UK COVID-19 death toll topped 38,000 as of early May: official data

[snoop1130]

UK COVID-19 death toll topped 38,000 as of early May: official data

By Andy Bruce

 

A man wearing a protective face mask walks along London Bridge following the outbreak of the coronavirus disease (COVID-19), London, Britain May 11, 2020. REUTERS/Simon Dawson

 

LONDON (Reuters) - The United Kingdom’s COVID-19 death toll topped 38,000 as of early May, including suspected cases, by far the worst official toll yet in Europe, according to official data published on Tuesday.

 

The Office for National Statistics said it recorded 34,978 COVID-19 related deaths as of May 1 in England and Wales.

 

Adding previously released data from Scotland and Northern Ireland, the toll stood at 38,289 as of May 3, according to Reuters calculations.

 

While different ways of counting make comparisons with other countries difficult, the figure confirmed Britain was among those hit worst by a pandemic that has killed more than 285,000 worldwide.

 

Ministers dislike comparisons of the headline death toll, saying that excess mortality - the number of deaths from all causes that exceed the average for the time of year - is more meaningful because it is internationally comparable.

 

The figures on that front painted a grim picture, albeit improving slowly.

 

The ONS said it recorded 17,953 deaths from all causes during the week ending May 1. While a decrease for the second week running, this was 8,012 more than average for the time of year.

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2020-05-12

 

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[evadgib]

Unless or until UK & elsewhere can be sure that the fine line between citizens dying 'with' the virus or dying 'of' the virus has been fully clarified these figures will have to be taken with a pinch of salt. The public are being manipulated & I for one am not having it.

Edited May 12, 2020 by evadgib

[7by7]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Unless or until UK & elsewhere can be sure that the fine line between citizens dying 'with' the virus or dying 'of' the virus has been fully clarified these figures will have to be taken with a pinch of salt. The public are being manipulated & I for one am not having it.

Did you miss the final paragraph of the report?

 

1 hour ago, snoop1130 said:

The ONS said it recorded 17,953 deaths from all causes during the week ending May 1. While a decrease for the second week running, this was 8,012 more than average for the time of year.

(7by7 emphasis)

So what, in your opinion, are those extra 8,012 dying of?

 

Yes, it is true that most of those who have died had other factors as well; heart disease being the most common. But would they have died when they did had they not contracted the virus; or would they have had months, maybe years, more life?

 

I'm not a doctor nor a virologist, so don't know; what about you? 

 

Coronavirus: How to understand the death toll

Quote

The Office for National Statistics has tried to shed light on this. It looked at nearly 4,000 deaths in England and Wales during March.

There were two main findings. Firstly, the virus was the cause of the majority of deaths, not other factors.

But secondly, nine in 10 did have pre-existing illnesses, such as heart disease and respiratory problems that put them at heightened risk of death anyway.

 

How much ‘normal’ risk does Covid represent? is also interesting.

 

[Tug]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Unless or until UK & elsewhere can be sure that the fine line between citizens dying 'with' the virus or dying 'of' the virus has been fully clarified these figures will have to be taken with a pinch of salt. The public are being manipulated & I for one am not having it.

Go volunteer in a covid19 ward if you think it’s bs my condolences UK hopefully we will have some treatment regimens soon seeing some glimmers of hope from science backed sources 

[evadgib]

2 hours ago, Tug said:

Go volunteer in a covid19 ward if you think it’s bs my condolences UK hopefully we will have some treatment regimens soon seeing some glimmers of hope from science backed sources 

I'm far from alone in noticing that deaths from stroke/heart attack/cancer/old age are going down just as quickly in the other direction, or that families are complaining in droves that the virus is being unduly blamed when they know full well that it wasn't the cause.

 

Feel free to follow your own virtue-signalling advice.

[mrfill]

9 hours ago, evadgib said:

I'm far from alone in noticing that deaths from stroke/heart attack/cancer/old age are going down just as quickly in the other direction, or that families are complaining in droves that the virus is being unduly blamed when they know full well that it wasn't the cause.

 

Feel free to follow your own virtue-signalling advice.

So how about looking at the change in ALL deaths, regardless of reason and compare to a 5 year average.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52623141

 

Not 38000, but 50000 excess deaths since mid-March - about 50% up. Explain that.

[Syduan]

2 hours ago, mrfill said:

So how about looking at the change in ALL deaths, regardless of reason and compare to a 5 year average.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52623141

 

Not 38000, but 50000 excess deaths since mid-March - about 50% up. Explain that.

The BBC are a major part of the problem, without them and the rest of the mainstream media there would be no virus and life would go on as normal.

[Chomper Higgot]

18 hours ago, evadgib said:

Unless or until UK & elsewhere can be sure that the fine line between citizens dying 'with' the virus or dying 'of' the virus has been fully clarified these figures will have to be taken with a pinch of salt. The public are being manipulated & I for one am not having it.

