COVID-19 vaccine roll-out expected in less than 3 months in UK - The Times

[ourmanflint]

1 hour ago, canuckamuck said:

It take years to ensure a vaccine is safe and even approved vaccines injure people every year. So therefore this vaccine will be risky. But on top of that, the vaccine being developed is an mRNA vaccine which will essential modify your DNA. That has not been done before. The trial evidence is insufficient, and therefore it is risky. Especially if have not yet had children.

The only people that should consider a vaccine are those at high risk.

 

Please please stop. 

"an mRNA vaccine which will essential modify your DNA"

 

Never heard such misinformed claptrap. mRNA vaccine absolutely will not rewrite your DNA, this is not a Marvel movie.

What they do is behave like viruses and get your cells to behave a certain way in preparation of an infection of covid

[RichardColeman]

5 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

No, it is common sense. If a vaccine is more risky than the disease, why take it? If everybody took it there would be more people sick than if no one took it.

And just what exactly are you - and any other vaccine fearers - going to do if it is insisted on as a visa point for Thailand ? If you must show vaccine taken at immigration when incoming and for visa extension renewals after ? 

[canuckamuck]

3 minutes ago, RichardColeman said:

And just what exactly are you - and any other vaccine fearers - going to do if it is insisted on as a visa point for Thailand ? If you must show vaccine taken at immigration when incoming and for visa extension renewals after ? 

My kids have all the regular vaccinations. My concern is with the rush job. Vaccine injuries are no laughing matter.

[connda]

Every company and government that badmouthed the Russian Sputnik vaccine are now doing the exact same thing they accused Russia of doing - fast-tracking the testing the vaccine.  However.  Russia is using proven technology.  The rest are using unproven mRNA technology which basically makes everyone who takes the new generation of vaccines willing guinea-pigs.  As far as I'm concerned that's too much risk. I would not willingly take an mRNA-based vaccine until I see long-term scientific reports of their safety.  Like no less then five years preferably more.
If I had to chose between the virus-based Sputnik vaccine and a fast-tracked, unproven mRNA-based vaccine - I'd opt for the virus-based technology every time.  And I'm not an "anti-vaxxer" so I do hope we have a choice. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by connda

[sungod]

39 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

Post 18 addresses some situational realities. 

Should we abandon vaccine trials now, because of Covid? Your real question should be who says its safe? And how much do they get paid if we believe them.

Post 18, written by an amateur virologist!

[EricTh]

I thought the Russian vaccine is already out?

[connda]

12 minutes ago, RichardColeman said:

And just what exactly are you - and any other vaccine fearers - going to do if it is insisted on as a visa point for Thailand ? If you must show vaccine taken at immigration when incoming and for visa extension renewals after ? 

Find a special doctor who will provide you with a vaccine certificate during your more expensive than normal visit to his office? 

[connda]

30 minutes ago, ourmanflint said:

Please please stop. 

"an mRNA vaccine which will essential modify your DNA"

 

Never heard such misinformed claptrap. mRNA vaccine absolutely will not rewrite your DNA, this is not a Marvel movie.

What they do is behave like viruses and get your cells to behave a certain way in preparation of an infection of covid

Again - I'm not an "anti-vaxxer."  I routinely take certain vaccinations. So don't go there.
However - mRNA vaccines are bleeding edge technology.  So, please don't start denigrating people for stating that they would not be comfortable submitting to an mRNA vaccination until long-term studies of their safety have been published.  And why shouldn't we?  Governments allow the vaccine manufacturers to escape all liability.  So they have nothing to lose by fast-tracking a vaccine that hurts people. I don't trust the profit motives of capitalistic corporations even a little bit. And I've no plans on being one of the guinea-pigs by being forced to take a vaccination under duress. 

[ourmanflint]

7 minutes ago, connda said:

Again - I'm not an "anti-vaxxer."  I routinely take certain vaccinations. So don't go there.
However - mRNA vaccines are bleeding edge technology.  So, please don't start denigrating people for stating that they would not be comfortable submitting to an mRNA vaccination until long-term studies of their safety have been published.  And why shouldn't we?  Governments allow the vaccine manufacturers to escape all liability.  So they have nothing to lose by fast-tracking a vaccine that hurts people. I don't trust the profit motives of capitalistic corporations even a little bit. And I've no plans on being one of the guinea-pigs by being forced to take a vaccination under duress. 

What the Moderna vaccine does is get your cells to produce a single protein to which your body will then hopefully produce anti-bodies or T-cells. I am not saying it is safe or not safe, just clearing up some of the wilder claims, like it rewrites your DNA

[connda]

9 minutes ago, connda said:

Again - I'm not an "anti-vaxxer."  I routinely take certain vaccinations. So don't go there.
However - mRNA vaccines are bleeding edge technology.  So, please don't start denigrating people for stating that they would not be comfortable submitting to an mRNA vaccination until long-term studies of their safety have been published.  And why shouldn't we?  Governments allow the vaccine manufacturers to escape all liability.  So they have nothing to lose by fast-tracking a vaccine that hurts people. I don't trust the profit motives of capitalistic corporations even a little bit. And I've no plans on being one of the guinea-pigs by being forced to take a vaccination under duress. 

