Hamline University professor who lost job over Muhammad art sues

[Scott]

A professor who was let go from her job after showing a class an artwork depicting the Prophet Muhammad has sued her former university, alleging religious discrimination and defamation.

The case has raised issues of religious tolerance and academic freedom.

The basic facts are not being disputed.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64243344

[candide]

When universities, which are supposed to be institutions promoting free speech and critical mind, are subject to religious censorship, whatever the religion concerned, something is going wrong.

Edited January 19, 2023 by candide

[pacovl46]

Ridiculous! I hope she wins the trial and a nice lump sum!!! 

[Foghorn]

The head of the university should lose their job.  This religious bs is only one sided in the uk , islam has no restrictions 

[Skeptic7]

2023 and still pandering to absurd, idiotic beliefs and ignorance. 

[JonnyF]

6 hours ago, candide said:

When universities, which are supposed to be institutions promoting free speech and critical mind, are subject to religious censorship, whatever the religion concerned, something is going wrong.

That ship sailed long ago.

 

Universities now are places where you can get yourself 50,000 USD in debt in order to be indoctrinated into Woke ideology. I got my degree in the 90's. If I was 18 now, there's no way I'd go to Uni.

[brianthainess]

2 hours ago, Foghorn said:

The head of the university should lose their job.  This religious bs is only one sided in the uk , islam has no restrictions 

This was in the USA. just saying.

[Smokey and the Bandit]

1 hour ago, JonnyF said:

That ship sailed long ago.

 

Universities now are places where you can get yourself 50,000 USD in debt in order to be indoctrinated into Woke ideology. I got my degree in the 90's. If I was 18 now, there's no way I'd go to Uni.

Right and in the USA where this happened its getting worse, colleges are promoting their own agendas?

[JonnyF]

29 minutes ago, Smokey and the Bandit said:

Right and in the USA where this happened its getting worse, colleges are promoting their own agendas?

Indeed. They've always been dominated by left wing ideology but it is getting worse.

 

Thomas Sowell (the absolute legend) described the phenomenon very well.

 

 

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, JonnyF said:

Indeed. They've always been dominated by left wing ideology but it is getting worse.

 

Thomas Sowell (the absolute legend) described the phenomenon very well.

 

 

Not just the humanities departments.  Scientists, too.

Trends in American scientists’ political donations and implications for trust in science

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-022-01382-3

 

As Stephen Colbert once remarked i, it's a fact that reality has a liberal bias.

[Purdey]

Unfortunately, this is not the ordinary censorship we are accustomed to, like dirty words or nudity. Someone is likely to get stabbed in the street for showing a picture of the prophet. I am sure the University was aware of the likelihood of murders following. 

[placeholder]

6 minutes ago, Purdey said:

Unfortunately, this is not the ordinary censorship we are accustomed to, like dirty words or nudity. Someone is likely to get stabbed in the street for showing a picture of the prophet. I am sure the University was aware of the likelihood of murders following. 

Images of Mohammed have been part and parcel of courses at other Universities. No violence has ensued.

[Purdey]

19 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Images of Mohammed have been part and parcel of courses at other Universities. No violence has ensued.

Never heard of French teacher Samuel Paty? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Samuel_Paty

Showing pictures of Mohammed led to violence in Texas too. Whether in University or anywhere outside may lead to violence. 

https://edition.cnn.com/2015/05/04/us/garland-mohammed-drawing-contest-shooting/index.html

Edited January 20, 2023 by Purdey

[Hanaguma]

14 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Images of Mohammed have been part and parcel of courses at other Universities. No violence has ensued.

The insanity is that the teacher warned the students about it, gave them time to decide whether or not to see the image, allowed them to choose to turn off their screens (it was an online class) and also told them when the image was gone so they could safely rejoin the class. And STILL someone managed to be offended.  That takes a lot of effort on the part of the "victim".

 

The threat is real though. The only solution is for all industries and academia to simply say "no more".  Blasphemy laws do not apply in free countries. Those who demand them should be ridiculed and mocked mercilessly. 

