SURVEY: Should Foreigners separated from family be allowed to return?

[transam]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:15 AM, mr mr said:

wrong. 

 

people made choices to leave for work (the ones we are talking about anyways). the money that work provides is the reason they do the job no ? 

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Total nonsense, so what is your opinion of farang military chaps that spend time away, do they all do it for the money.....?

You are 43 and retired, so you claim, with an "I'm all right jack" attitude...????

[Chongalulu]

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:57 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Anyone that left in February, March or April knew there was a risk that they wouldn't be able to travel or get back into Thailand. If they didn't, they are either lying or an idiot.

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In February there was no advice or official restrictions on travel. That’s why if you had expensive tickets probably booked several months previously and didn’t travel you would lose them with no recourse to insurance.

[sirineou]

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:09 AM, Captain Monday said:

It is a backwards nationalistic policy that is medically unsound from an epidemiology perspective.

I thought anything short of PR was not a legal residence in Thailand, jut a visitor. I was wrong. 

Obviously you need a Thai passport to honestly say you have a right to live here, an impossible goal for MOST 

The virus does not discriminate. It knows no border. A Thai person coming in is just as likely infected as a foreigner the rules should be same

 

For the poll there should have been an option to "quarantine 14 days" at ones own residence.

People here have businesses, families, wonderful homes and gardens with plenty of space for "social distancing"

No reason they can't be isolated at home and safer than being put into a cramped facility with strangers.

Understand the need to limit unnecessary travel (tourists) But foreign people live here and this should be realized by the authorities.

 

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Quarantine at home would be the best option for many but not for all. Many will respect the rules and self quarantine properly  but many will not. and as such not a viable option since it would be impossible for the Thai government to monitor who is doing it right and who is not. 

  Back to the issue at hand. If a whole family is traveling back home to Thailand but one person is not a Thai national  what would be the benefit to Thailand  from removing him? IMO it is shameful for the Thai government to separate families especially in times such as these.  

 

[Chongalulu]

  On 5/24/2020 at 7:00 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Actually the actual status of persons here on Non-Immigrant visas with extensions (not working or PR holders) is 'temporary visitor for purposes other than tourism'. 

 

As I said on the other thread, people need to read the small print and wake up to their actual status here.

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Does the small print say that the expiry date of the annual visa you have been granted is meaningless?

[yogi100]

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:50 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Absolutely not.

 

The low case numbers and deaths show that a total travel ban on foreign arrivals works.

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Well said, look at the UK where foreign arrivals are not even screened, let alone tested nor quarantined.

[mr mr]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:21 AM, transam said:

Total nonsense, so what is your opinion of farang military chaps that spend time away, do they all do it for the money.....?

You are 43 and retired, so you claim, with an "I'm all right jack" attitude...????

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ya ? 

 

i spent a year separated from my wife and son. so anyone crying here after a couple months come back after a year and we will talk. 

 

i was specifically talking about oil workers for the most part. as for military guys. they know full well the structure of their life being in the military before starting a family.

 

 

 

[sirineou]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:30 AM, yogi100 said:

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:50 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Absolutely not.

 

The low case numbers and deaths show that a total travel ban on foreign arrivals works.

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Well said, look at the UK where foreign arrivals are not even screened, let alone tested nor quarantined.

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It works towards controlling the virus but not toward maintain family cohesion. What if there was a way to do both, at a minimum cost? 

[bangrak]

  On 5/24/2020 at 7:00 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Actually the actual status of persons here on Non-Immigrant visas with extensions (not working or PR holders) is 'temporary visitor for purposes other than tourism'. 

 

As I said on the other thread, people need to read the small print and wake up to their actual status here.

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Congatulation; you are perfectly in-line with what a military dictatorship propagating nationalism, racism and xhenophoby would impose. 

[flexomike]

  On 5/24/2020 at 5:50 AM, RangerP703 said:

Yes, but they should cover all costs of the quarantine including a test at the end of the 14 days.

