'Brexit carnage': shellfish trucks protest in London over export chaos

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, transam said:

So when Hitler was looking through his bins at the White Cliffs of Dover, after crushing Europe, you would be on the UK beach waiting with the sandwiches for the imminent squashing of the Brits......?   

 

We Brits will go on long after the UK is consigned to the history books. 

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, tebee said:

 

Because there won't be a UK in a few years.......

 

touché

[RayC]

5 hours ago, vogie said:

Strangely enough I have not noticed any leavers on here that you are calling "xenophobic" being so,

 

For once, I'm lost for words. To quote Mr. McEnroe: "You cannot be serious?"

 

(And no, I am not going to trawl through umpteenth threads to prove my point. Unfortunately, I'm sure further examples will be along shortly).

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

but I have noticed many Euros that are obviously xenophobic to the UK, I suspect mainly towards the English though,

 

This is being balanced and impartial (see below)?

 

However unfortunately, there are a handful of Europeans who are guilty as charged. 

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

for four and a half years we have had to put up with the insults and snide remarks

 

What about the barbed comments about German imperialism/ Nazism; French intransigence/ superiority; Italian lack of courage, etc.? That's not snide? Of course not, just the great British sense of humour? Johnny Foreigner shouldn't be so sensitive.

 

On the other hand, comments of a similar ilk about we Brits ARE insulting and snide. Double standards, methinks.

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

and anybody with an ounce of pride in his country might have noticed this

 

And next comes the usual not-very-well disguised insult that Remainers are unpatriotic, and that Brexiters have a monopoly on patriotism: My vision for the UK does not coincide with yours, but I am no less of a patriot.

 

Indeed, if a definition of patriotism extends to caring about the welfare of their compatriots then, judged on that criterion,  Remainers are more patriotic than Brexiters. At least we gave a thought to the effect that Brexit might have on our compatriots living and working in the EU; Brexiters didn't give a toss.

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

 

and at the very least acknowledged this fact.

 

Acknowledged above and not for the first time. If only you could reciprocate.

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

I am mentioning this in the interest of balance as many remainers

 

Balance????? You might want to get those scales recalibrated.

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

don't seem to be blessed with impartialability

 

Impartiality? ???????? Oh, my giddy aunt...

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

 

 

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

There was even one Euro who openly admitted he was xenophobic towards us,

 

If I'd had seen that comment I would have commented negatively on it

 

5 hours ago, vogie said:

but hey, always the leavers to blame.

 

 

Well, Vogie, you are consistent if nothing else. It's always someone else's i.e. the EU and/or the Remainer's fault.

 

Hopefully, we will both be alive in 10 years time. I hope that - as a Leaver - by then you might have assumed  responsibility and accountability for the effects of Brexit, but I'm not betting on it. You never know, Brexit might turn out to be a success, and you can rub my nose in it. I sincerely hope that this is the case but I very much doubt it.

[Laughing Gravy]

7 hours ago, tebee said:

I can't help it if the UK has decided to commit collective suicide. 

How on earth do all the other countries who are not in the EU survive. It must be hell for all of them

 

Talk about tinpot head stuff.

 

I can see you are a half of the half glass empty brigade. I suppose we  =should be getting ready with prepping.

 

Will people in the UK be going out hunting with bows and arrows.

 

Will there be a mass exodus to Albania and other EU countries of the like, as they will be seen as paradise.

Edited January 22, 2021 by Laughing Gravy

[tebee]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

How on earth do all the other countries who are not in the EU survive. It must be hell for all of them

 

......

Firstly  the other countries haven't based their economies on being an integrated part of the EU for 50 years.

 

Secondly, Most of the  other counties in Europe that are not part of the EU are considerably worse off economically than the EU members.

 

We will adapt,  but   we will always be trading at a disadvantage to the counties that are EU members. We will get less for our products and pay more for what we buy. Our overheads will be higher and we will all end up poorer.

[Pro1Expat]

It couldn't by any chance be the countries in the EU that are making it difficult by any chance?

[shdmn]

8 minutes ago, Pro1Expat said:

It couldn't by any chance be the countries in the EU that are making it difficult by any chance?

It's almost as if choosing to not be a part of an organization means you no longer have any say in the matter.

