Many farang must leave their families, friends and Thailand

[Pattaya Spotter]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

5 hours ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

Don't tell me...tell it to the immigration officer when you're hauled-up in front of them for having obtained permission to stay illegally.

We all saw what happened when they "investigated" the agent caught with everything down to the stamps.  Bosses and Bosses' Bosses - all on the take - shut that right down.  Would the Singapore Police, or similar, be called in to do this investigation?

So the Thais are on the take...does this give you license, as a foreigner, to break Thailand's immigration laws?

[Pattaya Spotter]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

3 hours ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

There'd be no need to use "agents" if people qualified for the visas for which they were applying.

I qualified every time.  Had the proven-income, living with my Thai wife, etc.  It made NO Difference.  I am not the only one to report such issue.  That is not how it works for everyone. 

There's an Immigration corruption hotline...Google it.

[Pattaya Spotter]

2 hours ago, DrTuner said:

The actual problem is the way Thais have set up the system. 

 

Permanent residence is what should be attainable for those that actually live here. Not temporary extensions of stay or visa runs, which have become the norm. From what I've understood, decades ago the system worked as it should: you'd enter with a visa, extend a few times and then get PR. Like in most countries. 

 

Thailand's immigration system with it's loopholes and desire to keep people as non-immigrants is a failure.

It's worked perfectly fine for me for 20 years...I guess I'm the exception.

[CANSIAM]

7 hours ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

It always amazes me the number of people who don't follow the law and resort to illegal means to remain in Thailand. Then they inevitably post about how unfair it all is when they are eventually caught out.

Get that 400k in the bank ! you are not following the rules or go home and get your snow shovel out......

[Pattaya Spotter]

24 minutes ago, BritTim said:

It is difficult to get a divorce from a Philippine lady, and recent law changes make it potentially very hazardous to try to abandon her.

Isn't divorce still illegal in the Philippines...the only way out is to obtain a church marriage annulment from the church on very specific grounds and this can take a year or more (especially if she fights it).

Edited September 3, 2020 by Pattaya Spotter

[yinki]

am in same situation , i need a fresh at least 15 day left visa to apply for non-o children dependant visa. i got all documents needed for visa and 400k in bank waiting since she born 10 month ago... but covid decide otherwise.

 

now i need to leave my family, go back to France where covid is very high and come back maybe  in 3 month if all goes well ( neither country close borders nor i got hit by virus).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CANSIAM]

4 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

It's worked perfectly fine for me for 20 years...I guess I'm the exception.

It appears the 10-20 year Elite visa is the only sure safe way of staying longterm ? Non O means nothing even when showing the 800k yearly as I do....

[johnray]

I know a bunch of guys that don't have degrees, and yet they have full time jobs here as teachers making big money.  I would love to know what their visa status is.  One pothead described university as ''some strong sh*t'' and the other one is ''doing his degree online''.  Do they kidnap people or something.  How do they get away with this.  One muppet I knew started showing a traditional Thai culture booklet around the classroom and saying the women have nice breasts.  The same guy would randomly tell everyone to close the workbooks, say it is too boring and waste the lesson watching music videos.  What visa is that?

Edited September 3, 2020 by johnray

[Pattaya Spotter]

3 minutes ago, CANSIAM said:

It appears the 10-20 year Elite visa is the only sure safe way of staying longterm ? Non O means nothing even when showing the 800k yearly as I do....

If you are referring to extensions of Non-Imm O visas for retirement or other purposes, they mean exactly what they say...the holder is granted an extension of 1 year to stay in The Kingdom; nothing more...nothing less. As I said, I've extended my annually for 20 years without any problems (and many of my friends have as well).

Edited September 3, 2020 by Pattaya Spotter

[david555]

11 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

If you are referring to extensions of Non-Imm O visas for retirement or other purposes, they mean exactly what they say...the holder is granted an extension of 1 year to stay in The Kingdom; nothing more...nothing less.

Got mine last week #8 good for another year for 1900 Thb , and in contradiction with Elite Visa  I can take out my 800 000 Thai baht whenever I stop with-it , Elite visa is a expensive gift to Thailand .

 

But yes …,I don't get a VIP car or more so by arrival (should it now be a VIP ambulance …????? ?) , anyway I am not a golfer so..... ????

Edited September 3, 2020 by david555

[bangkokbonecollector]

1 hour ago, treetops said:

I tend to agree, but I've got a Western viewpoint.  When I'm away from home I know I have to stick by the local rules.  We Westerners might like to think we're always right but there's nothing to say our way of thinking is more appropriate than anyone else's.

