Thailand must welcome back Chinese tourists now says leading tourism chief

[Emeraldisle]

If this happens there will be very few Chinese tourists anyway.

 

[samsensam]

On 8/3/2020 at 4:13 AM, CelticBhoy said:

"Much of the money ends up abroad and not in the hands of Thais."

 

Greed in full view here. Unbelievable comment .... ????

 

 

er... surely this would be the approach of any sensible country, the only surprising thing is how thailand ended up with all the tourists and not much income from them in the first place!

 

mis-management/corruption in the tourist sector?!

[AndrewMciver]

It wouldn't surprise me if this lot quarantined Thai's on an island far far away, so the Chinese can visit. 

 

Mass Chinese tourism has destroyed the beauty of Thailand, made a few middle men rich, but done nothing for tourism - with most money going abroad back to China. 

 

The exploitation of Thailand by China is disheartening. 

 

Put back visa restrictions on them. Make them provide a health certificate on arrival, along with a covid test, and isolation for 3 months before they can be set loose. 

[DrTuner]

2 hours ago, Emeraldisle said:

If this happens there will be very few Chinese tourists anyway.

 

CCP self-quarantine. Wouldn't that be nice. Then they can compare hermit state notes with North Korea.

[paulikens]

what they should do to be extra safe is chuck out every foreigner living there, just have thais in the country, cuz the foreigner is a disease ridden person so can never be too careful. its got to be the next step surely @Mr Meeseeks 

[Trujillo]

" I think that we are going to see new cases in Thailand soon; like most people I take the government's claim of zero cases with a grain of salt, although it seems like they have done a very good job overall. However, I don't think it can last."

 

We will ONLY see new cases in Thailand if they are brought in from abroad. That's a key distinction. 

What evidence makes you doubt the government's covid case numbers? Do you have facts or is it just that your bunion is acting up, which means corruption? 

You don't think what can last? The government's good job or no domestic cases? 

 

By the way, I love the not-so-veiled racist comment along side the bald-faced greed of the tourism dude. Other nationalities can bite the big one, but we LOVE the folks from the Middle Kingdom (equals -- We will tolerate you loud mouthed, dog-eating, gobbing, holier than thou, rude and obnoxious people because YOU HAVE LOTS OF MONEY TO SPEND HERE! [and we don't have to spend our own money to advertise for you to come -- double bonus round!])

 

Then again, let the first wave of Celestials come in bringing the first cases of covid into Thailand and see how much love they get from the locals after that.

The Chinese would be avoided like, well, the plague. 

If all nationalities were allowed in at the same time, the "dirty farang" would get the blame; let in only Chinese and they would have the sole honor of being the diseased ones. 

....hmmm.... maybe we should let them in after all....

[balo]

The virus is on it's way up again in Europe, several outbreaks now ,mainly due to tourism . 

Same will happen in Thailand if they want millions of Chinese back too soon.  

[Rhys]

...any runners?

 

[Maestro]

Removed a troll post (unintelligible/

[Maestro]

9 minutes ago, Rhys said:

...any runners?

 

 

No runners.

[teacherclaire]

On 8/3/2020 at 11:35 PM, Selatan said:

Now I understand why you farangs want the Chinese to be kept out so badly - so that Thailand's sex tourism sector could continue to thrive.

If more and more Chinese tourists come to Thailand for sightseeing, shopping and for the food, there is less need for poor Thai women to prostitute themselves.

I've seen it too often when Thai girls couldn't' wait to leave the village to go to a bar somewhere at the east coast, or in Bangkok.

 

    Many of them didn't even finish high school just because of their plans making as soon as possible money with foreigners.

 

Nobody prostitutes them, they're the ones who do it. 

 

Of course is often the own family behind it and they hang an amulet around her neck before she leaves and all know what she'll be doing. 

 

Money doesn't stink, so when the first paycheck comes in, nobody cares where the money comes from. 

 

And considering the impact of COVID 19, it's just one more reason to go for it, too many who have no other alternatives. 

 

BTW, prostitutes is the oldest business and you can find it all around the world. 

 

  Some of our village even take their boy friends to a tourist destination, hoping that he also finds a job at a boy club.