Here is the exact corporate mindset I'm talking about (see quote below)

Right here they state that this technology is untested, but don't let a good crisis go to waste.  The gist here is to force the public to become guinea-pigs for the vaccines that have "not yet been pressure tested."  Get the governments to mandate vaccinations and make global masses into test subjects. If the plebes get sick - well, too bad.  It's the price of scientific advancement.  They can't sue the manufacturer.  Instead they can take years with the help of expensive lawyers and attempt to cover there medical expenses, and pain and suffering from a small pool of funds set aside by their government to cover 'incidents.'  Yeah.  No thanks. But if you want it?  Feel free.

"They [mRNA vaccines] have been described as the vaccines of the future,” says Dan Barouch, director of the Center for Virology and Vaccine Research at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center. “However, they have not yet been pressure tested,” he adds. There are no approved mRNA or DNA vaccines, and neither has ever been tested in a large-scale clinical trial for an infectious disease. “The COVID crisis is a great opportunity for those technologies to be pushed." 

-- Will the coronavirus help mRNA and DNA vaccines prove their worth?, Chemical and Engineering New, by Ryan Cross April 3, 2020

"To be pushed." Like in your governments force you to take it which essentially forces you be a lab rat.  How wonderful.

[connda]

39 minutes ago, EricTh said:

I thought the Russian vaccine is already out?

It's out in limited supply domestically as well as to some global partners as it is still in a testing phase.  But that's not the Western media's narrative.  The vaccine should be available to the general public in January 2021.

Edited October 4, 2020 by connda

[ourmanflint]

11 minutes ago, connda said:

" There are no approved mRNA or DNA vaccines, and neither has ever been tested in a large-scale clinical trial for an infectious disease. “The COVID crisis is a great opportunity for those technologies to be pushed." 

"To be pushed." Like in your governments force you to take it which essentially forces you be a lab rat.  How wonderful.

 

Slight of hand there, mRNA vaccines have been used extensively against cancer for which they were developed. But cancer is not an infectious disease so as I said slight of hand/words.

[3NUMBAS]

https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/03/every-adult-in-uk-could-be-vaccinated-for-coronavirus-by-easter-13365637/

 

Every adult in UK ‘could be vaccinated for coronavirus by Easter’

 

Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/03/every-adult-in-uk-could-be-vaccinated-for-coronavirus-by-easter-13365637/?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/

Every adult in UK ‘could be vaccinated for coronavirus by Easter’

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by 3NUMBAS

[onthedarkside]

A troll post with yet another fake Trump image has been removed. Further such posts will earn posters' suspensions.

 

[tomacht8]

7 hours ago, 4reaL said:

 

Do you always only consider yourself?

 

An old porker like Trump has a 67% chance of living or a 33% chance of dying - are those better figures for a potential vaccine?

 

Where did you get this numbers from?

That Trump has a 33% chance of dying.

Source?

[ourmanflint]

12 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/03/every-adult-in-uk-could-be-vaccinated-for-coronavirus-by-easter-13365637/

 

Every adult in UK ‘could be vaccinated for coronavirus by Easter’

 

Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/03/every-adult-in-uk-could-be-vaccinated-for-coronavirus-by-easter-13365637/?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/

Every adult in UK ‘could be vaccinated for coronavirus by Easter’

 

Just to say, this is not the Moderna mRNA vaccine, this is the Oxford Group ChAdOx1 anti-virus. This is good news, won't get to Thailand for a long while though

[Donga]

1 hour ago, canuckamuck said:

My kids have all the regular vaccinations. My concern is with the rush job. Vaccine injuries are no laughing matter.

Fair enough, except can understand how the leading pharma and regulatory agencies would be able to expedite a vaccine in this case to be safe.

The regulatory pathway of say, ten years was always fraught with paper shuffling overkill and hopefully going forward, we'll get a lot more therapeutics faster than before.

It should not take years and years, in a digital age, given the concise steps involved in trials and thorough data review. The progress with the Oxford vaccine is very heartening.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Donga

[simple1]

8 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

I have about a .005 chance of dying from Covid-19. The risk of the health issues from a rapidly developed vaccine of a type never before used, is surely in the 0.1 percentile, if not 1% or higher. Since there is no time for trials. Seems to be me the foolish move would be to take the vaccine.

Trials have already resumed. Vaccine will not be available for the UK general public until trials have been successfully completed. US and PRC are not members of the global agreement for fair and equitable distribution for Covid-19 vaccine.

 

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/us-and-china-absent-from-who-s-global-coronavirus-vaccine-distribution-plan

Edited October 4, 2020 by simple1

[tomauasia]

Where's the THAI vaccine and new super fast test kit reported ????????????

[from the home of CC]

imo way too early to be crowing about this, they can't even get their daily infection numbers correct..

[Meat Pie 47]

2 hours ago, EricTh said:

I thought the Russian vaccine is already out?

No that was the Thai one

[Meat Pie 47]

1 hour ago, tomacht8 said:

Where did you get this numbers from?

That Trump has a 33% chance of dying.

