 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Fake news. Economists said the economy will suffer after we leave.

Perhaps, perhaps not but that's not what you quoted.

[OneMoreFarang]

46 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

After your Boris prediction any credibility you may have had has gone. Stick you you and your two mates you all know best.

again as you are not British, you do not understand the British people and that is why all your remarks seem to be proven incorrect.

 

You and statistics. Them same statisticians who told us all, the UK wouldn't vote to leave the EU and Boris Johnson would be the shortest serving prime Minister in British history. Do you see a pattern?

 

P.S. Better forget commenting when you are consistently proven to be wrong...

Exactly which prediction did I make about Boris?

I gave up predicting British people. Many of them don't think rational.

 

I never said or wrote I know best. But likely I wrote lots of times that it makes sense to look at reality and accept facts.

Lets say you would show up with a girl from Soi 6 which you met an hour ago and you tell me you want to marry her. I wouldn't dare to tell you it's impossible. But probably I would warn you that your chance of success is not very high - just like the UK with Boris in charge.

[nauseus]

14 minutes ago, david555 said:

I am not talking about the E.U. . my reply was about Scotland being for ages a nation , another pointing to E.U "smokescreen producing" using to divert from that frightening growing Scottish independence  reality, which Scotland is becoming 

 

Anyway the E.U . seems to be in any case a reality you cant win from …. with or whiteout Boris , why you just go on WTO   it is perfect for U.K...... not 1 opposition allowed , follow the trade rules or be on your own …. perfect solution 

You listen to the SNP too much - they have a majority in Scotland and bleat the loudest - Sturgeon's own Wee Project Fear. The frightening thing is that an SNP, which is currently "managing" Scotland so badly, is trusted by so many Scots. The fact remains that in the recent GE, 55% of Scots voted for parties that are not pro independence, which is the same as seen in the 2014 Scottish referendum. 

 

If the EU wish to try isolate the UK post Brexit, then it is the EU that will ultimately suffer the most. EU GDP as a % of global GDP will continue to decline but the UK's standalone GDP has a chance to actually grow. Unlike the EU, the UK has historical and established allies all around the world and most certainly will not be alone.   

 

 

[nauseus]

11 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Exactly which prediction did I make about Boris?

I gave up predicting British people. Many of them don't think rational.

 

I never said or wrote I know best. But likely I wrote lots of times that it makes sense to look at reality and accept facts.

Lets say you would show up with a girl from Soi 6 which you met an hour ago and you tell me you want to marry her. I wouldn't dare to tell you it's impossible. But probably I would warn you that your chance of success is not very high - just like the UK with Boris in charge.

The UK got married to the EU in Walking Street. Expensive, disappointing and for quite a short time.

[nauseus]

31 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Fake news. Economists said the economy will suffer after we leave.

"Economists" said the economy would suffer after the referendum i.e. BEFORE we leave.

 

Already proven to be fake.

[nauseus]

24 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And that is exactly why they had that "End of 2020" date and the option to extend it if necessary.

This "option" has to be agreed by both the UK and EU.

[david555]

24 minutes ago, nauseus said:

You listen to the SNP too much - they have a majority in Scotland and bleat the loudest - Sturgeon's own Wee Project Fear. The frightening thing is that an SNP, which is currently "managing" Scotland so badly, is trusted by so many Scots. The fact remains that in the recent GE, 55% of Scots voted for parties that are not pro independence, which is the same as seen in the 2014 Scottish referendum. 

 

If the EU wish to try isolate the UK post Brexit, then it is the EU that will ultimately suffer the most. EU GDP as a % of global GDP will continue to decline but the UK's standalone GDP has a chance to actually grow. Unlike the EU, the UK has historical and established allies all around the world and most certainly will not be alone.   

 

 

So wishing you all the best under WTO  trade rules , as our E.U. main goal is only not to give in on our standards …., and if they not fit you it is normal you go your own way …. I wonder why you did not do that 3 years ago  ? . "Leave means leave" (U.K. land of slogans seems ..) you remember that once slogan ?. A member who go leave negotiating about their future (up to them I would say..) ….. I never saw that having a good result anyway …. it was only the E.U.'s hope for it might could have a change, who made this hopeless negotiations  happen ...

 

This is now different …. as in January 10to15 (E.U. positioning their chess pieces …)  and formal start 1 February....off the white cotton gloves …! 5555

Edited December 30, 2019 by david555

[david555]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

This "option" has to be agreed by both the UK and EU.

at least both sides , meaning we are not bound for ever on that transition if U.K. go really unreasonable ….thanks for saying that escape route still exists for us both !

[nauseus]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

So wishing you all the best under WTO  trade rules , as our E.U. main goal is only not to give in on our standards …., and if they not fit you it is normal you go your own way …. I wonder why you did not do that 3 years ago  ? . "Leave means leave" (U.K. land of slogans seems ..) you remember that once slogan ?. A member who go leave negotiating about their future (up to them I would say..) ….. I never saw that anyway …. it was only the E.U.'s hope for it might could have a change, who made this hopeless negotiations  happen ...

 

This is now different …. as in January 10to15 (E.U. positioning their chess pieces …)  and formal start 1 February....off the white cotton gloves …! 5555

If you are wondering why you we did not leave 3 years ago here are the two main reasons (as discussed endlessly on TV) previously:

 

1. As a member of the EU, the UK was obliged to follow the terms of Article 50. So, once the letter of intent to leave was sent in March 2017, there were two years allowed to conclude the framework for withdrawal (the Withdrawal Agreement).

 

2. The process of 1 (above) was delayed by the newly installed remainer PM (May), who displayed the heart and negotiating skills of a muppet, and a heavily remain-oriented HoC and HoL, with the former now recently flushed of offensive germs.

 

Whoop whoop.

  

[nauseus]

28 minutes ago, david555 said:

at least both sides , meaning we are not bound for ever on that transition if U.K. go really unreasonable ….thanks for saying that escape route still exists for us both !

Don't worry...you're out. 555