SURVEY: Would you leave to get vaccinated?

[statman78]

I am going back to America in a couple of weeks.  The trip is dual purpose.  I want to be at the celebration for my brother’s 70th birthday and I’ll get the vaccine of my choosing.  I’ll be coming back to Thailand in July.  I already have a nice room reserved for my quarantine.

[NaamGin]

3 minutes ago, patman30 said:

same i hear from the missus, most dont want it.
the MILs village, only 1 person put their name down
the MIL asked the people coming around for registrants if they will be taking it?.... "no, scared"

 

Same with my missus... Her boss at work keeps badgering her employees to get the jab... Out of 24 employees, only two have declined, including the missus... 

[Misty]

52 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Also hoping that by November quarantine has completely stopped or reduced back to the previous 7 days, or reduced to 3 days as was proposed but never implemented. 

 

Also hoping that having 2 shots of the vaccine Pfizer or AZ, plus a booster of same as original or the other vaccine will help to gain zero or much reduced quarantine on arrival in LOS. 

 

 

I'd like to see my aging parents in the US again, and sooner rather than later. But there are risks in traveling when not yet vaccinated, and getting back to Thailand in a timely fashion isn't guaranteed. A prolonged stay abroad isn't really an option since I own and run a Thai company.  Timing a trip in between annual visa extension/work permit renewal is also a bit tricky. 

 

Others may face other difficulties, as highlighted by a former US Ambassador to Thailand:

 

"For U.S. citizens, returning home to get vaccinated is difficult. Traveling to America, taking
two shots three or four weeks apart, then spending two to three weeks in quarantine upon
return to Asia could cause the whole process to take up to seven weeks and thousands of
dollars in flights and accommodation. That’s not a realistic option if you have a full-time
job, especially if you have children."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-americans-who-cant-get-vaccines-11622156230

 

 

 

[connda]

15 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

Thailand is probably one of the safest countries to be in right now as an unvaccinated person if you consider the relatively low number of Covid cases here compared with most other countries of the world.  Travelling to the US would expose me to high risk of infection, mainly from lengthy layovers in airports.  I feel that it is safer to stay here while practicing sensible social distancing and wait for vaccination here in the Kingdom.

My feeling is that Thailand is still very conservative with their testing program but statistics are statistics and compared to other places you're right - Thailand definitely has low overall numbers.  Why put yourself in a aluminum tube and risk international travel and mixing with the masses of people at international airports? 
The Mrs and I are good right here in the middle of rural Thailand in a province with no Covid cases.  Why move around?




 

[The Fugitive]

Too complicated for overseas travel for me at the moment. Some Countries (or rather one autonomous region of Portugal) allows one out of three for entry; 1) Proof of recovering from Covid within the last 90 days 2) negative test no more than 72 hours before departure 3) Proof of receiving both vaccine shots at least 15 days prior. However, the airlines all have their own requirements too. Transiting the colour zones has already been mentioned and adds to the headache. Hoping that Sinovac will eventually become universally acceptable and waiting for the time when proof of vaccination within a specific time frame will be the only requirement for International travel.  

[WaveHunter]

12 minutes ago, connda said:

My feeling is that Thailand is still very conservative with their testing program but statistics are statistics and compared to other places you're right - Thailand definitely has low overall numbers.  Why put yourself in a aluminum tube and risk international travel and mixing with the masses of people at international airports? 
The Mrs and I are good right here in the middle of rural Thailand in a province with no Covid cases.  Why move around?




 

Even more telling is when you compare new daily cases per capita (per million of population) since it puts all of those countries on an even footing for comparison, and only includes new cases which gives a better idea of how fast cases are increasing or decreasing.

 

WHen you look at this graph, there's no question that for an unvaccinated person, Thailand is the place to be if you are not yet vaccinated ????  (click on map for better resolution)

 

What's more, historically, Thailand has managed this pandemic FAR better than any of these other countries.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 30, 2021 by WaveHunter

[connda]

2 minutes ago, Misty said:

Others may face other difficulties, as highlighted by a former US Ambassador to Thailand:

 

"For U.S. citizens, returning home to get vaccinated is difficult. Traveling to America, taking
two shots three or four weeks apart, then spending two to three weeks in quarantine upon
return to Asia could cause the whole process to take up to seven weeks and thousands of
dollars in flights and accommodation. That’s not a realistic option if you have a full-time
job, especially if you have children."