 

  

[DrTuner]

11 hours ago, balo said:

The virus is on it's way up again in Europe, several outbreaks now ,mainly due to tourism . 

Same will happen in Thailand if they want millions of Chinese back too soon.  

Also winter is coming, as soon as people start spending more time indoors R will rise. Then some management must be done to keep it under 1. At least euros now have a grasp on how it can be managed - test & tracing being the backbone. They don't have the capacity or ability here.

Edited August 10, 2020 by DrTuner

[Harry Fingerling]

On 8/3/2020 at 10:49 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

I posted this in another thread, but i think it is relevant to this discussion as well. BTW, a better statement from the tourism guy is to let long-term people in rather than a country-specific group.

 

I think it is time for Thailand to re-evaluate its Virus Response policy.

 

Thailand has been following a 'Zero-Tolerance' policy, but I think it is time to move to a 'Managed-Tolerance' policy. I make this suggestion based mainly on two factors; I think it is inevitable that the virus will return to Thailand and a calm, managed response is more effective than hysteria. Secondly, the economic damage being done to millions is more harmful than the virus itself and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.

 

We recently saw new cases in Vietnam, and I think that we are going to see new cases in Thailand soon; like most people I take the government's claim of zero cases with a grain of salt, although it seems like they have done a very good job overall. However, I don't think it can last. A better policy is to prepare, both medically and in terms of public opinion/education, for the return of the virus. Is this a radical idea? No, not really. Members will recall the phrase "flatten the curve", but perhaps a reminder is needed that the idea is to manage the virus so that the health system isn't overwhelmed; a policy of Zero Tolerance is incompatible with an open society and/or open economy. It is time to re-enforce the precautions needed, but also to allow for an economic re-start which includes outsiders/foreigners. A final point; humanity's best minds and a boat-load of resources are being thrown at the problem. This global effort, propelled by the power of competition, is expected to produce a vaccine either this year or early next year while treatments are being developed and refined daily; we as a species are going to beat this scourge, and relatively soon.

 

The economic damage being done to Thailand is immense. Yes, I know that we don't hear about it too much, but there is a reason for that. The people talking in the (not quite free) Media are almost all in a 'Virus-Proof' economic situation; they aren't directly affected so they don't feel the urgency of fixing the problem. Firm numbers are difficult to come by, but it seems around 6-9 million Thais are very badly hurt by the economic fall-out of the virus, and those people need to be both helped and heard. The damage done to these people is egregious and growing worse; some government support is being withdrawn, the option of 'Go Back to the Farm' isn't really possible anymore (and not a great idea regardless), and they will soon need more food and rent support to survive. Further, many aren't well-educated and don't have transferable skills, so their options are limited. Finally, even before Covid-19, their economic situation was in decline; it is in free-fall now and they can't be ignored. Simply put, plans for their economic regeneration must to be formulated now and implemented soon.

 

When people are hungry, all bets are off.

 

How to proceed?

 

It is the beginning of August; continue/speed up the current repatriation policy 'as is', but ramp up the public education aspect of change. Announce that by October 1st (perhaps Nov. 1st?) that the airspace around Thailand will be open to commercial air travel, long-term tourists (Snow-Birds who 'winter' here), remaining residents and retirees will be allowed to return with a few restrictions (test before boarding or on arrival, reasonable insurance, self-isolation at home on arrival, etc. BUT no mandatory state quarantine), implement common sense visa issuance (sorry Floridians and Texans!) and most of all prepare the Thai people for the idea that although there will be cases of the virus, they will be managed, and the benefits of re-opening are a risk worth taking. Yes, the end of mandatory state quarantine is essential if this is going to work; I believe that the long-term visitors will respect the self-isolation policy and Thailand's million strong public health volunteers can monitor them, but they won't come if they are going to be locked up. Moreover, the selection of the residents/retirees and 'Snow-Birds' as an initial group isn't accidental; these people already know the Kingdom and understand life within it, are good 'testers' of a new system, have a lot of money to spend, and can be excellent examples of a working policy of re-opening. Finally, allowing these kinds of visitors would build confidence, test whether short-term tourists could actually visit (I think not yet, but...), and help protect the tourism infrastructure from further and/or irreparable damage.