No totally not and I am not linking my opinion to my race, religion or nationality, nor am I in anyway thai bashing. I am simply saying alot of genuine foreigners with probably the most genuine reason for being here, Thai kid, are in a grey place right now. 

[bangkokbonecollector]

31 minutes ago, yinki said:

am in same situation , i need a fresh at least 15 day left visa to apply for non-o children dependant visa. i got all documents needed for visa and 400k in bank waiting since she born 10 month ago... but covid decide otherwise.

 

now i need to leave my family, go back to France where covid is very high and come back maybe  in 3 month if all goes well ( neither country close borders nor i got hit by virus).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Really sorry to hear that mate, I am in the same boat child wise but obvious mine is lot older. I really feel for you with a baby!  It's such a joke

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, trucking said:

I see I have completely misunderstood things. I always assumed that when I entered the country by land or air I was dealing with immigration officers who would know the rules and regulations.

 

Obviously, if they were all from the ministry of foreign affairs it perfectly explains why not once in 20 years was it ever pointed out to me and the multitude of others that I was doing something wrong or illegal. Immigration officers would clearly have done this. Over the course of those decades immigration and the MOFA would have noticed things were not dove tailing and brought things into agreement.

Sarcasm and twisting my words are not required.

The Embassies issuing the Visa are controlled by the MFA.

Once entering Thailand at the borders Thailand's Immigration officials consider entry and permit you to stay for the duration permitted by your entry type. VE 30 days, TV 60 days, Non O 90 days.

 

I have never stated you were doing something wrong or illegal.

 

[problemfarang]

10 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Bear in mind that while there is no law against border runs, ME visas were not designed with the intention that they would be used in that manner; they are designed for people who make multiple separate trips here, with genuine gaps in between, and the "border run" approach is basically a loophole. 

 

So no reason for Immigration to view inability to do border runs as a legitimate problem; from their standpoint people living here full time should get annual extensions of stay.  "I can't afford to meet the financial requirement"  will get zero sympathy as the government does not want retirees here who lack the minimum required funds.

 

I didnt read 6-7 pages of comments. I read the post owner comment and yours. And some others. 

the very first moment i read the post owner, I was like wait a minute, its nothing with the IO or government. NON-O multi has a purpose. which is as Sheryl said. It is for the people who are married with a thai national and coming to thailand and going back to their country 

 

About many years ago. i was very first person who posted that phnom penh cambodia border stopped doing 90 days thing (non-o multi) and many people said im wrong, something's wrong with my visa or IO is wrong. actually no. they are right. The very new head of the IO officer there ( and yes it was his 3rd day on the job) told me im abusing the visa. I hate it but yes he was right, I was! When i was mentioned this in my posts people said im wrong again, they said IO cannot say or do anything if i have the visa. Well, i say again.. NO. they can and actually they have all the right to do so.  I know im the one also using this multi non-o gateway but still i know its wrong and yes its abusing the visa. That day when the officer say he will let me to this only for this time but not again, i was like f you but also i was like.. well buddy you did your job. When i cross the border i told this to the arrivals side and even the IO there surprised and she said he is new here and dont know things and she gave me her business card and told me if i have a problem again call her. Well.. no need to make it longer because now we all know there is no way to do 90 days at that border and also some other borders too. 

 

So, i really dont agree with the PO. to be honest, yes you are abusing the visa non-o multi which is wrong and illegal (i think). BUT i also agree that marriage visa should change and be more easier. I mean why i have to have 40K income or 400K in bank? thai people dont have that but they can marry! lol

 

anyway this is my opinion, thanks

Edited September 3, 2020 by problemfarang

[problemfarang]

7 hours ago, trucking said:

 

No , not really. Extensions are not the correct way to go if you intend to live here full time. 

 

The correct visa to apply for is residency.

 

https://immigrationbangkok.com/thai-permanent-residence-visa/

 

People extending year in year out are just the same as visa runners. No better or worse. Using a loophole in the law for convenience. 

 

Personally , that doesn't bother me but the Thai Visa  holier than thou schadenfreude brigade just love to see others not doing as they do suffer . What possible pleasure they derive from this I cannot imagine. Very sad.

 

well they forgot to mention you have to pay 970.000 baht. 

also i think you are not right about this too. There are many types of visas and purpose. Non-o 1 year extension is one of them. Extensions are correct up to you living situation or life style. For example.. if you have no other place to go in the world your suggestion is, yes correct. But if you are a person who both living in 2 countries or else but have a thai wife/husband you have another option. Or you have a thai national child.. you have another option. etc. All these type of visas allows you to stay or live in thailand. its all up to your intentions and what you have. 

