The Protests in Michigan Have Signaled the Nonsense Is Coming

[connda]

3 minutes ago, FolkGuitar said:

These are not normal times, and they call for community before self.

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

Really there are only two opinions happening here: Those who believe the will of the community supersedes the rights of the individual, and those who believe that the rights of the individual supersedes the will of the community.

Neither group will ever see eye-to-eye.  Their views are in polar opposition.

[katatonic]

12 minutes ago, connda said:

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

Really there are only two opinions happening here: Those who believe the will of the community supersedes the rights of the individual, and those who believe that the rights of the individual supersedes the will of the community.

Neither group will ever see eye-to-eye.  Their views are in polar opposition.

Soo.. all the individuals are opposed 180 degrees to all the communities, then? That makes sense. "I'd never join a club that would have me as a member (Groucho Marx, comic actor)."

Edited April 16, 2020 by katatonic
punctuation

[Odysseus123]

7 minutes ago, connda said:

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

Really there are only two opinions happening here: Those who believe the will of the community supersedes the rights of the individual, and those who believe that the rights of the individual supersedes the will of the community.

Neither group will ever see eye-to-eye.  Their views are in polar opposition.

Well..one supposes that you are somewhere up the "J" in Northern Thailand,waving your American banner,toting your semi-automatic weapon and shouting "let freedom ring!"

 

Or are you merely obeying the Thai gov'ts rules and regulations?

Edited April 16, 2020 by Odysseus123

[Jingthing]

In addition to the predictable white supremacist American "Rebel" flags seen at this pro death really, it's been reported that Nazi swastikas were also in evidence. I wonder what the U.S. president will say if he's asked about this at one of his propaganda press conferences. We can guarantee that he won't condemn them. They are a core part of his base.

[FolkGuitar]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

 

I have no qualms about you living unencumbered by the will of the community. Feel free to do so. I'm sure most people agree that you should be allowed to do so.

 

But you can't do so while living within the community, and taking advantage of the community benefits.

If we want to remain within the community, we have to abide by community standards. It' simple.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[samran]

7 minutes ago, connda said:

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

Really there are only two opinions happening here: Those who believe the will of the community supersedes the rights of the individual, and those who believe that the rights of the individual supersedes the will of the community.

Neither group will ever see eye-to-eye.  Their views are in polar opposition.

So I guess you drive as fast as you want, and on the right.

Didn't bother to get a visa to come here and stay.

Have never paid taxes.

Dump your rubbish in the middle of the street.

 

You know, cause of freedom, right?

 

[connda]

6 minutes ago, connda said:

Actually, that's the tenets of Communism which are based on the will of the community. 

The tenets of Liberty are based on the rights of the individual to live unencumbered by the will of the community - the tyranny of the majority.

Really there are only two opinions happening here: Those who believe the will of the community supersedes the rights of the individual, and those who believe that the rights of the individual supersedes the will of the community.

Neither group will ever see eye-to-eye.  Their views are in polar opposition.

The "fine specimens of American manhood, morons, deplorables, pathetic bunch of **********, wingnut, nutters" are those protesting and who believe that the rights of the individual supercedes those of the collective.

Those who have used the above pejoratives are those who embrace the collective and reject the rights of the individual.

It so simple.  I'll let ya'll get back to your virtue signalling and name calling.  Carry on...

[Odysseus123]

4 minutes ago, connda said:

It so simple.  I'll let ya'll get back to your virtue signalling and name calling.  Carry on...

So..you are merely following the Thai gov'ts rules and regulations.

 

I thought so...

Edited April 16, 2020 by Odysseus123

[Kelsall]

It's an Instagram post for God's sake.  LOL

[Jingthing]

22 minutes ago, connda said:

The "fine specimens of American manhood, morons, deplorables, pathetic bunch of **********, wingnut, nutters" are those protesting and who believe that the rights of the individual supercedes those of the collective.

Those who have used the above pejoratives are those who embrace the collective and reject the rights of the individual.

