Will I Pay Tax in Thailand?

[USNret]

I am a retired American, living from pension, military retirement, Social Security, and savings.  I am here on a non-O extension for marriage.  I earn no money in Thailand, but I do transfer money in from time to time for rent & living expenses.  I use the "lump sum method" (400K in the bank when my annual extension is due) rather than monthly deposits to my Thai bank account.

So with all that background...  Will Thailand tax any of my income or money transfers into the country?  After all this time, I've given it little thought and the subject of Thai taxes has never come up.

If I do pay tax in Thailand, is this a deduction from my American taxes?  Thanks. 

[kralledr]

No pay ^^

[Boomer6969]

It depends on the following:

a) Is there an income tax agreement preventing double taxation between your country of origin and Thailand ?

b) Are you taxed on your income in your country of origin ?

c) Could you prove that you don't transfer money to Thailand in the year you have earned it?

d) Are the Thais going to apply their own laws?

 

That covers it I think.

[couchpotato]

Dont let others over complicate this for you.

You are a retiree (albeit on a marriage extension), and any money you bring is for living expenses. You dont need to report it, and the authorities dont check on it.

So just enjoy your retirement as thousands of others have in Thailand.

 

The only reason taxes are due for a foreigner in Thailand is if you actually work and draw a salary. This is of course taxable (as in most countries).

[paddyfield7]

I asked my lawyer about paying taxes in Thailand. She said that the Thai Tax Authorities wouldn't care about it, they would rather expect Farangs to bring a lot of money to here AND SPEND IT!

[Oldie]

23 minutes ago, paddyfield7 said:

I asked my lawyer about paying taxes in Thailand. She said that the Thai Tax Authorities wouldn't care about it, they would rather expect Farangs to bring a lot of money to here AND SPEND IT!

Strange. Such an unqualified information you can get at every beer bar. Normally I would expect a lawyer to tell you what the law is.

[topt]

5 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Strange. Such an unqualified information you can get at every beer bar. Normally I would expect a lawyer to tell you what the law is.

Nice to hear from a straight talking lawyer 

[Oldie]

14 hours ago, couchpotato said:

 

The only reason taxes are due for a foreigner in Thailand is if you actually work and draw a salary. This is of course taxable (as in most countries).

The revenue department does not know this. You should tell them. They always charge me taxes on my interest income for instance. 

[USNret]

6 minutes ago, Oldie said:

The revenue department does not know this. You should tell them. They always charge me taxes on my interest income for instance. 

You mean interest income earned outside of Thailand? How do they even know?  When you say "they charge you taxes" what exactly does that mean?  They send you a dunning letter, or what?

[USNret]

15 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Strange. Such an unqualified information you can get at every beer bar. Normally I would expect a lawyer to tell you what the law is.

Lawyers generally do 2 things: They tell you the law, and they give you advice.  Sounds like this is advice. 

[USNret]

41 minutes ago, paddyfield7 said:

I asked my lawyer about paying taxes in Thailand. She said that the Thai Tax Authorities wouldn't care about it, they would rather expect Farangs to bring a lot of money to here AND SPEND IT!

I love this reply.  I.e., "don't bite the hand that feeds you."

How long ago was this conversation with your lawyer? 

[Oldie]

1 minute ago, USNret said:

You mean interest income earned outside of Thailand? How do they even know?  When you say "they charge you taxes" what exactly does that mean?  They send you a dunning letter, or what?

I am talking about interest income in Thailand. According your statement I don't have to pay taxes for them. 

[Oldie]

2 minutes ago, USNret said:

Lawyers generally do 2 things: They tell you the law, and they give you advice.  Sounds like this is advice. 

Then this is a very bad advice. 

[USNret]

5 minutes ago, Oldie said:

I am talking about interest income in Thailand. According your statement I don't have to pay taxes for them. 

My original post specifically said: "I earn no money in Thailand."  Naturally, money earned inside the country is subject to tax.  But that was not my question. 

[Proboscis]

35 minutes ago, Oldie said:

Strange. Such an unqualified information you can get at every beer bar. Normally I would expect a lawyer to tell you what the law is.