 

There are those who will argue that it is better to keep the borders closed and wait this out, and I honestly have trouble arguing against that idea (I don't want to catch the <deleted> thing). However, those who make that point rarely take the next step; what do you do with the 6-9 million people damaged by the current policy? Will those that advocate for closed borders take in homeless people? If so, how many? One family? Two families? Three? Will those that advocate for closed borders give up a percentage of their salaries/pensions to help? If so, how much? 25%? 35%? 45%? Will those that advocate for closed borders pay school fees and related costs for all the children of unemployed/underemployed parents? How many kids? One? Five? Twenty? The question isn't merely an intellectual exercise, it has real-world implications and consequences. 

 

If you want those 6-9 million people to sacrifice for you, what are you going to sacrifice for them?

 

To sum up, I think that the question of whether or not to keep the border closed is incomplete. The question should be: if you keep the border closed, then what will you do for the 6-9 million people economically-eviscerated by the response to the virus? Opening the Kingdom to visitors in November for the high season would likely see a few cases of the virus, but the Thai medical system can handle that (it did before, right?) until a vaccine is widely available. It would begin the process of re-starting the tourism industry in Thailand (20% of GDP!!!), begin the process of building trust again, re-start the employment of huge numbers, give Thailand a 'leg up' on future tourism business in the region, and alleviate some of the damage done to the poorest in the Kingdom. The alternative is a policy of rot, idleness, atrophy and decline with an indefinite timeline. 

 

History is replete with examples of people hiding behind walls for protection, but it rarely ever works (especially against something the size of a virus); see the 'Maginot Line', the Great Wall of China, the Berlin Wall, and more. History shows that a combination of pro-active tactics coupled with reasonable, layered defenses provides a better outcome to almost any problem.

 

Didn’t read. 

[greeneking]

On 8/9/2020 at 11:53 PM, balo said:

The virus is on it's way up again in Europe, several outbreaks now ,mainly due to tourism . 

Same will happen in Thailand if they want millions of Chinese back too soon.  

China cracks down on Buddhism.

If this is true and Thailand has enough pride to turn down their money then things could change anyway.

'In China, the government is not only cracking down on Muslims, but on other religions as well as it pushes to assert communist ideology. Buddhist temples have been closed or demolished, while a campaign has been launched to destroy hundreds of statues of Buddha.' DW News Aug 4, 2020

 

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed. 

[AndrewMciver]

 I'm surprised they've never really gone after no pay vacations. These low cost holidays by the Chinese, where everything is paid for, hotels, trips, food, drinks, etc The tour operators are chinese, the hotels are chinese owned. 

 

It's the worst sort of mass eco tourism that puts off other high paying tourists. 

[soi3eddie]

2 hours ago, greeneking said:

China cracks down on Buddhism.

If this is true and Thailand has enough pride to turn down their money then things could change anyway.

'In China, the government is not only cracking down on Muslims, but on other religions as well as it pushes to assert communist ideology. Buddhist temples have been closed or demolished, while a campaign has been launched to destroy hundreds of statues of Buddha.' DW News Aug 4, 2020

 

 

The Thai people would not allow it however the Thai government don't care and welcome it. Money talks though and ordinary Thai people cannot stop the Chinese invasion once the border is reopened. 

[DrTuner]

2 hours ago, greeneking said:

China cracks down on Buddhism.

If this is true and Thailand has enough pride to turn down their money then things could change anyway.

'In China, the government is not only cracking down on Muslims, but on other religions as well as it pushes to assert communist ideology. Buddhist temples have been closed or demolished, while a campaign has been launched to destroy hundreds of statues of Buddha.' DW News Aug 4, 2020

Yup, Mao wasn't big on religions and Xi has sucked in his teachings at school, religions are competing ideologies. That's why falun gong got booted out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falun_Gong

 

Quote

The practice initially enjoyed support from Chinese officialdom, but by the mid to late 1990s, the Government of China increasingly viewed Falun Gong as a potential threat due to its size, independence from the state, and spiritual teachings. By 1999, government estimates placed the number of Falun Gong practitioners at 70 million

 

They got too big, so down with the hammer.

