Electric Vehicles in Thailand

[josephbloggs]

6 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

You guys wander way more off topic that I ever did, with all your work talk, but it appears I have been zeroed out.

On the subject of EVs, I am sad to sad that another vehicle has been added to "the list". Documented with pictures and a new story, but I am afraid you will have to use Google for more information as I have been curtailed from sharing such factual information. 

It is a Tesla, so your Chinese toys are safe.

Serious question: why don't you start an EV fire thread. Then you can post as much as you like and no one will mind. And we might also join in occasionally.

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

there are over 70,000 EV on the road which will consume over 280,000 kw/h of electricity per day and every if every EV on the road consumes that much or that little, where does the extra power come from.

How many times do we have to explain this. I have must have posted this answer 20 times in this discussion.

 

People who don’t own EVs clearly don’t understand how the grid works.

 

Power usage is not flat it varies during the day. That’s why PEA/MEA are happy to sell half price electricity at night.

 

EV owners aren’t stupid so they charge when it’s cheap, ie when supply exceeds demand

In my case I don’t have a grid connection because it’s much much cheaper to power my 450m2 house, 2 EVs and an electric motorbike from solar. Solar in Thailand is expanding rapidly due to cheap imports from China. If you don’t believe it, then open your eyes the next time you go into Thaiwasadu or a similar store.
 

If PEA were concerned about the proliferation of EVs they would make it difficult for people to hook up EV chargers, that is not the case, the last time I checked they were offering free TOU meter installations. 

[ExpatOilWorker]

1 hour ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

Easily solved with a silver hammer.

Quick question to the man with the hammer, didn't you use to drive a Porsche Taycan? 

That is an EV, right?

[GroveHillWanderer]

1 hour ago, transam said:

Nearby.........Great, but that wasn't the answer I was looking for to my question..🤗

The answer you wanted was in the first part of the post: "I plug it into the mains." 

 

Maybe you didn't read that part, as you continued with several more posts, acting as if that answer had not been given.

 

It wasn't until after the point that you could plug an EV directly into the mains had been repeatedly made, that you finally decided to accept that you had in fact been given the answer.

[billd766]

51 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

Thailand has made huge advances in its grid in recent years, in the case of solar they have added 1,500 MW of solar from one company alone (Loxley, where I spent a couple of years as Sales Director) and they are intending to double that.

 

1,500 MW will supply those 280,000 KwHr's in 12 minutes if the sun is shining (assuming I have understood the terms correctly).

Thank you For that information.

[ExpatOilWorker]

14 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

Serious question: why don't you start an EV fire thread. Then you can post as much as you like and no one will mind. And we might also join in occasionally.

Valid question, but hopefully EV fires are so rare that it only has to be discussed every other months. 

Ironically, I was trying to establish a baseline as to how few EV fires per billion miles we have had so far in Thailand, but that effort is now totally derailed. 

[Andrew Dwyer]

14 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

That's an excellent idea!

 

But it's not just asking a question about EVs. I have learned a ton in this thread due to people asking questions about EVs and EV owners answering them - in fact that was the whole reason for this thread in the first place before it got hijacked by the anti-EV brigade.

You asked if the charge didn't work and someone explained you can plug it in to any socket. You then expanded by taking it to "but what if your car charger didn't work"? That's not asking a question to learn, that is a leading question because you want the answer to be "then you are bricked" and you can feel you've won because you've found the flaw. I merely pointed out all cars can have single points of failure, nothing unique to EVs or ICEVs, although EVs have a lot less to go wrong.

 

But by using the wrong terminology he  aims to mislead and then start his famous “ you didn’t answer my question “ routine.

He never said car charger, he said actual charger which is meaningless.

Flooding the thread with meaningless “what ifs” without any interest in the answers just to sidetrack a successful thread.

Playground humour at its most basic level.

[Andrew Dwyer]

3 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

Valid question, but hopefully EV fires are so rare that it only has to be discussed every other months. 

Ironically, I was trying to establish a baseline as to how few EV fires per billion miles we have had so far in Thailand, but that effort is now totally derailed. 

 Not if you start your own thread it isn’t.

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

I see I haven't missed much by utilizing the ignore function of the forum.   Does make for a quick read though.