Such as whether there is any liability under Thai law for worldwide income or assets, capital gains abroad etc, whether Thailand has international tax agreements with countries such as your home country. You need to talk to an international tax specialist and they tend to be accountants, not lawyers. Go to one of the international accountancy practices and they will tell you. Asking any ordinary Thai lawyer or layman (including even the more well-informed of us on this forum) is a waste of time.

[vibration]

15 hours ago, Boomer6969 said:

It depends on the following:

a) Is there an income tax agreement preventing double taxation between your country of origin and Thailand ?

b) Are you taxed on your income in your country of origin ?

c) Could you prove that you don't transfer money to Thailand in the year you have earned it?

d) Are the Thais going to apply their own laws?

 

That covers it I think.

What you have written is correct I pay tax on pensions in Norway and pay tax to Thailand only on money transferred in the same year that I received it.

 

Because of the tax agreement between Thailand I get all tax back paid in Norway and because of deductions in Thailand I only pay a small amount of tax here last year 11000 THB.

[Oldie]

15 minutes ago, USNret said:

My original post specifically said: "I earn no money in Thailand."  Naturally, money earned inside the country is subject to tax.  But that was not my question. 

Sorry. Not you but couchpotato made the statement. 

 

Perhaps this link provides some information for you 

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

 

And money transfers are only taxable if you transfer income you earned abroad in the same year when you earned it. For instance if you transfer a pension directly to your Thai bank account. Otherwise the income is not relevant. 

[abrahamzvi]

16 hours ago, PatrickC said:

You should not pay any tax if you have no in country earnings. I am on a work permit and they do not tax my foreign earnings - at least not yet.

 

You might want to get professional advice from an accountant though - unless a qualified Thai accountant replies to this thread.

The tax poison is quite clear on foreign earning ( pensions, dividends, interest etc). If you can prove that the amounts transferred to Thailand are earned in the year(s) prior to current tax year, such income is not subject to Thai income tax, provided however, that it is not derived from a Thai source, even if such source is abroad. Even if the amounts transferred to Thailand are earned in the current tax year, they are not taxed, provided the total does not exceed THB120,000.

[khunPer]

17 hours ago, USNret said:

So with all that background...  Will Thailand tax any of my income or money transfers into the country?  After all this time, I've given it little thought and the subject of Thai taxes has never come up.

If I do pay tax in Thailand, is this a deduction from my American taxes?  Thanks.

You can find the answer in the DTA (Double Taxation Agreement) between Thailand and USA, you can find he DTA here.

Quote

ARTICLE 20

Pensions and Social Security Payments

 

1. Subject to the provisions of paragraph 2 of Article 21 (Government Service), pensions and other similar remuneration paid to a resident of a Contracting State in consideration of past employment shall be taxable only in that State.

 

2. Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph 1, social security benefits and other similar public pensions paid by a Contracting State to a resident of the other Contracting State or a citizen of the United States shall be taxable only in the first- mentioned State.

 

3. Annuities derived and beneficially owned by a resident of a Contracting State shall be taxable only in that State. The term "annuities" as used in this paragraph means a stated sum paid periodically at stated times during a specified number of years, under an obligation to make the payments in return for adequate and full consideration (other than services rendered).

 

4. Alimony paid to a resident of a Contracting State shall be taxable only in that State. The term "alimony" as used in this paragraph means periodic payments made pursuant to a written separation agreement or a decree of divorce, separate maintenance, or compulsory support, which payments are taxable to the recipient, under the laws of the State of which he is a resident.

 

5. Periodic payments, not dealt with in paragraph 4, for the support of a child made pursuant to a written separation agreement or a decree of divorce, separate maintenance, or compulsory support, paid by a resident of a Contracting State to a resident of the other Contracting State, shall be taxable only in the first-mentioned State.

Any income earned in Thailand, including interest from bank account(s), is taxable in Thailand. However, tax on bank account interest is withheld, and you don't need to do any further. The same applies for any investments in stocks and mutual funds, any tax on dividends are withheld. Capital gains on SET listed and traded stocks are tax free...????

[natway09]

Generally, tax paid monies brought into Thailand have no tax liability if not being sent to a Company & are used for "living expenses."

