1 hour ago, katana said:

13 verses from the koran exhorting muslims not to take the kafir as a friend:
https://www.theunitedwest.org/2017/10/14/the-13-verses-that-reveal-that-a-muslim-is-not-the-friend-of-a-kafir/

In the Koran, as in the bible, you will find different pieces of text which contradict each other. Both are a collection of texts from different sources.

1 hour ago, katana said:

13 verses from the koran exhorting muslims not to take the kafir as a friend:
https://www.theunitedwest.org/2017/10/14/the-13-verses-that-reveal-that-a-muslim-is-not-the-friend-of-a-kafir/

The answer remains no. 

I'm very sorry about the whole situation and I'd be more than happy if things were different. 

 

  A  teacher, who I'd think loved these students and did a great job, was killed, because of a freaking cartoon character?

 

  God, f_c__ng -shi_e, that's all a bit too much for me. 

Disgusting. Anyone who supports this thinking needs to be locked up...no excuse for any religion or cult to be tolerated that supports or does not condem these things. 

We have to be responsible for our actions.  Didn't the teacher realize the possibilities of reactions to doing this?  And of course we all know how infamous the offended group is for their extreme reactions to such things.

Not in defense of the killer by any means, but on the other hand if a non-Christian teacher showed his class satirical cartoons of, say, Joan d'Arc or the Virgin Mary (in France!), anyone with any sense would see an uproar in the making.  Try showing Thais satire involving those who cannot be mentioned and see what kind of reception you get (your health insurance includes hospitalization, right?). 

What was this guy thinking?

 

 

53 minutes ago, bendejo said:

We have to be responsible for our actions.  Didn't the teacher realize the possibilities of reactions to doing this?  And of course we all know how infamous the offended group is for their extreme reactions to such things.

Not in defense of the killer by any means, but on the other hand if a non-Christian teacher showed his class satirical cartoons of, say, Joan d'Arc or the Virgin Mary (in France!), anyone with any sense would see an uproar in the making.  Try showing Thais satire involving those who cannot be mentioned and see what kind of reception you get (your health insurance includes hospitalization, right?). 

What was this guy thinking?

 

 

"Didn't the teacher realize the possibilities of reactions to doing this?"  Perhaps he did.  If so this type of person in some circles is known as a patriot.  

“A patriot is traditionally defined as a person who loves his or her country, supports its rights and freedoms, and is willing to defend it against its enemies."

21 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

This subject is not in the school curriculum, it is therefore on the teacher's own initiative.

Laicite has long been official policy in France; perhaps he felt these cartoons provided some context for discussing that.

The man...posted photos of the victim to a Twitter account, along with insults to Mr Macron and French "infidels" and "dogs".
It was also disclosed that the attacker was a refugee.

Continued:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-54581827

20 hours ago, luckyluke said:

I googled : "concrete measures by France against Muslim fundamentalists"

in English, French & Dutch.

Didn't find anything concrete.

Care to point me in the right direction?

perhaps the concrete measures could be the french government blatantly turning a blind eye to the illegal entry to the U.K. from french soil by illegal immigrants and the french refusal to grant political asylum contary to the haig convention to refugees.

4 hours ago, bendejo said:

 

What was this guy thinking?

 

 

practising free speech? which incidentally is a bastion of a free society.

18 minutes ago, kingdong said:

perhaps the concrete measures could be the french government blatantly turning a blind eye to the illegal entry to the U.K. from french soil by illegal immigrants and the french refusal to grant political asylum contary to the haig convention to refugees.

As those illegals wish by all means to get to the U.K., in no way staying in  France/Europe, it is not a bad idea to get those potential Muslims extremists out of France, even with sometimes a little help from the authorities. 

Not really according to conventions I agree, but extreme situations request extreme measures. 

 

And of course up to the country government , where these "refugees" desperately wish to stay, to, in turn, take the measures they find opportune. 

 

 

Inflammatory post and reply removed.   Keep it civil or face a suspension. 

 

10 hours ago, candide said:

In the Koran, as in the bible, you will find different pieces of text which contradict each other. Both are a collection of texts from different sources.

both a total fantasy

5 hours ago, bendejo said:

We have to be responsible for our actions.  Didn't the teacher realize the possibilities of reactions to doing this?  And of course we all know how infamous the offended group is for their extreme reactions to such things.

Not in defense of the killer by any means, but on the other hand if a non-Christian teacher showed his class satirical cartoons of, say, Joan d'Arc or the Virgin Mary (in France!), anyone with any sense would see an uproar in the making.  Try showing Thais satire involving those who cannot be mentioned and see what kind of reception you get (your health insurance includes hospitalization, right?). 

What was this guy thinking?

 

 

Nonsense absolute  rubbish, show me a cartoon of  my Mother being shangged by a horse doesnt mean Im gonna  cut someones head off especially over a load of  old religious BS  which I have  zero respect for, a fantasy created by humans. To kowtow to this brigade of morons is the beginning of the end, ALL religion needs  putting in its place which is in the pile labelled  GARBAGE

See the very laudatory portrait of a dangerous terrorist, ABDELHAKIM SEFRIOUI, who took part in the massacre of Samuel PATY (yes, this professor has a name) and whom FRANCE welcomes with impunity, in the name of his legendary "country open to all "of" human rights ".
Sadly, this is only the start of a long chain of massacres against lay teachers or rather, let's not be afraid of words, against those who don't think or practice like those bloodthirsty, barbarians.
 

