'We don't know if we'll survive': Thailand sex workers left struggling as COVID-19 lockdown drags on

[Mac Mickmanus]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. I had a BG GF from when she started, but she was no more messed up at the end as at 8 years earlier when I first met her

While she was a bit messed up, she was still lovely to be with ( usually, though sometimes she wasn't ) for the entire 8 years and we had many great beach holidays together. I think she was probably the only BG GF I had that liked going for long walks with me on my hours long rambles- most were too lazy.

We only parted ways because she found some rich guy to marry her.

Was she working in a bar and also your girlfriend at the same time, simultaneously ?

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, FarangULong said:

I've never been to one of those types of bars while in Thailand, other than to play some pool with mates, watch sports, and have a couple drinks. Just heard, that "bar girl" is just a euphemism for hooker / that the drinks for company bar girls hook up if you pay them/pay the bar fee.

If you have never been with one, why do you feel qualified to discuss what they are like, or the bar scene, which you never participated in?

I've been in the science museum in London, but I don't feel qualified to discuss science because of it.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Was she working in a bar and also your girlfriend at the same time, simultaneously ?

Ummm. By saying that she was a BG it implies that she was indeed working in a bar at the time. That was her work and how she earned money when I wasn't there.

I wasn't one of those suckers that sent her money every month so she didn't have to "work bar" and still "worked bar" behind my back, like many do.

She was my GF because she always went with me when I was holidaying in LOS and we had a relationship that was more than just commercial, but she wasn't exclusive to me.

However there was no difference to a married woman that plays away from home and her, IMO, except I knew that she was.

It wasn't as though we were "in love" or any such BS as that. More like friends with benefits.

[Mac Mickmanus]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Ummm. By saying that she was a BG it implies that she was indeed working in a bar at the time. That was her work and how she earned money when I wasn't there.

I wasn't one of those suckers that sent her money every month so she didn't have to "work bar" and still "worked bar" behind my back, like many do.

She was my GF because she always went with me when I was holidaying in LOS and we had a relationship that was more than just commercial, but she wasn't exclusive to me.

However there was no difference to a married woman that plays away from home and her, IMO, except I knew that she was.

It wasn't as though we were "in love" or any such BS as that. More like friends with benefits.

Did you pay her when you were with her ?

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 8/18/2021 at 1:41 PM, BritManToo said:

I'm certainly enjoying living here.

I'm about as happy as a 65 year old guy could be living anywhere in the world.

Even being a billionaire probably wouldn't make me any happier.

Even being just a millionaire would make me as happy as a sandboy in a very large pile of sand, as I could then return to Thailand.

[thaibeachlovers]

32 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Did you pay her when you were with her ?

 

 

Are you for real? I can only suspect you are trolling me.

Bye.

[BritManToo]

9 hours ago, DBath said:

I feel you...I've always felt you seem like a great dad. Your first wife sounds like my first wife. Though mine was never unfaithful, but she did faithfully treat me like SHlT for 30 years. I always thought somehow it would change one day, boy was I stupid, but I think it was partly getting caught up in our careers (I traveled every week and she was a flight attendant) and raising our three sons as best we could. I always thought we were good at balancing that chaos and over time things just fell apart - which is easy to see in retrospect. The divorce was worse than messy, she would have had me thrown in jail, if she could have, regardless of the impact it would have had on me being able to pay child support - a spiteful one she was and still is.

Snap!

30 years .... yep, treat me like poop .... yep, 3 sons ....... yep, .....thrown me in jail ...... yep, spiteful and still is ...... yep.

[Mac Mickmanus]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Snap!

30 years .... yep, treat me like poop .... yep, 3 sons ....... yep, .....thrown me in jail ...... yep, spiteful and still is ...... yep.

Although your Wife cannot "throw you in jail"

What did you do wrong to end up in jail ?

[thaibeachlovers]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Snap!

30 years .... yep, treat me like poop .... yep, 3 sons ....... yep, .....thrown me in jail ...... yep, spiteful and still is ...... yep.

Mine treated me like poop, and seemed surprised that I'd actually leave her when the day finally came that she crossed the line of no return.

[BritManToo]

13 hours ago, FarangULong said:

Or are there bar girls that just do the drinks for company thing,

Entire bars based around 'drinky girls' in the Philippines.

'Cheap Charlies' in Barretto was one.

[Mac Mickmanus]

18 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Back in the UK I had no say at all, my wife dumped me and I was never allowed to see the 4 kids again.

 

In Thailand, I had absolutely full say over the raising of my step-daughter (her mom didn't want her either), from age 11 to age 23 she was totally my kid. Moved out a month back after finishing university and starting work. Still got my 10 year old son to look after.

Must be a bit of a relief that shes gone . 

It will give you more free time to spend with your Wife and one less mouth to feed .

Not only that , she will probably be back soon with her own Children, just hope she finds a decent guy who stays with her  and they don't dump the kid with you, as so often happens 

[newnative]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Thailand's reputation in the west was IMO made in the 80s and 90s by backpackers and built on by the flashpacker industry. Given that in the decade before corona IMO they were doing their best to destroy everything that created that reputation, I can't see westerners returning in the same numbers. Frankly, if I'd first arrived in LOS this century I would probably never have returned. That's how Sri Lanka was for me- a one time only disaster.

