OPINION: How a high-profile case reflects Thai society’s views on sexual harassment victims and offenders?

[webfact]

 

While Thailand was enjoying the Songkran holidays, many people returned home to the shocking news that a former deputy leader of the Democrat party, Prinn Panitchpakdi, is the subject of a string of sexual assault allegations.

 

Whether it’s because it involves a renowned politician and economist, or because a famous “people’s lawyer”, Sittra Biabungkerd, exposed the case on Facebook, it has become the biggest high-profile #MeToo case in Thailand so far.

 

-Victims vs The Powerful-

 

Tales of sexual harassment involving well-known and powerful figures are nothing new in Thai culture, and are often underreported. In this case, however, with a well-known lawyer urging more victims to come out to report their assaults and the extensive reporting in the Thai media, a serious investigation into the case appears to be underway.

 

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On the other hand, this makes one wonder why such incidents in Thailand are so ubiquitous? Why so many women, who fall victim to rape, are still afraid to report to the police? Why is it so difficult to hold these well-respected public figures accountable for their wrongdoing?

 

Full story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/opinion-how-a-high-profile-case-reflects-thai-societys-views-on-sexual-harassment-victims-and-offenders/

 

-- © Copyright Thai PBS 2022-04-18

 

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[WEBBYB808]

I am and will be surprised  if he doesnt file a defamation  lawsuit as most do.  It often doesn't  matter guilt or innocent,  but who reports or turns one in is often in a lawsuit and loses. I once read a story in the media about a nurse who reported a Doctor for malpractice  and crimes against patients.   He was found guilty and turned right around and made a defamation  case against the nurse that reported  him, and he won!  I will be surprised  if this doesn't  happen here with who reported  him!

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

On the other hand, this makes one wonder why such incidents in Thailand are so ubiquitous? Why so many women, who fall victim to rape, are still afraid to report to the police? Why is it so difficult to hold these well-respected public figures accountable for their wrongdoing?

In one word..

Reprisals.

[bkk6060]

I agree with crime of sexual assault being a big no no.  But, the harassment agenda seems to have gotten out of hand in the west.  You look at a women and it makes her feel "uncomfortable" she can/will report you.  How do they determine what is indeed harassment?

Ridiculous now men so afraid walking around their offices with their heads down can't look or make eye contact with females, it is all way out of control in my opinion.

[ThailandRyan]

Many stay silent because of the famous line used by these pillars of society, yes the pillars of society is sarcasm. The line used "Don't you know who I am"

[JeffersLos]

The man in the photo doesn't look very Thai. 

[mrfill]

19 minutes ago, JeffersLos said:

The man in the photo doesn't look very Thai. 

You can tell from one butt cheek?

[JeffersLos]

2 minutes ago, mrfill said:

You can tell from one butt cheek?

He doesn't appear to have 5 mates backing him up. 

[mtls2005]

It takes a lot more than one individual miscreant's deeds - even as prolific as he is alleged to have been - to change the thai social contract that has been in place for more than a century, and allows the few at the top to lord over the masses.

 

Let's check back in fifty years.

[jingjai9]

Two other points come to mind as I read this article.

 

I pose this as a question and NOT an opinion. Could the concept of Karma be a reason why women suffer in their attempts to combat sexual harassment? Is it implicit within the culture that if you are born a woman, sexual issues will be one part of your suffering? No one really has it easy and all people struggle through life. Sexual harassment in a society is one struggle specific to women. As I said, this is a question I pose which I did not see addressed in the article. 

In western countries the issue with sexual harassment can be troublesome because lawyers are so skilled at spinning the facts so they can win in court for their client in civil court. There is a profit motive here because lawyers often receive a percentage of money won in a cash settlement. So it seems to me, watching from the outside that trials become a dramatic event and perhaps the lawyers efforts to win the case do not always probe deep enough into the merit of the charges. Also, many cases in the west never make it to court, parties settle before any trial takes place. Some critics say in such a system some people who file charges concerning sexual issues with high profile people visit their lawyer before they take it to the police.

The settlement by Prince Andrew is the latest example. By settling, he paid the victim, but it was a civil case and does not result in a conviction in a criminal court. 

 

"The out-of-court settlement accepted no liability and Prince Andrew has always strongly rejected claims of wrongdoing. But the prince agreed to pay an unspecified amount to Ms Giuffre and to her charity for victims' rights"

 

[Andycoops]

Unfortunately for victims in Thailand, the archaic defamation laws are there to protect the corrupt and incompetent.

Also, the immigration laws are the same dating from 1979, also archaic and not fit for purpose in the 21st century and are there to fulfill a bloated bureaucracy.

