Thailand is red-lighted in UK for quarantine purposes alongside Brazil, China and US, inexplicable move

[transam]

2 minutes ago, Misab said:

The English people are normally intelligent people but this stink. Is it the revenge of some sort, but revenge for what? Or perhaps plain stupidity among the English officials who didn't bother to check how few COVID-19 cases there are in Thailand?

You seem to forget, the English have an excellent Secret Service, perhaps they looked at why so few LOS cases.........................................................????

[AndrewMciver]

UK rates are awful, but i'm aghast how there is no independent verification of 'official' figures each country gives out. Some are obviously motivated to keep the numbers down low. 

 

Spain and Italy, two high tourist zones - the numbers they give out for mortality are hospital only rates. They don't include the huge numbers in care homes, and those at home. The UK does include all sets of figures. 

 

Does anyone trust the figures out of Vietnam and Thailand? Especially when we are expected to beleive they have less numbers than Singapore, despite mamoth difference in populations. Vietnam especially, just closed up, and then said there was nothing to see. This despite huge volumes of Chinese pouring into Vietnam around Chinese New Year. 

 

Any independent checks? No chance. 

 

Even in India, the figures are wild crazy. But if you ever been to India, where all hospital care is privatised and at a cost, huge swades of poverty, where you won't get any access to health care never mind post mortems. 

 

Then there is the testing issue - how many tests are Thailand doing to even know how much is in the country? The official figures are very small. Certainly not 150,000 tests a day a country like the UK is doing. 

 

For all the <deleted> the UK is getting, at least you know the figures aren't being fudged. They report all mortality, infections rates in all settings. They aren't pulling a Spain, Italy and France and giving out half truth data. The UK's biggest scandal has been there utter horrific disaster in old peoples care homes, and poor governence at the start where they simply locked down too late. 

 

Sad times. 

[JCP108]

2 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

I would love to see your "reliable data"....

Thailand's DOPH data can be found as the supportive data for the NYT article about excess deaths...

 

https://github.com/nytimes/covid-19-data/tree/master/excess-deaths

 

[bluedoc]

On 7/6/2020 at 12:11 PM, JCP108 said:

It's a red herring to respond to criticisms of the Thai response to Covid 19 (or their lack of apparent honesty about their numbers) by saying the poster isn't sufficiently simultaneously bashing their own country. I'm from the U.S. I bash the stupid and incompetent U.S. government all day long in contexts where there other people who care about that (and currently live there having to deal with that stupidity). When I raise questions about the numbers in Thailand it's with no shirking of my responsibility to hold my home country's government accountable, too. One can walk and chew gum at the same time. 

 

Honestly, some things are going better in Thailand than in the West (e.g., mask wearing). And, some of that is consequential. And, and, and the reports being fed to us here are so very obviously problematic and even more so if viewed in the context of the Thai DOPH data that they themselves have released showing a big and consistent increase in monthly deaths (diverging from a 3-year long consistent number) starting in May of 2019 and continuing through the last month reported (April 2020). No mounds of bodies here or social media posts clarifying things for us. But, there's the DOPH data...so, one wonders. 

Hi, could you guide me to the Thai DOPH data. Please

[Woolsgibb60]

On 7/6/2020 at 12:38 AM, bkkcanuck8 said:

Thailand test numbers were actually considerably well within the higher test nations earlier (when they had the peak) - they have not been testing as much.  It looks wider now because other countries which are considered hotspots have had to continue testing at a higher level longer.  I was skeptical for a very long time that there was a hidden problem, but there are really only two directions - controlled or increasing rapidly... I see no indication of the hospitals being hit by wave after wave of COVID patients... so I am no longer skeptical... Thailand has done a good job of tracking and tracing and controlling it.

I like to know when Thailand had the peak because they have never said the month when it hit the peak and the month fall off every country in the world have said when they hit the peak and the fall off I would not believe 1 word what come out of there mouths they lie like the Chinese wait for the second wave when the  Chinese are back at why u.k have give Thailand red notice at say something what the uk government think of the Thailand figures 

[baboon]

9 hours ago, Misab said:

The English people are normally intelligent people but this stink. Is it the revenge of some sort, but revenge for what? Or perhaps plain stupidity among the English officials who didn't bother to check how few COVID-19 cases there are in Thailand?

Just a bit of diplomatic tit for tat, more than likely. It's pointless to be so upset about it.

