Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[ballpoint]

A nice look at the zombie audience for Putin's annexation speech.  They clapped when expected to, but showed no real emotion, other than a vague look of horror on some faces.  They know what this may lead to.  Note, too, the enormous gap between the front row and the rostrum.  He really has major fears / trust issues.

 

 

[Mavideol]

21 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

A nice look at the zombie audience for Putin's annexation speech.  They clapped when expected to, but showed no real emotion, other than a vague look of horror on some faces.  They know what this may lead to.  Note, too, the enormous gap between the front row and the rostrum.  He really has major fears / trust issues.

 

 

did you had the chance to look at the Chinese XI meetings and the excitement in the audience, pretty much the same, they are paid to be there and be part of the show, monkey see monkey do

[Bkk Brian]

Israeli intelligence firm @ImageSatIntl has detected an “irregular presence” of Russian TU-160 & TU-95 strategic bombers deployed to Olenya Airbase. The base, on the Kola Peninsula, houses a significant number of military hardware, including tactical & strategic nuclear weapons

More here

While it is unclear why the bombers have been moved to the airbase, it comes as Russian President Vladimir Putin continues to threaten the West that he could use strategic nuclear weapons, including after he announced a partial mobilization in the country, saying that “this is not a bluff.”

Olenya airbase is located on the Kola Peninsula near Murmansk. It houses Russia’s Northern Fleet and a significant number of arms and military hardware, including tactical and strategic nuclear weapons.

https://www.jpost.com/international/article-718618

 

[Mavideol]

supply routes to Russia soldiers in Lyman under Ukraine's control

Ukraine tells Russia to appeal if it wants imperilled troops freed

https://au.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-forces-encircling-russian-units-123334418.html

[Bkk Brian]

13 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

supply routes to Russia soldiers in Lyman under Ukraine's control

Ukraine tells Russia to appeal if it wants imperilled troops freed

https://au.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-forces-encircling-russian-units-123334418.html

Annexation is going well then..........lol

 

Zelenskyy thanks Armed Forces for reclaiming Yampil and Lyman: Ukraine takes over initiative in war

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/09/30/7369898/

[bannork]

The Ukranians aren't going to stop fighting in the provinces illegally annexed by Putin, so having threatened to use nuclear weapons, if Putin doesn't use them, he'll lose face/ credibility big time, especially if the Russians lose Lyman.

His reference to Hiroshima and Nagasaki makes me wonder if he's thinking a couple of nuclear bombs will bring Ukraine to its knees  like Japan in 1945.

But what would NATO do in that scenario?

 

[jvs]

2 hours ago, bannork said:

The Ukranians aren't going to stop fighting in the provinces illegally annexed by Putin, so having threatened to use nuclear weapons, if Putin doesn't use them, he'll lose face/ credibility big time, especially if the Russians lose Lyman.

His reference to Hiroshima and Nagasaki makes me wonder if he's thinking a couple of nuclear bombs will bring Ukraine to its knees  like Japan in 1945.

But what would NATO do in that scenario?

 

What NATO should do is declare the Ukraine part of NATO.

Why should they do anything less?

Time to call Putin's bluff?

I know this is probably not going to happen but it is the right option imo.

[placeholder]

48 minutes ago, jvs said:

What NATO should do is declare the Ukraine part of NATO.

Why should they do anything less?

Time to call Putin's bluff?

I know this is probably not going to happen but it is the right option imo.

Well, I think the problem with that is that the vote of NATO members has to be unanimous. I can't imagine Hungary endorsing that move. At least, not for now or the near future.

[rudi49jr]

19 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Well, I think the problem with that is that the vote of NATO members has to be unanimous. I can't imagine Hungary endorsing that move. At least, not for now or the near future.

Hungary is already pushing to have all sanctions against Russia lifted by the end of this year at the latest. Orban is proving himself to be the perfect Putin lapdog, right in the heart of NATO and the EU. 

 

But the most important reason why Ukraine can’t join NATO (not yet, anyway) is because it is at war with Russia. Russia can call it a “special military operation” until they’re blue in the face, but this is war, no matter how you slice it. So if Ukraine were to join NATO, all the countries in NATO would automatically be at war with Russia as well. 

[rudi49jr]

The director general of Ukraine's Russian-occupied Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant was detained by a Russian patrol, Energoatom, the state-owned company in charge of the plant, said on Saturday.

Ihor Murashov was detained on his way from Europe's largest nuclear plant to the town of Enerhodar around 4 p.m. (1300 GMT) on Friday, company chief Petro Kotin said in a statement.