To anyone feeling ignored, please be offended 

[JBChiangRai]

25 minutes ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

Quick question to the man with the hammer, didn't you use to drive a Porsche Taycan? 

That is an EV, right?

Yes I did and yes it is an EV.

[ExpatOilWorker]

On 5/19/2024 at 9:04 AM, JBChiangRai said:

 

Yes I have, here is a list of all the EV fires in Thailand (not caused by accidents)

 

Begin List

End List

As of today, May 24th at 1:20 pm your accident theory is no longer valid thanks to  a Porsche. 

[JBChiangRai]

1 minute ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

As of today, May 24th at 1:20 pm your accident theory is no longer valid thanks to  a Porsche. 

A reference would be nice

[ExpatOilWorker]

1 minute ago, JBChiangRai said:

A reference would be nice

I have pictures and a fire report, but I risk being blocked 🚫 if sharing it.

[transam]

52 minutes ago, macahoom said:

 

The fact that you're asking such a basic, fundamental, schoolboy question gives the game away that after four and a half years of regular EV threads on this forum, you still haven't got the first flippin' clue about EVs. 

 

Why don't you partake in subjects you actually know something about and stop clogging up the EV threads with your embarrassing nonsense?

I am not embarrassed about asking questions, it is folk like you that know everything that has the problem.

Plus, you can be sure of this, I will continue to ask questions about anything I want, people like you should mind your own business.

Got it...........😉

[transam]

57 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

That's an excellent idea!

 

But it's not just asking a question about EVs. I have learned a ton in this thread due to people asking questions about EVs and EV owners answering them - in fact that was the whole reason for this thread in the first place before it got hijacked by the anti-EV brigade.

You asked if the charge didn't work and someone explained you can plug it in to any socket. You then expanded by taking it to "but what if your car charger didn't work"? That's not asking a question to learn, that is a leading question because you want the answer to be "then you are bricked" and you can feel you've won because you've found the flaw. I merely pointed out all cars can have single points of failure, nothing unique to EVs or ICEVs, although EVs have a lot less to go wrong.

Ask a genuine question and you'll get a helpful answer. But dreaming up "what ifs" to try and prove a misguided point is pointless. I don't even own an EV but it drives me insane.

Let me ask you a question: why are you so against EVs? Why do you and EOW scrape the internet to try and find things against them? I really don't get it.

You have totally misunderstood my initially question.

You, are making assumptions.......

 

 

So I suggest you mind your own business, and again, if you don't like my questions, move on.

It is that simple..........

Got it.....?  🙄

[transam]

54 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

The answer you wanted was in the first part of the post: "I plug it into the mains." 

 

Maybe you didn't read that part, as you continued with several more posts, acting as if that answer had not been given.

 

It wasn't until after the point that you could plug an EV directly into the mains had been repeatedly made, that you finally decided to accept that you had in fact been given the answer.

Another who has jumped on the flame bandwagon.

 

I have learned that if the wall charger packs up, you have an extra lead to plug into a wall socket, but, where does the other end of that lead go, does it go into the charger on the wall and bypass what the charger does, or is it something that plugs into the car itself...

 

I have tried very hard to get an answer to clarify, I have now used extra words to get my answer about EV's on an EV thread clarified, if my question is beyond you, just say you don't know or ignore it.

 

I may have to ask on Google instead.........🤭

 

 

[Andrew Dwyer]

21 minutes ago, transam said:

Another who has jumped on the flame bandwagon.

 

I have learned that if the wall charger packs up, you have an extra lead to plug into a wall socket, but, where does the other end of that lead go, does it go into the charger on the wall and bypass what the charger does, or is it something that plugs into the car itself...

 

I have tried very hard to get an answer to clarify, I have now used extra words to get my answer about EV's on an EV thread clarified, if my question is beyond you, just say you don't know or ignore it.

 

I may have to ask on Google instead.........🤭

 

 

I explained but you chose not to understand it.

 Emergency/Granny charger is a separate cable that is supplied with the car it has a 3 pin plug ( for standard wall socket) on one end and the other is a plug only for the charging socket on the outside of the car, dealer supplied is usually 10 amps but can buy 3rd party cables with varying amperage, has nothing to do with the wall charger. 

 

Now come back and say you couldn’t understand that !!