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-americans-who-cant-get-vaccines-11622156230

I love my country.
They tell US expats not to come home on the one hand, and on the other hand they tell US expats that the US isn't China so unlike China don't expect Uncle Sam to extend a helping hand in a time of need to its citizens aboard. 

For all the China bashing on this forum it's easy to see which one of the two countries care about their citizens abroad and which one does not. 
China - provides vaccinations to it's citizens abroad via their embassies.
United States - "US citizens abroad aren't our problem.  Tough it out and don't bother us."

[Misty]

1 minute ago, connda said:

I love my country.
They tell US expats not to come home on the one hand, and on the other hand they tell US expats that the US isn't China so unlike China don't expect Uncle Sam to extend a helping hand in a time of need to its citizens aboard. 

For all the China bashing on this forum it's easy to see which one of the two countries care about their citizens abroad and which one does not. 
China - provides vaccinations to it's citizens abroad via their embassies.
United States - "US citizens abroad aren't our problem.  Tough it out and don't bother us."

 

I agree.  And then there's the announcement that the US will send 550,000 vaccines for Korean soldiers...

[sqwakvfr]

"And then there's the announcement that the US will send 550,000 vaccines for Korean soldiers..."

 

I think ROK Soldiers(who will fight and possibly die with US Forces) are a little more important than us living in LOS.  ROK Soldiers have a lot of close contact with US Forces in S. Korea.  I can see the practical benefit of vaccinating as many as possible.  Logistically easier to have ROK Soldiers(many are stationed at US Military Garrisons in the ROK) vaccinated than rounding up US Expats who are  located in many parts of LOS or other ASEAN nations.  If I was still on Active Duty and stationed in ROK then I would want my fellow ROK soldiers vaccinated as well.  

[sqwakvfr]

"For all the China bashing on this forum it's easy to see which one of the two countries care about their citizens abroad and which one does not. 
China - provides vaccinations to it's citizens abroad via their embassies.
United States - "US citizens abroad aren't our problem.  Tough it out and don't bother us."

 

 

In terms of China vaccinating it's overseas citizens(I wonder if Chinese in the US went to a local pharmacy and got the Pfizer vaccine for free??) I think it is more likely a matter of controlling it's citizens or possibly living up to the essential principle of Socialism: The State Will Provide What You Need.  Allegedly we capitalists are suppose to be Independent and "Fend for Ourselves".  This is what I was told when I attended a low cost public university in Long Beach CA when Reagan was POTUS.  Who knows?  Maybe the Chinese really care about the health and safety of it's oversea citizens?  Something to ponder over a beer or two on a hot Thailand afternoon. 

 

Of course  Joe Biden just announced a 6 Trillion(yes Trillion with a T) dollar budget for FY 2022.  Maybe there is some unallocated money for vaccinating overseas Americans.  The bad news is FY 2022 does not begin  until October 1, 2021.  

 

 

[connda]

1 hour ago, bkk6060 said:

Also, if Jan. 2020 was your claim then your antibody timeline is expired as studies show 8 months is about as long as immunity lasts after Covid.

Not necessarly true.  If so, link an article supporting your assertion.

Given how recent Covid is the studies of SARS-coV-2 immune response are self-limiting.  Studies completed in late 2020 and early 2021 relied on samples with subjects who were infected for no longer than 6 to 8 months.  What studies were finding is that there was virus-specific immune memory up to the limit of there sample, i.e., 6 to 8 months.  The studies didn't claim that no virus-specific immune memory existed after 8 months but conversely a robust virus-specific immune memory still was exhibited at 8 months.¹
Now that Covid has been around for over a year, other studies are examining samples for virus-specific immune memory at one year² , which show a robust immune response up to  1 year.  In a few more months we'll probably see samples tested beyond the 12 month mark.

Unless a study can be linked stating that the immune response to SARS-coV-2 falls significantly after 8 month, the the assertion is simply tosh.

1. Immunological memory to SARS-CoV-2 assessed for up to 8 months after infection, Jennifer Dan, et.al, AAAS Science, 05 Feb 2021: Vol. 371, Issue 6529
2. SARS-CoV-2 antibodies remain detectable 12 months after infection and antibody magnitude is associated with age and COVID-19 severity, Eric Laing, et.al, medRxiv, May 2, 2021

[wasabi]

59 minutes ago, statman78 said:

I am going back to America in a couple of weeks.  The trip is dual purpose.  I want to be at the celebration for my brother’s 70th birthday and I’ll get the vaccine of my choosing.  I’ll be coming back to Thailand in July.  I already have a nice room reserved for my quarantine.