[Sydebolle]

Everybody is equal in front of the law - here in Thailand (and not only in Thailand) some are more equal than others - simple as that ???? 

[klauskunkel]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

why such incidents in Thailand are so ubiquitous? Why so many women, who fall victim to rape, are still afraid to report to the police? Why is it so difficult to hold these well-respected public figures accountable for their wrongdoing?

Are these rhetorical questions?

[Tropposurfer]

There's an efficient and rapid manner of justice for such men.

[Enzian]

2 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

You look at a women and it makes her feel "uncomfortable" she can/will report you.  How do they determine what is indeed harassment?

One writer called it "reckless eyeballing".

[BangkokReady]

8 minutes ago, Enzian said:

One writer called it "reckless eyeballing".

Western feminist extremist types call it "stare rape".

Edited April 18, 2022 by BangkokReady

[ftpjtm]

8 hours ago, webfact said:

This makes one wonder why such incidents in Thailand are so ubiquitous? Why so many women, who fall victim to rape, are still afraid to report to the police? Why is it so difficult to hold these well-respected public figures accountable for their wrongdoing?

I'd rather not answer due to the threat of a defamation lawsuit. 

[ThaiFelix]

9 hours ago, webfact said:

Why so many women, who fall victim to rape, are still afraid to report to the police? Why is it so difficult to hold these well-respected public figures accountable for their wrongdoing?

Best Joke 2022 contender.

[khunPer]

It has sadly been the same in many countries - or still is - not that special in Thailand only; but good that eyes are opening to view the problems.

[ThaiFelix]

4 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

I agree with crime of sexual assault being a big no no.  But, the harassment agenda seems to have gotten out of hand in the west.  You look at a women and it makes her feel "uncomfortable" she can/will report you.  How do they determine what is indeed harassment?

Ridiculous now men so afraid walking around their offices with their heads down can't look or make eye contact with females, it is all way out of control in my opinion.

Agreed but in my experience it depends on who is doing the staring.  No problems if you are considered handsome, you may even get a smile, but heaven help you if youre not (though I must say I never had any problems myself lol)

[malibukid]

5 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

I agree with crime of sexual assault being a big no no.  But, the harassment agenda seems to have gotten out of hand in the west.  You look at a women and it makes her feel "uncomfortable" she can/will report you.  How do they determine what is indeed harassment?

Ridiculous now men so afraid walking around their offices with their heads down can't look or make eye contact with females, it is all way out of control in my opinion.

these Western girls come over here and find out that they are not in Kansas anymore.  love it.  go home Dorthy

Edited April 18, 2022 by malibukid

[malibukid]

1 hour ago, ThaiFelix said:

Agreed but in my experience it depends on who is doing the staring.  No problems if you are considered handsome, you may even get a smile, but heaven help you if youre not (though I must say I never had any problems myself lol)

we have a saying " if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen"

[HaoleBoy]

6 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Many stay silent because of the famous line used by these pillars of society, yes the pillars of society is sarcasm. The line used "Don't you know who I am"

Can't find the video I saw on IG recently ...
A Highway Patrol Officer  pulls over a younger kid (say late 20s) driving a Ferrari for some reason.  The kid asks "Do you know who my father is?" and the Officer replies "What, your mother never told you?" .... 

[KanchanaburiGuy]

Hmmm....... 

 

Sex is....... 

 

A) An extremely entertaining and enjoyable activity; and

 

B) An unavoidable necessity for the survival of our species. (At least it was for millions of years. Now?..... ????????????) 

 

Inextricably entwined with these two unavoidable realities are two more......... 

 

#1 - There are now, and always have been, certain mating rituals--- historical, cultural and instinctual----that have been associated with accomplishing both A) and B) above; and........

 

#2 - There are Power and Control dynamics that have always been a part of accomplishing both A) and B) above. 

 

As we've "grown" as a species....... as we've become more educated and sophisticated......... .. as we've developed complex and detailed languages and the ability to transmit knowledge from one generation to another, over centuries........... as we've developed the ability to communicate over vast distances and not just with those within earshot........

 

........... we've kind of lost touch with the fact that we are animals! We have drives and urges and instincts....... just like dogs and cows and fish and Bluejays! 

 

Instead we expect everyone---at all times---to be thinking Human Beings; people who vigilantly maintain absolute control over themselves!

 

The problem with this is......... 

 

Sometimes people WANT......... A)....... 

 

And sometimes the only way to get to A)........ is for someone to show their interest by actively pursuing #1........... and sometimes even #2! (Because some people ENJOY power-based sex, as long as it's consentual.) 

