Change in evaluation criteria bumps number of suspected virus cases to 615

[robsamui]

4 hours ago, geisha said:

A bit off topic but please, in airplanes,

apart from sitting next to an infected person, is the circulating air dangerous ? ( air con system) 

I'm surprised that, with all the publicity, people still don't understand how this virus is spreading.

It's not somehow carried in the air, somehow drifting in and out of the planer's air system.

Try to think - SNOT AND SPIT. Great big lumps and smears of stuff . . . (to simplify the image a bit . . . )

 

With many infections, the air from the respiratory system of a person with an infection becomes atomised into minute particles that drift about in the atmosphere - it's called 'aerosol' transmission. Although it is suspected, there is no evidence that the coronavirus spreads in this way. But it's known to be spread by physical contact with 'spit spray', for want of a better description.

 

An infected person is coughing and sneezing, spraying 'droplets' (technical term) all around. These droplets are heavier than the air and fall to land on people and on surfaces. The virus in this liquid form has a limited life, dying away when the mucus etc dries up. But the lifespan of this varies, depending on the conditions and environment. There's a lot of expert opinion of this but nobody's really sure, although most agree that half an hour exposed to direct sunlight renders it neutral. Indoors or in moist and humid conditions it remains active a lot longer - until the mucus dries out completely, in fact.

 

if you touch a surface that's had the virus sneezed onto it in droplet form, you still won't become infected immediately. It's not transmitted via the skin, but has to enter your bloodstream somehow. This mostly happens by your hand then coming into contact with your mouth. It;s also transmitted via the mucus membrane in your nose and tear-ducts in your eyes. And as everyone is constantly touching their face, nose and eyes, any droplets on your hands are quickly transferred into your bloodstream

 

The virus can't exist 'in the air', nor can it get 'into' the air circulation system of an aircraft. But every surface - seats, belts, buckles, trays, headrests, rails, handles, lockers etc - is a potential source of transferring the live virus.

 

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/01/how-coronavirus-spreads-on-a-plane/

 

 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2020 by robsamui

[theequalizer]

6 minutes ago, onekoolguy said:

I have started wearing a N95 mask and wiping down the seat tray with alcohol wipes in aircraft.

I was wiping down the armrests, table tray and seatbelt buckle long before we ever heard about nCov 2019. Asians are well known for using their hand to clean themselves after defecating. Ecoli infection is highly dangerous and painful and can be fatal.

 

The mask is to be worn by those who are sick and limit the water droplets from their coughing and sneezing.

 

An airline physician recently reinforced this truth. As a former member of the medical community I have been telling the following to others for years.

 

Wearing a surgical face mask does not prevent any virus from entering your respiratory system. First, the virus is small enough to penetrate the fibers of any mask that you buy from a pharmacy. Second, none of the masks you buy provide an air tight seal around your nose and mouth.

 

But "IF" you are coughing and sneezing, then by all means...wear a mask. That is what surgical masks were designed to do.

 

A surgeon wears the mask to protect you in case he or she coughs or sneezes during surgery. Surgeons don't wear a mask to protect themselves. They do sometimes wear a face shield to protect against blood or bodily fluids from splashing into their eyes.

 

Wearing a mask, if you are not sick, can actually make you sick.

 

Exhaling warm, moist air into the mask creates a perfect environment for bacterial growth. Your hands touch door handles, escalator hand rails, elevator buttons and host of other germ laden items during the course of your day. Then you unconsciously touch your face or nose because of an itch. In the process you also touch your face mask. Now you have transferred those germs to a warm, moist environment where they can grow and you will be inhaling them into your respiratory tract.

 

Stop listening to the medical supply industry that just wants to sell their products or to so-called health experts who don't have a clue about who should actually be wearing a mask.

[robsamui]

3 minutes ago, theequalizer said:

I was wiping down the armrests, table tray and seatbelt buckle long before we ever heard about nCov 2019. Asians are well known for using their hand to clean themselves after defecating. Ecoli infection is highly dangerous and painful and can be fatal.

