Crashed my ninja possible bent neck?

[ZXHY600]

Only photo I have. 

[Neilly]

2 hours ago, ZXHY600 said:

Only photo I have. 

That's the fork legs, not the frame...yeah go ahead and have them straightened, no worries. But they're cheap so just as well buy new ones

[ZXHY600]

4 minutes ago, Neilly said:

That's the fork legs, not the frame...yeah go ahead and have them straightened, no worries. But they're cheap so just as well buy new ones

Yeah I know. Don't have a photo of the neck unfortunately. 

[Neilly]

5 minutes ago, ZXHY600 said:

Yeah I know. Don't have a photo of the neck unfortunately. 

Your call, Baht 50k and call it new, with no niggling worries, or have it straightened...without seeing pic's I can't say one way or other.

[ZXHY600]

5 minutes ago, Neilly said:

Your call, Baht 50k and call it new, with no niggling worries, or have it straightened...without seeing pic's I can't say one way or other.

According to the mechanic no issues. They wouldn't do it if it weren't safe. I'll see if I can get a picture later. How much for new fork legs? 

[stubuzz]

18 minutes ago, ZXHY600 said:

According to the mechanic no issues. They wouldn't do it if it weren't safe.

This is Thailand.

[ZXHY600]

14 minutes ago, stubuzz said:

This is Thailand.

Yes true. But owner is foreigner. According to them no creases no cracks. 

[Orinoco]

Let Somchai repair it, then sell it to Shomchai's brother.

 

Seriously, if an aluminum alloy frame/ head stock.

don't trust the locals. they will cut corrners to save money. not you. 

TIT.

 

[Damrongsak]

Aluminum alloys that have been heat treated to a high degree, such as 6061-T6, don't take kindly to being bent/formed. 

[daveAustin]

My option, fwiw, don't F around bending sh.1t back on a bike above 50cc. 

[LS24]

Hi OP, I hope you are okay after your incident. It can be a bit of a shock when you have an impact.

Straightening fork stanchions such as the bent ones in your photo. The forks are connected to the fork stem and lower triple clamp/tree. The fork stem goes through the frame head stock and supported by an upper and lower bearing. The upper trip clamp ties the top of the forks to the top of the fork stem.

 

On multiple bikes, the fork stem can be pressed out of the lower triple clamps if they are bent but replacement triples are easy to source second hand from a bike dismantler.
 

Fork stanchions can often be straightened simply if there is no impact dents, pitting of the chrome or peeling of the chrome coating. Coatings can be reapplied bu then you might be better off with second hand units or whole second hand forks. Be sure to dismantle the second hand forks and add new fluids and possibly cartridge emulator valves. They will help you brake faster and safer and give you a much improved ride.

If frame head is damaged, first look at the bearing races and check for correct shape. Call one of the big insurance companies in TH and ask for a repairer that they use. Contact that repairer and ask them to define if a frame is suitable for repair or not. Also ask what those repair methods might be. Then you are armed with info to compare what your personal repairer is suggesting.

As someone else mentioned, changing frame means a whole lot of time to physically do it and then you have all the paperwork of frame and engine numbers not working. If the frame is not repairable, I would certainly consider parting the bike out or selling it complete to a dismantler or someone wanting one to repair their own bike or someone looking for a race track only bike.

 

Let us know what you decide and how you get on.

 

[Kwasaki]

On 1/11/2023 at 7:13 PM, Orinoco said:

Let Somchai repair it, then sell it to Shomchai's brother.

 

Seriously, if an aluminum alloy frame/ head stock.

don't trust the locals. they will cut corrners to save money. not you. 

TIT.

 

Steel frame and would of thought the forks would be damaged before a steel head stock,  tough bit of frame kit that. 

[Kwasaki]

1 hour ago, Onroadz bike rental said:

If you have crashed your Ninja motorcycle, it is possible that the neck of the frame (the part that connects the front and rear sections of the frame) may be bent. This can happen in a crash if the force of the impact is concentrated on the neck of the frame. A bent neck can affect the handling and stability of the motorcycle, and it will require professional repair to fix.

It's important to check the bike and inspect the frame, especially the neck, for any visible signs of damage. If you suspect the neck is bent, you should not ride the bike and should have it inspected by a professional motorcycle mechanic as soon as possible.

The best way to determine if the neck is bent is to take your bike to a professional motorcycle mechanic who can check it using special equipment. They will be able to tell you whether the neck is bent and, if so, how severe the damage is and what kind of repair is required.

It is important to note that riding a motorcycle with a bent neck can be dangerous and can lead to further damage or even accidents. So please do not ride the bike until it's fixed.
Bike Rentals in Bangalore Starting @ 8/Hr - Onroadz.in

Sorry I don't get people here, the measuring of the angle of the dangle of the leading fork sleeves is required yes.

