Thailand's sex workers petition to decriminalise prostitution

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Hey, it is your fate. You chose it. Nobody twisted your arm, and you did it voluntarily. From my point of view, I do not understand why someone would marry someone their same age or older, unless there were no other options.

 

But, that is just me! I find most older women here to be overly opinionated, closed minded, fairly inflexible, very conservative, and less fun! And less attractive!

There have always been social taboos w.r.to age difference, although the rich get away with it far more easily. Onassis and Murdoch, for example. Mae West and Jackie Collins.

IMO one of the best ideas came from the science fiction writer, Robert Heinlein. I forget the specific ages, but the concept was an older man or woman would train a younger woman or man in sex. They would have partners three times in their life, the middle phase was for child-bearing when both were peaking. Probably enraged the religious establishment, although it could be argued by today's standards the Prophet Mohammed was a pedophile.

I certainly would have welcomed getting skilled instruction in how to give and receive pleasure in sex with an older woman, instead of learning as I went.

One of Heinlein's quotes: "Women and cats will do as they please. Men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."

[Donga]

9 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Said from the side of a male supporter for female prostitution. A victimless crime? How do you figure that?

Do you think all the girls you see in the bars in Pattaya, Bangkok and many other places in Thailand that offer the possibility to go with them (sex included) had that on their list of wishes in life? Are you sure that it´s a victimless crime just because they can´t report it or that they do not have any physical scars or marks? Hoe do you define a crime? Is that a person breaking the law or a person that causes harm to a victim according to your definitions?

In many cases the girls that offer this kind of services are young and lured by other friends into this business, with the promise of riches and a great life. Many use drugs to cope with their situation in life. many are also mentally unstable and easily falls into deep depression, but still with a smile on their face to the next customer.

Why do you think so many bargirls that offer prostitution comes form poor areas in Isaan and have poor education? They are of course victims because they are basically forced into this line of work out of the feeling of need to support their families. I am not saying that there are not girls working with prostitution that actually likes it and see it as the good part outweighs the bad. However, most a not comfortable with what they are doing and therefore they are victims without a real choice in life.

Mmmmm a bit of judgemental stuff to unpack..

1. Most pros I came across weren't forced into it and many enjoyed the lifestyle compared to their alternatives, which is a whole different discussion that goes back eons and across the world. Don't think anyone is entitled to judge a woman for choosing prostitution over say selling something in a mall. I'm not denying there are many cases where woman feel they have no choice, and I also detest under age or trafficking, which don't see as a big issue in Thailand. Just that in my experience, most prostitutes do have choice and don't think I ever encountered any trafficking.
2. In Thailand there are many shades of grey - bar girls do have individual choice, massage shops ditto, dating sites  same again. I've met some wonderful ladies on Thai Friendly who enjoyed weekends away, sometimes weeks traveling with different guys. Call it high end prostitution and others call it marriage... just being facetious.
3. Far, far worse, and I came across it a lot in my corporate career is the harassment and abuse of female employees, sales reps, nurses etc. #Me Too exposed a lot, and went a little too far in some ways. But it had to happen. So many horrid guys out there. Pity these bullies didn't go to the local knock shop, or found a high class consort or perhaps sugardaddy.com. But no, it wouldn't suit their predatory nature. So sad for their victims.
4. Then rapes, child marriages, outrageous laws against women in some countries for adultery.

To me prostitution is a societal need. The wealthy and higher classes, kings even, have indulged for centuries. It's mostly (or should be) consensual and doesn't have to endanger anyone in the service provided. Many millions of women rely on the trade for their livelihood, just like any other job.

By the way, Thailand is middle ranking in number of prostitutes per capita (well below many countries like Russia and Latvia and half that of Germany, Switzerland), which surprises many people. But there are those shades of grey and lovely smiles... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_statistics_by_country

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, andycule5000 said:

Talking of which... anyone knows what underage means? Is the age of consent 15 for Thai and 18 for farang?