However if you are in a lucky position of having a big roll in a bank here you will pay tax on the interest,

which is taken out at source by the banks (15% I think)

Before any requirement for an actual tax return check "the tax free threshold" from the tax office.

It may be in your interests as it is mine to do a tax return & yes, last year I got a physical refund

 

[Max69xl]

4 hours ago, paddyfield7 said:

I asked my lawyer about paying taxes in Thailand. She said that the Thai Tax Authorities wouldn't care about it, they would rather expect Farangs to bring a lot of money to here AND SPEND IT!

It has nothing to do with Thai authorities and if they care or not. If there's a double taxation agreement between Thailand and your home country you pay taxes on the pension where it was earned, not in Thailand. 

[Geir Rasch]

Many expat do not pay tax in Thailand, and many revenue office is not aware of what the law actually is.
When you read about the revenue law you will notice that if you live in Thailand for 180 days or more during a calendar year, you shall pay tax to Thailand. Most countries have tax-agreement with Thailand to avoid double tax.
For a pensioner the only money that are taxable in Thailand are pension transferred to Thailand the same year that they are earned. Other money are savings and already taxed in your home country. 

 

So why pay tax to Thailand when so many does not and revenue offices seam to not care?

1.

When you pay tax to Thailand you get documentation from revenue department that you send to your tax office of your origin that will deduct your tax in the country of your origin. For most expat the tax level in Thailand are lower than in our home country, so there is money to save.

2.

It might be that revenue department will be more aware of possible income from expat. It is possible that revenue department and immigration will cooperate and that immigration will check if you have paid tax before they extend your visa.

 

For the time being it is all up to you if you pay tax or not. My advice is that you should pay tax to Thailand.

[paddyfield7]

5 hours ago, USNret said:

I love this reply.  I.e., "don't bite the hand that feeds you."

How long ago was this conversation with your lawyer? 

This was about 6 years ago. I'm Swiss, and I know Thailand and Switzerland have a tax agreement to avoid double taxation, but it is (quietly) not enforced in Thailand.

[Tuvoc]

2 hours ago, Max69xl said:

It has nothing to do with Thai authorities and if they care or not. If there's a double taxation agreement between Thailand and your home country you pay taxes on the pension where it was earned, not in Thailand. 

 

I think there may be a difference between an occupational pension (defined benefit) which is paid to you every month linked to past employment - and an invested pension which is simply something you and possibly your employer have paid into and which is simply an investment pot in your name and you simply take out how much you want when you want. But pensions are a very complex area and professional tax advice is definitely needed.

[MyTHaiMyKe]

Yes! You will pay an immigration tax which will be whatever the particular immigration officer wants to collect! If you don't pay you will have to leave the country or go to the monkey house! It is their way or the highway!

[topt]

20 minutes ago, MyTHaiMyKe said:

Yes! You will pay an immigration tax which will be whatever the particular immigration officer wants to collect! If you don't pay you will have to leave the country or go to the monkey house! It is their way or the highway!

Some people it seems should not be let loose on a keyboard..........

No it was not funny .......

[daejung]

It depends upon intenational tax treaty between USA and ThaIland.

 

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/thailand-tax-treaty-documents

 

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-trty/thailand.pdf

[xtrnuno41]

As i understood when money comes in from in bankaccount (savings) out of Thailand then they dont tax it.

But if your pension is straight away coming in Thailand, it is taxable, like some other people already wrote.

[Jeffrey346]

10 hours ago, paddyfield7 said:

I asked my lawyer about paying taxes in Thailand. She said that the Thai Tax Authorities wouldn't care about it, they would rather expect Farangs to bring a lot of money to here AND SPEND IT!

Your Lawyer is a jerk. Thailand has a Tax Agreement with the US.  If you earned money in the US then it is not taxable here as long as it was declared in the US.

 

Think about getting another Lawyer. 

[Jeffrey346]

9 hours ago, Oldie said:

I am talking about interest income in Thailand. According your statement I don't have to pay taxes for them. 

If you earn money in Thailand it's taxable. The bank by law deducts 15% of earned income which you can get back by filing for it at the Revenue Dept as long as the earned income is less than B150,000.