"He was taken out of the car, and with his eyes blindfolded he was driven in an unknown direction," Kotin wrote on the Telegram messaging app, adding there was no immediate word on Murashov's fate.

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/zaporizhzhia-nuclear-plant-director-general-detained-by-russian-patrol-2022-10-01/

[placeholder]

10 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

Hungary is already pushing to have all sanctions against Russia lifted by the end of this year at the latest. Orban is proving himself to be the perfect Putin lapdog, right in the heart of NATO and the EU. 

 

But the most important reason why Ukraine can’t join NATO (not yet, anyway) is because it is at war with Russia. Russia can call it a “special military operation” until they’re blue in the face, but this is war, no matter how you slice it. So if Ukraine were to join NATO, all the countries in NATO would automatically be at war with Russia as well. 

I think that's what JVS wants.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, bannork said:

The Ukranians aren't going to stop fighting in the provinces illegally annexed by Putin, so having threatened to use nuclear weapons, if Putin doesn't use them, he'll lose face/ credibility big time, especially if the Russians lose Lyman.

His reference to Hiroshima and Nagasaki makes me wonder if he's thinking a couple of nuclear bombs will bring Ukraine to its knees  like Japan in 1945.

But what would NATO do in that scenario?

 

Unless NATO is going to declare war on Russia there isn't much more they can do, IMO. Ukraine isn't in NATO, so no treaty obligations and if the US/ Britain did use nukes it's likely we all lose after it escalates to MAD.

[Mavideol]

1 hour ago, jvs said:

What NATO should do is declare the Ukraine part of NATO.

Why should they do anything less?

Time to call Putin's bluff?

I know this is probably not going to happen but it is the right option imo.

kind of not a bad thought, let's see Russia annexed territory in Ukraine in order to justify the use of any type of weapons available to them to protect Russia territory, now the other way around, let's assume EU/NATO  also annex some territory in Ukraine,  thus justifying the use of any weapons to protect EU/NATO territory....yep that's plausible, did Vlad thought about that one, maybe not 555

[Mavideol]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Well, I think the problem with that is that the vote of NATO members has to be unanimous. I can't imagine Hungary endorsing that move. At least, not for now or the near future.

many ways to put pressure on Orban, he's a as corrupted as Vlad is, holding EU money is one of them, changing the NATO and EU rule of vote to a majority instead of the non sense veto power by one (1) member, btw, UN should do the same asap or nothing will move forward as Russia will veto anything and everything

[placeholder]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

many ways to put pressure on Orban, he's a as corrupted as Vlad is, holding EU money is one of them, changing the NATO and EU rule of vote to a majority instead of the non sense veto power by one (1) member, btw, UN should do the same asap or nothing will move forward as Russia will veto anything and everything

Maybe once Russia is soundly put in its place, NATO should be dissolved and immediately reconstituted under a different name. Members could technically walk out the NATO door  and enter an organization designed for a similar purpose but with slightly more democratic rules.

[Mavideol]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Maybe once Russia is soundly put in its place, NATO should be dissolved and immediately reconstituted under a different name. Members could technically walk out the NATO door  and enter an organization designed for a similar purpose but with slightly more democratic rules.

not a bad idea, for me UN security council and NATO should be updated to the current normal, when they were created, although with good intentions, they never thought/imagined about the future/probabilities of any potential draw backs/violations by one of it's own member, the "new" democracy is not like the old democracy, although same word it does have different perceptions/understandings by different members, in my humble opinion both organizations are outdated and useless

[thaibeachlovers]

19 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

kind of not a bad thought, let's see Russia annexed territory in Ukraine in order to justify the use of any type of weapons available to them to protect Russia territory, now the other way around, let's assume EU/NATO  also annex some territory in Ukraine,  thus justifying the use of any weapons to protect EU/NATO territory....yep that's plausible, did Vlad thought about that one, maybe not 555

Do you actually know what NATO is? It's a defense pact started when the cold war was on. It's not in the business of "annexing" other countries.

Can't see the EU or Britain doing something like that either.

 

[Mavideol]

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Do you actually know what NATO is? It's a defense pact started when the cold war was on. It's not in the business of "annexing" other countries.

Can't see the EU or Britain doing something like that either.

 

you don't have a sense of humor, did you see the laughing 555 maybe not, it was a joke, just a joke

[thaibeachlovers]

17 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

many ways to put pressure on Orban, he's a as corrupted as Vlad is, holding EU money is one of them, changing the NATO and EU rule of vote to a majority instead of the non sense veto power by one (1) member, btw, UN should do the same asap or nothing will move forward as Russia will veto anything and everything

IMO the US will never allow it's veto power in the UN to be lost to a majority vote, given it's support for a certain country.