 

The mask is to be worn by those who are sick and limit the water droplets from their coughing and sneezing.

 

An airline physician recently reinforced this truth. As a former member of the medical community I have been telling the following to others for years.

 

Wearing a surgical face mask does not prevent any virus from entering your respiratory system. First, the virus is small enough to penetrate the fibers of any mask that you buy from a pharmacy. Second, none of the masks you buy provide an air tight seal around your nose and mouth.

 

But "IF" you are coughing and sneezing, then by all means...wear a mask. That is what surgical masks were designed to do.

 

A surgeon wears the mask to protect you in case he or she coughs or sneezes during surgery. Surgeons don't wear a mask to protect themselves. They do sometimes wear a face shield to protect against blood or bodily fluids from splashing into their eyes.

 

Wearing a mask, if you are not sick, can actually make you sick.

 

Exhaling warm, moist air into the mask creates a perfect environment for bacterial growth. Your hands touch door handles, escalator hand rails, elevator buttons and host of other germ laden items during the course of your day. Then you unconsciously touch your face or nose because of an itch. In the process you also touch your face mask. Now you have transferred those germs to a warm, moist environment where they can grow and you will be inhaling them into your respiratory tract.

 

Stop listening to the medical supply industry that just wants to sell their products or to so-called health experts who don't have a clue about who should actually be wearing a mask.

A minor point - the coronavirus isn't a 'germ' or a bacterium. It's a virus.

 

But what you have said above is spot-on - and applies equally to the coronavirus ????

[FritsSikkink]

22 hours ago, smedly said:

that is one giant step up and a giant leap for

 

Thailand

 

China had similar numbers a week ago and now in the tens of thousands

 

anybody now starting to pay attention - you should be

better check your numbers again because it is far from the truth.

[natway09]

If they really cared about their own people they would have stopped all flights from China as many other countries have done. A loss of some monies  for a month could save them a lot more in the long run

[theequalizer]

3 minutes ago, robsamui said:

A minor point - the coronavirus isn't a 'germ' or a bacterium. It's a virus.

Correct, but the warm moist environment inside the face mask is most likely to create a haven for bacteria of which there are far more than viruses. Google "Bacteria that will kill you." The list should make every healthy person throw away their face mask.

[atyclb]

dont recall link but there was a infectious disease expert that commented on thailands numbers being way too low given the scenario

[peter48]

Forget the Chinese aspect this Virus does not discriminate and hits middle aged , young or old and the death of young doctors is worrying. Thailand may have some resources in Bangkok or wealthy spots but goodness knows if this hits poorer areas and remoter hospitals. I think Thailand could come out of this badly as its got too much dependence on Tourism and it’s own class and health inequality and resources could be really tested soon. I hope I am wrong but it’s health care infrastructure is not as robust as many other states.

[brianthainess]

Some good news for Koh Chang they are now checking temperatures of people boarding Center Point ferry to the island. i have no news about the other ferry service yet though.???? take care all. 

[Parsve]

4 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

Evidence based on research shows no appreciable benefit to closing borders.

I know where this statement come from, but I for sure not understand it. Can you maybe please explain to me? Because what you and WHO says is that it basically is the same risk for me if a person that have catch the corona virus standing beside me and sneezing as if I am here and he stand sneezing 1000 kilometers away from me. Very hard to believe and scary if it was true. What it not is, if that was the case we all should have been infected weeks ago. 

[Tayaout]

13 minutes ago, Parsve said:

I know where this statement come from, but I for sure not understand it. Can you maybe please explain to me? Because what you and WHO says is that it basically is the same risk for me if a person that have catch the corona virus standing beside me and sneezing as if I am here and he stand sneezing 1000 kilometers away from me. Very hard to believe and scary if it was true. What it not is, if that was the case we all should have been infected weeks ago. 

The theory is that it's easier to screen peoples in official border point. If the border are closed then peoples may use illegal entry point or hide their travel history. I'm not sure I agree with this but that's their opinion. 