[transam]

1 minute ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

I explained but you chose not to understand it.

 Emergency/Granny charger is a separate cable that is supplied with the car it has a 3 pin plug ( for standard wall socket) on one end and the other is a plug only for the charging socket on the outside of the car, dealer supplied is usually 10 amps but can buy 3rd party cables with varying amperage, has nothing to do with the wall charger. 

 

Now come back and say you couldn’t understand that !!

Thank you, now wasn't that easy, concise, every point covered in a way anyone could understand in a couple of lines.

Well done........

 

So no problem charging at home unless your wall sockets don't have an RCD/MCB to cater for it, or a power cut........🤗

[Pib]

5 hours ago, billd766 said:

If as you say one EV uses 4kw/h per day to charge, then 1,000 EV will use 4,000 kw/h of electricity across the country.

 

According to this link https://washingtondc.thaiembassy.org/en/content/number-of-electric-vehicles-in-thailand-quadrupled

 

there are over 70,000 EV on the road which will consume over 280,000 kw/h of electricity per day and every if every EV on the road consumes that much or that little, where does the extra power come from.

 

quote from your post "it is not difficult for the grid to cope with that and the grid will probably be enhanced at a faster rate than uptake of EV's." Have you actually seen or heard of any expansion plans to enhance the MEA and PEA network?

 

Locally I have seen the PEA out working on the power grid most days but I don't know if they are expanding the grid or just relocating some of it.

 

I have not read anywhere that there are new power stations being built and a power station, no matter what fuel it uses takes a long time in years to build from the original decision to actually supplying power to the network.

 

In the real world Norway seems to be in the lead simply because they use hydro power. IMO solar is OK for a small scale but fossil fuels need to be shipped to a site and the left over waste needs to be removed and disposed of.

 

EVs themselves are not the problem, until it comes to disposing of them. The main problem is charging them, and the more EVs that come onto the roads currently will need more and more power to charge them.

 

That is why Thailand is playing catch up.

 

Don't worry about EVs stressing the Thailand electrical grid....maybe worry about air cons stressing the grid as more & more Thais buy A/Cs to keep cool....got tired of only using a fan...decided to buy a room A/C.

 

A typical 18K BTU invertor spilt air conditioner like many have in their residences in one or more rooms can use a little over 2KW when operating at full cooling capacity.  But let's say the room is already cooled-off and the A/C is only using about half of its cooling capacity to keep the room cool and therefore using about half the power of 1KW.   Now, over 1 hour that means it uses 1 Kw/H....over 10 hours 10KwH...and over 24 hours 24KwH.   

 

Over one month/30 days if only using the A/C for 10 hrs a day/night that means 10KwH times 30 days equals 300KwH used which would result in an electric bill charge of approx Bt1,560 based on PEA/MEA rates including all taxes/Ft/fees/etc (works out to approx Bt5.2/KwH).  Now real-world that inverter A/C is probably going to be using more than 1Kw/H especially if being used during the day when it really hot...but let's go with 1Kw.h for discussion purposes like it's being used for night time use.

 

I have an EV...a BYD Atto 3 which has a 60KwH battery.  I'm driving around 1,800Km/month or averaging 60Km/day here in the greater Bangkok area.  For each kilometer I drive my EV uses approx 0.138KwH which includes the charging losses, full A/C use, etc.  So, 0.138KwH times 1,800km/month means I'm using appox 248KwH/month (i.e., filling-up the EV 60KWH battery with electrons a little over 4 times per month using my home wall-charger) which adds  approx Bt1,289 to my home electric bill.   That 248KwH used to power my EV for a month is significantly less than the 300KwH over one month used by the person using an 18K BTU inverter A/C 10 hours.. 

 

How come no one is concerned about all the extra power demand being put on the Thailand electrical grid when someone installs an A/C in a room?...or a new office/condo building or mall is built with massive A/C power requirements, etc?    And I'm sure many thousands of additional A/Cs are being added monthly to the electrical grid (as Thailand goes from fans to A/Cs) to the already millions of A/Cs already on the Thailand electrical grid. 

 

Yea, how come no one is screaming about A/Cs stressing the electrical grid?  Maybe it's because some people really don't understand how much power different electrical devices really consume....maybe are assuming an EV uses a massive amount of energy in comparison to that room A/C blowing cool air on you.

