SSA payments to Thailand

[Noslenlsn]

Problems That Can Arise From Social Security Deposits To Bangkok Bank – Under a new law, the US government is now requiring Bangkok Bank to verify that everyone who is receiving Social Security benefits in Thailand is actually alive. So, every month, if you receive your Social Security benefits in Bangkok Bank, you will have to physically go to the bank and sign paperwork to be able to withdraw the money.  Is this for real or how to negative this without incurring a bunch of transfer fees each moth?

[KIngsofisaan]

So, the US wrote a law just to verify people receiving social security and living in Thailand are still alive?

 

What is the law? References?

[rodknock]

direct deposit to Bangkok bank has always required you to go to bank to do withdrawal.

[Dwig]

Yes it is required to set up a separate account for a SS check deposit.  You will not receive a debit card.  The only way to have access to your money is personally go to the bank and transfer to your regular account. 

[flexomike]

34 minutes ago, Dwig said:

Yes it is required to set up a separate account for a SS check deposit.  You will not receive a debit card.  The only way to have access to your money is personally go to the bank and transfer to your regular account. 

This is only true if you are getting the deposit by ACH from Bangkok Bank New York,  you can now do an International Direct Deposit to most banks in Thailand where you can also have a debit card and do not have to go into the bank. I have ACH deposits and have to go into the bank, my wife has IDD and does not have to. This change started over two years ago. 

[ubonjoe]

Nothing new it has been that way for many years.

Bangkok bank will only charge 2 fees and that is taken out by the branch in New York in USD ($5 or $10 dependent upon the amount that is received and a 200 baht minimum or .25%. here.

There is no additional charges after the funds are in your account.

You can also have your SSA transfered into any bank account here using International Direct Deposit that is transferred in Baht. Sign up form here. https://www.ssa.gov/forms/ssa-1199-op107.pdf

[flexomike]

3 hours ago, KIngsofisaan said:

So, the US wrote a law just to verify people receiving social security and living in Thailand are still alive?

 

What is the law? References?

It is just a report that you have to do once a year so that they know you are still alive, during Covid years they suspended it. This year they started it up again. This pertains for all US citizens collecting Social Security in a foreign country. In some countries you only have to do the report every other year.

[KIngsofisaan]

2 minutes ago, flexomike said:

It is just a report that you have to do once a year so that they know you are still alive, during Covid years they suspended it. This year they started it up again. This pertains for all US citizens collecting Social Security in a foreign country. In some countries you only have to do the report every other year.

Ok thanks

[gk10012001]

5 minutes ago, flexomike said:

It is just a report that you have to do once a year so that they know you are still alive, during Covid years they suspended it. This year they started it up again. This pertains for all US citizens collecting Social Security in a foreign country. In some countries you only have to do the report every other year.

Do they require the Alive thing if living in the USA, as far as they knowor if really living in the USA

[flexomike]

1 minute ago, gk10012001 said:

Do they require the Alive thing if living in the USA, as far as they knowor if really living in the USA

only if you are receiving your SS payment to a registered address in a foreign country, if a have a US address and you are getting your payments in the US you will not have to do the report

[CM Dad]

23 minutes ago, flexomike said:

It is just a report that you have to do once a year so that they know you are still alive, during Covid years they suspended it. This year they started it up again. This pertains for all US citizens collecting Social Security in a foreign country. In some countries you only have to do the report every other year.

I just received the form from SSA by mail.  I have been sent this form before.  I just fill it out and return it.  It is a very short form where questions are asked and you just tick boxes yes or no then sign it. It's a simple form and nothing to worry about.

[ifmu]

and the bank conversion rate    usd to thb is ?

[wpcoe]

When I lived in Thailand (up until 2020) I would get the annual letter mailed to my Thai address from the SSA asking me to reply or they would suspend my benefit.  I never had the SS payments made to Thailand – I always have had it direct deposited to my USA bank.  I did, however, have my permanent address in the SSA system as Thailand, so I think it's not only folks with ACH transfers to Bangkok Bank.

[soisanuk]

Prior to SSA including Thailand in the countries eligible for International Direct Deposit (IDD), the only way to get funds deposited direct was the Bangkok Bank Program which did require a separate account, no debit card, and a trip to a Bank branch to withdraw or transfer funds.

 

As mentioned, this changed a couple of years ago with the advent of IDD for Thailand. With IDD you can designate your bank in Thailand, it does not have to be Bangkok Bank, and your SS payment will be sent to your Thai bank for deposit - there are no restrictions on that account.

 

Another way to get SS payments is to use Wise transfer service.  You create a Wise Account which will have a US Automated Clearinghouse (ACH) Number which you use to designate the Wise bank and your Wise bank account number for SS to direct deposit your monthly payment in US dollars.  After it is deposited, you can log in to Wise and have all or a portion transferred to your Thai Bank account in baht (exchange rate is about the same as would be used by the Thai bank if the transfer was in US$). There are some nominal fees involved. 