Edited January 22, 2021 by shdmn

[Laughing Gravy]

3 hours ago, tebee said:

Secondly, Most of the  other counties in Europe that are not part of the EU are considerably worse off economically than the EU members.

Switzerland are not in the EU as are Russia and they are doing very well, much better than many EU countries, who are really are cap in hand, so that statement is a load of rollocks.

 

3 hours ago, tebee said:

We will adapt,  but   we will always be trading at a disadvantage to the counties that are EU members. We will get less for our products and pay more for what we buy. Our overheads will be higher and we will all end up poorer.

We will adapt and you like other posters give the constant doom and gloom and jump on the anti British Reuters news articles with the rhetoric, how worse off the UK is for not being in the EU.

 

It is as though one miraculous day the people of the UK will say lets rejoin the EU. In fact it will do the exact opposite so bring these constant negative news articles on.

 

The people of the UK will just stop buying from the EU and the Dutch will be claiming how they prevented a guy from eating his ham sandwich. What a victory for them.

Edited January 22, 2021 by Laughing Gravy

[Hi from France]

10 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Switzerland are not in the EU as are Russia and they are doing very well

Russia is doing very well? You know what the total GdP of Russia is? The GdP per head?

 

And that's you definition of "doing very well" ?

 

 

I'm starting to understand why Brexiteers are so happy: your ambition is to make the UK as rich and successful as Russia ???? 

 

 

 

Considering this is your objective I must say you are doing pretty well: one or two more pandemics managed as well as this one and you'll be just there.

 

.

 

 

 

Edited January 22, 2021 by Hi from France

[bannork]

14 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Switzerland are not in the EU as are Russia and they are doing very well, much better than many EU countries, who are really are cap in hand, so that statement is a load of rollocks.

 

We will adapt and you like other posters give the constant doom and gloom and jump on the anti British Reuters news articles with the rhetoric, how worse off the UK is for not being in the EU.

 

It is as though one miraculous day the people of the UK will say lets rejoin the EU. In fact it will do the exact opposite so bring these constant negative news articles on.

 

The people of the UK will just stop buying from the EU and the Dutch will be claiming how they prevented a guy from eating his ham sandwich. What a victory for them.

Switzerland is in the Customs Union.

[Laughing Gravy]

25 minutes ago, Hi from France said:

Russia is doing very well? You know what the total GdP of Russia is? The GdP per head?

Better than some countries in the EU as the poster stated. Look it up as your English has miraculously improved.????

 

4 hours ago, tebee said:

Secondly, Most of the  other counties in Europe that are not part of the EU are considerably worse off economically than the EU members

I will help you out what the poster said again. The statement which I gave two examples too is simply not true.

[Laughing Gravy]

35 minutes ago, bannork said:

Switzerland is in the Customs Union.

It must be a day for selective reading. Go back and see what the poster said. Those in the EU.

 

Switzerland is not an EU or EEA member. 

Edited January 22, 2021 by Laughing Gravy

[transam]

15 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

 

We Brits will go on long after the UK is consigned to the history books. 

The UK has never been out of the history books, and never will be, chummy.......

Plus, you will all still be communicating in ENGLISH........????

Edited January 23, 2021 by transam

[bannork]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

It must be a day for selective reading. Go back and see what the poster said. Those in the EU.

 

Switzerland is not an EU or EEA member. 

 

Apologies,-further reading below from ec.europa

 

The cornerstone of EU-Swiss relations is the Free Trade Agreement of 1972.

As a consequence of the rejection of the EEA membership in 1992, Switzerland and the EU agreed on a package of seven sectoral agreements signed in 1999 (known in Switzerland as "Bilaterals I"). These include: free movement of persons, technical trade barriers, public procurement, agriculture and air and land transport. In addition, a scientific research agreement fully associated Switzerland into the EU's framework research programmes.

A further set of sectoral agreements was signed in 2004 (known as "Bilaterals II"), covering, inter alia, Switzerland's participation in Schengen and Dublin, and agreements on taxation of savings, processed agricultural products, statistics, combating fraud, participation in the EU Media Programme and the Environment Agency.

In 2010 an agreement was signed on Swiss participation in EU education, professional training and youth programmes.