 

It will be the forks that will be damaged first with a head on.

 

If the fork sleeve damage is minimal then i doubt there will be head stock damage apart from bearings which you would replace as a matter of course. 

[LS24]

20 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Sorry I don't get people here, the measuring of the angle of the dangle of the leading fork sleeves is required yes.

 

It will be the forks that will be damaged first with a head on.

Maybe you missed where Onroadz said: "This can happen in a crash if the force of the impact is concentrated on the neck of the frame. "

It is logical that if the impact or part of the impact was between the top of bottom triple clamps that there could be shunt damage to the head stock.

 

The same could also happen if the impact was below the triple but close enough to it where the force on the fork stanchion was in shear. That however would likely show shunt damage on the fork stanchion - not sure. Never tested it.

 

Flat bed trailer and pickup tray on some vehicles would be at heights that could potentially cause damage that Onroadz suggests should the force be high enough.

 

[Kwasaki]

1 minute ago, LS24 said:

Maybe you missed where Onroadz said: "This can happen in a crash if the force of the impact is concentrated on the neck of the frame. "

It is logical that if the impact or part of the impact was between the top of bottom triple clamps that there could be shunt damage to the head stock.

 

The same could also happen if the impact was below the triple but close enough to it where the force on the fork stanchion was in shear. That however would likely show shunt damage on the fork stanchion - not sure. Never tested it.

 

Or are you suggesting that an impact should never happen on a bike at headlight level as first impact or at least heavy impact? Because flat bed trailer and pickup tray on some vehicles would be at heights that could potentially cause damage that Onroadz suggests should the force be high enough.

Agree head stock can be damaged but I never came across a repairable bike with that kind of damage, a bike being crashed bad enough to do bend head stocks were written off and scrapped for parts. 

Just my experience in UK. 

[LS24]

4 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Agree head stock can be damaged but I never came across a repairable bike with that kind of damage, a bike being crashed bad enough to do bend head stocks were written off and scrapped for parts. 

Just my experience in UK. 

That is a very different response to how you replied to Onroadz.  It is good that you now ackknowledge that head stock damage can actually happen in a head on. People use this motorcycle forum for advice. It really does assist when posts are as factual as possible in such instances.

 

[Kwasaki]

52 minutes ago, LS24 said:

That is a very different response to how you replied to Onroadz.  It is good that you now ackknowledge that head stock damage can actually happen in a head on. People use this motorcycle forum for advice. It really does assist when posts are as factual as possible in such instances.

 

If you wanna take any notice of other people on here, up-to you. 

It was not a different response just didn't agree. 

Maybe you should read OP's post as I just did again. ????

He said front wheel hit the vehicle in front.

Then i noticed ninja 600 not 650.

So a different ball game. 

[LS24]

11 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Maybe you should read OP's post as I just did again. ????

 

Why? You stated "It will be the forks that will be damaged first with a head on. "

Notice you said "A head on", not the OP's accident. So the Op's accident was not relevant to your statement that frames can't be damaged in head ons. So my posts stand.

 

I'm waiting for a plane and am killing time. What's your excuse?

[Elkski]

Hitting a car with your front tire is can be a head on or any angle of glancing.  Looks to my like turned left wheel impact to me.  

2 ways to think of this.  Or 3.  Buy new, if fork  seal won't see any nicks or damaged finish then straighten, or just straighten it and worry about seal leaks later.   Of course is it bent without any visible fracture lines? I can straighten an aluminum arrow and make it fly well again but it will bend easier than a new arrow.  

[Kwasaki]

7 minutes ago, LS24 said:

Why? You stated "It will be the forks that will be damaged first with a head on. "

Notice you said "A head on", not the OP's accident. So the Op's accident was not relevant to your statement that frames can't be damaged in head ons. So my posts stand.

 

I'm waiting for a plane and am killing time. What's your excuse?

My excuse as a motorcycle engineer is not having to read posts of people like you who want to start an argument instead of working out the complexities of bike crashes of different bikes and different frames involving front on collisions.

 

If your happy with OP getting it fixed in Thailand personally I would need to see the shop the OP is taken his bike to and see what equipment they have to check motorcycle frame head stocks. 

 

Enjoy your flight. 

[LS24]

14 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

My excuse as a motorcycle engineer is not having to read posts of people like you who want to start an argument instead of working out the complexities of bike crashes of different bikes and different frames involving front on collisions.

 

I just quoted exactly what you said and questioned it and then I explanded on it with a post explaining my rationale. In a basic yet scientific and logical way. You know, the way and engineer would go about it.