[Mr Meeseeks]

On 8/9/2020 at 10:30 PM, paulikens said:

what they should do to be extra safe is chuck out every foreigner living there, just have thais in the country, cuz the foreigner is a disease ridden person so can never be too careful. its got to be the next step surely @Mr Meeseeks 

@paulikens It might well be the next step.

 

Stuff of dreams for the inadequates that run this place that.

 

I see they are threatening Barrow over his visa renewal now too, possibly because he's been involved with 2pricethailand.

 

They deserve everything they are going to get and it is going to be glorious.

[Mr Meeseeks]

On 8/11/2020 at 10:10 PM, DrTuner said:

Yup, Mao wasn't big on religions and Xi has sucked in his teachings at school, religions are competing ideologies. That's why falun gong got booted out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falun_Gong

 

 

They got too big, so down with the hammer.

My missus is part of a similar sect, farang tingtong.

[checkered flag]

On 8/14/2020 at 9:36 AM, Mr Meeseeks said:

My missus is part of a similar sect, farang tingtong.

Her vocabulary must be immense.

[outsider]

On 8/3/2020 at 11:06 AM, webfact said:

The pandemic has left the Chinese largely friendless around the world and it's time that Thailand's "special relationship" with the Chinese was resumed. 

 

Yes, time to start sucking up to your paymaster. As for 'foreigners', you can forget about them already. Especially since they are not welcome by you lot anyway.

 

[JackThompson]

On 8/3/2020 at 11:24 AM, RotBenz8888 said:

Perhaps they'll start with "quarantene islands" at some point, Samui, Phuket? Obviously not as safe as SQ/ASQ, but with strict social distancing, test before departure and on arrival etc, it could be the next step. 

That is what I suggest - quarantine (a) whole island(s), setting up any vulnerable to the virus (a tiny % of the population) with nice-digs elsewhere for the interim. 

Anyone leaving to other parts of Thailand, after the start of the operation, undergoes the 14-day quarantine - no exceptions. 

Pay for relocations of vulnerable, Thai's exit-quarantines, and medical-insurance for all Thais working there, out of a fee paid by entering travelers - 1000 Baht per-head should do it.

[metisdead]

An off topic post using unattributed content has been removed. 

[AndrewMciver]

On 8/3/2020 at 4:49 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

I posted this in another thread, but i think it is relevant to this discussion as well. BTW, a better statement from the tourism guy is to let long-term people in rather than a country-specific group.

 

I think it is time for Thailand to re-evaluate its Virus Response policy.

 

Thailand has been following a 'Zero-Tolerance' policy, but I think it is time to move to a 'Managed-Tolerance' policy. I make this suggestion based mainly on two factors; I think it is inevitable that the virus will return to Thailand and a calm, managed response is more effective than hysteria. Secondly, the economic damage being done to millions is more harmful than the virus itself and needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.

 

We recently saw new cases in Vietnam, and I think that we are going to see new cases in Thailand soon; like most people I take the government's claim of zero cases with a grain of salt, although it seems like they have done a very good job overall. However, I don't think it can last. A better policy is to prepare, both medically and in terms of public opinion/education, for the return of the virus. Is this a radical idea? No, not really. Members will recall the phrase "flatten the curve", but perhaps a reminder is needed that the idea is to manage the virus so that the health system isn't overwhelmed; a policy of Zero Tolerance is incompatible with an open society and/or open economy. It is time to re-enforce the precautions needed, but also to allow for an economic re-start which includes outsiders/foreigners. A final point; humanity's best minds and a boat-load of resources are being thrown at the problem. This global effort, propelled by the power of competition, is expected to produce a vaccine either this year or early next year while treatments are being developed and refined daily; we as a species are going to beat this scourge, and relatively soon.

