Married to a Thai. Can I Apply for Permanent Residency?

[BritTim]

On 11/11/2020 at 1:58 PM, DrJack54 said:

OP, What advantages will you obtain having PR.

You mention avoid 90 day report. I assume that's a joke. You can do it online in 3 mins or small payment to agent or mail. 

Also mention no desire to work.

It's very easy to live in Thailand obtaining annual extension based on retirement or marriage. 

 

I somewhat agree with this, but with an important caveat. Under the current conditions for extensions of stay, money in a Thai bank account and annual extensions is pretty easy (except when you must deal with rogue offices). However, no one can predict the conditions in the future. If citizenship was possible, this would protect against whatever insane changes are introduced over the next 20 to 30 years.

[HampiK]

The problem is, that you have different categories for PR. But every category have the rule for working and pay tax. 
So let's be honest. Actually they can say working and paying tax is the real problem for most to gain PR or citizenship.

 

If they would really introduce a PR/Citizenship for married to a Thai (without working) then I guess much more would go the way for PR/Citizenship. Same for people who have a Thai child or for people with Investement Visa/extension.

 

Who knows what will happen in future. Maybe they will soften the regulation (i not believe, but I hope) or they make it more difficult for non Immigration extension.

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

If citizenship was possible, this would protect against whatever insane changes are introduced over the next 20 to 30 years.

I like your posts Tim. Always on the positive side of life.

I was thinking earlier that how many expats in Thailand have actually become citizens. There was news worthy case not that long ago of fella that had USA citizenship yet lived here as a kid. Took him to adulthood to obtain Thai citizenship and even then had to forfeit USA status and pay dosh.

In any event this thread was started from naive fella asking about PR. 

That was never on. He was retiring to Los and did not wish to work. The thread could/should end on one reply. As usual morphed into nonsense thread.

[sometimewoodworker]

8 hours ago, judokrab said:

Actually, PR *is*  visa. If you leave the country without a re-entry permit, your PR visa automatically gets cancelled just like any other visa.

It is not a visa. 
Visas do not get cancelled by leaving the country.

You do not need a re-entry permit if you have a visa.

[hotchilli]

8 hours ago, judokrab said:

That is not true. With citizenship you can buy land and do everything else that a Thai do except be a politician.

Even Thais struggle at being a politician...

[Neeranam]

9 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Took him to adulthood to obtain Thai citizenship and even then had to forfeit USA status and pay dosh.

Why did he have to forfeit USA status? Dual citizenship is not disallowed in either country.

In my Naturalization process, the only fee was 5000 baht. 

[Neeranam]

10 hours ago, HampiK said:

If they would really introduce a PR/Citizenship for married to a Thai (without working) then I guess much more would go the way for PR/Citizenship.

This will never happen for obvious reasons. At the moment gaining citizenship in Thailand for married guys is easier than in most countries. 

[Neeranam]

10 hours ago, BritTim said:

If citizenship was possible, this would protect against whatever insane changes are introduced over the next 20 to 30 years.

It is possible. The main reason I went for it was to not need a visa when old.

[abrahamzvi]

12 hours ago, judokrab said:

No knowledge of Thai language is required when applying for citizenship, if married to a Thai.

Are you sure? Where is this stated? I do know for a fact that for PR this is required even if one is married to a Thai.

[HampiK]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

This will never happen for obvious reasons. At the moment gaining citizenship in Thailand for married guys is easier than in most countries. 

But only if you work in Thailand and pay Tax. Which is the reason for many to gain PR an impossible thing.
This is different in Europe. But on the other site, this was clear before the move to Thailand, so should not be a problem. Would only be nice.

Edited November 13, 2020 by HampiK

[Sheryl]

6 hours ago, abrahamzvi said:

Are you sure? Where is this stated? I do know for a fact that for PR this is required even if one is married to a Thai.

AFAIK it is still very much a requirement

[jomtienisgood]

On 11/12/2020 at 8:59 PM, Sheryl said:

Yes, you are correct.

 

And PR is impossible to get unless you have worked and paid taxes here for at least 3 years and even then is difficult, time-consuming and expensive to obtain.

 

The person I was responding to does not have PR. He has annual extensions of stay based on either marriage or retirement.

 

I was responding to a question as to whether having a pink ID card and being listed in a yellow tabian ban means one has PR.  It does not.

Thanks for clarifying? from the thread I read I couldn't make up it was a response to a specific question or person. 

[jomtienisgood]

On 11/13/2020 at 6:01 AM, sometimewoodworker said:

It is not a visa. 
Visas do not get cancelled by leaving the country.

You do not need a re-entry permit if you have a visa.

You DO need a re-entry with any Visa.....

[jomtienisgood]

On 11/12/2020 at 11:10 PM, HampiK said:

The problem is, that you have different categories for PR. But every category have the rule for working and pay tax. 
So let's be honest. Actually they can say working and paying tax is the real problem for most to gain PR or citizenship.

 

If they would really introduce a PR/Citizenship for married to a Thai (without working) then I guess much more would go the way for PR/Citizenship. Same for people who have a Thai child or for people with Investement Visa/extension.

 

Who knows what will happen in future. Maybe they will soften the regulation (i not believe, but I hope) or they make it more difficult for non Immigration extension.

Where did you get this????? There is only 1 type of PR....... 

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, jomtienisgood said:

You DO need a re-entry with any Visa.....

A  re-entry permit is associated with a Permit To Stay and allows a person to retain that permit until date on leaving and returning to the country. It is not associated with a Visa (although the original Visa type may be stamped on the Permit, ie Non-Imm). A Valid Visa will allow a person to enter the country and get a new permit to stay. 

Beware confusing Visas and Extensions.... 

Edited November 14, 2020 by jacko45k

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, jomtienisgood said:

You DO need a re-entry with any Visa.....