[Peter Denis]

26 minutes ago, Woolsgibb60 said:

I like to know when Thailand had the peak because they have never said the month when it hit the peak and the month fall off every country in the world have said when they hit the peak and the fall off I would not believe 1 word what come out of there mouths they lie like the Chinese wait for the second wave when the  Chinese are back at why u.k have give Thailand red notice at say something what the uk government think of the Thailand figures 

Perfect sample of what I would call a 'stream of unconsciousness'.

[Traubert]

This, gentlemen, is why there is an ignore list and couple of our more 'eccentric' and corpse fixated members adorn mine.

[bkkcanuck8]

11 hours ago, Woolsgibb60 said:

I like to know when Thailand had the peak because they have never said the month when it hit the peak and the month fall off every country in the world have said when they hit the peak and the fall off I would not believe 1 word what come out of there mouths they lie like the Chinese wait for the second wave when the  Chinese are back at why u.k have give Thailand red notice at say something what the uk government think of the Thailand figures 

March 22 with 188 new cases... 

[Redline]

It’s possible they have experience with Thai authorities stretching the truth?

[nausea]

Weird, must be political, or maybe they know something we don't, or maybe pure ineptness, or maybe Thailand just isn't that important as a source of tourist revenue.

[SkyFax]

10 minutes ago, nausea said:

maybe Thailand just isn't that important as a source of tourist revenue.

"British nationals make over one million visits to Thailand every year"

(Still current at 6 July 2020)

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand

 

184,412 (2019) Thailand to UK visits https://www.visitbritain.org/markets/thailand

[Trillian]

On 7/8/2020 at 2:22 AM, smedly said:

everyone needs to take a reality check in this country

 

my guess based on reliable data from other countries is at least 30,000 people have died from CV-19  in Thailand and the virus is spreading amongst the population at the same rate as anywhere else 

 

they know it and are hiding it - actions speak louder than words and there is a serious mismatch between what they are claiming and reality, some say why are the hospitals not filling up with sick people - well they aren't because they don't give a flying .. about people who are sick here - neither do they record deaths properly, it is the family that records a death and off to the burner they go - this is not the west - people die here and that is it, authorities have no interest in recording such things - head me in villages are the local authority - they are not doctors ............dead - burn have a slap up party bye bye - cause of death - they stopped breathing

 

some stupid people here think they are in the UK (or western countries) were everything is done by the book - a doctor must certify a death - every death, if you think that is the Thai way then you really have no idea about the country you are living in

 

waken up people and get the 3rd world head on and stop thinking that western standards apply here - they don't and not even close 

It might be helpful for people living here to ask themselves:

 

- Do I know of anyone who has died from any cause this year?

- Have I had reliable second hand reports of anyone dying?

- Have I witnessed first hand unusual activity at the local burner, ie an unusually large     number of cremations?

- Does anyone else that I know share my beliefs about the high number of deaths and do I view that person as balanced, rational and normal?

- Do my friends who work in the medical field support the excess deaths theory?

 

If I answer the above I come up with, no, no, no, no and no, others may answer differently (or they may not)!

 

 

 

 

 

[JCP108]

14 minutes ago, Trillian said:

It might be helpful for people living here to ask themselves:

 

- Do I know of anyone who has died from any cause this year?

- Have I had reliable second hand reports of anyone dying?

- Have I witnessed first hand unusual activity at the local burner, ie an unusually large     number of cremations?

- Does anyone else that I know share my beliefs about the high number of deaths and do I view that person as balanced, rational and normal?

- Do my friends who work in the medical field support the excess deaths theory?

 

If I answer the above I come up with, no, no, no, no and no, others may answer differently (or they may not)!

 

 

 

 

 

The idea of using TV posters' direct experiences to decide whether reports of public health data in Thailand are valid would be amusing if it weren't so completely bonkers. 

 

There's this, though:

 

https://bangkokherald.com/coronavirus/new-evidence-casts-doubts-on-accuracy-of-thailands-official-coronavirus-statistics/

Edited July 9, 2020 by JCP108

[rott]

On 7/6/2020 at 9:43 AM, AussieinThaiJim said:

It’s far more likely Thailand will put UK on the Red list!

 

A little tit for tat!

Another bitter and twisted anglophobic comment. 

 

It may have escaped your notice Jimbo but Thailand has everyone on the Red List. 

[nausea]

42 minutes ago, SkyFax said:

"British nationals make over one million visits to Thailand every year"

(Still current at 6 July 2020)

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand

 

184,412 (2019) Thailand to UK visits https://www.visitbritain.org/markets/thailand

You miss my point, tourist revenue into the UK. Who gives a damn about money spent overseas. It's lost to the UK economy. This is why pensions are frozen for us guys living in Thailand.

