Photoguy21 Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 I thought the Conservatives had been disbanded. Hasn't been much Conservatism for the last few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, JonnyF said: In most countries that would be the government, I'm surprised you didn't know... The extent to which salaries are taxed varies greatly between governments, but broadly speaking left wingers support high taxation and big government whereas right winger tend to support low taxation and smaller state interference. Any other basic questions? Forgive my unconcise grammar, and let’s follow your earlier insistence of UK, not ‘most counties’. Who in the UK is taxed most of their salary? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 6 minutes ago, JonnyF said: The point is that all parties have different opinions within that party. Claiming it is a conservative thing is inaccurate. Sunak and Truss have different approaches to certain issues, yes. If they all thought the same on every issue it would be like one of your lefty Twitter echo chambers which wouldn't be a great form of Democracy. Diametrically opposed on taxation is not a small matter. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 11 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Forgive my unconcise grammar, and let’s follow your earlier insistence of UK, not ‘most counties’. Who in the UK is taxed most of their salary? Denise Coates 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 25 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: The opposition is not the subject of discussion. Now do you deny the splits in the Tory party and that the two candidates sit either side of the significant split on fiscal policy? Well yes of course they do . That is the very nature of politics and also general human interaction . Politicians/people all have differing opinions . Politicians give their opinions and people vote accordingly . That is the very nature of democracy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 19 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Denise Coates Makes money from a vice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Just now, Chomper Higgot said: Makes money from a vice. You had to websearch her, didnt you ???? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 14 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Well yes of course they do . That is the very nature of politics and also general human interaction . Politicians/people all have differing opinions . Politicians give their opinions and people vote accordingly . That is the very nature of democracy Correct, but this isn’t a split between different parties, this is a split on fundamental fiscal policy between two candidates and their respective factions within the Tory Party. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: You had to websearch her, didnt you ???? No, she was the subject of a BBC Radio 4 program earlier this year. I certainly don’t need to Google the impact of her business on poverty in the UK. Edited July 21, 2022 by Chomper Higgot 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Correct, but this isn’t a split between different parties, this is a split on fundamental fiscal policy between two candidates and their respective factions within the Tory Party. Same situation still applies . Both candidates will state their opinion and policies and the ministers will vote on which one they agree with and the person with the most votes will be the new PM . That is is the very essence of democracy . Different people with different opinions and voters decide on which one will be successful . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DezLez Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Both candidates will state their opinion and policies and the ministers will vote on which one they agree with and the person with the most votes will be the new PM . The next step in the process now that it is down to the last two is a postal ballot by the members of the Conservative Party some time in August. It has nothing to do with MPs or ministers now. Edited July 21, 2022 by DezLez 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, DezLez said: The next step in the process now that it is down to the last two is a postal ballot by the members of the Conservative Part some time in August. It has nothing to do with MPs or ministers now. Well yes, but the same principals still apply . Whoever gets to cast the vote isn't such a relevant issue 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 15 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Same situation still applies . Both candidates will state their opinion and policies and the ministers will vote on which one they agree with and the person with the most votes will be the new PM . That is is the very essence of democracy . Different people with different opinions and voters decide on which one will be successful . That’s not correct. The two candidates have already been selected by the Parliamentary Conservative Party. The Constituency Conservative Party Members will now select which candidate shall be PM. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Well yes, but the same principals still apply . Whoever gets to cast the vote isn't such a relevant issue Well it is when the people who get to vote are so far removed from being representative of the population as a whole. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 59 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Forgive my unconcise grammar, and let’s follow your earlier insistence of UK, not ‘most counties’. Who in the UK is taxed most of their salary? Who is taxed most? You need specific names? Professions? Let's take a simple tradesman from Northumberland (since you're talking about counties now), a good honest chap named Albert. Let's say he earns 100 pounds. He has 75 pounds left after income tax. He spends 20 pounds on 2 packs of cigarettes (another 16 pounds in tax) and 55 pounds on half a tank of petrol for his car petrol (about 17 pounds of tax). How much of that 100 pounds went to the taxman? 58 for the taxman and 42 for the tradesman. 58 pounds is 'most' of 100 pounds. Under Labour it would probably be more like 65/35 with their crazy tax/spend other people's money policies. So you see, it is not only those evil rich people (evil Tories no doubt) that pay a lot of tax. It is the man in the street as well. So yes, I support lower tax for honest hard working people and if that's means less money to benefit scroungers and illegal immigrants then excuse me if I don't shed too many tears. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Well it is when the people who get to vote are so far removed from being representative of the population as a whole. This is an internal vote by the Conservatives to elect their new leader and thus not open to everyone . Of course people who vote Labour cannot vote in this "election" , otherwise they would vote for the candidate which suits them best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, JonnyF said: Who is taxed most? You need specific names? Professions? Let's take a simple tradesman from Northumberland (since you're talking about counties now), a good honest chap named Albert. Let's say he earns 100 pounds. He has 75 pounds left after income tax. He spends 20 pounds on 2 packs of cigarettes (another 16 pounds in tax) and 55 pounds on half a tank of petrol for his car petrol (about 17 pounds of tax). How much of that 100 pounds went to the taxman? 58 for the taxman and 42 for the tradesman. 