Story Of My Thai Citizenship Application

[Neeranam]

On 4/5/2022 at 12:57 AM, qualtrough said:

My Thai passport lists the USA as my birthplace, so are banks/financial institutions still likely to turn me down?

I opened an account and told them I didn't have a passport, just showing my Thai ID card. 

[gettingby]

I am an American long time resident in Thailand with with PR for more than 5 years already and looking to apply for Thai citizenship.  I believe I have all qualifications requirements for tax, language, references, etc covered and can complete the paperwork/intervies; however I am still unclear on the requirements for providing evidence of renouncing  my usa citizenship.  Is that still a requirement?  and if so how to go about that.  Especially as the USA embassy post covid has become very difficult/cumbersome to get appointments/docs/certifications/notarization/etc from.  

 

Anyone with recent experience on how to get through this?  I contacted SB several years ago and was told I was more than  qualified but then I got hung up trying to figure out what I needed to show (from an uninterested and unfriendly embassy) my intent to revoke, and pretty much gave up in frustration - and then covid hit.  ready to try again.  any advice much appreciated.

[Arkady]

On 4/7/2022 at 7:07 PM, yankee99 said:

The owner of the property needs to be present to add you to the yellow book

I am pretty sure this can be done with the property owner signing a form and with a power of attorney, if he is normally required to be present.  I did it with a company ownership and obviously the company didn't need to be physically present. 

 

Even land can be transferred using a power of attorney from the absent owner which is one reason there is so much fraud in land transfers.

[sas_cars]

On 4/10/2022 at 11:45 AM, gettingby said:

I am an American long time resident in Thailand with with PR for more than 5 years already and looking to apply for Thai citizenship.  I believe I have all qualifications requirements for tax, language, references, etc covered and can complete the paperwork/intervies; however I am still unclear on the requirements for providing evidence of renouncing  my usa citizenship.  Is that still a requirement?  and if so how to go about that.  Especially as the USA embassy post covid has become very difficult/cumbersome to get appointments/docs/certifications/notarization/etc from.  

 

Anyone with recent experience on how to get through this?  I contacted SB several years ago and was told I was more than  qualified but then I got hung up trying to figure out what I needed to show (from an uninterested and unfriendly embassy) my intent to revoke, and pretty much gave up in frustration - and then covid hit.  ready to try again.  any advice much appreciated.

It's just the intent to revoke. You just write on the affidavit of the US embassy that you intent to renounce your US citizenship once you become thai citizen, put any wording bla bla bla and the consular officer will stamp and sign that's it. It's just an intent which may change, you are not actually renouncing your US citizenship. You got nothing to lose here. It's just a cumbersome requirement imposed by the nationality department to inform embassies of certain countries who don't allow dual citizenship.

[Marcati]

2 hours ago, sas_cars said:

It's just the intent to revoke. You just write on the affidavit of the US embassy that you intent to renounce your US citizenship once you become thai citizen, put any wording bla bla bla and the consular officer will stamp and sign that's it. It's just an intent which may change, you are not actually renouncing your US citizenship. You got nothing to lose here. It's just a cumbersome requirement imposed by the nationality department to inform embassies of certain countries who don't allow dual citizenship.

FYI, the US Embassy will do nothing regarding the renunciation of Thai Citizenship.  I went through this 2 years ago.  They will not sign or stamp anything.

 

SB will give you letter and require you to go through the motions only to come back and tell them the US Embassy will do nothing.  Then you will need to write a letter in Thai (I highly recommend getting someone to help with the language, SB will ensure it covers everything) that says you did all this and that you intend to renounce your US Citizenship upon receipt of your Thai Citizenship.

[DrJoy]

3 hours ago, Marcati said:

FYI, the US Embassy will do nothing regarding the renunciation of Thai Citizenship.  I went through this 2 years ago.  They will not sign or stamp anything.

 

SB will give you letter and require you to go through the motions only to come back and tell them the US Embassy will do nothing.  Then you will need to write a letter in Thai (I highly recommend getting someone to help with the language, SB will ensure it covers everything) that says you did all this and that you intend to renounce your US Citizenship upon receipt of your Thai Citizenship.

Have they stopped the Sworn Affidavit for $50 ?

[Marcati]

5 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

Have they stopped the Sworn Affidavit for $50 ?

I guess so because when I showed up with the sealed letters from the SB and presented it to them they said they don't get involved with any application of US citizens to apply for citizenship in another country and would not stamp, sign or provide any document for me to return to SB.

 

They asked if I wanted to renounce my US citizenship and if so they would be prepared to move forward with that process only.