[Chomper Higgot]

30 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Indeed. They've always been dominated by left wing ideology but it is getting worse.

 

Thomas Sowell (the absolute legend) described the phenomenon very well.

 

 

The problem with teaching people to think is they acquire the skills to see straight through rightwing propaganda and fear mongering.

 

It’s why so many MAGA supporters have little or no education beyond high school.

Hence the rightwing rants against education.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

5 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

The insanity is that the teacher warned the students about it, gave them time to decide whether or not to see the image, allowed them to choose to turn off their screens (it was an online class) and also told them when the image was gone so they could safely rejoin the class. And STILL someone managed to be offended.  That takes a lot of effort on the part of the "victim".

 

The threat is real though. The only solution is for all industries and academia to simply say "no more".  Blasphemy laws do not apply in free countries. Those who demand them should be ridiculed and mocked mercilessly. 

Let’s go a bit further.

 

Keep all religion out of schools, colleges, universities and Government at all levels and the Supreme Court.

 

Put all religion back where it belongs, a private matter not for public consumption. 

[BritManToo]

11 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

The threat is real though. The only solution is for all industries and academia to simply say "no more".  Blasphemy laws do not apply in free countries. Those who demand them should be ridiculed and mocked mercilessly. 

Those who demand them should be permanently removed from free countries.

[JonnyF]

26 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The problem with teaching people to think is they acquire the skills to see straight through rightwing propaganda and fear mongering.

 

It’s why so many MAGA supporters have little or no education beyond high school.

Hence the rightwing rants against education.

 

A strange post.

 

I'm not aware of any rightwing rants against education. 

 

In the UK it is the left wing Labour party that traditionally had their voting base in the working class, less well educated demographic. The wealthier, educated groups tended to vote Conservative.

 

My point (that you are unsuccessfully trying to twist) is that Universities should be politically neutral. They should teach critical thinking, free speech, not Woke ideology. Campus censorship in the UK is at an all time high, with many speakers being banned from speaking due to their ideas not aligning with the views of the University's administration. 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11015789/Students-warned-record-toll-cancelled-speakers-watchdog-threatens-intervene.html

 

  

[ballpoint]

42 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Let’s go a bit further.

 

Keep all religion out of schools, colleges, universities and Government at all levels and the Supreme Court.

 

Put all religion back where it belongs, a private matter not for public consumption. 

Exactly.  It's more than a little hypocritical to demand one's own puritanical religious views be forced on the whole country, and then throw a fit because someone else's puritanical religious views are being forced on a university.  

[Bluespunk]

From the OP

 

”Another advocacy group, the Muslim Public Affairs Council, came out with a full-throated defence of the professor. 
 

“Dr Prater was trying to emphasise a key principle of religious literacy: religions are not monolithic in nature, but rather, internally diverse," the group said.”

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, Purdey said:

Never heard of French teacher Samuel Paty? 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Samuel_Paty

Showing pictures of Mohammed led to violence in Texas too. Whether in University or anywhere outside may lead to violence. 

https://edition.cnn.com/2015/05/04/us/garland-mohammed-drawing-contest-shooting/index.html

The first took place in France where conditions are very different.

And the second incident in Texas had nothing to do with universities. It was about a politically charged event 

[mikeymike100]

In the USA there is no law saying you cannot draw a picture or painting of Muhammad?

If Muslims don't like it, they can move elsewhere?

[placeholder]

12 minutes ago, mikeymike100 said:

In the USA there is no law saying you cannot draw a picture or painting of Muhammad?

If Muslims don't like it, they can move elsewhere?

Actually, Muslims are free to dislike it. Just as other Americans are free to dislike activities they disagree with. Those other unhappy Americans can move elsewhere, too, right?

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, JonnyF said:

A strange post.

 

I'm not aware of any rightwing rants against education. 