58 pounds is 'most' of 100 pounds. Under Labour it would probably be more like 65/35 with their crazy tax/spend other people's money policies. So you see, it is not only those evil rich people (evil Tories no doubt) that pay a lot of tax. It is the man in the street as well. So yes, I support lower tax for honest hard working people and if that's means less money to benefit scroungers and illegal immigrants then excuse me if I don't shed too many tears. Add to that : Council tax , National insurance , V.A.T and probably a few other taxes as well , T.V licence , car tax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 7 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: This is an internal vote by the Conservatives to elect their new leader and thus not open to everyone . Of course people who vote Labour cannot vote in this "election" , otherwise they would vote for the candidate which suits them best You’ll recall I recently corrected your misunderstanding on how this works. I know how it works. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: You’ll recall I recently corrected your misunderstanding on how this works. I know how it works. Yes, and I replied to another poster who stated the same thing and my answer also applies to you . Its not really relevant as to whether the Ministers or Conservative members vote , the point was that the Politicians in question voice there opinion and those eligible to vote . they cast their vote . Whether they be other Ministers or Party members is beside the point , point being that a vote is cast by voters who decide which candidate they think is most suitable 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 20 minutes ago, JonnyF said: Who is taxed most? You need specific names? Professions? Let's take a simple tradesman from Northumberland (since you're talking about counties now), a good honest chap named Albert. Let's say he earns 100 pounds. He has 75 pounds left after income tax. He spends 20 pounds on 2 packs of cigarettes (another 16 pounds in tax) and 55 pounds on half a tank of petrol for his car petrol (about 17 pounds of tax). How much of that 100 pounds went to the taxman? 58 for the taxman and 42 for the tradesman. 58 pounds is 'most' of 100 pounds. Under Labour it would probably be more like 65/35 with their crazy tax/spend other people's money policies. So you see, it is not only those evil rich people (evil Tories no doubt) that pay a lot of tax. It is the man in the street as well. So yes, I support lower tax for honest hard working people and if that's means less money to benefit scroungers and illegal immigrants then excuse me if I don't shed too many tears. I don’t dispute ordinary people pay high taxes, they pay considerably more taxes proportional to their income than do the rich. Which is why I support a fairer distribution of the tax burden. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Yes, and I replied to another poster who stated the same thing and my answer also applies to you . Its not really relevant as to whether the Ministers or Conservative members vote , the point was that the Politicians in question voice there opinion and those eligible to vote . they cast their vote . Whether they be other Ministers or Party members is beside the point , point being that a vote is cast by voters who decide which candidate they think is most suitable Which doesn’t get away from the fact that the candidates are both presenting mutually exclusive tax and spending policies, indicative of the schism within the Tory Party. Neither candidate will fix that. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Just now, Chomper Higgot said: I don’t dispute ordinary people pay high taxes, they pay considerably more taxes proportional to their income than do the rich. Which is why I support a fairer distribution of the tax burden. Conservatives generally favour low taxation. Truss more than Sunak in this case. A free market economy with low tax and minimal government interference. Marvellous. Labour on the other hand would tax everyone more. They always do. Then spend it on frivolous projects that make their politicians feel all warm inside. They try to justify it by telling everyone how much they taxed those bad rich people and corporations, thus ensuring investment into the country goes down and the economy tanks. Except Blair of course, he ditched the virtue signalling and simply spent it on the illegal war with Bush ????. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said: Which doesn’t get away from the fact that the candidates are both presenting mutually exclusive tax and spending policies, indicative of the schism within the Tory Party. Neither candidate will fix that. It doesn't need to be "fixed" . That is how democracy works . Its only in places with no democratic process where all Politicians have the same opinion and opposing vires are unwelcome and clamped down on . Dictatorships are Countries where everyone has the same opinion and different views are not tolerated . 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 10 minutes ago, JonnyF said: Conservatives generally favour low taxation. Truss more than Sunak in this case. A free market economy with low tax and minimal government interference. Marvellous. Labour on the other hand would tax everyone more. They always do. Then spend it on frivolous projects that make their politicians feel all warm inside. They try to justify it by telling everyone how much they taxed those bad rich people and corporations, thus ensuring investment into the country goes down and the economy tanks. Except Blair of course, he ditched the virtue signalling and simply spent it on the illegal war with Bush ????. Odd then that this Tory Government has raised taxes to the highest level since WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 11 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Odd then that this Tory Government has raised taxes to the highest level since WW2. Not really - when you consider Covid19 and the War in Ukraine. What were you expecting after over 2 years of economic devastation? Free Candy for everyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said: Odd then that this Tory Government has raised taxes to the highest level since WW2. As you are in favour of high taxation , will you be voting Conservative in the next election ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Just now, Mac Mickmanus said: As you are in favour of high taxation , will you be voting Conservative in the next election ? Where did I say I was in favour of high taxation? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Mickmanus Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 Just now, Chomper Higgot said: Where did I say I was in favour of high taxation? I assumed that you were . Are you in favour of a higher taxation or do you favour lower taxation ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Mac Mickmanus said: Well yes, but the same principals still apply . Whoever gets to cast the vote isn't such a relevant issue You don’t think it is relevant who votes in the next pm? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chomper Higgot Posted July 21, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2022 6 minutes ago, Mac Mickmanus said: I assumed that you were . Are you in favour of a higher taxation or do you favour lower taxation ? I’m in favour of equitable taxation, the repeal of tax loopholes, the ending of offshore tax havens and the ending trusts as a means of tax evasion. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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