12 hours ago, Opl said:

College has first been supported by the Great Pantin Mosq

Bulldoze the thing and chuck any who  supported it in any way out  of the country, they understand nothing else but  force, they will play their stupid  games because euro countries let them.

"Didn't the teacher realize the possibilities of reactions to doing this?" 

-bendejo-

 

That's all what those Muslim extremist wish. 

Instoring fear

 

Don't say a word, don't do nothing which may offend us, or... 

 

 

Candid, it is useless to refer to the Koran or the Bible (I have read both) it is 2020 and things have changed a lot, badly, very badly for Muslims, almost identically, for them. other.
But by reading them, you can make comparisons.
 Why not!
 

5 hours ago, Victornoir said:

To speak about the cartoons of Muhammad in a class partly composed of Muslim students was provocative. This subject is not in the school curriculum, it is therefore on the teacher's own initiative.

Clumsy, controversial, indelicate, militant...

This in no way excuses his assassination. The police did well to eliminate the killer, but in these troubled times when the rational mind clashes with archaic beliefs, caution should be exercised.

Too bad, French National Education program didn't receive the Muslim Brotherhood approbation

A large majority of Muslims living in France share your point of view - therefore are de facto morally complicit and part of the chain of reactions that led to the teacher's beheading.

To remind what Charlie Hebdo terror attack was in the context of the trial of those who helped the perpetrators , to debate of Freedom of Expression in France - now and in this context- is totally relevant. 

" caution should be exercised" , yes  ... not to reverse the accusation, not to help them bury our heads in the sand

In Saudia Arabia 1991, we (USMC) we were told we could not wear or openly show crosses, crucifixes or any other religious jewelry. It offended our Muslim " Hosts " all the while caricatures of Jesus and Jews, were the butt of all humor. 

13 hours ago, Opl said:

Because you're in denial.

The Mosq - in a non muslim country supported the call to protest against a teacher - leading to his killi,ng - it's not the way we do it here. 

Where have I denied the reality of Islamist violence / terror - never done so.

 

Macron's response never to enable Islamist terror to change French culture, in this case, norms of education for non violent Freedom of Speech / Expression, is spot on. Your suggestion Islamist terror will lead to Islamism taking over the French Education system, I believe is extraordinary defeatism.

 

5 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Where have I denied the reality of Islamist violence / terror - never done so.

 

Macron's response never to enable Islamist terror to change French culture, in this case, norms of education for non violent Freedom of Speech / Expression, is spot on. Your suggestion Islamist terror will lead to Islamism taking over the French Education system, I believe is extraordinary defeatism.

 

Will The Mosq in question be shut down?  

22 minutes ago, Morty T said:

all the while caricatures of Jesus and Jews, were the butt of all humor. 

I very much doubt the "Jesus" bit.  Jesus is one of the prophets of Islam, known to Moslems as ʿĪsā ibn Maryam.  He's also regarded as a Muslim and is referenced almost 200 times in the Koran.

2 minutes ago, Opl said:

Will The Mosq in question be shut down?  

Don't know. As you're French, you must know the French government has closed down dozens of mosques and private Islamic schools preaching Islamist violence as well as deporting the Imams.

20 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Don't know. As you're French, you must know the French government has closed down dozens of mosques and private Islamic schools preaching Islamist violence as well as deporting the Imams.

Sisyphean.. 

 

17 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

But they do represent the ideology that motivates their crimes, the majority are irrelevant. I have read plenty on the life of the so called prophet who is quoted in the Hadith of Bukhari (4.52.220) when asked how he became victorious- 'I have been made victorious with terror'  there you have the problem the perfect man stating the way to win is terror. Of course the apologists have plenty of excuses- out of context, written a long time after the prophet died, have to read it in Arabic etc etc.

There you have the problem of an infidel quoting (probably from some YouTube clip) and claiming to have 'read plenty'.

 

They're not all apologists BTW. Some may be simply more fluent in the language and nuance of the Koran. I mean even some of the Christian's own ulama couldn't (still don't) agree on how good and precise the King James version was when it came out.

17 hours ago, transam said:

Social Security, hospitals and soft officialdom.....

I watched a BBC Newsnight special on the fire that destroyed the Moria refugee camp on Lesbos last month. The footage of the fire was taken by a group of young Afghan refugees, attending a course on videography provided in the camp by an NGO. Young and obviously intelligent with some of them surprisingly fluent in English, they still see their future in a European country.

 

They aren't all religious zealots, breeding solely for government handouts while going out stabbing and decapitating their way to forming a caliphate.

 

 

50 minutes ago, simple1 said:

 the French government has closed down dozens of mosques and private Islamic schools preaching Islamist violence as well as deporting the Imams.

And still.

 

9 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

They aren't all religious zealots, breeding solely for government handouts while going out stabbing and decapitating their way to forming a caliphate.

it's called "burn-and-go tactic".

Get used to it. 

30 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

I watched a BBC Newsnight special on the fire that destroyed the Moria refugee camp on Lesbos last month. The footage of the fire was taken by a group of young Afghan refugees, attending a course on videography provided in the camp by an NGO. Young and obviously intelligent with some of them surprisingly fluent in English, they still see their future in a European country.

 

They aren't all religious zealots, breeding solely for government handouts while going out stabbing and decapitating their way to forming a caliphate.

 

 

Of course not, but there is a % that have religious killing on their mind, because the book they follow says it's OK.

Those who want a better way of living come to a Christian country, how hypocritical is that..