 

In the UK it is the left wing Labour party that traditionally had their voting base in the working class, less well educated demographic. The wealthier, educated groups tended to vote Conservative.

 

My point (that you are unsuccessfully trying to twist) is that Universities should be politically neutral. They should teach critical thinking, free speech, not Woke ideology. Campus censorship in the UK is at an all time high, with many speakers being banned from speaking due to their ideas not aligning with the views of the University's administration. 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11015789/Students-warned-record-toll-cancelled-speakers-watchdog-threatens-intervene.html

 

  

Woke ideology is a fabrication of the rightwing culture wars, which is why you rely on the rightwing Daily Mail (with its proud history of supporting rightwing extremism).

[candide]

3 hours ago, JonnyF said:

A strange post.

 

I'm not aware of any rightwing rants against education. 

 

In the UK it is the left wing Labour party that traditionally had their voting base in the working class, less well educated demographic. The wealthier, educated groups tended to vote Conservative.

 

My point (that you are unsuccessfully trying to twist) is that Universities should be politically neutral. They should teach critical thinking, free speech, not Woke ideology. Campus censorship in the UK is at an all time high, with many speakers being banned from speaking due to their ideas not aligning with the views of the University's administration. 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11015789/Students-warned-record-toll-cancelled-speakers-watchdog-threatens-intervene.html

 

  

By definition, woke is a form of critical thinking.

Of course, the right-wing propaganda is presenting only a caricature of it, for political reasons.

[JonnyF]

23 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Woke ideology is a fabrication of the rightwing culture wars, which is why you rely on the rightwing Daily Mail (with its proud history of supporting rightwing extremism).

Are you suggesting Woke ideology does not exist? That's some incredible gaslighting, even by your standards.

 

Don't like the story so attack the source? OK, how about the OFS themselves? Are they rightwing extremists as well?

 

https://www.officeforstudents.org.uk/news-blog-and-events/press-and-media/almost-200-speakers-rejected-at-english-universities-and-colleges-in-2020-21/

 

 

 

 

 

[Purdey]

2 hours ago, placeholder said:

The first took place in France where conditions are very different.

And the second incident in Texas had nothing to do with universities. It was about a politically charged event 

Ok, so the USA being more violent than France should not concern teachers of repercussions. Second, the number of school shootings in the USA should not concern university professors.

Got it. 

[JonnyF]

12 minutes ago, candide said:

By definition, woke is a form of critical thinking.

Of course, the right-wing propaganda is presenting only a caricature of it, for political reasons.

And yet the individual who liked your post claims Woke ideology doesn't exist. Strange then, that she liked a post claiming it is a form of critical thinking. So which is it?

 

I don't believe Woke is a form of critical thinking, neither do I believe it is a fabrication by the right. Critical thinking relies on facts and evidence. Woke ideology is a tool to silence those who disagree with your extreme leftist views. It oftens takes the form of screaming "Racist" at someone even if the conversation has nothing to do with race ????.

[Chomper Higgot]

What this news item demonstrates is the danger of ‘self censorship’, the University administrators have bought into the fear mongering around Muslim sensibilities and have fire the professor.

 

Meanwhile American Muslim groups have spoken up in the Prof’s defense.

 

The university is a private business, there are no First Amendment rights involved so the issue will be settled around the employment contract both the Professor and the University signed.

I suspect an out of court settlement is the most likely outcome.

 

 

 

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

And yet the individual who liked your post claims Woke ideology doesn't exist. Strange then, that she liked a post claiming it is a form of critical thinking. So which is it?

 

I don't believe Woke is a form of critical thinking, neither do I believe it is a fabrication by the right. Critical thinking relies on facts and evidence. Woke ideology is a tool to silence those who disagree with your extreme leftist views. It oftens takes the form of screaming "Racist" at someone even if the conversation has nothing to do with race ????.

It's not ideology. It could be more accurately described as education. Higher levels of education are closely associated with "woke" attitudes. Ever wondered why universites tend to be liberal?

Edited January 20, 2023 by ozimoron