Overall, more than 100 bilateral agreements currently exist between the EU and Switzerland.

The on-going implementation of these agreements obliges Switzerland to take over relevant EU legislation in the covered sectors.

These bilateral agreements between the EU and Switzerland are currently managed through approximately 20 joint committees.

As a consequence of its partial integration in the EU's single market, Switzerland pays a financial contribution to economic and social cohesion in the new EU Member States.

 

Switzerland is partially integrated into the EU as the article says, plus it allows free movement of people.

A useful diagram below, the UK at home alone.

[RuamRudy]

4 hours ago, bannork said:

 

Apologies,-further reading below from ec.europa

 

The cornerstone of EU-Swiss relations is the Free Trade Agreement of 1972.

As a consequence of the rejection of the EEA membership in 1992, Switzerland and the EU agreed on a package of seven sectoral agreements signed in 1999 (known in Switzerland as "Bilaterals I"). These include: free movement of persons, technical trade barriers, public procurement, agriculture and air and land transport. In addition, a scientific research agreement fully associated Switzerland into the EU's framework research programmes.

A further set of sectoral agreements was signed in 2004 (known as "Bilaterals II"), covering, inter alia, Switzerland's participation in Schengen and Dublin, and agreements on taxation of savings, processed agricultural products, statistics, combating fraud, participation in the EU Media Programme and the Environment Agency.

In 2010 an agreement was signed on Swiss participation in EU education, professional training and youth programmes.

Overall, more than 100 bilateral agreements currently exist between the EU and Switzerland.

The on-going implementation of these agreements obliges Switzerland to take over relevant EU legislation in the covered sectors.

These bilateral agreements between the EU and Switzerland are currently managed through approximately 20 joint committees.

As a consequence of its partial integration in the EU's single market, Switzerland pays a financial contribution to economic and social cohesion in the new EU Member States.

 

Switzerland is partially integrated into the EU as the article says, plus it allows free movement of people.

A useful diagram below, the UK at home alone.

I am not sure that this is 100% correct. Does the UK not now stand proudly basking in its sovereign independence beside Belarus? 

[Loiner]

13 hours ago, shdmn said:

It's almost as if choosing to not be a part of an organization means you no longer have any say in the matter.

The same organisation that is still trying to poke its nose into our matters after we left?

[bannork]

2 hours ago, Loiner said:

The same organisation that is still trying to poke its nose into our matters after we left?

Come on Loiner, you know how it is with the EU being geographically on our doorstep- You can check out out you can never leave. 

[Loiner]

34 minutes ago, bannork said:

Come on Loiner, you know how it is with the EU being geographically on our doorstep- You can check out out you can never leave. 

You already know how it is Banners, we already checked out last January, then last December we actually left. The EU will have to wake up to hotel Singapore-on-Thames, such a lovely place, being geographically on its' doorstep.

[candide]

14 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Better than some countries in the EU as the poster stated. Look it up as your English has miraculously improved.????

 

I will help you out what the poster said again. The statement which I gave two examples too is simply not true.

Switzerland has always been a special case.

Despite abundant natural resources, GDP per capita in Russia is below any country, Eastern Europe countries included.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

[tebee]

15 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Switzerland are not in the EU as are Russia and they are doing very well, much better than many EU countries, who are really are cap in hand, so that statement is a load of rollocks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Switzerland  , although not in the EU or EEA as such, has lots of bilateral agreements with them and is part of Schengen. If this is your definition of "not in the EU" would you be happy to see the UK in the same situation ? We might have found something we can agree upon!

 

Russia - have you talked to any  Russians lately? - the place is a basket case.   

[shdmn]

3 hours ago, tebee said:

 

 

Switzerland  , although not in the EU or EEA as such, has lots of bilateral agreements with them and is part of Schengen. If this is your definition of "not in the EU" would you be happy to see the UK in the same situation ? We might have found something we can agree upon!

 

Russia - have you talked to any  Russians lately? - the place is a basket case.   

Switzerland has some special agreements where they get some benefits of being in the EU without actually being in the EU.  I think a lot of that is going to be ending soon with Brussels saying they can not continue to cherry pick the sorts of agreements they want renewed.  So I think Brussels is trying to treat Swizerland and the UK the same now.

