Adjusting sleep pattern... How?!

[OptimisticAndy]

The past few weeks I have found it hard to adjust my sleep pattern. It's like being a student again!...

 

I've been waking up after midday most days. My job means that I can wake up anytime I like. But I still would prefer to wake up in the morning and go to sleep at a sensible time. Being in my mid 30s I like having the evening free to socialise etc

 

Problem is every time I wake up earlier I'm so tired I need a coffee to make it to the end of the day. But then when I get into bed at 9 or 10 pm I can't sleep! 

 

Any tips on how to adjust back to a normal sleep pattern? I'm finding it impossible..  

 

[Polar Bear]

Aim to adjust it by 15-30 minutes every 2 days. The biggest mistake people make is to suddenly start trying to sleep 4-6 hours earlier, and it doesn't work. Go to bed 15-30 minutes earlier than normal and set your alarm for 8 hours (or whatever you normally need.) When the alarm goes off, get up. Don't mess about with snooze or whatever.

 

Avoid caffeine and alcohol, especially in the evening, and definitely for at least an hour or two before bed. No naps, no early nights, no lie-ins. If you are sleepy too early, get up and do something until is passes. Follow all the usual sleep hygiene rules (e.g no TV or phone in bed, not doing anything other than trying to sleep after some set time, most people use brushing their teeth as the cut-off). If you wake up or can't doze off, do not look at your phone! Just lie there and be bored. Think about boring things to keep your mind busy, shopping lists, paint on the ceiling, mentally count how many shirts you own. It doesn't matter what, just have a list of dull, non-stressful things to think about. Control your breathing, slow deep breaths. You'll go back to sleep quick enough.

 

If you really can't get back to sleep after 15-20mins, get up and do something else for 15-20 mins. No screen time. Get a drink of water, walk around for a few minutes, do some stretches. Keep the lights off, keep it quiet, keep it boring. Then go back to bed.

 

Be absolutely strict with yourself while you are shifting your routine. One late night or early morning will put you back days. 

If you hit a wall, and can't seem to move it earlier, stick at the time you could manage for a few extra days and then try again. 

Be realistic about what's going to suit you. If 1am-9am works for you, there's no reason to keep pushing for 10pm-6am.

It's not complicated to do, but it's hard and it's tedious. Once you get back into a routine you are happier with it, stick with it for a while before relaxing the rules.

[OptimisticAndy]

1 hour ago, Polar Bear said:

Aim to adjust it by 15-30 minutes every 2 days. The biggest mistake people make is to suddenly start trying to sleep 4-6 hours earlier, and it doesn't work. Go to bed 15-30 minutes earlier than normal and set your alarm for 8 hours (or whatever you normally need.) When the alarm goes off, get up. Don't mess about with snooze or whatever.

 

Avoid caffeine and alcohol, especially in the evening, and definitely for at least an hour or two before bed. No naps, no early nights, no lie-ins. If you are sleepy too early, get up and do something until is passes. Follow all the usual sleep hygiene rules (e.g no TV or phone in bed, not doing anything other than trying to sleep after some set time, most people use brushing their teeth as the cut-off). If you wake up or can't doze off, do not look at your phone! Just lie there and be bored. Think about boring things to keep your mind busy, shopping lists, paint on the ceiling, mentally count how many shirts you own. It doesn't matter what, just have a list of dull, non-stressful things to think about. Control your breathing, slow deep breaths. You'll go back to sleep quick enough.

 

If you really can't get back to sleep after 15-20mins, get up and do something else for 15-20 mins. No screen time. Get a drink of water, walk around for a few minutes, do some stretches. Keep the lights off, keep it quiet, keep it boring. Then go back to bed.

 

Be absolutely strict with yourself while you are shifting your routine. One late night or early morning will put you back days. 

If you hit a wall, and can't seem to move it earlier, stick at the time you could manage for a few extra days and then try again. 

Be realistic about what's going to suit you. If 1am-9am works for you, there's no reason to keep pushing for 10pm-6am.

It's not complicated to do, but it's hard and it's tedious. Once you get back into a routine you are happier with it, stick with it for a while before relaxing the rules.

Thanks for the advice PB. Usually I had a pretty normal routine, but finding this hard to shake off.

 

Unfortunately I can't do it gradually as need to get up for something tomorrow. So I'm preparing for a day of being tired but then not being able to sleep any earlier ????

[OptimisticAndy]

1 hour ago, Polar Bear said:

 mentally count how many shirts you own. 

Loved this by the way ????

[Polar Bear]

5 minutes ago, OptimisticAndy said:

Thanks for the advice PB. Usually I had a pretty normal routine, but finding this hard to shake off.

 

Unfortunately I can't do it gradually as need to get up for something tomorrow. So I'm preparing for a day of being tired but then not being able to sleep any earlier ????

Yeah, you won't fix it one night, so that's going to suck. But hopefully you can get it back in check after that. 