15 for everyone in a loving relationship with parental approval.

20 for everyone if you're paying for sex.

[Baggy]

21 hours ago, RotBenz8888 said:

Of course. If it was legalized, it would be more difficult to milk money(and free service...) from the sex workers. 

I remember reading that there is no prostitution in Thailand especially Bangkok.

something changed recently ?

 

 

[micmichd]

42 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

There have always been social taboos w.r.to age difference, although the rich get away with it far more easily. Onassis and Murdoch, for example. Mae West and Jackie Collins.

IMO one of the best ideas came from the science fiction writer, Robert Heinlein. I forget the specific ages, but the concept was an older man or woman would train a younger woman or man in sex. They would have partners three times in their life, the middle phase was for child-bearing when both were peaking. Probably enraged the religious establishment, although it could be argued by today's standards the Prophet Mohammed was a pedophile.

I certainly would have welcomed getting skilled instruction in how to give and receive pleasure in sex with an older woman, instead of learning as I went.

One of Heinlein's quotes: "Women and cats will do as they please. Men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."

There's a good Indian book about it all. A book that's rarely read in full length, but known by name all over the world: Kamasutra. 

[1FinickyOne]

9 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Hoe do you define a crime?

You and Freud would have a great time together... 

[1FinickyOne]

51 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I certainly would have welcomed getting skilled instruction in how to give and receive pleasure in sex with an older woman, instead of learning as I went.

When I was 24 I had an attractive 44 yr old married lady come spend the night when she was in the mood. She was not having physical relations w/her husband and then after being w/me, started sleeping w/her husband again... I was never sure if that was a compliment or not??

 

Had fun but not sure I learned much... 

 

ps - good job on the Heinlen references... that was so long ago for me... maybe I should revisit... 

[Bender Rodriguez]

but but officially there is none...

[ronaldo0]

So they arrested a fifth of them ? Surely not unless the total number doing it for a living was far more . ????

[Airbagwill]

21 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Hey, totally irrelevant! Nobody enforce those rules and laws anyway. Why would they think that a new law would be different? 

Lax law enforcement in Thailand belies what an illiberal country it is.

The fact that the profession is outside the law leaves it open to exploitation and corruption...not lease of all by those in positions of power.

[micmichd]

20 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

Lax law enforcement in Thailand belies what an illiberal country it is.

The fact that the profession is outside the law leaves it open to exploitation and corruption...not lease of all by those in positions of power.

Just one counter-question : How many Europeans do actually follow the CoviD-19 rules? 

[Airbagwill]

10 minutes ago, micmichd said:

Just one counter-question : How many Europeans do actually follow the CoviD-19 rules? 

That isn't a counter question at all it is a totally spurious argument, presumably because you don't understand the issues involved.

You don't even specify which country you are talking about.....very half-baked thinking on your part.

[Black Angus]

Simple!! Use the German system. Make it legal , have dedicated areas and the girls are medical checked every month. They pay their taxes everyone Happy. except the pimps and brown envelope Brigade. 

[Airbagwill]

3 minutes ago, Black Angus said:

Simple!! Use the German system. Make it legal , have dedicated areas and the girls are medical checked every month. They pay their taxes everyone Happy. except the pimps and brown envelope Brigade. 

this would be a starting point but it isn't that simple - the industry in Thailand is old and established so the government needs to come up with a comprehensive plan to deal with it.

The simple part is to stop using the law to harass and exploit the women involved.

Large numbers of expats have married protitutes but they really don't seem to understand the issues involved. I think a lot of them think they are some kind of trophy in that they think they have "saved" a woman by being a better customer.

[Lacessit]

8 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

Large numbers of expats have married protitutes but they really don't seem to understand the issues involved. I think a lot of them think they are some kind of trophy in that they think they have "saved" a woman by being a better customer.

Maybe it has not occurred to you some of the prostitutes are really great lays, and that's the reason many expats take them on a more permanent basis. Granted, they may be a trophy if they are really beautiful, but I doubt "saving " them comes into it.