 

Quarantine is not required in America any longer. There are some places that recommend it but even that will likely disappear soon. My wife and I returned to the US 11 days ago.  Already had our 1st vaccine jab and the second will be next week. It was a calculated risk to come here but I'm glad we did. I know the odds are I won't catch Covid but I personally have been on a ventilator and it's not an experience I ever want to repeat. I am temporarily staying in California and it's surprisingly more affordable than I expected. Being able to breathe clean air and ascend a flight of stairs without needing to take a shower is a plus too.

[2 is 1]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Doesn't really worry me.

I have no fear of COVID or of death, I've had my time and am satisfied with it.

I wouldn't want a lingering and painful end, but there are plenty of hotels with balconies to choose from.

 

My Thai misses is a far worse COVID anti-vaxxer than me, she says no way they are going to inject her, and most of her Thai LINE pals feel the same way. I seriously doubt Thailand is going to force even 25% of it's population to be vaccinated.

 

ThaiVISA claims a large elderly membership, I'm surprised more members haven't had serious COVID or long-COVID, and posted about their treatment, let alone members like me claiming non-serious COVID. If so few of us have had it, or claimed to have had it, maybe it isn't that serious?

Even doctors dont know why somebody get serious covid. My friend have wife and 2 kids, kids and wife get covid friend not even sleep same bed whit wife. Wife had running nose thats it kids loose how to taste like food for few days and thats it. My friend only was really bist off coz he have to be in quarantine total 28 days. Reason kids get that first and after first quarantine wife get it. In other hand one friend was in ICU over 30 days and he was really healty before.

[Misty]

"I think ROK Soldiers(who will fight and possibly die with US Forces) are a little more important than us living in LOS.....If I was still on Active Duty and stationed in ROK then I would want my fellow ROK soldiers vaccinated as well. "

 

Not sure who is more important, but I would say since the US insists on taxing its citizens overseas, there is a realistic expectation of some kind of social contract. In the words of former Ambassador DeSombre "As ambassadors, our priority was to secure the health and safety of all Americans. It is time for the U.S. to offer Covid-19 vaccines to our fellow citizens living overseas."

 

To the second point, having been on Active Duty in ROK and elsewhere in Asia, yes, of course.  It's not that Korean soldiers shouldn't be vaccinated.  It's that 1) It's quite possible to do so (some have argued not) and that 2) the US is willing to do so. 

 

 

[connda]

1 hour ago, patman30 said:

same i hear from the missus, most dont want it.
the MILs village, only 1 person put their name down
the MIL asked the people coming around for registrants if they will be taking it?.... "no, scared"

Less then 30% of our entire Tambon is registered with less than 5% in the largest village.  With all this "say one thing one day and something different another day and something opposite the next" from the Halls of Truthfulness and Virtue and Expensive Watches in Bangkok, the rural locals don't necessarily trust Uncle Tu and friends.  And this is red shirt territory too so the mistrust runs deeper than Covid-mansplaining from the top.

[Moonlover]

Covid has hardly affected our lives at all up here in sleepy Issan. I would run a far greater risk by leaving the country to get vaccinated than I would by simply staying here and doing nothing about it.

 

As it happens though I have an appointment in early August at the local hospital for my first jab, so all being well, it's not a problem either way.

[simple1]

2 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

 

Did you get tested when you had it ?

 

How old are you ?

 

Any pre-existing conditions ?

 

I am sure we all want to know first hand knowledge from a TVF member who's had it.

 

Some feedback for you. My daughter, aged 40, living in the UK caught Covid. Was ill for six weeks with tiredness, bad headaches etc, but luckily did not progress to requiring hospitalisation. Her children were also infected, but did not experience major illness. Personally I believe anyone downplaying the risk of Covid really needs to taken into account the number of deaths and severe consequences for some with ongoing health issues. As an example let's not forget the US is currently tracking at approx 590,000 deaths from Covid and associated complications, with additional deaths in the hundreds every day, primarily due to downplaying of risk with millions suckered in with the BS.

[UTH001]

I did leave, got my J&J shot, now in 14 day quarantine in BKK. Not regretting I left but expecting a 7 day quarantine on return...

