Wind turbine maker Vestas today announced that it’s figured out how to recycle all wind turbine blades – even ones already sitting in landfills.

The Danish company says it has discovered a solution that “renders epoxy-based turbine blades as circular, without the need for changing the design or composition of blade material.”

Vestas, Aarhus University, Danish Technological Institute, and epoxy maker Olin have developed a novel process that can chemically break down epoxy resin into virgin-grade materials.

https://electrek.co/2023/02/08/wind-turbine-recycle-blades/

 

Very cool hopefully the materials can be reused for their original purpose im thinking the op is saying that but not sure anyway that’s good news!

Well, this is good news, except for the anti-climate folks who have been using this as an example of how horrible renewables are will have to find something else to complain about.

1 hour ago, Credo said:

Well, this is good news, except for the anti-climate folks who have been using this as an example of how horrible renewables are will have to find something else to complain about.

And don’t forget old Donnie and his heart felt concern for our avian friends 

Now if they can keep birds from flying into these big blades and getting killed.

  Green people? How about the birds? Anyone?

   

2 hours ago, Stargeezr said:

Now if they can keep birds from flying into these big blades and getting killed.

  Green people? How about the birds? Anyone?

   

You think fossil fuels are comparatively benevolent to avian life?

6 hours ago, Stargeezr said:

Now if they can keep birds from flying into these big blades and getting killed.

  Green people? How about the birds? Anyone?

And the whales?

"Wind turbine maker Vestas today announced that it’s figured out how to recycle all wind turbine blades – even ones already sitting in landfills."

 

donate them to the Thai air force..........

On 2/11/2023 at 6:21 AM, Credo said:

Well, this is good news, except for the anti-climate folks who have been using this as an example of how horrible renewables are will have to find something else to complain about.

Quote any poster that has been saying renewables are "horrible"!

I haven't seen any poster "anti climate" or anti renewables, though some of us point out that there are many problems with them, they are not yet able to replace oil/ coal based generation and that the biggest polluters are nowhere near to phasing out oil based generation. Also they will probably make electricity more expensive to the consumer.

 

 

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Quote any poster that has been saying renewables are "horrible"!

I haven't seen any poster "anti climate" or anti renewables, though some of us point out that there are many problems with them, they are not yet able to replace oil/ coal based generation and that the biggest polluters are nowhere near to phasing out oil based generation. Also they will probably make electricity more expensive to the consumer.

 

 

Plenty of anti-climate posters.  But since you haven't seen them, they don't exist?  

37 minutes ago, Credo said:

Plenty of anti-climate posters.  But since you haven't seen them, they don't exist?  

Plenty of anti man made climate change posters.

there, I fixed it for you.

On 2/11/2023 at 4:48 AM, Stargeezr said:

Now if they can keep birds from flying into these big blades and getting killed.

  Green people? How about the birds? Anyone?

 

Pales into comparison with birds headbutting windows. 

22 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Plenty of anti man made climate change posters.

there, I fixed it for you.

You have a point. There is lots of ignorance on the subject out there.  On the part of people who claim that renewables will push up the cost of power, for example.

Cant say how much I despise wind turbines.

 

Another eu sponsored project to mask up all the problems those massive giant resource and land consuming turbines represent! 

 

A temporary bad solution we will regret.

10 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Cant say how much I despise wind turbines.

 

Another eu sponsored project to mask up all the problems those massive giant resource and land consuming turbines represent! 

 

A temporary bad solution we will regret.

There's no reason why onshore wind farms and agriculture can't co-exist.

 

Wind energy gives American farmers a new crop to sell in tough times

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/02/16/wind-energy-can-help-american-farmers-earn-money-avoid-bankruptcy/4695670002/

This is good news and sounds promising.

 

It would be interesting to know how much this costs to do and how much energy is used during the process (dismantling and transporting the massive blades to the chemical/recycling plant for example). Also exactly what chemicals are required, how they are manufactured and what are the by products of this chemical breakdown.

 

Because ultimately the cost of this process will be passed onto the consumer in the form of energy bills.

 

18 minutes ago, placeholder said:

There's no reason why onshore wind farms and agriculture can't co-exist.

 

Wind energy gives American farmers a new crop to sell in tough times

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/02/16/wind-energy-can-help-american-farmers-earn-money-avoid-bankruptcy/4695670002/

The whole point, windturbines is a temporary short sighted, resource demanding monster created to secure economy, not the environment. If we talked about environment solely, wind turbines would never see the daylight at the 21st century 

25 minutes ago, Hummin said:

The whole point, windturbines is a temporary short sighted, resource demanding monster created to secure economy, not the environment. If we talked about environment solely, wind turbines would never see the daylight at the 21st century 

Can you supply some actual evidence to support your assertion?

3 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Can you supply some actual evidence to support your assertion?

