WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 hour ago, spidermike007 said: Just another achievement, of the Trump foreign policy, or lack thereof. The US will be kicked out of Iraq, in a very humiliating and inglorious manner, within the year. Another few trillion down the toilet, several hundred thousand lives lost, but does the US care about brown lives lost? By the way, did they ever find the WMD's? No. They never did. The USA should withdraw forces today, likewise Afghanistan, likewise leave NATO and withdraw from Germany, also South Korea. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ThaiFelix Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 hour ago, TopDeadSenter said: America saved the Iraqi's from the oppressive and tyrannical Saddam, then the Iraqi's had a chance to make their lives and country great. But, instead they chose to fight each other about power and religious opinions and made a right pig's ear of the opportunity the USA gave them. Now they blame it all on America. Ungrateful, and they deserve exactly the mess they are in. End of. And who supported Saddam? "saved"?? you must have a different definition for the word? "ungrateful"? you think they should thank the US for bombing it back to the stoneage? If the US really wanted to take out Saddam why didnt they just get him how they got the Iranian general....oh yeah thats right, there is no money to be made by Cheney and his cronies doing it that way. I believe more relevant words for this discussion would be "destabilise" and "exploit" !! GO HOME YANKEE! 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post holy cow cm Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said: America saved the Iraqi's from the oppressive and tyrannical Saddam, then the Iraqi's had a chance to make their lives and country great. But, instead they chose to fight each other about power and religious opinions and made a right pig's ear of the opportunity the USA gave them. Now they blame it all on America. Ungrateful, and they deserve exactly the mess they are in. End of. I think it has been said that even though he was terrible, it was still better under Saddam because of the ones who came after were worse. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 hour ago, HannahD said: It now appears that Mr. Trump will in fact keep some of his campaign promises though perhaps not as he envisioned keeping them. Withdraw from useless wars. Afghanistan? Iraq? Absolutely, but because the US is being evicted not because the US is voluntarily withdrawing. Normalize relations with Russia? Of course. While the US has been expending treasure on useless wars (pallets of $100 bills anyone?) the Russians have developed weapons that have rendered the USA a second rate military power. Can’t intimidate them any more so maybe the US should try friendship and diplomacy. What a brilliant politician. He tricked the Deep State into doing what he wanted to accomplish by letting them do what they wanted. Re the Russians developing weapons rendering the US a second rate power. Simply untrue laughably so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: Well yeah, leaving is called withdrawing. But even if Iraq was inviting the USA to remain, I support pulling out, withdrawing, leaving. No, you advocated choosing to withdraw. That is not what is happening here. Edited January 25, 2020 by Bluespunk 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiFelix Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 13 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: No. They never did. The USA should withdraw forces today, likewise Afghanistan, likewise leave NATO and withdraw from Germany, also South Korea. Nor did they ever find a link between Saddam, Al Qaeda and the World Trade Centre bombing...Funny that. It just goes to show you the efficiency of the US of Lies propaganda machine although I believe more and more Americans are seeing through this nonsense now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 47 minutes ago, giddyup said: As long as the refugees aren't created by western interference. No. Not those either, unless they were allies who defended Americans in battle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Bluespunk said: No, you advocated choosing to withdraw. That is not what is happening here. Nice try. I have said withdraw several times. In this thread and elsewhere. Edited January 25, 2020 by WalkingOrders And 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post giddyup Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: No. Not those either, unless they were allies who defended Americans in battle. So it's OK to go illegally into another country and interfere with the leaders and their politics, create disruption and chaos then refuse to accept any responsibility? That sounds like US policy. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiFelix Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, jingjai9 said: As an American it makes me so sad. The resentment against America in Iraq shouts out to me that we are an empire. To think my country was born from the revolutionary spirit and now it has deteriorated to this. It is not all Trump's fault. This is not a new thing and often only nuances exist between US presidents on foreign policy not a stark convrast. Excellent post, thank you. Its Americans like you that give me hope for the future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, ThaiFelix said: Nor did they ever find a link between Saddam, Al Qaeda and the World Trade Centre bombing...Funny that. It just goes to show you the efficiency of the US of Lies propaganda machine although I believe more and more Americans are seeing through this nonsense now. You think so? I bet a very large amount of Democrat progressives here think that its Trump pushing for confrontation with Iran and even Russia. And likewise they believe that it is NOT Trump fighting against a entrinched apparatus of bureaucracy that tries to control US foreign policy. Funny huh? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, giddyup said: So it's OK to go illegally into another country and interfere with the leaders and their politics, create disruption and chaos then refuse to accept any responsibility? That sounds like US policy. Obviously you have not been reading any of my posts. I favor a strongly non-interventionist foreign policy, especially when leftists want to scream about a US responsibility to protect or regime change in support of progressive Democracy., and yeah, I dont want any refugees unless they have been involved in protecting US blood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenl Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: You think so? I bet a very large amount of Democrat progressives here think that its Trump pushing for confrontation with Iran and even Russia. And likewise they believe that it is NOT Trump fighting against a entrinched apparatus of bureaucracy that tries to control US foreign policy. Funny huh? I think you'd lose that bet badly. On both counts. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ThaiFelix Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, giddyup said: Why is it that western cultures expect other cultures to want the same things and behave in the same way? Ever heard of self-determination? its called ethnocentrism or eurocentrism: a worldview centered on or biased towards Western civilization. Everything else is considered inferior and needs to be 'saved' lol. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, stevenl said: I think you'd lose that bet badly. On both counts. Actually I would bet my post was not understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chazar Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, giddyup said: It isn't Americas job to decide who rules a country and who doesn't, that's what coups are for. unfortunately when you arent able to decide who runs it and will never be given the chance makes it all a bit of a joke..............Lets see can I vote for the muslim party or the muslim party? almost as good as Thailand choices 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post stevenl Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, WalkingOrders said: Actually I would bet my post was not understood. And you would lose that one as well. You're really easy to understand. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post giddyup Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, Chazar said: unfortunately when you arent able to decide who runs it and will never be given the chance makes it all a bit of a joke..............Lets see can I vote for the muslim party or the muslim party? almost as good as Thailand choices So, it's up to the USA to step in and decide is it? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, ThaiFelix said: its called ethnocentrism or eurocentrism: a worldview centered on or biased towards Western civilization. Everything else is considered inferior and needs to be 'saved' lol. If only the world was as simple as textbook definitions. I just hate it when on culture starts mass murdering the other in a civil war, and then the world demands that power be used to stop the killing, or demands the fleeing women and children be fed, or housed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chazar Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, giddyup said: So, it's up to the USA to step in and decide is it? yes, and they had a choice and they blew it............Japan had a similar choice 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: I dont want any refugees unless they have been involved in protecting US blood. Even if your illegal intervention created those same refugees? Edited January 25, 2020 by giddyup 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just now, giddyup said: Even if your intervention created those same refugees? I don't favor intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sujo Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just now, giddyup said: Even if your intervention created those same refugees? Yeah countries and people who are better off simply because of where they were born should never ever help those less fortunate. Let them eat cake. Sarcasm. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ThaiFelix Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, giddyup said: It was the tyrannical Sadam that kept a lid on the sectarian violence. You can't force democracy on a country. And Saddam was also the kind of strong man Iraq needed to control the various different peoples and cultures who were forced to live inside unnatural borders, drawn up by interfering Europeans, in order to exploit (oil) and without any consideration at all for those peoples and cultures. But of course the official explanation, same as today, is they were "saving" or civilising the Iraqis?? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, Sujo said: Yeah countries and people who are better off simply because of where they were born should never ever help those less fortunate. Let them eat cake. Sarcasm. Make up your mind do you want the USA to interfere to stop civil wars, feed the losers, thus enable them to fight on? Or do you want a non-interventionist policy? As for where people are born, is there something in cultures outside the USA that means they are inferior? Unable to come to peace? Govern themselved? Be prosperous? Liberals are war mongers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 29 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said: Nice try. I have said withdraw several times. In this thread and elsewhere. Yes you did, you said withdrawal. That is not what is happening here, this is removal. Edited January 25, 2020 by Bluespunk 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 3 hours ago, Ventenio said: When Wuhan invades Iraq and wipes out half the population, they will be crying to America for help. But, who cares, they will be angry all day and hate and hate...OK, off to the beach, have fun Iraqis with all your hatred. <deleted>? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, ThaiFelix said: And Saddam was also the kind of strong man Iraq needed to control the various different peoples and cultures who were forced to live inside unnatural borders, drawn up by interfering Europeans, in order to exploit (oil) and without any consideration at all for those peoples and cultures. But of course the official explanation, same as today, is they were "saving" or civilising the Iraqis?? I thought an Empire existed that lost a war? Which forced lines to be drawn? Exploiting Europeans? What were the Ottoman's nice guys? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalkingOrders Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 44 minutes ago, ThaiFelix said: And who supported Saddam? "saved"?? you must have a different definition for the word? "ungrateful"? you think they should thank the US for bombing it back to the stoneage? If the US really wanted to take out Saddam why didnt they just get him how they got the Iranian general....oh yeah thats right, there is no money to be made by Cheney and his cronies doing it that way. I believe more relevant words for this discussion would be "destabilise" and "exploit" !! GO HOME YANKEE! Go home? Good idea! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lannarebirth Posted January 25, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2020 33 minutes ago, giddyup said: So it's OK to go illegally into another country and interfere with the leaders and their politics, create disruption and chaos then refuse to accept any responsibility? That sounds like US policy. That is exactly US policy. Victory in any sphere is not the aim. Destablization is the aim so no regional power may gain hegemony over any given region. I doubt the boys fighting realize that and certainly the 100's of thousands of civilians killed or displaced don't. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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