I have delayed sleep phase syndrome, so it's usually a constant battle for me. I admit, I've stopped trying while I've been working from home during the pandemic. It's such a relief to just be able to sleep when I'm tired and wake up naturally, but I'll pay for it when I have to get back into a 'normal' routine again.

[1FinickyOne]

cut out the 2nd coffee, try a nap instead..

 

my Thai wife will just close her eyes and not open them again... she eventually falls asleep. 

[Pmbkk]

 

Andy, don't be too optimistic, if you're a little more pessimistic you'll be fine. Problem sorted...

[OptimisticAndy]

1 minute ago, 1FinickyOne said:

cut out the 2nd coffee, try a nap instead..

 

my Thai wife will just close her eyes and not open them again... she eventually falls asleep. 

Even with one coffee in the morning it's hard to sleep. I'm a complete lightweight.

 

 

[OptimisticAndy]

2 minutes ago, Pmbkk said:

 

Andy, don't be too optimistic, if you're a little more pessimistic you'll be fine. Problem sorted...

Far too many pessimistic people. I feel I must redress the balance.

[1FinickyOne]

1 minute ago, OptimisticAndy said:

Even with one coffee in the morning it's hard to sleep. I'm a complete lightweight.

 

 

then belly up to the buffet... so, you can't stay awake, but then you can't sleep... just wait until you get older. Have you considered therapy? 

[OptimisticAndy]

4 minutes ago, Polar Bear said:

Yeah, you won't fix it one night, so that's going to suck. But hopefully you can get it back in check after that. 

I have delayed sleep phase syndrome, so it's usually a constant battle for me. I admit, I've stopped trying while I've been working from home during the pandemic. It's such a relief to just be able to sleep when I'm tired and wake up naturally, but I'll pay for it when I have to get back into a 'normal' routine again.

You pretty much summarised all the sleep advice I've read. There is a lot of stuff about reducing blue light in the bedroom... So I'm certainly not one of those who takes their phone to bed. 

 

Interesting what you say about keeping the lights off though. I have been known to turn on the light and read but maybe I'll try and cut that out.

[Pmbkk]

2 minutes ago, OptimisticAndy said:

Far too many pessimistic people. I feel I must redress the balance.

 

Go out and buy yourself a lottery ticket then - than should readdress the balance...

[OptimisticAndy]

Just now, 1FinickyOne said:

then belly up to the buffet... so, you can't stay awake, but then you can't sleep... just wait until you get older. Have you considered therapy? 

Belly up to the buffet... Is that a saying? ????

 

Not thought about therapy, this has only been going on for a few weeks. It's just annoying.

[1FinickyOne]

5 minutes ago, OptimisticAndy said:

It's just annoying.

Annoying is when your GF snores - - and then her husband shows up w/a gun just after you fall asleep and you have trouble getting back to sleep because of the shouting and the adrenalin rush.. 

[internationalism]

malatonin on lazada, 10mg pills box 100 for 420b.

Half pill some 30 minutes before bed.

Also beer or two in the evening has calming effect.

Adjust blue light on your devices throughout the whole day, not only smartphone before sleep.

[OptimisticAndy]

10 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

Annoying is when your GF snores - - and then her husband shows up w/a gun just after you fall asleep and you have trouble getting back to sleep because of the shouting and the adrenalin rush.. 

Just another night in Thailand hey?

[Polar Bear]

Alcohol makes it easier to get to sleep, and it'll put you in a deeper sleep for a couple of hours, then it starts to wear off and disrupts the rest of your sleep. You are more likely to still be tired in the morning, get sleepy in the afternoon and end up taking a nap or needing coffee to get through the day, so it just continues the cycle. Melatonin causes similar problems. 

If it's only been going on a few weeks, and hasn't always been a problem, it's just a bad habit, and it can be reset with a bit of effort.

[HashBrownHarry]

Drugs or Alcohol.......or a combination of both should do the trick.

[OptimisticAndy]

10 minutes ago, Polar Bear said:

Alcohol makes it easier to get to sleep, and it'll put you in a deeper sleep for a couple of hours, then it starts to wear off and disrupts the rest of your sleep. You are more likely to still be tired in the morning, get sleepy in the afternoon and end up taking a nap or needing coffee to get through the day, so it just continues the cycle. Melatonin causes similar problems. 

If it's only been going on a few weeks, and hasn't always been a problem, it's just a bad habit, and it can be reset with a bit of effort.

How does water come into the equation?....Stay very hydrated in the day then stop drinking an hour or two before bed?

[DrPhibes]

Making sure morning light comes in the room and don't do any screen time for about an hr before bed, the light frequencies will affect the natural hormones that affect sleep.  I also use earplugs to cut out out aircon and other noises and sleep like a baby.

Edited November 4, 2021 by DrPhibes

[OptimisticAndy]

2 minutes ago, DrPhibes said:

Making sure morning light comes in the room and don't do any screen time for about an hr before bed, the light frequencies will affect the natural hormones that affect sleep.  I also use earplugs to cut out out aircon and other noises and sleep like a baby.

So leave the curtains a bit open for the morning light?