Edited February 8, 2020 by Tayaout

[Parsve]

23 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

The theory is that it's easier to screen peoples in official border point. If the border are closed then peoples may use illegal entry point or hide their travel history. I'm not sure I agree with this but that's their opinion.

And the theory falls as it is less infected people in the countries that have closed borders than in those who still have them open.

[Grumpy John]

I've been a fan of Serpentza on youtube for a few years.  He has been living and working  in China for 11 years up to about 1 year ago,  has worked with Chinese doctors as a trainer,  speaks Mandarin, and is married to a Chinese doctor.  They live in USA now.   Today's video was a eye opening change of tempo.  Check his ideas out were he and his pal C-milk talk about the corona virus. 

[GeorgeCross]

11 minutes ago, Parsve said:

And the theory falls as it is less infected people in the countries that have closed borders than in those who still have them open.

oh and the small point that thailand does not have a land border with china

 

so 400K flew in versus 'n' that flew to a nearby country then walked to an unprotected part of the border and jumped the fence

 

 

 

 

[Vigilante]

2 hours ago, ExpatLife said:

One defining reason I got out of LOS when I did, is that I could see exactly where this was all heading weeks ago. You should expect a total loss in transparency regarding infections, deaths and recoveries, you should expect blame to be deflected from the real people guilty of not handling this situation properly, and maybe as we have started to see, the blame falling onto farang. You can expect the virus to be everywhere already due to the lack of hygiene the Thai people have, and their love for Chinese tourists, and of course the incubation period being so long. You can expect society to crumble when the virus infects the entire nation and food / water becomes more and more scarce, and the streets become lawless. You can expect hospitals to be so overrun that medical care for the infected (possibly you) becomes impossible, and maybe even xenophobia will take hold and farang won't be prioritised for treatment when things get really nasty.

Yes I love a lot of things about Thailand and it's people, I lived there for 10 years. But this situation and how they have addressed this outbreak has been the worst in the entire world, worse than China and look how China has ended up already. If you value your life be it from the virus directly or the downfall of society as a repercussion, I'd suggest getting out while you still can. Flights will be blocked out of Thailand soon enough, when the infected become large enough in numbers, and then you're stuck in xenophobic crazy town to fend for yourself. 

I envisaged the same senario when China quarantined Wuhan.

I chose to stay. Too lazy to fly and btw many of us have weathered a multitude of 'plagues' in the last 20 years

The disease is the least of my worries...a total breakdown in food supplies/Banking/Hospital care are my worries. Last but not least, law and order

 

I would recommend preparations for all long-termers...wads of cash, food for a couple of months and don't let anyone know that you are prepping.

 

 

 

 

 

[CGW]

1 hour ago, natway09 said:

If they really cared about their own people

"If they really cared about their people" they wouldn't be in the position they are in now, they didnt stage yet another coup to take care of the people, think $$$$$$$$

[Vigilante]

50 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

The theory is that it's easier to screen peoples in official border point. If the border are closed then peoples may use illegal entry point or hide their travel history. I'm not sure I agree with this but that's their opinion. 

Screening at borders is a PR exercise...with an incubation period of 2 weeks it's hit and (mostly) miss

[overherebc]

21 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

I will be staying put, getting on an airplane is a bad idea IMHO (if not now, very shortly).

 

You might have to pay for healthcare though since it is very likely if it gets to expensive or threatens to be it won't be covered as it is an act of god.

Do the Chinese have a Bat God?

Please don't think I'm not taking this seriously. I am, at 70 + and not at my best it worries me.

I will be staying home as much as is possible and if I have to go out I will check out where I have to buy essentials ( from the car ) too many inside I will pick another place or go back when it's quieter.

Edited February 8, 2020 by overherebc

[bkkcanuck8]

8 hours ago, overherebc said:

Do the Chinese have a Bat God?

Please don't think I'm not taking this seriously. I am, at 70 + and not at my best it worries me.