If I kept coming this century, it was only because I knew where to find the bits that hadn't been ruined.

Indeed it was a popular tourist destination, but IMO not for anyone that cared about the environment.

    There seems to be the perception that fewer western tourists were visiting Thailand, pre-covid.  In reality, of the countries tracked, only Singapore and Australia had slight declines.  Perhaps it seemed there were fewer because of all the Asian visitors--maybe the westerners were getting lost in the crowd.   In 2019, 24 million of the nearly 40 million visitors were from Asian countries.

     Perhaps there actually are fewer western tourists of your ilk--who remember Thailand of the 80s and 90s and now find it wanting--but those types who have stopped coming are apparently being replaced by others since the overall numbers weren't dropping except for the two countries I mentioned.  

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, newnative said:

    There seems to be the perception that fewer western tourists were visiting Thailand, pre-covid.  In reality, of the countries tracked, only Singapore and Australia had slight declines.  Perhaps it seemed there were fewer because of all the Asian visitors--maybe the westerners were getting lost in the crowd.   In 2019, 24 million of the nearly 40 million visitors were from Asian countries.

     Perhaps there actually are fewer western tourists of your ilk--who remember Thailand of the 80s and 90s and now find it wanting--but those types who have stopped coming are apparently being replaced by others since the overall numbers weren't dropping except for the two countries I mentioned.  

Perhaps the sort of western tourist was changing and preferred to lie by the hotel swimming pool, rather than exploring.

Then there were the thousands of youths who only came for the full moon party to get drunk and take drugs.

For someone like me, both those demographics would be invisible.

The places I did go like Pattaya were IMO seeing less westerners as the Chinese became more prevelant.

I also explored the north by car, and westerners were a rare breed for sure.

I have to assume  most western tourists were on package tours rather than independent travellers.

I always chuckle when I remember a tourist bus I traveled from Kanchanaburi on ( I was doing the package tour to the River Kwai thing ). I had my young Thai GF with me and two Australian matronly types made a great show of saying goodbye to everyone on the bus, EXCEPT me. As a put down it was tres amusing.

[BritManToo]

3 hours ago, Mac Mickmanus said:

Must be a bit of a relief that shes gone . 

It will give you more free time to spend with your Wife and one less mouth to feed .

Not only that , she will probably be back soon with her own Children, just hope she finds a decent guy who stays with her  and they don't dump the kid with you, as so often happens 

Not sure it's a relief, but it's definitely a money saver ..... I'm about 5Kbht/month better off.

[DBath]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Snap!

30 years .... yep, treat me like poop .... yep, 3 sons ....... yep, .....thrown me in jail ...... yep, spiteful and still is ...... yep.

Coming home from trip exhausted (pretty much every week for 25 years) and not so much as a “hello” or “Welcome home, how was your week?” …… yep

[DBath]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Mine treated me like poop, and seemed surprised that I'd actually leave her when the day finally came that she crossed the line of no return.

When you’ve finally had enough and decide it’s time to cut things off…It’s like that Delfonics song “Didn’t I blow your mind this time, didn’t I?”. 

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, DBath said:

Coming home from trip exhausted (pretty much every week for 25 years) and not so much as a “hello” or “Welcome home, how was your week?” …… yep

We sure put up with some poop!

But to be fair, I didn't know life could be any different then, I just did what every other guy did, (and my dad, uncles, cousins, friends) and put up with it.

It wasn't until I was being divorced, and took a two week trip to Thailand (flights were cheap) to get away from it all, that I discovered easy sex with young and attractive women in a warm climate at age 50+. It was quite amazing really, only went back to give away all my junk. I'm guessing if Brit guys found the alternative (like we did) they'd all be over here for their retirement years.

Edited August 22, 2021 by BritManToo

[DBath]

20 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

We sure put up with some poop!

But to be fair, I didn't know life could be any different then, I just did what every other guy did, (and my dad, uncles, cousins, friends) and put up with it.

It wasn't until I was being divorced, and took a two week trip to Thailand (flights were cheap) to get away from it all, that I discovered easy sex with young and attractive women in a warm climate at age 50+. It was quite amazing really, only went back to give away all my junk. I'm guessing if Brit guys found the alternative (like we did) they'd all be over here for their retirement years.

Dude, if you change your story from LOS to PRC, that was me to a ‘T’ - same age even!

 

Almost 30–years of pent up sexual frustration on the loose and treated like some movie star - deadly combination. I was like a bull in a China shop, only this time literally!!

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

But to be fair, I didn't know life could be any different then, I just did what every other guy did, (and my dad, uncles, cousins, friends) and put up with it.

Over the years I have recommended Thailand to a lot of guys... I have told them it is the cure for divorce depression, or marriage misery. It may save you from a second disaster! Many struggle to take the step, as if they have lost the will to live....

[Espanol]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I'm guessing if Brit guys found the alternative (like we did) they'd all be over here for their retirement years.