Source?

I guess the poster is realistic, Trump weighs 111 kg and is obese

[Chomper Higgot]

4 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

My kids have all the regular vaccinations. My concern is with the rush job. Vaccine injuries are no laughing matter.

On this I would agree.

 

However, the procedures for testing and approving vaccines are well established and greatly reduce the risk of ‘vaccine injury’.

 

Vaccines, like all medicines are a ‘risk v benefit’ balance. 

 

I would gladly get on board questioning the safety of vaccines if politics and politicians get involved in the approval process.

 

Unless that happens leave the vaccine trial experts, statisticians and regulators to do their work.

 

 

[baansgr]

11 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

I have about a .005 chance of dying from Covid-19. The risk of the health issues from a rapidly developed vaccine of a type never before used, is surely in the 0.1 percentile, if not 1% or higher. Since there is no time for trials. Seems to be me the foolish move would be to take the vaccine.

Have you researched the long term effects Covid has even on the young. I personally know 2 very fit mid 50s non smokers that are still suffering respiratory problems after catching the virus while skiing in February

[Chomper Higgot]

3 hours ago, Donga said:

Fair enough, except can understand how the leading pharma and regulatory agencies would be able to expedite a vaccine in this case to be safe.

The regulatory pathway of say, ten years was always fraught with paper shuffling overkill and hopefully going forward, we'll get a lot more therapeutics faster than before.

It should not take years and years, in a digital age, given the concise steps involved in trials and thorough data review. The progress with the Oxford vaccine is very heartening.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

I don’t believe the testing process for vaccines has ever been ‘ten years’, other pharmaceutical drugs do however face long testing and approval, for very good reason.

 

The Pharmaceutical industry is of course keen to reduce costs, and testing/approval is a big cost.

 

But this pandemic, urgent as the need for a vaccine, should not form the basis for stripping out regulation of pharmaceutical testing and approval. 

 

When medicines injure, they often do so with horrific consequences.

 

[Refresh]

Before you read the following - the assumption here is that there is rigourous testing in a vaccine, not like the Russian and Chinese ones...

 

So how does a vaccine work? for sure the efficacy is less than 100%...take measles, the efficacy (amount who have defacto immunity) is around 60%...if we need society to have 'herd immunity' the target seems to be 60-80% (same for measles, right?).  not giving the vaccine to children (these fall into 2 categories - 1: the small ones, defined by age, and 2: the selfish ones defined by intellect and observed through I am low risk of dying so I dont care if I spread it to others just open the bars and massage parlours type).  If they are not vaccinated there will be no herd immunity...100% x 60% efficacy (effectiveness) x 60% administration (proportion vaccinated) = 36%...that means no travel, no bars (open one week, deaths then closed, then open) and same for the rest of the economy.

 

The way to include 'children type 2' maybe to have vaccine passports - not vaccinated, ok cant fly, cant take taxis, cant go into restaurants - can ride motorbikes with no helmet, can eat raw pork, can follow the natural selection inevitability that will get ever near them as they age...

 

Before your cry - its a breach of civil liberties - try flying from a Yellow Fever country to one that does not have it - no vaccination certificate, no entry...and many other such normal practices the woke lot want to blame for all their ills 555

[sucit]

On 10/4/2020 at 2:20 PM, connda said:

Again - I'm not an "anti-vaxxer."  I routinely take certain vaccinations. So don't go there.
However - mRNA vaccines are bleeding edge technology.  So, please don't start denigrating people for stating that they would not be comfortable submitting to an mRNA vaccination until long-term studies of their safety have been published.  And why shouldn't we?  Governments allow the vaccine manufacturers to escape all liability.  So they have nothing to lose by fast-tracking a vaccine that hurts people. I don't trust the profit motives of capitalistic corporations even a little bit. And I've no plans on being one of the guinea-pigs by being forced to take a vaccination under duress. 

Thank you very much.

 

And, that is exactly right. Or, the way I would put it, these corporations bought the right to escape any liability for these vaccines.

 

Fact of the matter is a fat, very high profile 74 year old just got this disease. It looks like he was up and running again in a few days. I would think very seriously about taking this vaccine even if i was high risk. 

[englishoak]

Quote

A mass roll-out of a COVID-19 vaccine in Britain could be finished in as little as three months, the Times reported,

Absolutely impossible even if it began last week... Be amazed if its even begun by Jan. Just the usual guff by MSM 

[stevenl]

3 hours ago, englishoak said:

Absolutely impossible even if it began last week... Be amazed if its even begun by Jan. Just the usual guff by MSM 

Please read. Nowhere did they claim 'starting now', the government scientists, so not media, are saying '3 months from start'.

[englishoak]

9 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Please read. Nowhere did they claim 'starting now', the government scientists, so not media, are saying '3 months from start'.

 

I did read, it says "citing scientists" but actually gives no citation detail, which usually means made up then goes onto claim every adult could have it in 6 mths which is probably the citation reference if any, but no mention of 3 at all, thats all headline bs ... regardless its utter drivel seeing as only 50% are even willing to take it.. its just the times making up headlines just like the rest of fleet street does...