[DrJoy]

14 hours ago, Marcati said:

I guess so because when I showed up with the sealed letters from the SB and presented it to them they said they don't get involved with any application of US citizens to apply for citizenship in another country and would not stamp, sign or provide any document for me to return to SB.

 

They asked if I wanted to renounce my US citizenship and if so they would be prepared to move forward with that process only.

Affidavit-

Home | U.S. Citizen Services | Local Resources for U.S. Citizens | Notary Services | Affidavit

An affidavit is a sworn statement. Affidavits may be used in many different situations for many different purposes. Using our blank affidavit form for Bangkok (PDF 7KB) or for Chiang Mai (PDF 85KB), you can write out almost any statement you may wish to make. Please remember not to sign the form before you come to the office. You will need to sign it in front of a Consul.

Fee: $50 for each affidavit.

For other specific types of affidavits that we typically provide, please visit the Notaries Public information page.

 

https://th.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/local-resources-of-u-s-citizens/notaries-public/affidavit/

 

Will they deny what`s written on their website?

[Marcati]

2 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

Affidavit-

Home | U.S. Citizen Services | Local Resources for U.S. Citizens | Notary Services | Affidavit

An affidavit is a sworn statement. Affidavits may be used in many different situations for many different purposes. Using our blank affidavit form for Bangkok (PDF 7KB) or for Chiang Mai (PDF 85KB), you can write out almost any statement you may wish to make. Please remember not to sign the form before you come to the office. You will need to sign it in front of a Consul.

Fee: $50 for each affidavit.

For other specific types of affidavits that we typically provide, please visit the Notaries Public information page.

 

https://th.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/local-resources-of-u-s-citizens/notaries-public/affidavit/

 

Will they deny what`s written on their website?

I'm aware of the notary services and have used them in the past.  For the topic of intention to renounce US Citizenship they would not provide it and they won't sign or stamp Thai documents, even coming from Thai Officials.

[sas_cars]

15 hours ago, Marcati said:

I guess so because when I showed up with the sealed letters from the SB and presented it to them they said they don't get involved with any application of US citizens to apply for citizenship in another country and would not stamp, sign or provide any document for me to return to SB.

 

They asked if I wanted to renounce my US citizenship and if so they would be prepared to move forward with that process only.

That's a new information for me. Did they refuse to accept sealed letters from SB as such, which asks them to verify if your passport is genuine etc?
Or it was just the intention of renunciation on affidavit which they were not willing to do?

[Marcati]

1 minute ago, sas_cars said:

That's a new information for me. Did they refuse to accept sealed letters from SB as such, which asks them to verify if your passport is genuine etc?
Or it was just the intention of renunciation on affidavit which they were not willing to do?

The intention of renunciation of citizenship. This was the sealed letter from SB.

[sas_cars]

1 minute ago, Marcati said:

The intention of renunciation of citizenship. This was the sealed letter from SB.

They also send some documents to your embassy that verifies if your passport is genuine etc, this is what the SB guy was telling me yesterday as I went there. I am applying citizenship along with my minor children, one of whom is a US citizen, and the SB guy was telling me that he'll prepare letters for the embassy, for them to verify the passport etc. I am assuming I would need to take this sealed letter to the US embassy myself, but as you are saying that the sealed letter includes just the intention of renunciation, which in my minor child , certainly shouldn't be the case.

[Marcati]

1 minute ago, sas_cars said:

They also send some documents to your embassy that verifies if your passport is genuine etc, this is what the SB guy was telling me yesterday as I went there. I am applying citizenship along with my minor children, one of whom is a US citizen, and the SB guy was telling me that he'll prepare letters for the embassy, for them to verify the passport etc. I am assuming I would need to take this sealed letter to the US embassy myself, but as you are saying that the sealed letter includes just the intention of renunciation, which in my minor child , certainly shouldn't be the case.

The verification of passport is not a problem. This is a standard request and service. They just won't do anything with the sealed letter pertaining to the renunciation of US Citizenship

[qualtrough]

8 hours ago, Marcati said:

The verification of passport is not a problem. This is a standard request and service. They just won't do anything with the sealed letter pertaining to the renunciation of US Citizenship

When I did this about 3 years ago I just used some boilerplate from someone else's renunciation letter and then had that notarized by the embassy. I don't recall having to have a sealed letter from the SB or anything like that..

[qualtrough]

I finally had the satisfaction of entering a national park and paying the Thai fee. In this case it was Khao Yai. Foreigners 400 baht, Thais 40 baht. We used the savings to have a delicious lunch at the visitor's center in the middle of the park with change left over. The young woman at the entrance gate said she had never seen a farang with a Thai ID before. She also said that she has had farangs present their pink ID cards but they don't accept them. A friend who was up there a week ago ran into that issue too. There was a time when you could sweet talk your way into parks, or get in on a Thai driver's licence, but that seems to have pretty much disappeared some time ago. Having said that, I did get into Khun Tal national park using my pink ID a few years back, but that seems to have been an exception.