 

What a dilemma this is! 

 

Mating rituals....... mating ritual behaviors that have been used (successfully) for both A) and B)........ have now become/are rapidly becoming.......... Socially Unacceptable......... and often illegal! 

 

Historically, when changes like these come down, the pendulum almost always swings to an extreme. Fortunetely, the pendulum almost always swings back some, and Common Sense tempers the extremes. 

 

I think "The West" is still mostly in the extreme phase of the pendulum swing, though I think it has backed off a little. 

 

But I think the event mentioned in the OP may be telling us that in Thailand, the extreme may just be beginning. So watch out! Because simply being a human-animal with natural human-animal urges and attractions......... may be on the verge of becoming unacceptable! 

 

Of course.......... then what are we supposed to do? Me, what did I do? I moved to Thailand! 

 

????????????

 

Cheers! 

 

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by KanchanaburiGuy

[Bluespunk]

37 minutes ago, KanchanaburiGuy said:

Hmmm....... 

 

Sex is....... 

 

A) An extremely entertaining and enjoyable activity; and

 

B) An unavoidable necessity for the survival of our species. (At least it was for millions of years. Now?..... ????????????) 

 

Inextricably entwined with these two unavoidable realities are two more......... 

 

#1 - There are now, and always have been, certain mating rituals--- historical, cultural and instinctual----that have been associated with accomplishing both A) and B) above; and........

 

#2 - There are Power and Control dynamics that have always been a part of accomplishing both A) and B) above. 

 

As we've "grown" as a species....... as we've become more educated and sophisticated......... .. as we've developed complex and detailed languages and the ability to transmit knowledge from one generation to another, over centuries........... as we've developed the ability to communicate over vast distances and not just with those within earshot........

 

........... we've kind of lost touch with the fact that we are animals! We have drives and urges and instincts....... just like dogs and cows and fish and Bluejays! 

 

Instead we expect everyone---at all times---to be thinking Human Beings; people who vigilantly maintain absolute control over themselves!

 

The problem with this is......... 

 

Sometimes people WANT......... A)....... 

 

And sometimes the only way to get to A)........ is for someone to show their interest by actively pursuing #1........... and sometimes even #2! (Because some people ENJOY power-based sex, as long as it's consentual.) 

 

What a dilemma this is! 

 

Mating rituals....... mating ritual behaviors that have been used (successfully) for both A) and B)........ have now become/are rapidly becoming.......... Socially Unacceptable......... and often illegal! 

 

Historically, when changes like these come down, the pendulum almost always swings to an extreme. Fortunetely, the pendulum almost always swings back some, and Common Sense tempers the extremes. 

 

I think "The West" is still mostly in the extreme phase of the pendulum swing, though I think it has backed off a little. 

 

But I think the event mentioned in the OP may be telling us that in Thailand, the extreme may just be beginning. So watch out! Because simply being a human-animal with natural human-animal urges and attractions......... may be on the verge of becoming unacceptable! 

 

Of course.......... then what are we supposed to do? Me, what did I do? I moved to Thailand! 

 

????????????

 

Cheers! 

 

 

Dear god, some posts are just beyond the realm…

Edited April 18, 2022 by Bluespunk
Rewording but same point

[KanchanaburiGuy]

1 hour ago, Bluespunk said:

Dear god, some posts are just beyond the realm…

And some add nothing whatsoever to the conversation.*

 

Quite the world, ain't it! ????????????

 

Cheers! 

 

.

 

*(Which, of course, THIS post would be guilty of! ????????????)

[Bluespunk]

6 minutes ago, KanchanaburiGuy said:

And some add nothing whatsoever to the conversation.*

 

Quite the world, ain't it! ????????????

 

Cheers! 

 

.

 

*(Which, of course, THIS post would be guilty of! ????????????)

Your pseudo science biological imperative BS post above also would be an example. 

[Highend Expat]

On 4/18/2022 at 7:23 AM, WEBBYB808 said:

I am and will be surprised  if he doesnt file a defamation  lawsuit as most do.  It often doesn't  matter guilt or innocent,  but who reports or turns one in is often in a lawsuit and loses. I once read a story in the media about a nurse who reported a Doctor for malpractice  and crimes against patients.   He was found guilty and turned right around and made a defamation  case against the nurse that reported  him, and he won!  I will be surprised  if this doesn't  happen here with who reported  him!

Yes, the defamation laws here are like this. Innocence or guilt is not a factor. In other words, in Thailand, you can defame someone for speaking publicly about a crime they actually committed. 

 

In Thailand, it's mostly used to protect the powerful.