Edited May 30, 2021 by UTH001

[sqwakvfr]

"social contract"

 

I have lived and worked in 5 countries not named the USA.  The only services that a US Embassy/Consulate realistically offers is to replace or renew a passport, record the birth of child, notarize certain documents and visit you in jail. .  Anything more than that is "lip service".  A long time ago I worked for certain company based out Texas and  in a country located next to Pakistan.  When one of our fellow employee died(actually he was killed) the responsibility for getting his body home was the 100% responsibility of the employer.  The embassy(one of the most unwelcoming places I have ever been to) just wanted to know the name and home state of the deceased.  Another incident that exemplifies how much the US Government cares is this:  before  a severely injured coworker could be medically evacuated on a C-17 the Embassy demanded this employee had DBA and/or health insurance.  So we had to convoy back to the company office and printout the documents and then convoy back(not exactly a pleasant drive in armored vehicles?).  "Just paperwork that can wait"?  Not for the embassy.  Based upon my experience(s)with US Embassy/Consulate the US Government will never vaccinate overseas Americans.  The only exceptions I see are for military retirees and/or retired federal workers.   

[Misty]

"The only services that a US Embassy/Consulate realistically offers is to replace or renew a passport, record the birth of child, notarize certain documents and visit you in jail."

 

I've lived outside the US for decades, and without going into detail, I have to agree that the services (and attitude) of the ACS can underwhelm.

 

Even though there may not be snowball's chance in Bangkok, at this point I'm not ready to go quietly into that good night.  And I really appreciate our former Ambassador picking up the drum beat.

 

 

[shackleton]

Can't be bothered with all the hassle of leaving Thailand just to get the vaccine

Will conform to wearing my face mask in public places

And wait until the hospitals more likely the Private international ones

and get the vaccine of my choice when available 

[Stubby]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Doesn't really worry me.

I have no fear of COVID or of death, I've had my time and am satisfied with it.

I wouldn't want a lingering and painful end, but there are plenty of hotels with balconies to choose from.

Don't say that, BritManToo. TV forum threads would be pretty dull without your hooks, wit, and balanced replies that never fail to entertain.

Long live BMT, that's what I say ????

[RemyDog]

2 hours ago, Misty said:

 

I agree.  And then there's the announcement that the US will send 550,000 vaccines for Korean soldiers...

I agree that China sets a leading example of looking out for and caring about their citizens who are outside of China. Unfortunately, the Australian govt is even less caring than USA govt regarding its citizens overseas. Scott Morrison (the Prime Minister) uses an "us Vs them" approach of treating Oz citizens abroad as expendable in his building of a fear campaign among the voters in Australia - justifying it as Fortress Australia and keeping Australians safe (so long as you are inside the Fortress!). His primary motivation is for his mob to win the election due within 14 months - who or what gets hurt or damaged along the way are easily and without conscience classed as expendable cannon fodder. 

[placnx]

3 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

• Even though I would much prefer a Western vaccine such as Pfizer or J&J over SInoVac, SinoVac probably provides decent efficacy, and I could always supplement it with a Western vaccine at a later date.

•  My big concern with SinoVac (right now) is that no Phase 3 study data on the vaccine has yet been published in peer-reviewed journals, and as such, many countries around the world are "on the fence" right now about whether or not travelers vaccinated with SInoVac will be granted entry.  I want to be able to travel freely ASAP, with no concerns about being barred entry.

A problem about travel in the future is how governments will manage apps, paper records, all that certify vaccination. Could be chaotic, so US, for example, appears to be leaving the problem up to the airlines.

 

Sinovac may never be cleared everywhere, so if you get a second or third shot from a private hospital, how to explain this mix between public and private, and will such a mix be considered sufficient for entry (if they can figure out which vaccinations when)?

[WaveHunter]

6 minutes ago, placnx said:

A problem about travel in the future is how governments will manage apps, paper records, all that certify vaccination. Could be chaotic, so US, for example, appears to be leaving the problem up to the airlines.

 

Sinovac may never be cleared everywhere, so if you get a second or third shot from a private hospital, how to explain this mix between public and private, and will such a mix be considered sufficient for entry (if they can figure out which vaccinations when)?

Give it time and I'm sure there will be a unified way for an international solution similar to how passports work.

 

As for a mix of vaccines, I would guess that all that is important is that you have been vaccinated by an accepted brand; whether you were previously vaccinated with an unaccepted brand would have no bearing on that (IMHO).

