Fine for No Driving License

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, pjmorton said:

I have a fully valid Thai driver licence, but I usually carry a laminated copy in my wallet to minimize the likelihood of loss or theft. The originals remain at home in my safe. I have never been stopped, so I don't know if I am committing some kind of violation by not carrying the original. I do the same with vaccination certificates and passport and tabien baan. Does anyone know from experience whether I am asking for trouble?

No violation...  IF you keep a copy on your phone on the DLT App. 

DLT QR Licence

 

 

[richard_smith237]

On 11/12/2022 at 10:02 AM, jvs said:

Oh no,i don't have an Australian license!

What can i do?

You must not live in Thailand but are telling everyone who does live here

what to do?

Give it a rest.

Of course he lives in Thailand...  accusing him of not is just some sort of juvenile cheap-shot to try and score a hit to his credibility on THIS subject. 

 

The example provided was of Being in Thailand with an Australian licence, just as I have with a UK licence. 

 

Legally, an Australian or a Brit; or anyone from any other nation whose licence is in English (with a Photo ID) is a signatory to the 1968 Vienna convention on road traffic, can drive in Thailand on their home licence without an IDP if they are not a resident of Thailand.

[IvorBiggun2]

38 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

It would be interesting to see an insurance policy which states that...

It is a fact. The insurance is cancelled if a Thai licensed is not obtained within 60 days of arrival. That is not on applying for insurance.

 

Quote

First of all, the law requires drivers to obtain a Thai driver's license after residing in the country for more than 60 days.

If you have no license then you have no insurance. Simple innit?

https://homeinphuket.com/blog/how-obtain-thai-driving-license#:~:text=First of all%2C the law,or not wearing a helmet.

[skatewash]

2 hours ago, pjmorton said:

I have a fully valid Thai driver licence, but I usually carry a laminated copy in my wallet to minimize the likelihood of loss or theft. The originals remain at home in my safe. I have never been stopped, so I don't know if I am committing some kind of violation by not carrying the original. I do the same with vaccination certificates and passport and tabien baan. Does anyone know from experience whether I am asking for trouble?

I think you need to carry the original Thai driving license.  If you were to lose it, then the cost is very minor, you just go to the Land Transport Office and you can get a new one on the spot.  Note however, that many (most) LTOs insist that you first show a police report for the lost license.  These are easy to get at any police station and there is usually no charge for the report.

In the unlikely event that you lose your Thai driver's license outside of Thailand, do not mention that fact when you report your driver's license lost at a police station in Thailand.  They will assume you lost it in Thailand and that's all to the good.  This advice is from hard-won experience.  The process of getting a police report for a license lost in Thailand couldn't be easier.  The process for getting a Thai police report for a license lost outside Thailand is so complex it can scarcely be imagined.  This is the advice I ultimately received from the Tourist Police.  All Thai licenses are only ever lost in Thailand.  Remember that. ????

[Aussieroaming]

I'd be more worried about not being insured if you are seriously injured in a vehicle accident and do not have a valid licence. Medical expenses will bankrupt you, forget the 1000 baht petty cash.

[Aussieroaming]

Also, if you have a valid IDP then why not get it mailed to you?

[richard_smith237]

34 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

It would be interesting to see an insurance policy which states that...

It is a fact. The insurance is cancelled if a Thai licensed is not obtained within 60 days of arrival. That is not on applying for insurance.

I assume you mean ‘Void’ (not cancelled)....  but no, it is the car which is insured... 

Someone on a Tourist Visa and a UK license could drive our car without issue no matter how long they had been in country.

 

34 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

 

Quote

First of all, the law requires drivers to obtain a Thai driver's license after residing in the country for more than 60 days.

 

Residing....  Thats the key word there....  In this context it means a foreigner on a Resident Visa. 

 

Foreigners with a Resident Visa (i.e. Non Imm) must get a Thai Licence.

 

Tourists and those on Visa ‘can’ get a Thai Licence IF they can secure the right paperwork (specifically Certificate of address (from immigration) or Affirmation of Residence (from Embassy)).