 

The economic damage being done to Thailand is immense. Yes, I know that we don't hear about it too much, but there is a reason for that. The people talking in the (not quite free) Media are almost all in a 'Virus-Proof' economic situation; they aren't directly affected so they don't feel the urgency of fixing the problem. Firm numbers are difficult to come by, but it seems around 6-9 million Thais are very badly hurt by the economic fall-out of the virus, and those people need to be both helped and heard. The damage done to these people is egregious and growing worse; some government support is being withdrawn, the option of 'Go Back to the Farm' isn't really possible anymore (and not a great idea regardless), and they will soon need more food and rent support to survive. Further, many aren't well-educated and don't have transferable skills, so their options are limited. Finally, even before Covid-19, their economic situation was in decline; it is in free-fall now and they can't be ignored. Simply put, plans for their economic regeneration must to be formulated now and implemented soon.

 

When people are hungry, all bets are off.

 

How to proceed?

 

It is the beginning of August; continue/speed up the current repatriation policy 'as is', but ramp up the public education aspect of change. Announce that by October 1st (perhaps Nov. 1st?) that the airspace around Thailand will be open to commercial air travel, long-term tourists (Snow-Birds who 'winter' here), remaining residents and retirees will be allowed to return with a few restrictions (test before boarding or on arrival, reasonable insurance, self-isolation at home on arrival, etc. BUT no mandatory state quarantine), implement common sense visa issuance (sorry Floridians and Texans!) and most of all prepare the Thai people for the idea that although there will be cases of the virus, they will be managed, and the benefits of re-opening are a risk worth taking. Yes, the end of mandatory state quarantine is essential if this is going to work; I believe that the long-term visitors will respect the self-isolation policy and Thailand's million strong public health volunteers can monitor them, but they won't come if they are going to be locked up. Moreover, the selection of the residents/retirees and 'Snow-Birds' as an initial group isn't accidental; these people already know the Kingdom and understand life within it, are good 'testers' of a new system, have a lot of money to spend, and can be excellent examples of a working policy of re-opening. Finally, allowing these kinds of visitors would build confidence, test whether short-term tourists could actually visit (I think not yet, but...), and help protect the tourism infrastructure from further and/or irreparable damage.

 

There are those who will argue that it is better to keep the borders closed and wait this out, and I honestly have trouble arguing against that idea (I don't want to catch the <deleted> thing). However, those who make that point rarely take the next step; what do you do with the 6-9 million people damaged by the current policy? Will those that advocate for closed borders take in homeless people? If so, how many? One family? Two families? Three? Will those that advocate for closed borders give up a percentage of their salaries/pensions to help? If so, how much? 25%? 35%? 45%? Will those that advocate for closed borders pay school fees and related costs for all the children of unemployed/underemployed parents? How many kids? One? Five? Twenty? The question isn't merely an intellectual exercise, it has real-world implications and consequences. 

 

If you want those 6-9 million people to sacrifice for you, what are you going to sacrifice for them?

 

To sum up, I think that the question of whether or not to keep the border closed is incomplete. The question should be: if you keep the border closed, then what will you do for the 6-9 million people economically-eviscerated by the response to the virus? Opening the Kingdom to visitors in November for the high season would likely see a few cases of the virus, but the Thai medical system can handle that (it did before, right?) until a vaccine is widely available. It would begin the process of re-starting the tourism industry in Thailand (20% of GDP!!!), begin the process of building trust again, re-start the employment of huge numbers, give Thailand a 'leg up' on future tourism business in the region, and alleviate some of the damage done to the poorest in the Kingdom. The alternative is a policy of rot, idleness, atrophy and decline with an indefinite timeline. 

 

History is replete with examples of people hiding behind walls for protection, but it rarely ever works (especially against something the size of a virus); see the 'Maginot Line', the Great Wall of China, the Berlin Wall, and more. History shows that a combination of pro-active tactics coupled with reasonable, layered defenses provides a better outcome to almost any problem.

 

 

Nonsense. 

 

Living in Thailand with no (or a very small) covid, is paradise. 

 

Yes there will be people hurting with a lack of tourism, but the alternative being death raging through the country (which in turn will turn off tourism anyways) is not a viable alternative.

 

The correct solution is to protect the population, and hopefully in a few months we start to see treatments and a vaccine (although i'm not hopeful). 

 

 

[djayz]

What a great idea! Reward the people who brought the virus here by welcoming them back! Brilliant! The more, the merrier. 

[Xaos]

Follow the flag tourists ????