[yankee99]

28 minutes ago, qualtrough said:

I finally had the satisfaction of entering a national park and paying the Thai fee. In this case it was Khao Yai. Foreigners 400 baht, Thais 40 baht. We used the savings to have a delicious lunch at the visitor's center in the middle of the park with change left over. The young woman at the entrance gate said she had never seen a farang with a Thai ID before. She also said that she has had farangs present their pink ID cards but they don't accept them. A friend who was up there a week ago ran into that issue too. There was a time when you could sweet talk your way into parks, or get in on a Thai driver's licence, but that seems to have pretty much disappeared some time ago. Having said that, I did get into Khun Tal national park using my pink ID a few years back, but that seems to have been an exception.

I was there about a month ago and its all computerized where i entered so no room for sweet talking. 

 

So when i entered they wanted 70 baht 40+30(for vehicle) but i was only charged 30 baht total over 60 discount. 

[DrJoy]

11 hours ago, Marcati said:

I'm aware of the notary services and have used them in the past.  For the topic of intention to renounce US Citizenship they would not provide it and they won't sign or stamp Thai documents, even coming from Thai Officials.

 

11 hours ago, DrJoy said:

You can write out almost any statement you may wish to make.

My friend got it in December  2021. He wrote ` I Donald Trump, an American citizen, my US PP number is XXXX.

In connection with my recent application for Thai citizenship, I confirm I will renounce my US citizenship when granted Thai'

 

He signed in front of the consul, paid 50 usd and got the letter stamped on the spot.

 

I am not talking about any letters from SB Police.

[qualtrough]

On 4/12/2022 at 7:58 PM, yankee99 said:

I was there about a month ago and its all computerized where i entered so no room for sweet talking. 

 

So when i entered they wanted 70 baht 40+30(for vehicle) but i was only charged 30 baht total over 60 discount. 

Wait! There is a senior discount?

[Arkady]

On 4/12/2022 at 7:22 PM, qualtrough said:

I finally had the satisfaction of entering a national park and paying the Thai fee. In this case it was Khao Yai. Foreigners 400 baht, Thais 40 baht. We used the savings to have a delicious lunch at the visitor's center in the middle of the park with change left over. The young woman at the entrance gate said she had never seen a farang with a Thai ID before. She also said that she has had farangs present their pink ID cards but they don't accept them. A friend who was up there a week ago ran into that issue too. There was a time when you could sweet talk your way into parks, or get in on a Thai driver's licence, but that seems to have pretty much disappeared some time ago. Having said that, I did get into Khun Tal national park using my pink ID a few years back, but that seems to have been an exception.

I remember those days when they would let you in to National Parks at the Thai price with a Thai driving licence, an alien book or work permit.  But the order must have gone to stop that in favour of maximum gouging of all foreigners.  The whole thing still rankles with me and I prefer to avoid the places that caused me so much bitterness in the past.  However, Mrs Arkady likes to visit such places and I will spring out of the car and let them do their nasty pitch about overcharging foreigners before I slap my ID card on the counter like a joker in a pack of government monopoly playing cards. Mrs Arkady tries to stop me as she says it is not their fault and secretly believes that overcharging foreigners is perfectly justified. 

[THAIJAMES]

On 4/7/2022 at 6:59 PM, DrJoy said:

Answer - I am quite sure Foreign income is not accepted

This is true in regards to males applying. However this is in regards to the Thai husband. It's likely that foreign income can be used as proof for a Thai husband because of foreign tax treaties.

[THAIJAMES]

On 4/12/2022 at 10:04 AM, Marcati said:

I'm aware of the notary services and have used them in the past.  For the topic of intention to renounce US Citizenship they would not provide it and they won't sign or stamp Thai documents, even coming from Thai Officials.

I'm not sure if you're having the same problem that I had which is when you call the embassy about getting a notarized intention to renounce citizenship they will refuse on the phone.  But when you actually go in person and have them notarized a letter without saying anything about renouncing citizenship they actually go ahead and do notarize it.

[THAIJAMES]

On 4/11/2022 at 3:07 PM, Marcati said:

FYI, the US Embassy will do nothing regarding the renunciation of Thai Citizenship.  I went through this 2 years ago.  They will not sign or stamp anything.

 

SB will give you letter and require you to go through the motions only to come back and tell them the US Embassy will do nothing.  Then you will need to write a letter in Thai (I highly recommend getting someone to help with the language, SB will ensure it covers everything) that says you did all this and that you intend to renounce your US Citizenship upon receipt of your Thai Citizenship.