[DrPhibes]

Just now, OptimisticAndy said:

So leave the curtains a bit open for the morning light?

As long as there is not annoying light coming in at night, yep.

[Moonlover]

There's plenty of good tips already so I'll just add one.

 

Your sleep pattern indicates that your circadian rhythm is out of sync. A simple way to adjust it back to normal is to get straight out into the sunshine as soon as you wake up. Take that first cup of tea or coffee out into the garden, onto the balcony or wherever. Make sure you get natural sunshine into your eyes.

 

 

[Polar Bear]

40 minutes ago, OptimisticAndy said:

How does water come into the equation?....Stay very hydrated in the day then stop drinking an hour or two before bed?

Yes, lots of water until about 2 hours before bed. It's finding a balance between not getting too dehydrated at night, and not having to wake up and go to the bathroom. 

The suggestions for natural light when you first wake are really important too. (Sorry, I forgot that one because it doesn't apply to me.) But you don't want light during the night. So if there are streetlights or lights from neighbours that will shine in your room at night, keep the curtains closed at night, and think about getting blackout curtains if it's bad. Then in the morning, curtains open as soon as you wake, and get outside as soon as you can to get some sunshine on your skin and face.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Polar Bear

[Asquith Production]

If you are having a problem dropping off to sleep dont let you mind wander or focus on something that may have bee unpleasant during the day. Counting sheep is a little boring. My sister years ago had problems sleeping so she focused on something more pleasant. She would imagine that she was planning a holiday  and imagined looking through the brochures. She would then imagine travelling to the nearest travel agent (yes this was a while back) to book her perfect holiday. She reckoned she never got to book as she always fell asleep. The point being think pleasant thoughts while trying to sleep .  My favorite thought if I am having problems is to be sat in the pilots seat of an aircraft and flying between clouds and seeing the blue sea beneath. me.

[millymoopoo]

14 hours ago, Polar Bear said:

Aim to adjust it by 15-30 minutes every 2 days.

Polar bear is pretty well on the mark.

I'd suggest adjusting bedtime 5 minutes earlier every day.

Avoid coffee for 10 hours before bedtime and try to avoid alcohol in the evening.

It's could be helpful to consider our origins, electricity had only been around for a century, but for tens of thousands years we have been used to yellow flame as a light source in the evening, from fires, torchiers and candles etc.

So we are accustomed to warm white light (2300k) in the evening and blue white sun light (5000k) during the day.

Therefore if we are subjected to blue white light (like what comes from smart phones and TVs) at night, we still think it's daytime, and thus not sleeping time.

If you have a warm white (2300k) evening setting on your phone/TV use it.

If you have 5000k (cool white) lights in the house change them to 2300k (warm white) as this is the most appropriate light for the evenings.

Turn the phone over (face down) in the early evening and don't use it till the morning.

Turn the telle off early in the evening and read a book, take it to bed if need be and read for a few more minutes, you'll soon nod off.

Hope that helps.

[ArcticFox]

Go to a doctor/clinic, obtain enough benzodiazapines (Valium/Diazapam) for two or three nights, pick a time to go to sleep, pick a time to get up and get up when the alarm rings. 
Your body's clock will reset. 
Don't use benzos any longer than three days.  They are addictive but useful if conservatively used with care. 
An alternative is Hydroxyzine which is an antihistamine that can make you drowsy.  Buy some melatonin (easy to purchase from iHerb.com) and take it when it gets dark.  Melotonin is a hormone that will help keep your internal clock regulated.  And - exercise during the day.  A physically tired body is a body that will go to sleep.   Best of luck.

[Gecko123]

Not sure if Dr. Good Night's Sleep approves of the OP's night prowler lifestyle. You're sleeping in until past noon? What time are you going to bed? Lot's of stuff on the internet about how to improve your sleep hygiene. If you're hitting the hay after a night out drinking, chances are alcohol's going to affect your deep sleep patterns. That's a real no-no according to what I've read.

 

Whole-heartedly agree with recommendation to get more exercise. I've kept a sleep diary for a while now, and have definitely noticed that getting a good amount of exercise really improves sleep quality. Staying away from social media in the hours before turning in is also very helpful, not just because of blue light stimulation but because all the micro-aggressions you encounter aren't conducive to sound sleep.

 

One final tip to anyone looking to improve their sleep quality: pay attention to the noise that your air conditioner and even your fan is making. I've found that the humming and vibration noises from even a fan can negatively impact sleep. I try to keep my fan setting on one (the lowest setting) just to make the noise as minimal as possible, and I think that really has helped sleep quality.

 

Edited November 5, 2021 by Gecko123

[vandeventer]

15 hours ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Drugs or Alcohol.......or a combination of both should do the trick.

Or try a hammer to the head, you haven't told us how old you are. I am guessing 20 to 30 as there are not many student's in there 60-70 range. Try some warm milk before bed and there are some exercises you can do as well, when you are in bed to help you relax.

[RickG16]

Valium usually does the trick!

Edited November 5, 2021 by RickG16
.