I will be staying home as much as is possible and if I have to go out I will check out where I have to buy essentials ( from the car ) too many inside I will pick another place or go back when it's quieter.

Reduced contact during a pandemic is not a problem for me as I am naturally inclined to be a hermit.   People focus on the facemasks but that is really most useful for other people if you are sick by reducing the virus to contact in public.  The greatest risk of catching it is surfaces, especially in larger centers.  Without much thought it is almost impossible for us to stop our automatic involuntary touching of surfaces and our face around or near our mucus membrane areas (eyes, ears, mouth, nose) -- this will likely be the most common vector for the virus to be transmitted.  The mask will not stop this vector which would be the most likely vector for infection.  Heightened risk for this virus would be age of course (probably because it is common with other ailments), already reduced oxygen absorbtion from one of many ailments, high blood pressure etc. -- as well as smoking (not that I understand the science of it but they as far as I understand that an elevated ACE2 is problematic when it comes to this virus and although some reports saying there could be a race or gender component -- there is not... the issue relates to smokers will have an elevated ACE2 (and 48% of Chinese men smoke).

[Canuck1966]

game changer. This doesn't bode well at all

[bkkcanuck8]

1 hour ago, Canuck1966 said:

game changer. This doesn't bode well at all

But then no one that has said they don't trust the Chinese would accept that at face value ????

[anto]

20 hours ago, geisha said:

A bit off topic but please, in airplanes,

apart from sitting next to an infected person, is the circulating air dangerous ? ( air con system) 

No.

[bkkcanuck8]

2 minutes ago, anto said:

No.

I would qualify that a bit, recirculated air is suppose to be 99.97% free (usually a mix of fresh and recirculated) but the primary infection vector is through surface contact and that can be quite a large area that is infected when someone coughs or sneezes.

[TheAppletons]

7 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

I would qualify that a bit, recirculated air is suppose to be 99.97% free (usually a mix of fresh and recirculated) but the primary infection vector is through surface contact and that can be quite a large area that is infected when someone coughs or sneezes.

  Article below (interesting read but with graphics for those who prefer not to read it) says one row in front and one row in back of the infected person are the most dangerous areas for transmission.  Window seats are apparently the safest places to sit.  

 

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/01/how-coronavirus-spreads-on-a-plane/

[anchadian]

Sky News Breaking

 

@SkyNewsBreak

 

The total number of people who have died from the ongoing coronavirus outbreak worldwide has reached 805

 

 

 

 

[rabas]

3 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

(not that I understand the science of it but they as far as I understand that an elevated ACE2 is problematic when it comes to this virus and although some reports saying there could be a race or gender component -- there is not... the issue relates to smokers will have an elevated ACE2 (and 48% of Chinese men smoke).

Here is the science hot off the press. Age, gender, and race make no difference in ACE2 gene expression (how many receptors). They thus think the increased ACE2 receptors is all about smoking. Thus the increased risk is to smokers. They also wonder if vaping will show the same effects, i.e., is it the nicotine?

 

Published 5 Feb

https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202002.0051/v1

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by rabas

[bkkcanuck8]

8 minutes ago, rabas said:

Here is the science hot off the press. Age, gender, and race make no difference in ACE2 gene expression (how many receptors). They thus think the increased ACE2 receptors is all about smoking. They also wonder if vaping will show the same effects, i.e., is it the nicotine?

 

Published 5 Feb

https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202002.0051/v1

 

And there we have it -- a new conspiracy about to be born... Anti-smoking zealot tries to kill all smokers with engineered virus ????

[rabas]

And of course there is no need to worry, same old same old flu.

 

"NO OCCASION FOR PANIC"

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by rabas

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, rabas said:

And of course there is no need to worry, same old same old flu.

 

"NO OCCASION FOR PANIC"

 

And the 1918? Spanish flu didn't even start in Spain.

Edited February 9, 2020 by overherebc

[Hoppyone]

On 2/7/2020 at 3:34 PM, ourmanflint said:

Some honesty at last!

Maybe have TAT counting the numbers ,er sorry trying to count