 

For your suggestion you need almost 1 million baht and a job here or wife or a company. So why i pay this amount instead of i can do my visa for 2000 baht every year? Also if i do your way, its better to be a thai citizen.. cheaper, easier and all the same things you need to do.. thai language, interview.. etc. 

 

So, its actually not the right way to do. There are RIGHT ways to do for your situation.

[Eibot]

6 hours ago, david555 said:

I asked once a I.O. about that , and answer was reasonable simple ….. in case of need a house or car is not quick sold  so not as liquid as money ….( gold could do anyway …. )

I understand but the OP was questioning the investment capabilities of NonOME visa members. 

[Eibot]

1 hour ago, johnray said:

I know a bunch of guys that don't have degrees, and yet they have full time jobs here as teachers making big money.  I would love to know what their visa status is.  One pothead described university as ''some strong sh*t'' and the other one is ''doing his degree online''.  Do they kidnap people or something.  How do they get away with this.  One muppet I knew started showing a traditional Thai culture booklet around the classroom and saying the women have nice breasts.  The same guy would randomly tell everyone to close the workbooks, say it is too boring and waste the lesson watching music videos.  What visa is that?

Some years ago (9 to be precise) I was working at a goverment school on payroll with a two year overstay. The even opened a KrungThai Bank account for me. TIT

[jak2002003]

2 hours ago, bangkokbonecollector said:

I was never really looking for that, I like to travel but surely a single father taking care of a thai child with a monthly income coming from abroad into a thai bank account should be e bloody nough to be giving some sort of permanent visa until the kid is 18 or 21. I just want to clarify a little more about myself, I've been here for frickin 18years, I've had a business here for a while and did the 1 year extensions, I get it, I understand what you are all saying. Pom chowjai naaaaaa 

Would you be happy if the country you came from was handing out easy permanent residency male immigrants with no money just because they got the women in your country pregnant? 

[Susco]

1 minute ago, jak2002003 said:

Would you be happy if the country you came from was handing out easy permanent residency male immigrants with no money just because they got the women in your country pregnant? 

 

I would for sure not be happy about that, unfortunately most countries in the west do hand out easy permanent residency to male immigrants with no money, and they don't have to make anyone pregnant for that either.

[david555]

3 minutes ago, Eibot said:

I understand but the OP was questioning the investment capabilities of NonOME visa members. 

A house of a car is at this moment proven to be NOT the best investment , as even to sell a car …..not having a valid visa would be a  problem as needed for the sale , many are not aware about that … ( I only found it here on TVF  , i was surprised , but Thailand has many tricky laws …)

 

Any argument of kind as " I contribute or spend so much….," is not on order , it  is nice for Thai economy , but in first order the Immigration demand making the staying status in order

[Eibot]

12 minutes ago, david555 said:

A house of a car is at this moment proven to be NOT the best investment , as even to sell a car …..not having a valid visa would be a  problem as needed for the sale , many are not aware about that … ( I only found it here on TVF  , i was surprised , but Thailand has many tricky laws …)

 

Any argument of kind as " I contribute or spend so much….," is not on order , it  is nice for Thai economy , but in first order the Immigration demand making the staying status in order

Sure, but we were not having the argument what the best investment would be. I was merely responding to someone saying people on NONOME don't have as much financial means because they don't have the 400K in the bank. 

[david555]

24 minutes ago, Eibot said:

Sure, but we were not having the argument what the best investment would be. I was merely responding to someone saying people on NONOME don't have as much financial means because they don't have the 400K in the bank. 

No we don't have argument about that ….. but it is in many cases the reason why some have now terrible problems because not having  the 400K bht in bank , which even after stamped  they can use completely ,so the 400 k are only short period blocked for use for the married ones 

 

While my 800K has to be 2+keeping 3 months on bank and again 2 months before the new application.... I had to make my choice also , knowing I could do other things with that money if I example would trust the agent system ….which I don't 

Edited September 3, 2020 by david555

[Why Me]

3 minutes ago, david555 said:

While my 800K has to be 2+keeping 3 months on bank and again 2 months before the new application.

And, don't forget, you can't go below 400k for the remaining time.

 

3 minutes ago, david555 said:

I had to make my choice also , knowing I could other things with that money if I example would trust the agent system ….which I don't 

You mean knowingly break the min funds rule and trust an agent to fix the matter on extension day? Stupid and dangerous. Just keep that amount in a separate account and forget about it. It's not a lot. And quite reasonable of Thai Imm. to ask for it to make sure you have enough to not go bust.