If the attending Doctor writes COVID-19 on the death certificate, it’s COVID-19.

 

Your attempts to find cover for the Government’s failure is noted - again.

[Chomper Higgot]

13 hours ago, evadgib said:

I'm far from alone in noticing that deaths from stroke/heart attack/cancer/old age are going down just as quickly in the other direction, or that families are complaining in droves that the virus is being unduly blamed when they know full well that it wasn't the cause.

 

Feel free to follow your own virtue-signalling advice.

Some years ago a friend of mine who was suffering cancer died in a road accident.

 

The road accident killed him, he never made it to the death by Cancer.

 

Why the logic of such things troubles you is a mystery.

 

[RichardColeman]

4 hours ago, mrfill said:

Not 38000, but 50000 excess deaths since mid-March - about 50% up. Explain that.

 

 

[Rookiescot]

14 hours ago, evadgib said:

I'm far from alone in noticing that deaths from stroke/heart attack/cancer/old age are going down just as quickly in the other direction, or that families are complaining in droves that the virus is being unduly blamed when they know full well that it wasn't the cause.

 

Feel free to follow your own virtue-signalling advice.

Do you a link to something which shows deaths from stroke, heart attacks, cancer and old age are falling?

[evadgib]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

If the attending Doctor writes COVID-19 on the death certificate, it’s COVID-19.

 

Your attempts to find cover for the Government’s failure is noted - again.

Yeah, Right 

 

The public need to wake up to the fact that MSM are complicit and should learn to look elsewhere & trust their own judgement. 

 

I am again reminded of your prolific political rhetoric prior to UK's general election & what happened to the candidate in the ward in which you unilaterally declared yourself the Town Crier. In all the time you have entertained the boards with such nonsense I cannot recall you ever being right! ????

 

 

[evadgib]

40 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Some years ago a friend of mine who was suffering cancer died in a road accident.

 

The road accident killed him, he never made it to the death by Cancer.

 

Why the logic of such things troubles you is a mystery.

 

....in today's terms the DC would still indicate Cancer whereas any issued prior to March of this year (or whenever this virus officially started) would correctly state road traffic accident (RTA) as the cause therefore you might need to look again re logic.

Edited May 13, 2020 by evadgib

[Chomper Higgot]

11 minutes ago, evadgib said:

....in today's terms the DC would still indicate Cancer whereas any issued prior to March of this year (or whenever this virus officially started) would correctly state road traffic accident (RTA) as the cause therefore you might need to look again re logic.

You’ve just single handedly demolished your own argument.

 

Where, in ‘todays’ terms is the pre-existing condition recorded as the cause of death and if so how would COVID-19 ever be attributed if a Pre-existing condition exists?

Edited May 13, 2020 by Chomper Higgot

[Sujo]

Like shooting fish in a barrel.

[evadgib]

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You’ve just single handedly demolished your own argument.

?

The thread makes sense this end.

[Thingamabob]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

If the attending Doctor writes COVID-19 on the death certificate, it’s COVID-19.

 

Your attempts to find cover for the Government’s failure is noted - again.

That depends on the degree to which the attending doctor is politically motivated. This has become a numbers game. 

[evadgib]

55 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You’ve just single handedly demolished your own argument.

 

Where, in ‘todays’ terms is the pre-existing condition recorded as the cause of death and if so how would COVID-19 ever be attributed if a Pre-existing condition exists?

#17 was posted just after this belated add-on.

Edited May 13, 2020 by evadgib

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, evadgib said:

 #17..?

Some unattributed ripped video that is any case referring to the US and not the UK death count is your evidence?

 

Here’s a clue as to why it’s totally irrelevant:

 

”UK COVID-19 death toll topped 38,000 as of early May: official data”

 

Do you have any data that demonstrates the above statement is over reporting deaths?

 

If so, please provide the data and a link to the source.

[Krataiboy]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Some years ago a friend of mine who was suffering cancer died in a road accident.

 

The road accident killed him, he never made it to the death by Cancer.

 

Why the logic of such things troubles you is a mystery.

 

Any logical person should be troubled by the elasticity of The Coronavirus Act 2020 on the registration of deaths allegedly due to the virus and the accuracy of ONS data in relation to COVID 19.

 

It indemnifies all NHS doctors against claims of negligence and eliminates the need for a jury-led inquest on deaths attributed to COVID 19. A doctor not necessarily need to have examined the deceased prior to signing the medical certificate of cause of death (MCCD).

 

If it is "impractical" for the doctor who last saw the deceased to complete the MCCD, providing they report that the deceased "probably" had COVID 19, any other qualified doctor can sign the death certificate as a COVID 19 death.

 

There is no requirement for any signing doctor to have even seen the deceased prior to issuing the MCCD. A video link consultation within the four-week period leading up to the patient’s death, is deemed sufficient for them to pronounce death from COVID 19.

 

And there's lots more equally as worrying.