 

Otherwise: Tourist’s can drive on their home country licence under conditions 

a) Without an IDP IF their home country licence is in English (and part of 1968 convention).

b) With an IDP their home country licence is in English (and part of 1968 convention).

 

An IDP is valid for 1 year - they can simply renew after one year and continue driving legally. 

These laws assume that a ’Tourist’ cannot stay in Thailand for that long.

 

34 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

If you have no license then you have no insurance. Simple innit?

https://homeinphuket.com/blog/how-obtain-thai-driving-license#:~:text=First of all%2C the law,or not wearing a helmet.

Also not quite true: In Thailand, in most cases it is the car which is insured not the person. 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

31 minutes ago, skatewash said:

I think you need to carry the original Thai driving license. 

Not true: You can use the DLT QR App (shown a couple of posts above). 

Risk there is, the App crashing etc... so its good to have the physical licence. 

 

This App was put in place to reduce roadside corruption... i.e. Police officers taking your Thai DL and holding it ransom until you pay the ‘roadside fine’....  The BiB are no longer permitted to take and hold onto your Driving Licence, although many were still doing this. Now all you need to show them is the App. Of course, then the BiB have your phone and potentially a bigger bargaining chip, but that is perhaps a step too far and the BiB are not quite that ballsy just yet !!!

 

 

31 minutes ago, skatewash said:

All Thai licenses are only ever lost in Thailand.  Remember that. ????

Excellent advice !!!....  I’ll remember that ‘just incase’ I ever do lose my licence overseas.

 

That said: Thai’s no longer need a police report to replace a lost licence (Wife lost hers), I assume this is also the same for foreigners, but I’m not sure. 

It could also vary from province to province and DLT office to DLT office.

[ujayujay]

Anyway, If living in Thailand the International DL is only valid first 3 months in combination with your national license, afterwards a Thai DL is mandatory.

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

Anyway, If living in Thailand the International DL is only valid first 3 months in combination with your national license, afterwards a Thai DL is mandatory.

Really ??? - where does it say that ???? 

 

The IDP is valid for 12 months.

 

The requirement to switch to a Thai DL depends on your visa status. 

 

 

 

 

 

[kidneyw]

On 11/12/2022 at 7:12 AM, Joeski said:

until I get the Thai License is there anything I can do to avoid the 1000 baht fine

Get the wife to drive you.

[richard_smith237]

21 minutes ago, Aussieroaming said:

Also, if you have a valid IDP then why not get it mailed to you?

A good option IF there is someone at his address from which to mail the IDP.

But, this goes back to whether the IDP is needed at all ? - It depends on which country issued the Ops DL and what his visa status is here. 

 

iF the Op is on a Non-Imm visa - he needs a Thai DL. 

 

 

 

Also note: (In the UK at least) the IDP must be obtained in person, it cannot be obtained online etc.

[skatewash]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Really ??? - where does it say that ???? 

 

The IDP is valid for 12 months.

 

The requirement to switch to a Thai DL depends on your visa status. 

 

 

 

 

 

A foreign license with IDP is valid until 90 days since entry to Thailand, or until the expiration of the license or IDP, whichever comes first.  However, determining how long someone has been in Thailand without recourse to your passport or at least passport number is problematic.  So as a practical matter it is not checked at your typical police checkpoint.  However, should there be a serious accident it certainly could be checked.

[richard_smith237]

25 minutes ago, Aussieroaming said:

I'd be more worried about not being insured if you are seriously injured in a vehicle accident and do not have a valid licence. Medical expenses will bankrupt you, forget the 1000 baht petty cash.

Valid point... With all the Ambiguity and various circular requirements and regulations based on Nationality of home country license, Visa Status etc... with the BiB not knowing the specifics of their own Laws etc....  

... the most logical options are: Get a Thai Licence ASAP and having an IDP will not hurt your case if stopped by the BiB, in fact its more likely to appease them in their absence of legal knowledge rather than having to explain to them that they are wrong and you are right that you don’t need an IDP...  