 

 

Circled below is the "max" amps pulled by a Mitsubishi Standard Inverter 18K BTU A/C if it was operating at full cooling capacity.  Power equals Voltage times Current.....e.g., 220V times 9.6A equal 2.1KW.    

https://www.mitsubishi-kyw.co.th/getattachment/Product/For-Home/conditioner/JS-Series/Super-Inverter-(4)/Catalog-รวม-RAC-24_1.pdf.aspx

[josephbloggs]

5 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

I have pictures and a fire report, but I risk being blocked 🚫 if sharing it.

Start a new thread and go for it - you'll be in charge. Would love to see and discuss.

[billd766]

22 minutes ago, Pib said:

 

Don't worry about EVs stressing the Thailand electrical grid....maybe worry about air cons stressing the grid as more & more Thais buy A/Cs to keep cool....got tired of only using a fan...decided to buy a room A/C.

 

A typical 18K BTU invertor spilt air conditioner like many have in their residences in one or more rooms can use a little over 2KW when operating at full cooling capacity.  But let's say the room is already cooled-off and the A/C is only using about half of its cooling capacity to keep the room cool and therefore using about half the power of 1KW.   Now, over 1 hour that means it uses 1 Kw/H....over 10 hours 10KwH...and over 24 hours 24KwH.   

 

Over one month/30 days if only using the A/C for 10 hrs a day/night that means 10KwH times 30 days equals 300KwH used which would result in an electric bill charge of approx Bt1,560 based on PEA/MEA rates including all taxes/Ft/fees/etc (works out to approx Bt5.2/KwH).  Now real-world that inverter A/C is probably going to be using more than 1Kw/H especially if being used during the day when it really hot...but let's go with 1Kw.h for discussion purposes like it's being used for night time use.

 

I have an EV...a BYD Atto 3 which has a 60KwH battery.  I'm driving around 1,800Km/month or averaging 60Km/day here in the greater Bangkok area.  For each kilometer I drive my EV uses approx 0.138KwH which includes the charging losses, full A/C use, etc.  So, 0.138KwH times 1,800km/month means I'm using appox 248KwH/month (i.e., filling-up the EV 60KWH battery with electrons a little over 4 times per month using my home wall-charger) which adds  approx Bt1,289 to my home electric bill.   That 248KwH used to power my EV for a month is significantly less than the 300KwH over one month used by the person using an 18K BTU inverter A/C 10 hours.. 

 

How come no one is concerned about all the extra power demand being put on the Thailand electrical grid when someone installs an A/C in a room?...or a new office/condo building or mall is built with massive A/C power requirements, etc?    And I'm sure many thousands of additional A/Cs are being added monthly to the electrical grid (as Thailand goes from fans to A/Cs) to the already millions of A/Cs already on the Thailand electrical grid. 

 

Yea, how come no one is screaming about A/Cs stressing the electrical grid?  Maybe it's because some people really don't understand how much power different electrical devices really consume....maybe are assuming an EV uses a massive amount of energy in comparison to that room A/C blowing cool air on you.

 

 

Circled below is the "max" amps pulled by a Mitsubishi Standard Inverter 18K BTU A/C if it was operating at full cooling capacity.  Power equals Voltage times Current.....e.g., 220V times 9.6A equal 2.1KW.    

https://www.mitsubishi-kyw.co.th/getattachment/Product/For-Home/conditioner/JS-Series/Super-Inverter-(4)/Catalog-รวม-RAC-24_1.pdf.aspx

I can agree with you in part but more people are using a/c and more people are using EV so the national power consumption is rising as both are used more and more.

 

Unless more power is generated somewhere there will be a point when there wont be enough for everything. 

 

That is why the cart is in front of the horse.

 

Power stations are not built overnight, Expanding the electrical network cannot be done overnight

 

Expansion needs to come before consumption, and that IMO is the problem,

[Bandersnatch]

24 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Power stations are not built overnight, Expanding the electrical network cannot be done overnight

 

Expansion needs to come before consumption, and that IMO is the problem,

Still worrying that there will be enough electrons for all those EVs? 
 

Here is an article by the UK’s National Grid that you should look at. They don’t seem worried to me.