It so simple.  I'll let ya'll get back to your virtue signalling and name calling.  Carry on...

Public health means nothing? They held a pro death rally. There is nothing to defend there. 

 

Let me give you another example. 

Imagine an HIV positive person that is sleeping around, not informing his partners, and not practicing safe sex. But he'd be asserting his freedom as a "free" individual as opposed to the collective! So OK with extremist far right wingers, or not? I didn't think so. 

Edited April 16, 2020 by Jingthing

[Monomial]

14 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Public health means nothing? They held a pro death rally. There is nothing to defend there. 

 

 

They held a rally saying they wanted to get back to work JT. It wasn't a "pro death" rally. I will grant you are a master of hyperbole, but it doesn't help anything. Some people are going to have values that differ from your own. Just because you feel a specific way, it doesn't mean you're automatically right and everyone else is evil or an idiot.

 

The problem with this concern for "public health" as you call it, is that it pushes the burden onto some while others get the benefits. That isn't fair to those who have to pay the price, and it completely justifiable for them to complain and resist. In fact, it is to be expected, and unless you like police states, we should even encourage it. They aren't harming anyone, and hopefully someone will hear them and address their concerns before it goes further.

 

Any other action just pushes them to support a demagogue like Trump who will listen to them. Is that what you honestly want? Trump is a great divider and has pushed both sides to extremes. Don't play his game like you are doing.

[FolkGuitar]

51 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Public health means nothing? They held a pro death rally. There is nothing to defend there.

 

26 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

They held a rally saying they wanted to get back to work JT. It wasn't a "pro death" rally.

 

 

... except for the fact that this rally blocked off access to hospitals. Health care workers couldn't get to work to help those who needed it. Ambulances couldn't get to emergency rooms because of this rally. And two men were standing on the steps of the capital building holding weapons, one with a 30-round banana clip and his finger on the trigger. Do you suppose he was deer hunting in the middle of Lansing? Do you suppose those things add up to anything other than pro death?

 

They aren't harming anyone,

 

Tell that to the patients in the back of the ambulances that couldn't get through. Tell that to the patients in the hospital who couldn't get the care they needed because the rally blocked off the access to the hospital. See if they agree with you.

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, Monomial said:

 

They held a rally saying they wanted to get back to work JT. It wasn't a "pro death" rally. I will grant you are a master of hyperbole, but it doesn't help anything. Some people are going to have values that differ from your own. Just because you feel a specific way, it doesn't mean you're automatically right and everyone else is evil or an idiot.

 

The problem with this concern for "public health" as you call it, is that it pushes the burden onto some while others get the benefits. That isn't fair to those who have to pay the price, and it completely justifiable for them to complain and resist. In fact, it is to be expected, and unless you like police states, we should even encourage it. They aren't harming anyone, and hopefully someone will hear them and address their concerns before it goes further.

 

Any other action just pushes them to support a demagogue like Trump who will listen to them. Is that what you honestly want? Trump is a great divider and has pushed both sides to extremes. Don't play his game like you are doing.

They blocked the roads preventing essential workers from getting to their jobs.

They behaved without any regard to this health crisis as far as distancing and masks.

Statistically some of them are actively infectious. So they openly and actively spread this virus that kills so many.

If that's not hurting anyone, we're on different planets.

I can't help that there are members of society that act so irresponsibly. They have no right to take such actions that are directly leading to the deaths of others. These are not normal times. Most people have woken up to that. These people are not only essentially murderers (wouldn't you call the intentional HIV spreader a murderer?) but they are clearly ignorant as well. Shocking that such totally ignorant and selfish people have children. What an example!