You are showing your lack of comprehension.

 

A visa allows you to present yourself to an immigration officer who will give (or refuse ) you permission to stay in Thailand.

 

So NO visa requires a re-entry permission ever.

[sometimewoodworker]

3 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

A  re-entry permit is associated with a Permit To Stay and allows a person to retain that permit on leaving and returning to the country.

Technically, while the effect is the same, you actually get a new permission to stay that expires on the same day as the previous one, the previous one actually expired when you left the country.

[jacko45k]

14 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

the previous one actually expired when you left the country.

I grasp your point, but would like to add that 'the previous one' is part of the retirement extension stamp, and retains some relevance.

[ubonjoe]

23 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Technically, while the effect is the same, you actually get a new permission to stay that expires on the same day as the previous one, the previous one actually expired when you left the country.

I would say the previous on became invalid as soon you got stamped out of the country and you need a re-entry permit to make it valid again.

[jomtienisgood]

41 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I would say the previous one became invalid as soon you got stamped out of the country and you need a re-entry permit to make it valid again.

That was my point I tried to make clear.. 

[ubonjoe]

14 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

That was my point I tried to make clear.. 

A re-entry permit can be used to keep the permit to stay from a visa valid.

If you have a valid multiple entry visa a re-entry permit is not needed. After it expires you need a re-entry permit to keep the last entry from it valid.

[HampiK]

2 hours ago, jomtienisgood said:

Where did you get this????? There is only 1 type of PR....... 

1 type of PR, but a few ways to become PR (Categories of Application)

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/26122546_regulation_notice_en.pdf

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, HampiK said:

1 type of PR, but a few ways to become PR (Categories of Application)

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/26122546_regulation_notice_en.pdf

Not sure why immigration has that outdated document on their website. Since about 2009 it has been mostly invalid since they are not using it to accept applications.

This file has is the up to date requirements. Permanent Residency Requirements June 2019.pdf

[GroveHillWanderer]

On 11/13/2020 at 9:47 AM, abrahamzvi said:

Are you sure? Where is this stated? I do know for a fact that for PR this is required even if one is married to a Thai.

As I understand the points-based system they use for citizenship, it is possible to reach the minimum 50-point threshold required for a citizenship application to be considered, without scoring any points in the Thai language category.

 

According to various different websites, there are a maximum of 100 points available, divided up as follows:

 

Quote

1. Qualifications of the applicant (25 points)

Divided up into:

    1.1 Age (10 points)

    1.2 Education (15 points)

2. Security of profession (25 points)

3. Length of civil registration (20 points)

4. Thai language ability (15 points)

5. General knowledge about Thailand (10 points)

6. Personality, appearance and expression (5 points)

 

So even if you scored zero for Thai language ability, theoretically you could still pick up enough points to reach 50 if you scored highly enough in the other categories.

 

Unless of course, there's an unwritten rule that you have to have at least some points in the Thai language category - but as I say, I haven't seen that specified on the sites I've looked at.

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

I grasp your point, but would like to add that 'the previous one' is part of the retirement extension stamp, and retains some relevance.

Absolutely as the new stamp you get has the same expiration date, and is linked to the permission to stay or extension of permission to stay 
 

While not of any importance since the result is exactly the same I would consider the stamp on re-entry to be a new permission to stay linked to the original one rather than the original being reactivated. I have no idea which way immigration looks at it or even if they have a view. It’s certainly possible that @ubonjoehas the correct answer.

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, jomtienisgood said:

2 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

I would say the previous one became invalid as soon you got stamped out of the country and you need a re-entry permit to make it valid again.

That was my point I tried to make clear.. 

That may have been what you intended. The problem is that there is a significant difference between a Visa and a permission to stay.

 

So since you were insisting (incorrectly) that you needed a re-entry permit for a visa you were wrong as a re-entry permit has no effect on any visa.

 

There is no way of being sure that you were (incorrectly) calling a permission to stay a visa or actually talking about a visa

 

Thailand is rather different from many countries in the disconnection between the 2 

[jomtienisgood]

15 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

That may have been what you intended. The problem is that there is a significant difference between a Visa and a permission to stay.

 

So since you were insisting (incorrectly) that you needed a re-entry permit for a visa you were wrong as a re-entry permit has no effect on any visa.

 

There is no way of being sure that you were (incorrectly) calling a permission to stay a visa or actually talking about a visa

 

Thailand is rather different from many countries in the disconnection between the 2 

Why all this ..... fact remains if you leave Th  you need a re-entry permit, is that also incorrectly stated?

And before reaction, unless you are a Th National....

[sometimewoodworker]

30 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

Why all this ..... fact remains if you leave Th  you need a re-entry permit, is that also incorrectly stated?

And before reaction, unless you are a Th National....

Yes it is.

 

If you have one of the multi entry VISAs that is current  you have NO need for a re-entry permit, in fact a re-entry permit will reduce the time you can stay.

 

you are still not understanding the difference between a VISA and a Permission to stay

Edited November 15, 2020 by sometimewoodworker

[jomtienisgood]

6 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Yes it is.

 

If you have one of the multi entry VISAs that is current  you have NO need for a re-entry permit, in fact a re-entry permit will reduce the time you can stay.

 

you are still not understanding the difference between a VISA and a Permission to stay

I think I understand as much as you do..... In fact you just stated yourself: Multi Entry Visa...... By the way I don't really care as I am PR.....

[sometimewoodworker]

3 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

I think I understand as much as you do..... In fact you just stated yourself: Multi Entry Visa...... By the way I don't really care as I am PR.....

You clearly do not.

 

I certainly did talk about  a Multi Entry Visa

 

a multi entry visa is a multi entry visa it is not a permission to stay nor is it a multi re-entry permit.