And not only Brits, but every Western man. ????????

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

Over the years I have recommended Thailand to a lot of guys... I have told them it is the cure for divorce depression, or marriage misery. It may save you from a second disaster! Many struggle to take the step, as if they have lost the will to live....

I suspect many of them just didn't believe you.

I found that when I tried to tell a couple of guys what it was like out here.

They just flat out said that was impossible and I was a liar.

And were extremely angry and aggressive.

After that I never told anyone again.

Edited August 22, 2021 by BritManToo

[Leaver]

12 hours ago, newnative said:

There seems to be the perception that fewer western tourists were visiting Thailand, pre-covid.  In reality, of the countries tracked, only Singapore and Australia had slight declines. 

 

It was certainly not my perception, it was my observation.  Foreign business owners would confirm my observations to me..  

 

It's quite rare a Thai comes out in the media to say all is not well.  

 

Here's a news article about it.  Around 6 months before covid. 

 

  

 

 

[newnative]

20 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

It was certainly not my perception, it was my observation.  Foreign business owners would confirm my observations to me..  

 

It's quite rare a Thai comes out in the media to say all is not well.  

 

Here's a news article about it.  Around 6 months before covid. 

 

  

 

 

        Try reading a bit more carefully.  My post was referring to visitors to Thailand, not specifically to Pattaya.  In 2019 only two countries, of those tracked, had slightly fewer visitors to Thailand--Australia and Singapore.  Whether Pattaya had fewer western visitors, I don't know.  City specific statistics seem to be harder to come by.   Mastercard says Pattaya had over 9 million visitors in 2019 and was in the top 20 of visited cities worldwide.  I believe the Pattaya mayor quoted 15 million in 2019, both international and domestic.  Neither broke the numbers down by country, as far as I know.  If I had to hazard a guess I would say western tourists to Pattaya were no fewer in 2019 than previous years--they were just spread out a lot more with Pattaya's tremendous growth and the popularity of Airbnb.  

     The article you referenced I found quite laughable--especially the headline.  Again, I doubt you read it very carefully.  First, the minor tourism official in the article says he thinks there are, I quote: '20 to 30% less tourists this low season'.   Did you even notice the reference to low season ?  I love the scientific 20 to 30%, too.   Which is it?   And, how was the entire year, by the way?  No mention of that.  

     Yes, I'm sure some 'foreign business owners' will 'confirm' your 'observations'.  And, I'll be the first to agree that not every business was doing well.  If you have around the same number of western visitors coming each year, but the number of businesses catering to them doubles or triples, not everyone will do well.  The pie is sliced thinner and thinner and some may not even get a piece.  Supply and demand usually sorts things out eventually.  Some businesses not doing well doesn't automatically translate to the city not doing well.  Let's not forget that top 20 in the World.  

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I suspect many of them just didn't believe you.

I found that when I tried to tell a couple of guys what it was like out here.

They just flat out said that was impossible and I was a liar.

And were extremely angry and aggressive.

After that I never told anyone again.

Most of the people I worked with were women so we never discussed what happened in LOS. There was one male Dr that did like holidaying in LOS, but he was strictly 5 star and would never have soiled his reputation by visiting a gogo or suchlike. He didn't even talk about sex. Quite boring actually.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Most of the people I worked with were women so we never discussed what happened in LOS. There was one male Dr that did like holidaying in LOS, but he was strictly 5 star and would never have soiled his reputation by visiting a gogo or suchlike. He didn't even talk about sex. Quite boring actually.

Had a gf who worked the 5* hotels in Chiang Mai, 40,000bht for the weekend (2009).

She always claimed many of her customers just wanted to cuddle while blubbing about how badly their white wives treated them.

Edited August 23, 2021 by BritManToo

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Had a gf who worked the 5* hotels in Chiang Mai, 40,000bht for the weekend (2009).

She always claimed many of her customers just wanted to cuddle while blubbing about how badly their white wives treated them.

I reckon the cuddling talking thing only is more common than people think

[jacko45k]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I reckon the cuddling talking thing only is more common than people think

I was thinking the opposite, that it was likely BS from the lady....

 

[scubascuba3]

2 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I was thinking the opposite, that it was likely BS from the lady....

 

girls have said the same to me, that they just sit and talk to some guys, not everyone wants sex, in fact anecdotal survey on the other Pattaya forum polled that 50% would have oral only

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, scubascuba3 said:

girls have said the same to me, that they just sit and talk to some guys, not everyone wants sex, in fact anecdotal survey on the other Pattaya forum polled that 50% would have oral only

Well despite what Bill Clinton says oral counts....  I have only my perspective in this and just don't see it. Maybe in a few more years!

[BritManToo]

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

girls have said the same to me, that they just sit and talk to some guys, not everyone wants sex, in fact anecdotal survey on the other Pattaya forum polled that 50% would have oral only

My previous women have claimed 50% of the white guys don't actually manage to complete the job.

Maybe it's BS from the ladies, but I've never given them any incentive to lie.

 

They also claimed Chinese businessmen were even less successful, but in a different way.

The Chinese guys liked to fill a room with naked women, and maybe have sex with just one.