Edited January 23, 2021 by shdmn

[Laughing Gravy]

14 hours ago, candide said:

Switzerland has always been a special case.

Despite abundant natural resources, GDP per capita in Russia is below any country, Eastern Europe countries included.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

But again they are not in the EU as was suggested, so it was a false statement.

[Laughing Gravy]

14 hours ago, tebee said:

Switzerland  , although not in the EU

So we agree then. Finally.

[candide]

15 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

But again they are not in the EU as was suggested, so it was a false statement.

I replied to your claim that Russia GDP per head was "Better than some countries in the EU". Every country in the EU has a higher GDP per capita than Russia.

[Laughing Gravy]

2 hours ago, candide said:

I replied to your claim that Russia GDP per head was "Better than some countries in the EU". Every country in the EU has a higher GDP per capita than Russia.

I think you have forgotten what you also wrote.

"Switzerland has always been a special case".

 

As for the other claim. Russia are 11th in the world as the richest economy.

 

https://www.investopedia.com/insights/worlds-top-economies/

 

https://globalpeoservices.com/top-15-countries-by-gdp-in-2020/

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/685925/gdp-of-european-countries/

 

Edited January 24, 2021 by Laughing Gravy

[candide]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I think you have forgotten what you also wrote.

"Switzerland has always been a special case".

 

As for the other claim. Russia are 11th in the world as the richest economy.

 

https://www.investopedia.com/insights/worlds-top-economies/

 

https://globalpeoservices.com/top-15-countries-by-gdp-in-2020/

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/685925/gdp-of-european-countries/

 

So? Where did I claim Russia or Switzerland were in the EU?

 

As concerns GDP, the only way to know whether a country is doing better than another one, is to use GDP per capita. You're not going to compare the total GDPs of Russia and Lichtenstein, are you?

Edited January 24, 2021 by candide

[Laughing Gravy]

12 hours ago, candide said:

So? Where did I claim Russia or Switzerland were in the EU?

 

As concerns GDP, the only way to know whether a country is doing better than another one, is to use GDP per capita. You're not going to compare the total GDPs of Russia and Lichtenstein, are you?

I think you need to go back read what has been written and take a big chill pill.

 

So? Where did I claim Russia or Switzerland were in the EU? 

Where did i say YOU did.

 

Another poster claimed Switzerland was. Got it.

[tebee]

19 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

 

 

Another poster claimed Switzerland was. Got it.

 

Although Switzerland is not officially part of the EU it's effectively in it,  as indeed are all the EFTA members. 

 

Maybe, to avoid pointless argument. I should change my original statement from 

 

"Most of the other counties in Europe that are not part of the EU are considerably worse off economically than the EU members. "

 

to 

 

"Most of the other counties in Europe that are not tightly integrated to  EU are considerably worse off economically than those that are"

 

And you still haven't  answered my question - if  you consider   Switzerland to be not part of the EU, would you be happy for the UK to have the same deal, as this surely fulfills the referendum mandate ?

[Laughing Gravy]

11 hours ago, tebee said:

Although Switzerland is not officially part of the EU it's effectively in it,

We have established that and that was the crux of what someone said that they were. I was merely stating a fact.  Move on from it.

 

11 hours ago, tebee said:

And you still haven't  answered my question - if  you consider   Switzerland to be not part of the EU, would you be happy for the UK to have the same deal, as this surely fulfills the referendum mandate ?

if you have to ask me that then you have not followed my posts for the last 7 years on the matter. We have left the EU. That is a fact.

 

Postulating what could have, should have or maybe isn't interesting for me. Again Switzerland are not part of the EU. my whole point.

[tebee]

26 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

We have established that and that was the crux of what someone said that they were. I was merely stating a fact.  Move on from it.

 

if you have to ask me that then you have not followed my posts for the last 7 years on the matter. We have left the EU. That is a fact.

 

Postulating what could have, should have or maybe isn't interesting for me. Again Switzerland are not part of the EU. my whole point

Ok , I get that we voted to leave, but why did we have to. Leave in such a bat<deleted> crazy way?

We picked the way that was most expensive for British business and the most expensive for the UK government.

What was wrong with the Swiss model, were we were not in the EU but at least could trade with it easily?