[ThailandRyan]

49 minutes ago, Trillian said:

It might be helpful for people living here to ask themselves:

 

- Do I know of anyone who has died from any cause this year?

- Have I had reliable second hand reports of anyone dying?

- Have I witnessed first hand unusual activity at the local burner, ie an unusually large     number of cremations?

- Does anyone else that I know share my beliefs about the high number of deaths and do I view that person as balanced, rational and normal?

- Do my friends who work in the medical field support the excess deaths theory?

 

If I answer the above I come up with, no, no, no, no and no, others may answer differently (or they may not)!

 

 

 

 

 

I have had 3 family members of my ex wife die this year at a young age, early 60's from respiratory issues, never tested by the hospitals in the North where they lived, died at home. Many family members sick as well. Family normaly lives until well in there 90s unless a catastrophic accident.

Edited July 9, 2020 by ThailandRyan

[Blumpie]

People arrive on planes that transfer all over the world.  It's easy to have people from all countries on a planeload of people.  Planes do not necessarily have only thailand people on board.  Planes are cesspools for the virus to spread.

No conspiracy here other than heat and too much time on ones hands.  

[Trillian]

1 hour ago, JCP108 said:

The idea of using TV posters' direct experiences to decide whether reports of public health data in Thailand are valid would be amusing if it weren't so completely bonkers. 

 

There's this, though:

 

https://bangkokherald.com/coronavirus/new-evidence-casts-doubts-on-accuracy-of-thailands-official-coronavirus-statistics/

When faced with the choice of not knowing what to believe, homegrown calculations using other countries data, or, the numbers presented by current government, anecdotal evidence can sometimes be useful. After all, posters lapped up the idea that Wuhan incinerators were being used 24x7 and that urns were lining the streets, long before any firm medical conclusions!

 

BTW you link is in the same category as articles that ask: is the baht manipulated by the elites, are TAT numbers fudged, was the moon landing filmed in a studio.

Edited July 10, 2020 by Trillian

[Bkk Brian]

Its not just the UK sidelining Thailand, now Singapore to, even China does not need to quarantine:

 

State quarantine for Thais entering Singapore, while harder hit nations get a pass:

 

"Singapore, which has 45,298 total cases, says that Thais must serve their “Stay Home Notice” at dedicated government quarantine facilities. Arrivals from China, which has seen a total of 83,581 cases, Germany, with 198,765 cases, and Japan with 20,174, among other countries, will only need to be tested upon arrival and do not have to carry out their quarantine in government facilities."

 

https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/state-quarantine-for-thais-entering-singapore-while-harder-hit-nations-get-a-pass

 

 

[Trillian]

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Its not just the UK sidelining Thailand, now Singapore to, even China does not need to quarantine:

 

State quarantine for Thais entering Singapore, while harder hit nations get a pass:

 

"Singapore, which has 45,298 total cases, says that Thais must serve their “Stay Home Notice” at dedicated government quarantine facilities. Arrivals from China, which has seen a total of 83,581 cases, Germany, with 198,765 cases, and Japan with 20,174, among other countries, will only need to be tested upon arrival and do not have to carry out their quarantine in government facilities."

 

https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/state-quarantine-for-thais-entering-singapore-while-harder-hit-nations-get-a-pass

 

 

This is a quid pro quo issue, I'm sure.

[Peter Denis]

2 hours ago, JCP108 said:

The idea of using TV posters' direct experiences to decide whether reports of public health data in Thailand are valid would be amusing if it weren't so completely bonkers. 

 

There's this, though:

https://bangkokherald.com/coronavirus/new-evidence-casts-doubts-on-accuracy-of-thailands-official-coronavirus-statistics/

I don't think that 'looking around you' as part of the process to make up your mind about an issue like covid, is completely bonkers.

Surely @Trillian didn't imply that this should be your ONLY source of information, because that would be indeed ludicrous.

But thanks for the article, which makes a couple of fair points.

The notable ones being that:

1 - Worldwide, international health officials estimated that covid-19 cases are being undercounted by a factor of 10.

And based on the new health industry numbers, Thailand has been undercounting by a factor of seven.

2 - The Director-General of the thai Public Health Ministry admitted that testing for the virus itself - or even just antibodies - cannot confirm Thailand is free from covid-19.

And added 'asymptomatic people are still out there spreading the virus'.