If these horrible citizens are 45 fans, that's on them. Nothing to do with people that see them for what they are. Them with the white supremacist civil war Rebel flags. Can't call that about "Southern Heritage" in the North. Them with the Nazi swastikas. Them with the trump banners. See the connection? Evil in our midst in Michigan. The governor there is way too mild on them. Not suggesting a Duterte style tactic of shooting them which he would have done but something stronger anyway.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

To put this another way, the vast majority of the world now is doing all they can to fight this virus or at very least not actively promoting the spread of it. Most are doing that by non heroic acts of staying at home as much as they can, distancing, washing hands, masks, etc. A minority are on the front lines, the hospital workers and essential services providing food, medicine, etc. 

 

But these Michigan morons are on the other side. They are not fighting against the spread of the virus. They are fighting on the side of the virus which is exactly what opening up societies PREMATURELY does. That's a fact. That's science. 

 

[Throatwobbler]

You can't fix stupid. Well actually Covid might.

[AussieBob18]

9 hours ago, samran said:

Oh, so you think showing these actually strengthens their argument? 555

Liberals - always so willing to accept draconian Govt rules, and ridicule others who disagree. Heil Govt !!

[UbonThani]

1 minute ago, AussieBob18 said:

Liberals - always so willing to accept draconian Govt rules, and ridicule others who disagree. Heil Govt !!

They must like beimg treating as cattle

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, FolkGuitar said:

Are people so wound up in themselves that they can't find some way to entertain themselves for a few weeks. No one is asking you to do this for years.

What they are actually wound up about is losing their jobs, income, ability to support their families. How about not trying to ridicule those that are not either rich or on a guaranteed income. This isn't a holiday.

[UbonThani]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

What they are actually wound up about is losing their jobs, income, ability to support their families. How about not trying to ridicule those that are not either rich or on a guaranteed income. This isn't a holiday.

months in some places

politicians no clue what they r doing

 

Tell people what the plan is at least. They don't even have one.

[gamb00ler]

12 hours ago, Traubert said:

Ether way, let them carry on.

And then let them make their home elsewhere rather than bring an unpleasant surprise back home.

[gamb00ler]

5 hours ago, Throatwobbler said:

You can't fix stupid. Well actually Covid might.

yeah..... we have too many laws protecting the intellectually challenged.  Evolution got us this far, maybe it still works.

[UbonThani]

17 minutes ago, gamb00ler said:

yeah..... we have too many laws protecting the intellectually challenged.  Evolution got us this far, maybe it still works.

they made the laws to bring others down to them

[samran]

1 hour ago, AussieBob18 said:

Liberals - always so willing to accept draconian Govt rules, and ridicule others who disagree. Heil Govt !!

Aw bless - more American style name calling. Who are you trying to impress here?
 

Helping out every day on the front lines in intensive care are we? 
 

Anyway, more than happy for you to walk around ignoring how contagious this thing is and how it affects a certain population.  Knock yourself out - you and your mates. Chug some chloroquine while you are at it for good measure!

Edited April 16, 2020 by samran

[cornishcarlos]

13 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I am sure you would prefer over a million dead Americans

 

No comment

[UbonThani]

 https://theconversation.com/au

 

freedoms lost elsewhere

 

[cmarshall]

Although it is a minority view, I hold Abraham Lincoln responsible for this.  He should have let the South go when they wanted to.

[scorecard]

15 hours ago, UbonThani said:

Freedom should always come first.  Scared people can stay home. Lockdowns equals fascism.

Totally disagree and I wonder how you would react when (in this current scenario) total freedom means most of your family are in ICU on ventilators and will likely die and your total freedoms means that nothing is being done to stop the spread of the virus?

[Jingthing]

7 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

Although it is a minority view, I hold Abraham Lincoln responsible for this.  He should have let the South go when they wanted to.

Love those Michigan style grits. 

[samran]

1 hour ago, UbonThani said:

months in some places

politicians no clue what they r doing

 

Tell people what the plan is at least. They don't even have one.

What’s your plan then? Apart from playing rugged individualist?

 

What will be the costs, and benefits? 

[albertik]

Would be really  interesting,revealing to see what demographic is willing to download the Apple/Google tracking app that is being rolled out?