 

I don't use this method, but a friend of mine has used this method for several years now with no problem.  I have my SS payment as well as monthly pension deposited in my USA bank account and use Wise to transfer the funds I need to my Bangkok Bank account.  Also, since I use the monthly income method for my retirement extensions, I select the "living in Thailand" reason in the drop down menu to note the purpose of the transfer (it is the last item on the list) so that it gets sent to Bangkok Bank rather than one of their other partner banks -- this ensures it shows up with the code "FTT" denoting it came from outside of Thailand rather than a domestic transfer from a partner bank (usually Kasikorn).

 

A caveat -  Wise will limit the transfer to no more than 50,000 baht unless it is to one of 3 specific Thai banks (as I recall) which is due to Thai rules.  Bangkok Bank is one of the 3 where this limit does not apply.

 

 

[Pib]

OP,

  Other than being new info to you there is nothing new about the annual/biennial SSA mailing of "Are You Still Alive" forms (form number 7161 or 7162) if you have a foreign address on-file with the SSA.  This has been occurring for decades.   It's formal name is called the Foreign Enforcement Questionnaire (FEQ) Program...readup about it at below SSA weblink.

https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0302655000e

 

  And no new law....nothing new about being required to use a special/restricted Bankgok Bank acct "if", repeat, if you have your SSA benefit paid through the Bangkok Bank New York Branch (ABA routing number 026008691) using that branch's ACH/ABA routing number to send to your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank acct special/restricted acct.  Or said another way you pension is being paid through the U.S. Automated Clearing House (ACH) system.  Bangkok Bank is the only Thai bank with the ability to receive payments via the ACH system and to receive reoccurring U.S. govt payment it had to be to a special/restricted account.   Nothing new....been used for decades. 

 

  Additionally, in 2019 the U.S. Treasury Department implemented a new rule requiring all U.S. banks to utilize the "International ACH Transfer (IAT)" transfer format for funds leaving the U.S.....like a person initiating a transfer from their U.S. bank acct to their Bangkok Bank acct.  Since very, very few U.S. banks offer ACH "IAT" transfer format (because they use the standard/domestic ACH format) this pretty much stopped all "personal transfers" going from U.S. banks to Bangkok Bank.  HOWEVER, U.S. govt payments like SSA payments which still use the standard/domestic ACH format are waived for now from this Treasury requirement as the SSA and other U.S. govt agencies develop ACH IAT transfer capability in their financial systems.

 

   BUT, in 2019 the SSA also began International Direct Deposit (IDD) to Thailand which uses the SWIFT versus ACH transfer system.  You now have two methods to have U.S. govt pensions paid to Thailand....ACH and IDD.  If having your SSA pension sent via IDD you can have it sent to "any Thai bank and to a regular saving acct"....no restrictions...not special....to any Thai bank...to include a Bangkok Bank regular acct which has zero restrictions....no need to personally visit a branch to withdraw/transfer money.  The SSA/U.S. Treasury does the exchange on their end and send baht instead of dollars.   Other U.S. govt agencies also offer IDD.  The IDD exchange rate averages out to be about 0.25% lower than the Bangkok Bank TT Buying Rate used for incoming foreign funds like a SSA payment made in dollars.  But the IDD method has lower fees....only one fee of Bt100 which is a BAHTNET system fee if you live in the metro Bangkok area.  If living outside the metro area and depending on your Thai bank there may be another  inter-province fee of around Bt75.   Total IDD fees are less than the total ACH method fees where Bangkok Bank NY branch typically takes a $5 or $10 slice and your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch takes a 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) receiving fee.  

 

  Considering exchange rate and fees if your govt pension is approx $1150 or more you will get more baht in your acct if using the ACH method but as mentioned earlier only Bangkok Bank offers the ACH method which requires the special/restricted acct.    But if  you receive less than approx $1150 then you will be better off using the IDD method in terms of most baht in your acct....and you can have the pension sent to any Thai bank regular acct.....even a Bangkok Bank regular acct.    Also, you will receive different coding on your Thai bank acct....for ACH Bangkok Bank will issue FTT/International Transfer Coding;  for IDD Thai banks including Bangkok Bank will issue Local/BAHTNET coding which makes it appear the funds came from within Thailand versus originating outside Thailand....this coding may be of concern for those using the monthly transfer method for extension of stay purpose.

 

    Yeap, nothing new....no new law.

 

 

 

 

[Longwood50]

I have a Bangkok Bank account.  I use a U.S. bank account to accept my social security.  As a direct deposit it makes my account free. I then transfer to Wise each month takes 1 day.  I then set up an automatic conversion to baht when it hits a specific exchange rate.  If you do a direct deposit with any bank the exchange rate is not as good and you take whatever the exchange rate is on that specific day which may be low.  When the exchange is made in my account I schedule a transfer from Wise to my Bankgok bank account.  