Anyway, who says a majority of countries in the UN would support the EU/ US in Ukraine if it came to that?

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

you don't have a sense of humor, did you see the laughing 555 maybe not, it was a joke, just a joke

I do have a sense of humour, just not when it's possible Europe and Russia might be reduced to cinders, by some politicians doing something just like what you said.

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO the US will never allow it's veto power in the UN to be lost to a majority vote, given it's support for a certain country.

Anyway, who says a majority of countries in the UN would support the EU/ US in Ukraine if it came to that?

Well, a majority of countries in the UN already has condemned the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Twice.

"In two General Assembly votes soon after the Russian invasion, about 140 of the UN’s member nations overwhelmingly deplored Russia’s aggression against Ukraine and called for an immediate ceasefire and the withdrawal of all Russian forces from Ukrainian territory."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/9/21/at-un-general-assembly-leaders-condemns-russias-war-in-ukraine

 

Ya think the Russian case now looks more appealing or less? Cuz everybody loves a loser?

[Hellfire]

Ukrainians in Lyman!

 

 

[placeholder]

27 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I do have a sense of humour, just not when it's possible Europe and Russia might be reduced to cinders, by some politicians doing something just like what you said.

But, as you quite rightly pointed out, it couldn't be done

[tgw]

Governor: Ukrainian forces trap 5,000 Russian troops in Lyman

 

About 5,000 Russian soldiers are encircled by Ukraine's Armed Forces in Lyman in Donetsk Oblast, said Serhiy Haidai, the governor of neighboring Luhansk Oblast. According to him, Russian troops asked their commanders if they could retreat but the request was turned down.

 

https://kyivindependent.com/uncategorized/governor-ukrainian-forces-trap-5-000-russian-troops-in-lyman

Edited October 1, 2022 by tgw

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, tgw said:

Governor: Ukrainian forces trap 5,000 Russian troops in Lyman

 

About 5,000 Russian soldiers are encircled by Ukraine's Armed Forces in Lyman in Donetsk Oblast, said Serhiy Haidai, the governor of neighboring Luhansk Oblast. According to him, Russian troops asked their commanders if they could retreat but the request was turned down.

 

https://kyivindependent.com/uncategorized/governor-ukrainian-forces-trap-5-000-russian-troops-in-lyman

I've read that Putin has taken charge of battlefield strategy and has forbidden his forces from making major retreats. So this could be another case of his armchair generaling.

[bannork]

8 minutes ago, tgw said:

Governor: Ukrainian forces trap 5,000 Russian troops in Lyman

 

About 5,000 Russian soldiers are encircled by Ukraine's Armed Forces in Lyman in Donetsk Oblast, said Serhiy Haidai, the governor of neighboring Luhansk Oblast. According to him, Russian troops asked their commanders if they could retreat but the request was turned down.

 

https://kyivindependent.com/uncategorized/governor-ukrainian-forces-trap-5-000-russian-troops-in-lyman

If you can't retreat, surrender Ruskies. Live to fight another day and overthrow Putin.

[3NUMBAS]

they wont get any chips to rebuild t heir used up  weapons so going to their doom ,more sanctions will collapse their economy

 

 

civil aviation is gone for good

[placeholder]

The Russians have pulled out of Lyman.

Russian troops forced to withdraw from Lyman as Ukrainian troops gain ground
Ukrainian soldiers were later seen raising the nation’s flag before the entrance sign to the strategic city.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/europe/article/2022/10/01/russian-troops-forced-to-withdraw-from-lyman-as-ukrainian-troops-gain-ground_5998778_143.html

[tgw]

8 minutes ago, placeholder said:

The Russians have pulled out of Lyman.

Russian troops forced to withdraw from Lyman as Ukrainian troops gain ground
Ukrainian soldiers were later seen raising the nation’s flag before the entrance sign to the strategic city.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/europe/article/2022/10/01/russian-troops-forced-to-withdraw-from-lyman-as-ukrainian-troops-gain-ground_5998778_143.html

sad news if true.

maybe it's just "feel good" news from Ruzzia for its own audience.

let's wait to see how many Ruzzians were actually encircled.

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, tgw said:

sad news if true.

maybe it's just "feel good" news from Ruzzia for its own audience.

let's wait to see how many Ruzzians were actually encircled.

Well there is this:

A senior Ukrainian military official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that Lyman was “already liberated.”

“A mop-up is ongoing,” the official said. “The Russians have nowhere to run.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/10/01/world/russia-ukraine-war-news