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Why do you care about this, is money coming out of your pocket, get a life, I don't think anyone allowed to come back would have any problem having to pay for the quaratine

[dutchweller]

I just want to get back so I can finish moving house out of Thailand..

My local immigration finally granted my wife's long term visa after 3 years process unfortunately it was issued 3 days after flights stopped..

 

So flying to Thailand to do 14 days qarenteen then 5 days finishing clear our house...to fly home for another 14 days qarenteen....sounds like fun....

[transam]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:34 AM, mr mr said:

ya ? 

 

i spent a year separated from my wife and son. so anyone crying here after a couple months come back after a year and we will talk. 

 

i was specifically talking about oil workers for the most part. as for military guys. they know full well the structure of their life being in the military before starting a family.

 

 

 

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So we all must think like you for it to be OK.....Gawd......????

 

Oil workers are just ONE employment category of many where folk work away, and for many reasons. As for your military, seems they must take notice of you too.....???? 

 

 

[bangrak]

  On 5/24/2020 at 7:12 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Repatriation of Thai nationals is a right that (I believe) is protected in the Constitution and laws of Thailand.

 

Foreigners have no such rights enshrined anywhere in Thai law and most only remain on temporary visa extensions or permission to say, that can be cancelled on a whim by any immigration official.

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Thank you for your instructive last paragraph! When you do personally agree with its content, I guess you would have been a great fan of a certain Phibun Songkram (look it up when you don't know about him). 

[digger70]

SURVEY: SHOULD FOREIGNERS WITH FAMILY BE ALLOWED BACK? 

Yes I don't see why not .They Live here and have their Wife/Kids/Girlfriend here ,They spend their money here on , Buying Houses/Cars/Motor bikes/and their Lady /Wife & kids. Some do More than the Thai Men. At least they should have the same Right to return to their Loved ones as Anyone . Including having to do the 14 day Quarantine.

[mr mr]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:47 AM, transam said:

So we all must think like you for it to be OK.....Gawd......????

 

Oil workers are just ONE employment category of many where folk work away, and for many reasons. As for your military, seems they must take notice of you too.....???? 

 

 

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didn't tell anyone to think like me champ. keep up the good work. 

[DrJack54]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:49 AM, digger70 said:

At least they should have the same Right to return to their Loved ones as Anyone . Including having to do the 14 day Quarantine.

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Just a question. I live Thailand. Partner 7 years. If I was in Australia and if I was married to a Thai (I'm not) could she fly to Oz right now. 

I have UK mate married to a Thai. Every time she visits UK she has to obtain a visa.

[flexomike]

  On 5/24/2020 at 9:04 AM, Paiman said:

You share a flat with Don Mega? Sounds just like him.

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I will give you one vote for the best quote of the day

[flexomike]

  On 5/24/2020 at 9:56 AM, RangerP703 said:

 

Not what I would call making "HUGE BANK".

 

Think I'll stick to my land based job that pays more and allows me to be with my family every day.

 

 

https://www.ziprecruiter.com/Salaries/Offshore-Oil-Rig-Salary

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wow you truly are the special one - 555

 

[RangerP703]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:16 AM, mr mr said:

run that sentiment by an average thai and get back to me. 

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Why ?

[from the home of CC]

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:59 AM, transam said:

Then no person should cross borders, even Thais, until the Gov. thinks the cost is clear for all.

They let Thais back in the country, and they brought the virus with them...

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every decent country in the world has made reparation arrangements for its citizens, why would they leave their people in countries where mismanagement of the crisis is a national sport.. 

[digger70]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:57 AM, DrJack54 said:

Just a question. I live Thailand. Partner 7 years. If I was in Australia and if I was married to a Thai (I'm not) could she fly to Oz right now. 

I have UK mate married to a Thai. Every time she visits UK she has to obtain a visa.

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Only if she could get a tourist visa and you would have to prove that you have enough money to Keep her while she's in Aus.