... The BiB won’t have heard of and won’t care for the 1968 Vienna convention or care for the Road Traffic Act. 

 

 

[IvorBiggun2]

4 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

The IDP is valid for 12 months.

 

The requirement to switch to a Thai DL depends on your visa status. 

 

You are completely wrong. An IDP  may be valid for 12 months in other countries but in Thailand it's only valid for the first 60 days of you entering Thailand. Thereafter a Thai license must be obtained. No driving license then negates your insurance. This question was sorted out recently on here. 

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, skatewash said:

10 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Really ??? - where does it say that ???? 

 

The IDP is valid for 12 months.

 

The requirement to switch to a Thai DL depends on your visa status. 

 

 

 

 

 

Expand  

A foreign license with IDP is valid until 90 days since entry to Thailand, or until the expiration of the license or IDP, whichever comes first.  However, determining how long someone has been in Thailand without recourse to your passport or at least passport number is problematic.  So as a practical matter it is not checked at your typical police checkpoint.  However, should there be a serious accident it certainly could be checked.

I used to believe so too.... based on ‘hearsay’ on various webforms such as this etc... 

 

There is a lot of misinformation and ambiguity surrounding IDP’s and how long we can drive here, for how long etc.

 

I have never found a source which states this 90 days limit. 

I have never seen an insurance document which states this 90 days limit. 

 

 

 

 

[IvorBiggun2]

8 minutes ago, skatewash said:

A foreign license with IDP is valid until 90 days since entry to Thailand,

Cud well be 90 days as you say but 60 days sticks in my mind.

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

You are completely wrong. An IDP  may be valid for 12 months in other countries but in Thailand it's only valid for the first 60 days of you entering Thailand. Thereafter a Thai license must be obtained. No driving license then negates your insurance. This question was sorted out recently on here. 

I too used to believe the IDP was valid for (90 days actually) after entry. 

I have never seen a source for this information. 

 

Thus: I would happily be re-educated if provided with an accurate and official source.

(note embassy pages etc are notoriously inaccurate). 

 

 

[skatewash]

1 minute ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Cud well be 90 days as you say but 60 days sticks in my mind.

 

4 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I used to believe so too.... based on ‘hearsay’ on various webforms such as this etc... 

 

There is a lot of misinformation and ambiguity surrounding IDP’s and how long we can drive here, for how long etc.

 

I have never found a source which states this 90 days limit. 

I have never seen an insurance document which states this 90 days limit. 

 

 

 

 

90 days makes sense (although I'm not going to search for the legal reference now) if you realize that someone staying legally in Thailand longer than 90 days just about has to be on a long term visa or extension of stay.

But as a practical matter since police officers don't ask to see your passport or indeed ask you for your passport number there's not an easy way for them to determine how long you've been in Thailand (more than 90 or less than 90 days) other than asking you.  Given this if you attempted to use an foreign license and IDP beyond this 90 day period my guess is that you would be successful in regard to not getting a ticket for not having a valid license.  What would happen in a serious accident where insurance companies are involved and there are financial stakes is perhaps another matter.

[mjakob007]

On 11/12/2022 at 8:43 AM, BritManToo said:

They want 1kbht in Chiang Mai as well these days.

correct

should be post pandemic blues

[IvorBiggun2]

Skatewash is right. It's 90 days of driving on a IDP before you have to get a Thai license.

 

Quote

Note: Although International Driving Licences are valid for up to one year after arrival in Thailand, after three months many comprehensive insurance policies are made void if still driving on a foreign licence.

 

 

https://www.angloinfo.com/how-to/thailand/transport/driving-licences

Edited November 15, 2022 by IvorBiggun2

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, skatewash said:

90 days makes sense (although I'm not going to search for the legal reference now) if you realize that someone staying legally in Thailand longer than 90 days just about has to be on a long term visa or extension of stay.