 

Actually the Thai rules to be able to extend on the basis of retirement and marriage are quite generous. There are few non-shirthole countries so lenient. The US (let's leave for the moment the debate if the US has become shirthole) where I come from doesn't even have a retirement visa category. You can be a Thai multimillionaire visiting but you'll still have to leave the day your TV expires. No way you can stay on.

[david555]

1 minute ago, Why Me said:

And, don't forget, you can't go below 400k for the remaining time.

 

You mean knowingly break the min funds rule and trust an agent to fix the matter on extension day? Stupid and dangerous. Just keep that amount in a separate account and forget about it. It's not a lot. And quite reasonable of Thai Imm. to ask for it to make sure you have enough to not go bust.

 

Actually the Thai rules to be able to extend on the basis of retirement and marriage are quite generous. There are few non-shirthole countries so lenient. The US (let's leave for the moment the debate if the US has become shirthole) where I come from doesn't even have a retirement visa category. You can be a Thai multimillionaire visiting but you'll still have to leave the day your TV expires. No way you can stay on.

Yes I am aware of the 400 k , but I thought it would be  understand as I putted it , about the agents …., a real estate used that example to try to pull me over for a sale  to use that 800K also in eventual payment , but " I do not walk on ice from 1 night freezing " , as it is  a sales tctic , and who go guarantee it keep working future way ….., 

 

I just follow the rules as they are , and I am not in the hands from questionable peoples ….., but each at his own  choice I would say , but don't blame the rules if not follow them and gambled wrong 

[Why Me]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

I just follow the rules as they are , and I am not in the hands from questionable peoples ….., but each at his own  choice I would say , but don't blame the rules if not follow them and gambled wrong 

Exactly. Sure, an agent might say that for 20k they can fix "anything". Are they going to give that in writing? No. And when they try to extend they might have a bad day or run into a new IO or something unexpected. And then you'll not see them or your money again.

 

Follow the rules if you can. If not good luck with the agent.

 

Of course, this doesn't apply to those who qualify but still use an agent for convenience. Fine, it's their money to do as they please.

[CorpusChristie]

4 minutes ago, Why Me said:

Exactly. Sure, an agent might say that for 20k they can fix "anything". Are they going to give that in writing? No..

Yes, they give you the contract in writing which is signed by the both of you on an official document which logs their tax payment  details (Government tax) and exactly what they will provide 

[david555]

9 minutes ago, Why Me said:

Exactly. Sure, an agent might say that for 20k they can fix "anything". Are they going to give that in writing? No. And when they try to extend they might have a bad day or run into a new IO or something unexpected. And then you'll not see them or your money again.

 

Follow the rules if you can. If not good luck with the agent.

 

Of course, this doesn't apply to those who qualify but still use an agent for convenience. Fine, it's their money to do as they please.

And last , even when it works , and the day that "the sh.it hits the fann "happens , the foreigner is the one who get fried , the officers in worst case transferred to ….inactive post or in a  faraway forgotten job .

 

As we are the final responsible ones for our stamps in passports , and " must appear in person" rule would  not be  followed in a agent go wrong case 

Edited September 3, 2020 by david555

[david555]

15 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Yes, they give you the contract in writing which is signed by the both of you on an official document which logs their tax payment  details (Government tax) and exactly what they will provide 

you lucky guy  can read Thai ? and that contract would be ok as long nothing go wrong  , I agree 

But when not ...it only proves your involvement , that you very well knew what they where doing ,or did you not knew you did not have the 800/400 k on bank  ??, ???? or did you not knew you had to be in person for the application , A very clever agent would take you there for a picture ...LOL 555 

 

But I agree that it is a last resort solution to use agent …..but many see it as the first rule & normal ….and that is a damn wrong gamble 

Edited September 3, 2020 by david555

[CorpusChristie]

12 minutes ago, david555 said:

you lucky guy  can read Thai ? and that contract would be ok as long nothing go wrong  , I agree 

But when not ...it only proves your involvement , that you very well knew what they where doing ,or did you not knew you did not have the 800/400 k on bank  ??, ???? or did you not knew you had to be in person for the application , A very clever agent would take you there for a picture ...LOL 555 

 

But I agree that it is a last resort solution to use agent …..but many see it as the first rule & normal ….and that is a damn wrong gamble 

The contract is written in English and theres a 100 % refund guarantee if the service isnt provided and my photo was sorted out and for some of us, its the ONLY way to do it 

[david555]

6 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

The contract is written in English and theres a 100 % refund guarantee if the service isnt provided and my photo was sorted out and for some of us, its the ONLY way to do it 

"and for some of us, its the ONLY way to do it"

 

Agreed that is the true bottom line , …..but that are not immigration rules  fault