[DrJack54]

  On 5/24/2020 at 11:13 AM, digger70 said:

Only if she could get a tourist visa and you would have to prove that you have enough money to Keep her while she's in Aus.

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I've taken her to Oz many times. Tourist visa multiple 12 month. Fact is right now she would not be able to obtain one and the AU government would not allow her to enter Oz just because she has a marriage certificate. 

The vast majority of folk her on marriage extensions are on TEMPORARY permission of stay. This thread about married guys can be allowed into Thailand currently, imo, is bit of a joke. 

[JackThompson]

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:50 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Absolutely not.

 

The low case numbers and deaths show that a total travel ban on foreign arrivals works.

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Sorry, but that is just bad-science.  We don't know the "case numbers" - would need to test everyone (or at least a good cross-section) for antibodies to find out how many already had it - most having mild or no symptoms, and would never have sought care and been tested. 

 

And without knowing the level of spread that occurred, no one can infer causation between travel and hospital deaths.  It is quite possible most of the small fraction of the population who were suseptible to this virus have already been exposed - likely in February, when the infected from Wuhan were coming in by the thousands.

 

  On 5/24/2020 at 6:57 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

Anyone that left in February, March or April knew there was a risk that they wouldn't be able to travel or get back into Thailand. If they didn't, they are either lying or an idiot.

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That is also not true.  The WHO was encouraging nations to keep borders open through February ...

  Quote

GENEVA - The director-general of the World Health Organization is urging countries not to close their borders to foreigners traveling from China, in response to the coronavirus epidemic in that country.

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https://www.voanews.com/science-health/coronavirus-outbreak/who-chief-urges-countries-not-close-borders-foreigners-china
 

... while, at the same time, the Thai Govt was encouraging the Chinese New Year revlers to come in. 

 

I opposed this, btw.  I DO think there should have been closed-borders and much sooner, because we did not know, at that time, that this virus was only harmful to a tiny fraction of the population. 

But, those closures should have included a warning period, giving family members time to return and enter quarantine.  Many had no choice, as they had to travel for work.  They should be allowed to return and do quantine.

[yogi100]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:34 AM, sirineou said:

It works towards controlling the virus but not toward maintain family cohesion. What if there was a way to do both, at a minimum cost? 

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It's too late now where the UK is concerned. They've been allowing 15,000 people a day in and over 35,000 Britons have died so far, That's more than were killed in the Blitz of WW2.

 

Who knows how many arrivals brought the plague with them when they entered Britain. Personally I'd sooner have some family related inconvenience for a few weeks than have have friends and relatives dying for a lack of such a relatively minor disruption.

 

Rest assured many more are going to die until we get an effective vaccine.

 

Thailand and other Asian countries have got it right. The UK and other nations who value human rights above human life have got it wrong.

 

But we can learn from them for the next time.

 

Also after experience gained through the Sars outbreak South Korea and China knew what expect when it came to PPE. We were clueless.

[JackThompson]

  On 5/24/2020 at 7:59 AM, Keyser Soze666 said:

A firm no for me. You made your bed by leaving and should now be your own gov's problem, not another. We have zero rights here.

 

On top of that, as long as the money still flows, your Thai wife won't be worried at all if you are not here. We are no more than ATM's.

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You are revealing the nature of your relationships - not the rest of us.

[JackThompson]

  On 5/24/2020 at 8:35 AM, 473geo said:

But history has already proved you wrong, thousands of Chinese tourists flowed into Thailand, the government were heavily criticised for failing to close the borders, and yet....no real impact from the virus

 

Returnees from Italy and the UK on the other hand......

 

It would appear prudent to take the origin of travel into consideration

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What you are describing is "not testing" while the infected Chinese from Wuhan were bringing it here by the plane-load, and calling the early deaths "pnumonia" (w/o testing). 

 

Later, the testing begin, which happened to be when the evil-farangs came in with it.  Testing and closing borders was becoming a popular tactic world-wide, at that time.