IMO there's no real difference between prostitutes and non-prostitutes in a long-term relationship. Both categories are seeking financial support, and that's not just in Thailand.

 

[chuck holmes]

Make it Legal like Singapore and Las Vegas then Tax it .

[BritManToo]

Just now, Lacessit said:

Maybe it has not occurred to you some of the prostitutes are really great lays, and that's the reason many expats take them on a more permanent basis. Granted, they may be a trophy if they are really beautiful, but I doubt "saving " them comes into it.

Yep, no issues for me, I just wanted to bang her every night ...... easier if she's at home with me.

[micmichd]

27 minutes ago, Black Angus said:

Simple!! Use the German system. Make it legal , have dedicated areas and the girls are medical checked every month. They pay their taxes everyone Happy. except the pimps and brown envelope Brigade. 

Unless you're Thai. Then you get severely bashed, even if you're a Thai ex-stewardess at Deutsche Lufthansa with pensions from Germany. 

German lawmakers may be liberal, but for sure poorer German women ("das Volk") are not. 

[micmichd]

50 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

That isn't a counter question at all it is a totally spurious argument, presumably because you don't understand the issues involved.

You don't even specify which country you are talking about.....very half-baked thinking on your part.

Sorry, I'm from Germany. 

[racket]

Why would they want that? 

 

This would only increase the market supply if it becomes legal, which would eventually lead to lower prices on customers behalf. Bring it on, lol.

[3NUMBAS]

tell me where the punters and mongers are ?

[RocketDog]

21 hours ago, Enoon said:

 

It conforms to usual editorial practice:

 

Avoid depicting Thais as much as possible when illustrating societal "problems/controversies/issues" in Thailand, involving Thai people.

 

Use images of foreigners.

 

You'll see the same thing with alcoholism, drug addiction, child abuse, violence against women.....etc.

 

When illustrating "difficult" issues concerning foreigners..........open season.

 

 

 

It's actually also common practice in lingerie and swimsuit ads and anything remotely racy. Generally white female models are shown. And I'm talking clothing stores in big malls, etc. 

[Lacessit]

7 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

tell me where the punters and mongers are ?

Anywhere in Thailand, Thais are 95% of the clientele.

[Artisi]

23 hours ago, Justgrazing said:

 

The finest hypocrisy available .. 

 

Or the money or lack of money can buy.... 

[Eddy Ozark]

What these people are asking for is only fair. But the hypocrisy of the ruling elite prevents all progress as usual. Care for the poor? Not, not ever. 

[teacherclaire]

I'm just wondering how many of them are shoplifters?

 

 

[Artisi]

22 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

Title is "Thailand's sex workers petition to decriminalise prostitution"

and picture is a photo of a East European dancer (aka "Russian dancer")

near the "Russian bar" XO Club, on Pattaya Walking Street.

 

Russian dancers clearly have nothing to do with the article...

Don't let any small facts get in the way of nonsense stories. 

[teacherclaire]

1 minute ago, Artisi said:

Or the money or lack of money can buy.... 

The lack of money will buy you a nice place in a detention cell with plenty other foreigners who thought that there'd be another Amnesty, without being International. 

[teacherclaire]

38 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

It's actually also common practice in lingerie and swimsuit ads and anything remotely racy. Generally white female models are shown. And I'm talking clothing stores in big malls, etc. 

Not a problem when you wear them. It's okay, really. 

[Acharn]

Never gonna happen. I don't want to make false accusations against the police, but I remember when the current law was passed in December, 1996 (just months before the Dom Yum Gung Financial Meltdown). There were some good things in it, but they still allowed police to arrest women for prostitution. When asked, the spokesperson for some do-gooder NGO came out with, "We have to be able to arrest them in order to be able to help them." It's an essential part of the economy, yet it's illegal. Still, if you notice, they don't apply the law so strictly as to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. In the United States that's called prosecutorial discretion, and it is used in exactly the same way.