This is from where I suspect the initial ‘misunderstanding may have arise’....  someone has tied in permission of stay, to permission to drive.

 

There is an overlapping requirement of Visa Status / Permission to drive for residents (those on resident Visas such as Non-Imm) who are required to get a Thai Licence - although I’ve never read of a limit on that, but understand it to be 90 days. 

 

I suspect some have mixed this up and its been regurgitated and reposted on various other non-official sites. 

 

3 minutes ago, skatewash said:

But as a practical matter since police officers don't ask to see your passport or indeed ask you for your passport number there's not an easy way for them to determine how long you've been in Thailand (more than 90 or less than 90 days) other than asking you.  Given this if you attempted to use an foreign license and IDP beyond this 90 day period my guess is that you would be successful in regard to not getting a ticket for not having a valid license.  What would happen in a serious accident where insurance companies are involved and there are financial stakes is perhaps another matter.

 

[Jimjim1]

On 11/12/2022 at 1:58 AM, Sparktrader said:

I dont tell them anything. Never been asked.

Ah so the sound advice and the correct way to behave comes from a complete lack of knowledge about the Thai way in instances such as this?

 

To the poster go with the advice about not paying on the spot, tell the cop you have to go the bank and request a ticket to be presented at the police station you may even find the price is dropped

.
Further whilst I have never been stopped I have been asked every  time for my IDL and my DL from my own country which have been photocopied along with my PP when hiring a car in Thailand.

[cyril sneer]

you'll get a fine even with the correct documents/license

 

best just to stay in your room and take a taxi if it's a must

[Sparktrader]

5 minutes ago, Jimjim1 said:

Further whilst I have never been stopped I have been asked every  time for my IDL

Its an IDP not IDL. So they asked you whilst travelling at speed then. Your post makes no sense.

[DrJoy]

On 11/12/2022 at 8:43 AM, BritManToo said:

They want 1kbht in Chiang Mai as well these days.

Insist on a ticket its 400 baht, can be paid at any Police Station/Krungthai Bank branch.

[richard_smith237]

13 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Skatewash is right. It's 90 days of driving on a IDP before you have to get a Thai license.

 

https://www.angloinfo.com/how-to/thailand/transport/driving-licences

Quoted below from your link above...   ‘many comprehensive insurance policies.....’....

 

This link does not state any legal limit on the validity of IDP after entering the country. 

 

I’m yet to see an official source (from DLT / Road or Land Traffic Act) which places a time limit on an IPD from entry into Thailand. 

 

 

Quote

Note: Although International Driving Licences are valid for up to one year after arrival in Thailand, after three months many comprehensive insurance policies are made void if still driving on a foreign licence.

 

[Peterw42]

 

Direct from the Thai Motor vehicle act (2522)

 

Section 42 bis.46 In the case where there is a bilateral agreement between the Government of Thailand and a foreign Government concerning reciprocal recognition of domestic driving licenses, an alien temporarily permitted to stay in the Kingdom under the law on immigration having a driving license issued by the competent official or a driving society recognized by the Government of the country under such bilateral agreement may use the driving license of such country in driving in the Kingdom in accordance with the category and type of vehicle specified in such driving license; provided that the existing Conventions and/or Agreements between the Government of Thailand and the Government of such country and all the provisions relating to the obligations of a driver under this Act must be complied.

 

 

By the letter of the law, home license is legal and an IDP isn't required "BUT" thai police will still ask for an IDP. 

 

I literally used to carry a copy of that paragraph above, in Thai, with my home country license. On the rare occasion I got police who insisted I needed an IDP, I showed it and was sent on my way.

Some will accept only home license, some will accept only an IDP, some want both.

 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2022 by Peterw42

[richard_smith237]

4 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Its an IDP not IDL. So they asked you whilst travelling at speed then. Your post makes no sense.

when hiring a car in Thailand.....

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

when hiring a car in Thailand.....

Hired in 11 cities. Not asked once for IDP. Rode past cops today. They could care less.