 

No way officialdom would ever criticize their Chinese overlords for the shutdown / economic mayhem caused by China closing off Wuhan from the rest of China, while keeping the Wuhan airport open to the rest of the world.

[JackThompson]

  On 5/24/2020 at 8:51 AM, 473geo said:

A country looks after it's own first, they are keeping the flow regular but steady.

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Wake me up when that starts happening here.  If they wanted to do that, they would have blocked the infected Chinese coming in, from the start. 

 

Then, when the shutdown period started, they would have quickly dispersed the 5K/mo (more better) to keep working-Thais in Bangkok in their apartments (since their paychecks were gone), and NOT allowed them to pile into buses and trains, to spread the virus all over the country.   Remember the scenes at Mo Chit?

 

Remember, this is before we knew the virus was not as deadly as first forecast.  If it had been, the bodies would have been piling up all over the country, due to that move.

 

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Non nationals should be patient and show consideration for the Thai people and the way the government chooses to handle things

 

Really, is another month away so desperate, when that month could see so many positive changes?

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"A month away" - I hope that's all it is.

 

  On 5/24/2020 at 8:55 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

These foreigners that are wanting back in are not poor Cambodians or Burmese construction workers that lost everything and survive on pennies, that are desperate that they will work for less than minimum wage as virtual slaves.

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Nothing "virtual" about it - just a different form.  And the purpose of those workers - allowed in on L-Visas - is to avoid the Rich here having to pay Thais a decent wage.  They have to travel 1/2 way around the world, to compete with Bangladesis, for the Same Jobs those from Cambodia and Myanmar do here.

 

Like I said, above, no consideration what so ever for the well-being of average Thai people.

[sirineou]

  On 5/24/2020 at 11:30 AM, yogi100 said:

It's too late now where the UK is concerned. They've been allowing 15,000 people a day in and over 35,000 Britons have died so far, That's more than were killed in the Blitz of WW2.

 

Who knows how many arrivals brought the plague with them when they entered Britain. Personally I'd sooner have some family related inconvenience for a few weeks than have have friends and relatives dying for a lack of such a relatively minor disruption.

 

Rest assured many more are going to die until we get an effective vaccine.

 

Thailand and other Asian countries have got it right. The UK and other nations who value human rights above human life have got it wrong.

 

But we can learn from them for the next time.

 

Also after experience gained through the Sars outbreak South Korea and China knew what expect when it came to PPE. We were clueless.

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I was just watching a video on You Tube concerning testing and how the wrong people tested in some countries. Anything above the 10% mark in the graph below indicates wrong testing. The UK and US were on the top of the list. 

A fundamental failure in leadership IMO 

If you are interested below is the video.

 

[JackThompson]

  On 5/24/2020 at 9:01 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

So you are saying Thailand is not civilised?

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Thailand or the "Thai Government" / "Immigration"?  I like the Thai people.  Best not to confuse the two. 

 

The govt in my passport-country certainly is not civilized. 

 

  2 hours ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

This is exactly why it is so difficult to get PR and Thai citizenship, to keep types like you at arm's length.

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When was it easier to get PR and Thai Citizenship for Farangs?

[DrJack54]

  On 5/24/2020 at 11:30 AM, yogi100 said:

Thailand and other Asian countries have got it right.

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Vietnam got it right. They closed airports and entries~ March 20. They also shut all bars. Made face masks compulsory at same time. MANY other countries also banned flights inbound for friend nationals. Think NZ was one of the first. Google for interesting read. Thailand waited until ~March 26. 

I won't spend next 5 minutes typing the other major stuff ups since. 

The numbers if even close to correct is fantastic. Do not put it down to competent management. 

[Mr Meeseeks]

  On 5/24/2020 at 10:21 AM, nchuckle said:

Most civilised countries in the world do not prevent the return of a resident with a valid  visa,especially if involving separation of families ,even in these circumstances. Quarantine at the expense of the returnee is perfectly functional and acceptable to all concerned 

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Australia did.