 

> Even in the light of those 2 quotes (the validity of which I do not deny), it is still fair to conclude that - given the very low numbers of reported cases (0) during the last 45 days, even with increased testing and vigilance, as well as undercounting - that for all practical purposes Thailand is covid-free.

A politician can never make such a statement since 'it could backfire' in the light of new evidence or a resurgence of cases, and the opposition would use it to oust him.

Thank God I am not a politician, and can come to my own conclusions after digesting all the information and 'looking around me'.

 

Edited July 10, 2020 by Peter Denis

[smedly]

3 hours ago, Trillian said:

It might be helpful for people living here to ask themselves:

 

- Do I know of anyone who has died from any cause this year?

- Have I had reliable second hand reports of anyone dying?

- Have I witnessed first hand unusual activity at the local burner, ie an unusually large     number of cremations?

- Does anyone else that I know share my beliefs about the high number of deaths and do I view that person as balanced, rational and normal?

- Do my friends who work in the medical field support the excess deaths theory?

 

If I answer the above I come up with, no, no, no, no and no, others may answer differently (or they may not)!

 

 

 

 

 

I can answer yes to most of that in multiples 

 

but you really do post some beauties from your strange little world - puff puff

 

and just to add - there is no excess of deaths in Thailand, it is about the same as it usually is (maybe up a little) but deaths on the roads is down to a fraction of the norm due to curfews and lockdowns

Edited July 10, 2020 by smedly

[Trillian]

16 minutes ago, smedly said:

I can answer yes to most of that in multiples 

 

but you really do post some beauties from your strange little world - puff puff

 

and just to add - there is no excess of deaths in Thailand, it is about the same as it usually is (maybe up a little) but deaths on the roads is down to a fraction of the norm due to curfews and lockdowns

The last time I posted a covid's deaths calculation you said it was nonsense, now you think it's part of your calculation, too funny:

 

BTW if you answer to my post recent posts is yes, yes, yes, yes and yes, "in multiples", I'd move if I were you, you're clearly living in a dangerous spot.

[AndrewMciver]

3 hours ago, rott said:

Another bitter and twisted anglophobic comment. 

 

It may have escaped your notice Jimbo but Thailand has everyone on the Red List. 

 

Sky News today - the reason the UK has not exempt Thailand to UK route from quarantine is because its stats show that the Bangkok to London route is used by alot of Chinese citizens connecting from China. There's also a fear the Chinese (who many attend University in the UK), will try to bypass the quarantine in the UK, by trying to go via Thailand (which it expects to open to Chinese very soon) if Thailand was placed on a no quarantine list. 

 

Other nations the UK believe Chinese will try to connect via have also been put on the quarantine list, despite their own nations reporting low infections. 

 

The same rather complicated theory is being applied to the USA too. Whilst Canadians are so far exempt from any quarantine if they chose to come to the UK - if the country opens up to America then it would be taken of the exemption list, as many US citizens may exploit the loophole by travelling via Canada. 

 

 

Edited July 10, 2020 by AndrewMciver

[ThailandRyan]

1 minute ago, AndrewMciver said:

 

Sky News today - the reason the UK has not exempt Thailand to UK route from quarantine is because its stats show that the Bangkok to London route is used by alot of Chinese citizens connecting from China. There's also a fear the Chinese (who many attend University in the UK), will try to bypass the quarantine in the UK, by trying to go via Thailand (which it expects to open to Chinese very soon) if Thailand was placed on a no quarantine list. 

 

Other nations the UK believe Chinese will try to connect via have also been put on the quarantine list, despite their own nations reporting low infections. 

 

 

Now that actually makes sense to me 

[alant]

On 7/6/2020 at 6:39 AM, alant said:

Nore

Note! 

[Blumpie]

10 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Now that actually makes sense to me 

As I've said earlier but nobody paid attention.

There are about 20 people here that whip the nonsense into a froth that you can't see the truth.   I've never seen such nonsense being posted here ad nauseam.  

Of course they won't post anymore here because they've been clearly shown to be wrong.  This entire thread is nothing but garbage except the beginning and the end.  

[Mung]

On 7/6/2020 at 6:52 PM, samsensam said:

 

statistically, in the uk, the under 50s are more likely to die from being hit by a bus than from corona virus. corona virus deaths are in the vast majority the elderly and those with pre-existing health problems.

 

 

And yet life goes on here. People go to work, provide for their family, and we are dealing with things. We don't lock down an entire region because of 1 case of COVID-19. I agree that these people depicted in the UK are morons, but life must go on.