 

https://in-this-together.com/covid-19-is-a-statistical-nonsense/

 

Edited May 13, 2020 by Krataiboy

[7by7]

17 hours ago, evadgib said:

I'm far from alone in noticing that deaths from stroke/heart attack/cancer/old age are going down just as quickly in the other direction, or that families are complaining in droves that the virus is being unduly blamed when they know full well that it wasn't the cause.

 

Feel free to follow your own virtue-signalling advice.

 

Where is your evidence to support these claims?

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Krataiboy said:

Any logical person should be troubled by the elasticity of The Coronavirus Act 2020 on the registration of deaths allegedly due to the virus and the accuracy of ONS data in relation to COVID 19.

 

It indemnifies all NHS doctors against claims of negligence and eliminates the need for a jury-led inquest on deaths attributed to COVID 19. A doctor not necessarily need to have examined the deceased prior to signing the medical certificate of cause of death (MCCD).

 

If it is "impractical" for the doctor who last saw the deceased to complete the MCCD, providing they report that the deceased "probably" had COVID 19, any other qualified doctor can sign the death certificate as a COVID 19 death.

 

There is no requirement for any signing doctor to have even seen the deceased prior to issuing the MCCD. A video link consultation within the four-week period leading up to the patient’s death, is deemed sufficient for them to pronounce death from COVID 19.

 

And there's lots more equally as worrying.

 

https://in-this-together.com/covid-19-is-a-statistical-nonsense/

 

In-this-together.com

 

is a propaganda website with hidden ownership.

 

 

[7by7]

@Krataiboy, I'm not going to quote your lengthy copy and paste from a blog; it's there for all to see as is the link.

 

I will merely say it's a blog by a man who is not medically qualified. A man who sees himself as some sort of anti-establishment gadfly. A man whose main interest is self promotion and his book sales.

 

He, you, @evadgib and others all claim that the government are over reporting the Covid 19 deaths; yet none of you have given any reason why. Surely, if anything, in order convince us they're doing a good job the government would be under reporting the number of deaths? As they did at the beginning by ignoring deaths outside hospital.

 

You have all claimed that the MSM are complicit in this deception; despite for most of the last 4 years claiming that the MSM are anti Johnson and doing what they can to keep him out of office before the election and hound him out of it after.

 

None of you have explained the increase in deaths over the period. If this increase is not due to the virus, what is it due to?

 

None of you have provided a single shred of reputable evidence to back up your claims. The best you can do is an opinionated blog! How long were you searching on Google to find even that?

 

 

[mrfill]

1 hour ago, Krataiboy said:

Any logical person should be troubled by the elasticity of The Coronavirus Act 2020 on the registration of deaths allegedly due to the virus and the accuracy of ONS data in relation to COVID 19.

 

It indemnifies all NHS doctors against claims of negligence and eliminates the need for a jury-led inquest on deaths attributed to COVID 19. A doctor not necessarily need to have examined the deceased prior to signing the medical certificate of cause of death (MCCD).

 

If it is "impractical" for the doctor who last saw the deceased to complete the MCCD, providing they report that the deceased "probably" had COVID 19, any other qualified doctor can sign the death certificate as a COVID 19 death.

 

There is no requirement for any signing doctor to have even seen the deceased prior to issuing the MCCD. A video link consultation within the four-week period leading up to the patient’s death, is deemed sufficient for them to pronounce death from COVID 19.

 

And there's lots more equally as worrying.

 

https://in-this-together.com/covid-19-is-a-statistical-nonsense/

 

Ignore completely any reason for death.

Can you explain why there has been 50000 excess deaths (about 50%increase) over the 5 year average for the period mid-March - end of April?

 

What is causing this 50% increase in recorded deaths?

 

[Krataiboy]

29 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

In-this-together.com

 

is a propaganda website with hidden ownership.

 

 

Aka, "Can't dispute the facts, so I'll rubbish the messenger".

 

Sad, Chomps. You might have learned something.

[Chomper Higgot]

56 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

Aka, "Can't dispute the facts, so I'll rubbish the messenger".

 

Sad, Chomps. You might have learned something.

Propaganda from a website in which the owner hides their identity - you mean those ‘facts’?

[stevenl]

1 hour ago, Krataiboy said:

Aka, "Can't dispute the facts, so I'll rubbish the messenger".

 

Sad, Chomps. You might have learned something.

No facts there, just opinions.

[Krataiboy]

Just now, stevenl said:

No facts there, just opinions.

Example?

[Krataiboy]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Propaganda from a website in which the owner hides their identity - you mean those ‘facts’?

Ian Davies makes no attempt to hide his identity. Try reading the content of the website and watching the video before making such a silly statement. 

Edited May 13, 2020 by Krataiboy

[mrfill]

5 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

Ian Davies makes no attempt to hide his identity. Try reading the content of the website and watching the video before making such a silly statement. 

Could I trouble you for an answer to post #24 please? The one about the 50000 excess deaths over the 5 year average for all causes.