Better overall, in terms of cost and I still have a U.S. bank account in the event I need to pay for something there. 

[Wrwest]

6 hours ago, KIngsofisaan said:

So, the US wrote a law just to verify people receiving social security and living in Thailand are still alive?

 

What is the law? References?

I am only aware of the existence of American expats with addresses outside the USA and receiving their SS benefits in the foreign country receiving letters asking for, I believe, annual confirmation of life. My SS deposits are made to my US bank, then combined with additional funds are transferred monthly to Bangkok Bank. So, thinking this would not affect me or others in the same situation.

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, ifmu said:

and the bank conversion rate    usd to thb is ?

That varies with the exchange rate.   Knock a half baht off, and that's ballpark what shows up.  This month (1st week) to the low of Feb 2021 ...

 

Expecting 36.? something in about 10 day.  Maybe even 37 ... ????

[Wrwest]

12 minutes ago, Pib said:

OP,

  Other than being new info to you there is nothing new about the annual/biennial SSA mailing of "Are You Still Alive" forms (form number 7161 or 7162) if you have a foreign address on-file with the SSA.  This has been occurring for decades.   It's formal name is called the Foreign Enforcement Questionnaire (FEQ) Program...readup about it at below SSA weblink.

https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0302655000e

 

  And no new law....nothing new about being required to use a special/restricted Bankgok Bank acct "if", repeat, if you have your SSA benefit paid through the Bangkok Bank New York Branch (ABA routing number 026008691) using that branch's ACH/ABA routing number to send to your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank acct special/restricted acct.  Or said another way you pension is being paid through the U.S. Automated Clearing House (ACH) system.  Bangkok Bank is the only Thai bank with the ability to receive payments via the ACH system and to receive reoccurring U.S. govt payment it had to be to a special/restricted account.   Nothing new....been used for decades. 

 

  Additionally, in 2019 the U.S. Treasury Department implemented a new rule requiring all U.S. banks to utilize the "International ACH Transfer (IAT)" transfer format for funds leaving the U.S.....like a person initiating a transfer from their U.S. bank acct to their Bangkok Bank acct.  Since very, very few U.S. banks offer ACH "IAT" transfer format (because they use the standard/domestic ACH format) this pretty much stopped all "personal transfers" going from U.S. banks to Bangkok Bank.  HOWEVER, U.S. govt payments like SSA payments which still use the standard/domestic ACH format are waived for now from this Treasury requirement as the SSA and other U.S. govt agencies develop ACH IAT transfer capability in their financial systems.

 

   BUT, in 2019 the SSA also began International Direct Deposit (IDD) to Thailand which uses the SWIFT versus ACH transfer system.  You now have two methods to have U.S. govt pensions paid to Thailand....ACH and IDD.  If having your SSA pension sent via IDD you can have it sent to "any Thai bank and to a regular saving acct"....no restrictions...not special....to any Thai bank...to include a Bangkok Bank regular acct which has zero restrictions....no need to personally visit a branch to withdraw/transfer money.  The SSA/U.S. Treasury does the exchange on their end and send baht instead of dollars.   Other U.S. govt agencies also offer IDD.  The IDD exchange rate averages out to be about 0.25% lower than the Bangkok Bank TT Buying Rate used for incoming foreign funds like a SSA payment made in dollars.  But the IDD method has lower fees....only one fee of Bt100 which is a BAHTNET system fee if you live in the metro Bangkok area.  If living outside the metro area and depending on your Thai bank there may be another  inter-province fee of around Bt75.   Total IDD fees are less than the total ACH method fees where Bangkok Bank NY branch typically takes a $5 or $10 slice and your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch takes a 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) receiving fee.  

 

  Considering exchange rate and fees if your govt pension is approx $1150 or more you will get more baht in your acct if using the ACH method but as mentioned earlier only Bangkok Bank offers the ACH method which requires the special/restricted acct.    But if  you receive less than approx $1150 then you will be better off using the IDD method in terms of most baht in your acct....and you can have the pension sent to any Thai bank regular acct.....even a Bangkok Bank regular acct.    Also, you will receive different coding on your Thai bank acct....for ACH Bangkok Bank will issue FTT/International Transfer Coding;  for IDD Thai banks including Bangkok Bank will issue Local/BAHTNET coding which makes it appear the funds came from within Thailand versus originating outside Thailand....this coding may be of concern for those using the monthly transfer method for extension of stay purpose.

 

    Yeap, nothing new....no new law.

 

 

 

 

Thank you, well done.

[TucsonDavid]

Thanks for the excellent informative replies!!