Edited May 30, 2021 by WaveHunter

[Enzian]

3 hours ago, statman78 said:

I am going back to America in a couple of weeks.  The trip is dual purpose.  I want to be at the celebration for my brother’s 70th birthday and I’ll get the vaccine of my choosing.  I’ll be coming back to Thailand in July.  I already have a nice room reserved for my quarantine.

Can you share with us what kind of insurance you will have to show for re-entry (I'm over 80 so it's a natural question whether some company would even sell it to me), and what kind of paperwork you'll have to have from a Thai embassy or consulate in the US? Thanks very much.

Edited May 30, 2021 by Enzian
Thanks

[placnx]

2 hours ago, connda said:

Not necessarly true.  If so, link an article supporting your assertion.

Given how recent Covid is the studies of SARS-coV-2 immune response are self-limiting.  Studies completed in late 2020 and early 2021 relied on samples with subjects who were infected for no longer than 6 to 8 months.  What studies were finding is that there was virus-specific immune memory up to the limit of there sample, i.e., 6 to 8 months.  The studies didn't claim that no virus-specific immune memory existed after 8 months but conversely a robust virus-specific immune memory still was exhibited at 8 months.¹
Now that Covid has been around for over a year, other studies are examining samples for virus-specific immune memory at one year² , which show a robust immune response up to  1 year.  In a few more months we'll probably see samples tested beyond the 12 month mark.

Unless a study can be linked stating that the immune response to SARS-coV-2 falls significantly after 8 month, the the assertion is simply tosh.

1. Immunological memory to SARS-CoV-2 assessed for up to 8 months after infection, Jennifer Dan, et.al, AAAS Science, 05 Feb 2021: Vol. 371, Issue 6529
2. SARS-CoV-2 antibodies remain detectable 12 months after infection and antibody magnitude is associated with age and COVID-19 severity, Eric Laing, et.al, medRxiv, May 2, 2021

You make good points. This same also applies to the eventual need for vaccine boosters. Of course, each person's immune system is different, so trials and tests should cover a range of groups, but for sure those with weaker immune systems, i.e. old and those who are compromised by certain conditions. Then we can develop guidelines for recommending booster timing depending on age, etc.

 

From your second reference I quote:

"These findings support vaccination against SARS-CoV-2 in all suitable populations including those individuals that have recovered from natural infection."

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.27.21256207v1

Edited May 30, 2021 by placnx
add quote

[unblocktheplanet]

I'm giving the generals till October to pull their vaccine act together. In any case, my wife & I will leave to get a real vaccine in USA. We'd like to have one jab of something here first for some protection on the flights.

[nrasmussen]

52 minutes ago, placnx said:

A problem about travel in the future is how governments will manage apps, paper records, all that certify vaccination. Could be chaotic, so US, for example, appears to be leaving the problem up to the airlines.

 

Sinovac may never be cleared everywhere, so if you get a second or third shot from a private hospital, how to explain this mix between public and private, and will such a mix be considered sufficient for entry (if they can figure out which vaccinations when)?

 

IATA has already been working on that: IATA Travel Pass Initiative

[samtam]

3 hours ago, connda said:

Not necessarly true.  If so, link an article supporting your assertion.

Given how recent Covid is the studies of SARS-coV-2 immune response are self-limiting.  Studies completed in late 2020 and early 2021 relied on samples with subjects who were infected for no longer than 6 to 8 months.  What studies were finding is that there was virus-specific immune memory up to the limit of there sample, i.e., 6 to 8 months.  The studies didn't claim that no virus-specific immune memory existed after 8 months but conversely a robust virus-specific immune memory still was exhibited at 8 months.¹
Now that Covid has been around for over a year, other studies are examining samples for virus-specific immune memory at one year² , which show a robust immune response up to  1 year.  In a few more months we'll probably see samples tested beyond the 12 month mark.

Unless a study can be linked stating that the immune response to SARS-coV-2 falls significantly after 8 month, the the assertion is simply tosh.

1. Immunological memory to SARS-CoV-2 assessed for up to 8 months after infection, Jennifer Dan, et.al, AAAS Science, 05 Feb 2021: Vol. 371, Issue 6529
2. SARS-CoV-2 antibodies remain detectable 12 months after infection and antibody magnitude is associated with age and COVID-19 severity, Eric Laing, et.al, medRxiv, May 2, 2021

 

There is other interesting research:

 

https://news.sky.com/story/people-whove-had-covid-get-enhanced-protection-against-variants-from-one-vaccine-dose-study-12291757