A "motorcyle engineer" you say? in several recent posts you have enthralled us with such gems as not needing to check valve clearances as you just know instinctively when they are out. Is that what you were taught in motorcycle engineer school?

You have used hearsay and a distinct lack of facts in this post and others with typing that defy any rudimentary resemblance to anything that could even be remotely referred to as engineering.

Let's put two cases to you. The first is an impact from a head on where the wheel is the first point of impact with a force of say 8kN .

 

The second would be a shunt from a rear tray of a pickup that impacted directly at a height centre and perpendicular to the head stock with the same impact of 8kN.

 

No need for calculations but it should be easy for you to describe succinctly the transfer of force from the impact zones throughout out the bike's components in both instances for anyone claiming to be any type of engineer. I'd be really interested to hear a true motorcycle engineer's analysis.



 

[BananaStrong]

On 1/11/2023 at 6:35 PM, ZXHY600 said:

According to the mechanic no issues. They wouldn't do it if it weren't safe.

If they do it, they get paid

 

usually shops make the most on labor

 

I'd never sell you this snake oil if I thought it was bad for you!!!!!!  just give me your money!!!!! Thailand, land of no warranties and negligence...up to you

[Elkski]

1 hour ago, LS24 said:

I just quoted exactly what you said and questioned it and then I explanded on it with a post explaining my rationale. In a basic yet scientific and logical way. You know, the way and engineer would go about it.

A "motorcyle engineer" you say? in several recent posts you have enthralled us with such gems as not needing to check valve clearances as you just know instinctively when they are out. Is that what you were taught in motorcycle engineer school?

You have used hearsay and a distinct lack of facts in this post and others with typing that defy any rudimentary resemblance to anything that could even be remotely referred to as engineering.

Let's put two cases to you. The first is an impact from a head on where the wheel is the first point of impact with a force of say 8kN .

 

The second would be a shunt from a rear tray of a pickup that impacted directly at a height centre and perpendicular to the head stock with the same impact of 8kN.

 

No need for calculations but it should be easy for you to describe succinctly the transfer of force from the impact zones throughout out the bike's components in both instances for anyone claiming to be any type of engineer. I'd be really interested to hear a true motorcycle engineer's analysis.



 

Head on 8 kn.  So the forks bend but did they fail before the head tube sustained damage?  Did the bearings indent the races? Any chipped paint on the welds?  What is a shunt from a rear" tray"?   Do you mean the truck backs into the head tube and not the tire or fork struts? Seeing how creative Thai pe5are at fixing things so they "work" and knowing low cost, doing the minimum is standard I would want to see them do the repair and personally inspect the bearings and other parts while it is apart.  

[papa al]

Have it straightened,

sell it,

up to you.

My Thai mechanics fix this kind of stuff every day.

It's not rocket science.

[LS24]

3 hours ago, papa al said:

Have it straightened,

sell it,

up to you.

My Thai mechanics fix this kind of stuff every day.

It's not rocket science.

Correct Papa. But the difference is, the Thai repairers need to measure and use tools to fix things. 

 

Unlike one guy here who uses his only his "Jedi Mind" skills to sense tolerances mere mortals must use feeler gauges for.

 

Legend has it, that he can apparently sense the torque on a bolt just by visualising it, too. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

On 1/11/2023 at 9:28 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

If it is not too expensive, then I would let them straighten it and then sell the bike (and make sure the buyer knows that the bike has a crash).

"...and make sure the buyer knows that the bike has a crash" 

Er, yeah, right...make it difficult to sell and devalue it after having it properly repaired?

[Liverpool Lou]

On 1/11/2023 at 11:48 AM, papa al said:

On 1/11/2023 at 9:28 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

do you use it like you are supposed to use a Ninja 600?

Designed for race track.

...and the road, it's a road bike.

[Kwasaki]

18 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"...and make sure the buyer knows that the bike has a crash" 

Er, yeah, right...make it difficult to sell and devalue it after having it properly repaired?

One of my concerns would be does the Thai workshop have the proper equipment to examine or repair headstocks if so it's not a problem.

[LS24]

15 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

One of my concerns would be does the Thai workshop have the proper equipment to examine or repair headstocks if so it's not a problem.

Surely with your motorcycle engineering prowess, you would sense that as you walked in the front door.

 

As I mentioned in. Previous post referring to those who don't have ESP, I recommended the OP to contact insurance companies to seek our repairers that they recommend and then see for themselves.

 

That is common sense approach. Much like checking valve clearances with correct tools at correct service intervals. 

[Kwasaki]

On 1/11/2023 at 7:10 PM, ZXHY600 said:

Yes true. But owner is foreigner. According to them no creases no cracks. 

How's things, what's the workshop like.