[blackshadow]

7 hours ago, KIngsofisaan said:

So, the US wrote a law just to verify people receiving social security and living in Thailand are still alive?

 

What is the law? References?

have to do it for Uk pension.....prove that one is still alive

 

[Kwaibill]

5 hours ago, rodknock said:

direct deposit to Bangkok bank has always required you to go to bank to do withdrawal.

Not at all true. Been receiving SS direct deposit to Bkk Bank for years now, and take cash from ATM, make bank transfers, etc. all the time.

[Kwaibill]

For the first time, this year, I did receive a notice from SS US requiring confirmation of a few details, none of them difficult or invasive. My wife insisted on paying premium return shipping because of a notice that future payments might be suspended if the form was not back within 60 days, where I would have just stuck 85 baht in stamps and mailed it back.????

[Pib]

22 minutes ago, Kwaibill said:

Not at all true. Been receiving SS direct deposit to Bkk Bank for years now, and take cash from ATM, make bank transfers, etc. all the time.

You have just been lucky Bangkok Bank has not spotted your monthly payment as a U.S. govt payment.   Around a dozen years ago I changed my military retirement pension to go to my regular Bangkok Bank acct....that monthly pension flowed fine for a few months.  Then one month it was late....it was in July.....by the 10th or so it hadn't posted to my acct and I had decided I would call Bangkok Bank about it the next day.  But next morning a letter from Bangkok Bank show up in my mailbox saying my July payment was on-hold as it was a reocccuring U.S. govt payment via ACH and I must setup a restricted/special acct for the payment.  My branch is on Silom Rd in Bangkok.  Once doing this the payment that was on-hold would be transferred to the new acct and I would need to notify the military pension agency of the new acct for future payments.  I had two weeks to come setup the new acct or Bangkok Bank said they would send the payment back.  I went in...setup the new acct....notified mil pension folks of the new acct and payment began flowing no problem again.  But I later stopped using that method as I switched to other methods. 

 

 Yeap...you'll just been lucky (so far)...be thankful your local branch has allowed it which goes against Bangkok Bank policy.   Frankly, I'm surprised HQ Bangkok Bank has not spotted it since incoming foreign transfers flow them them on to the local branch.  

 

See the Bangkok Bank weblink below where it talks U.S. Govt Agency Direct Deposit via ACH (i.e., using the Bangkok Bank NY branch ACH/ABA routing number)....it describes the requirement for a special/restricted acct for reoccurring U.S. govt payments.   And this is not unique to Thailand....it ditto for some banks in the Philippines which also have ACH receiving capability.

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-US-to-Thailand-via-Bangkok-Bank-NewYork-branch

[wpcoe]

1 hour ago, Wrwest said:

I am only aware of the existence of American expats with addresses outside the USA and receiving their SS benefits in the foreign country receiving letters asking for, I believe, annual confirmation of life. My SS deposits are made to my US bank, then combined with additional funds are transferred monthly to Bangkok Bank. So, thinking this would not affect me or others in the same situation.

It's not only "American expats with addresses outside the USA and receiving their SS benefits in the foreign country," It's "American expats with addresses outside the USA."  I had my Thai address on file with the SSA, but always had my SS checks direct deposited to my US bank, never overseas, and I got the annual "are you still alive?" letter.

[flexomike]

5 hours ago, gk10012001 said:

Do they require the Alive thing if living in the USA, as far as they knowor if really living in the USA

not required if living in the US

[flexomike]

22 minutes ago, wpcoe said:

It's not only "American expats with addresses outside the USA and receiving their SS benefits in the foreign country," It's "American expats with addresses outside the USA."  I had my Thai address on file with the SSA, but always had my SS checks direct deposited to my US bank, never overseas, and I got the annual "are you still alive?" letter.

If you have a foreign address registered with SS you will, or should anyway get the form to fill out

[flexomike]

3 minutes ago, flexomike said:

not required if living in the US

and getting the SS sent to a US bank, unless you have a foreign address registered with SS

 

[portlandtree]

13 hours ago, Dwig said:

Yes it is required to set up a separate account for a SS check deposit.  You will not receive a debit card.  The only way to have access to your money is personally go to the bank and transfer to your regular account. 

This is stupidity! Why in Thailand? Why don’t they check i USA as that’s where all the frauders are <deleted> I just transfer all my money to stocks when I get to much the rest I keep in a us bank then when I need cheddar I use wise to transfers to bangkok bank for a small fee no Shyam I going to the bank more then once a year need cheddar the atm gives it for free NO FEES

[1FinickyOne]

12 hours ago, CM Dad said:

I just received the form from SSA by mail.  I have been sent this form before.  I just fill it out and return it.  It is a very short form where questions are asked and you just tick boxes yes or no then sign it. It's a simple form and nothing to worry about.

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