 

https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/journey-to-net-zero/electric-vehicles-myths-misconceptions
 

Thailand aims to add more domestic production of renewables and EVs which  are batteries on wheels can help with that transition. I currently have one of my EVs sending power back to my house.

 

https://www.trade.gov/country-commercial-guides/thailand-energy

[Rimmer]

Some personal attacks and replies have been removed. 

[transam]

Water, the one things us motorists don't look forward to this time of year.

Was out this morning in Mrs.T's Mini Super, driving through a back road, came up against a mini Ford (as in water), thought hmmm, should I or shouldn't I.......😵

 

I chanced it, think it came up to the sills, motor didn't splutter or have a problem, but now thinking, what would you EV drivers have done, as we know the EV battery doesn't like water.......

 

Would you risk it, would you think about the battery box possibly being underwater and......😱

 

What would you do....🤗

[josephbloggs]

39 minutes ago, transam said:

Water, the one things us motorists don't look forward to this time of year.

Was out this morning in Mrs.T's Mini Super, driving through a back road, came up against a mini Ford (as in water), thought hmmm, should I or shouldn't I.......😵

 

I chanced it, think it came up to the sills, motor didn't splutter or have a problem, but now thinking, what would you EV drivers have done, as we know the EV battery doesn't like water.......

 

Would you risk it, would you think about the battery box possibly being underwater and......😱

 

What would you do....🤗

I don't have an EV but I don't think there's any issue at all. In fact an EV is probably better in water than an ICE as if you get water in your air intake or the exhaust you're screwed. An EV doesn't have that issue.

EV batteries are sealed you know, they don't just dangle exposed underneath the car.

[transam]

13 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

I don't have an EV but I don't think there's any issue at all. In fact an EV is probably better in water than an ICE as if you get water in your air intake or the exhaust you're screwed. An EV doesn't have that issue.

EV batteries are sealed you know, they don't just dangle exposed underneath the car.

Water will not get into the intake in 6" of water, ICE Fuel tanks are sealed too, and they are situated in a similar location to an EV battery....🤗

 

We know the battery pack is in a sealed unit, but we also know battery packs have gone up in smoke via water.

 

As you do NOT own an EV, this question is not for you, as you would never be in the situation to even think about it...read my question again..😉

[JBChiangRai]

1 hour ago, josephbloggs said:

I don't have an EV but I don't think there's any issue at all. In fact an EV is probably better in water than an ICE as if you get water in your air intake or the exhaust you're screwed. An EV doesn't have that issue.

EV batteries are sealed you know, they don't just dangle exposed underneath the car.

 

I drove a German EV through a flood on the 118 between Chiang Rai & Chiang Mai.  Pickups were being waved through the center of the road, no cars were passing through.  The water was about 30-40cm deep.  I was 90km into the journey and didn't want to turn back.  The officials manning the road advised me to turn around.

 

I pressed a button and the car rose 10cm and I drove through the flood slowly.  The front camera triggered as the water was washing over it.

 

I could see people waiting for me to get stuck, but I just ploughed straight through.  At the other end, I stopped the car lowered it again 10cm (dramatic effect for the gathered audience) and was on my way.

 

Would I do it again?  Probably not, it was an extremely foolish thing to do, I dare say it could have invalidated my warranty.

[josephbloggs]

There was a guy asking about mini EVs in RHD but I can't remember which thread it was in - I thought this one but I can't find it.

Anyway, saw one of these little guys yesterday - it looks quite funky. Good for pootling around the city but probably wouldn't want to go too far in one.

[Bandersnatch]

On 5/30/2024 at 2:04 PM, josephbloggs said:

There was a guy asking about mini EVs in RHD but I can't remember which thread it was in - I thought this one but I can't find it.

The thread was:

 

Thailand Faces Economic Question: China and EV Cars in Thailand News

 

His name was @WDSmart

 

this is the car he wanted. I’ve already sent him the link
 

 

[Bandersnatch]

I often see quoted in this discussion by people who don’t own a EV in Thailand that EV insurance is crazy expensive and that EVs depreciate at an alarming rate here in Thailand.

 

So I thought I would post a quote and insured value for one my EVs.

 

It is an MG HS PHEV X with a 17kWh battery and it’s now 3 years old.

 

Maybe other EV owners can post their quotes to do a bit of myth busting?