This is true if the embassy won't seal your affidavit.  But to my surprise even after number phone calls adamantly saying they won't sign such an affidavit I just showed up without saying anything and the consul signed and sealed it without saying anything.

Edited April 18, 2022 by THAIJAMES

[THAIJAMES]

On 4/10/2022 at 11:45 AM, gettingby said:

I am an American long time resident in Thailand with with PR for more than 5 years already and looking to apply for Thai citizenship.  I believe I have all qualifications requirements for tax, language, references, etc covered and can complete the paperwork/intervies; however I am still unclear on the requirements for providing evidence of renouncing  my usa citizenship.  Is that still a requirement?  and if so how to go about that.  Especially as the USA embassy post covid has become very difficult/cumbersome to get appointments/docs/certifications/notarization/etc from.  

 

Anyone with recent experience on how to get through this?  I contacted SB several years ago and was told I was more than  qualified but then I got hung up trying to figure out what I needed to show (from an uninterested and unfriendly embassy) my intent to revoke, and pretty much gave up in frustration - and then covid hit.  ready to try again.  any advice much appreciated.

I Just showed up without mentioning anything about renouncing citizenship and the consul signed it without saying anything.  This is at the chiang mai consulate.

If one of the consuls in Bangkok gives you a problem then try another one the next day.

[Marcati]

1 hour ago, THAIJAMES said:

This is true if the embassy won't seal your affidavit.  But to my surprise even after number phone calls adamantly saying they won't sign such an affidavit I just showed up without saying anything and the consul signed and sealed it without saying anything.

In the end, as I mentioned in another post, I just wrote a letter in Thai to the SB that I intend to renounce my citizenship upon receipt of my Thai Citizenship.  They helped with the verbiage for the letter and they accepted it without the signed affidavit stamped by the US Embassy.

 

I'm just waiting for my final interview at the MOI now ????

[yankee99]

17 hours ago, qualtrough said:

Wait! There is a senior discount?

yes of course ????????

[qualtrough]

On 4/19/2022 at 10:04 AM, yankee99 said:

yes of course ????????

I just realized that on my Khao Yai trip I paid 40 baht for my daughter and 30 baht for the car. Entrance was free to me as a senior. So happy about that.

 

Does anyone know about senior discounts for SRT? I have checked their website and it talks about that but they are only offered for a limited several month period and I haven't been able to figure out what discount is offered.

[yankee99]

1 minute ago, qualtrough said:

I just realized that on my Khao Yai trip I paid 40 baht for my daughter and 30 baht for the car. Entrance was free to me as a senior. So happy about that.

 

Does anyone know about senior discounts for SRT? I have checked their website and it talks about that but they are only offered for a limited several month period and I haven't been able to figure out what discount is offered.

I dont know but my kids pay full price at the local shabu and I get a discount ????????

[Neeranam]

I just played golf at a Hua Hin course. The prices are displayed on the  window of the clubhouse. After asking the price I asked if there was any discount for being Thai, showing my ID card. I was pleasantly surprised as she knocked 20% off. 

It's always worth checking. I then paid for my foreign friend and she said he would have to pay the listed price. However, when I paid, she gave him the same price. He was very happy, especially as he got more than the green fee off me for winning by 3 holes! 

[DrJoy]

7 hours ago, qualtrough said:

I just realized that on my Khao Yai trip I paid 40 baht for my daughter and 30 baht for the car. Entrance was free to me as a senior. So happy about that.

 

Does anyone know about senior discounts for SRT? I have checked their website and it talks about that but they are only offered for a limited several month period and I haven't been able to figure out what discount is offered.

Its half price for elderly (60 +) Thai nationality only, conditions here -

 

Half price reduction for persons at the Railway Booking Counters, fare reduction  by 50 percent (excluding fees) including-

1. Children who are taller than 100 cm. but not more than 150 cm.

2. Monks and novices in Buddhism. or saints in Islam and Christianity
(according to the regulations of the Railway (specify qualifications)

3. Soldiers in uniform and those who receive medals NESDB, Ror. Sor., Victory, Worn., Sor
., Sor., Kor. ., Royal Thai Police, MSD

5. Elderly people (60 years and over) Thai nationality exercise their rights between 01 June - 30 September of every year

6. Village health volunteers (Vol.) by reducing the fare. Only 3rd floor, ordinary seats, give 20% between 01 June - 30 September of every year.

 

The discount is not available for online booking

 

Edited May 5, 2022 by DrJoy

[Dogmatix]

45 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

2. Monks and novices in Buddhism. or saints in Islam and Christianity
(according to the regulations of the Railway (specify qualifications)

 

Next time I'll have to tell them I am St. George.