I can, but Im on my way out for today and tomorrow, so it have to wait. In the meantime you can if you want to search up the land areal we are giving up for these monsters, not only on flat farmland in Usa, insects and birds massacre, resources used to build and maintain, the whole industry behind how many workplaces it creates to keep on building, and service them and that is my main point. It is good for the economic but for the environment, the win goes up in the spinn. 

 

Need to be realistic because there is better solutions out there. At the same time we are forced to use electric and during the change we are using more on temporary solutions, than necessary. Again to keep the economic sustainable, not the environment.

 

Believe me, I believe human activity is part of clima change we now see, so please to not mistake for someone denying the facts as we know it. 

 

 

27 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I can, but Im on my way out for today and tomorrow, so it have to wait. In the meantime you can if you want to search up the land areal we are giving up for these monsters, not only on flat farmland in Usa, insects and birds massacre, resources used to build and maintain, the whole industry behind how many workplaces it creates to keep on building, and service them and that is my main point. It is good for the economic but for the environment, the win goes up in the spinn. 

 

Need to be realistic because there is better solutions out there. At the same time we are forced to use electric and during the change we are using more on temporary solutions, than necessary. Again to keep the economic sustainable, not the environment.

 

Believe me, I believe human activity is part of clima change we now see, so please to not mistake for someone denying the facts as we know it. 

 

 

Well, when it comes to which generates less CO2, wind power seems to beat photovoltaics.
How Wind Energy Can Help Us Breathe Easier

https://www.energy.gov/eere/wind/articles/how-wind-energy-can-help-us-breathe-easier

 

How Green Is Wind Power, Really? A New Report Tallies Up The Carbon Cost Of Renewables

"Analyst Deepa Venkateswaran at Bernstein Research looked into it. 

Citing data from the likes of National Renewable Energy Laboratory, Vestas, Siemens Gamesa Renewable Energy, and Bernstein estimates, Venkateswaran determined that the biggest contributors to the carbon footprint of wind turbines are steel, aluminum and the epoxy resins that hold pieces together — with the steel tower making up 30% of the carbon impact, the concrete foundation 17% and the carbon fiber and fiberglass blades 12%. 

Good news: amortizing the carbon cost over the decades-long lifespan of the equipment, Bernstein determined that wind power has a carbon footprint 99% less than coal-fired power plants, 98% less than natural gas, and a surprise 75% less than solar."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2021/04/28/how-green-is-wind-power-really-a-new-report-tallies-up-the-carbon-cost-of-renewables/?sh=15636c2a73cd

Edited February 13, 20233 yr by placeholder

35 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I can, but Im on my way out for today and tomorrow, so it have to wait. In the meantime you can if you want to search up the land areal we are giving up for these monsters, not only on flat farmland in Usa, insects and birds massacre, resources used to build and maintain, the whole industry behind how many workplaces it creates to keep on building, and service them and that is my main point. It is good for the economic but for the environment, the win goes up in the spinn. 

 

Need to be realistic because there is better solutions out there. At the same time we are forced to use electric and during the change we are using more on temporary solutions, than necessary. Again to keep the economic sustainable, not the environment.

 

Believe me, I believe human activity is part of clima change we now see, so please to not mistake for someone denying the facts as we know it. 

 

 

Another issue is the death of birds and bats due to wind power. There is clearly some basis for this but again the issue is relative. 

 

Donald Trump’s issue with windmills might not be about birds
If the president were really worried about birds, he’d be talking about cats — and probably wouldn’t be trying to scrap penalties for industries that kill birds

"The US Fish and Wildlife Service estimates that cats are responsible for the deaths of 2.4 billion birds each year. After that, collisions with building glass and vehicles are to blame for about another 800 million deaths. By comparison, about 230,000 birds are killed after colliding with a wind turbine every year.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/10/23/21530123/trump-presidential-debate-windmills-kill-birds#:~:text=The US Fish and Wildlife,a wind turbine every year.

 

Of course, this article was written about 2 years ago. As the number of wind turbines increase, the toll might go up. But not in any way that can approach the numbers killed by cats and buildings. Also, mitigaton efforts are under way. For example:

Biodiversity Mitigation Measures are Saving Bats from Wind Turbines

Working in collaboration with local wind farms, the Greater Kromme Stewardship (GKS) initiative, which focuses on conservation in the Kouga region, has noted the positive strides being made by some of the wind farms with regard to creating no net loss to biodiversity from their operations. Through the installation of acoustic deterrent devices on selected turbines, two wind farms in particular are seeing significantly reduced bat fatalities.  For some turbines this reduction can be as much as between 80% and 100%.

https://conservationmag.org/en/wildlife/biodiversity-mitigation-measures-are-saving-bats-from-wind-turbines

 

Here are few links to wider ranging reports of mitigation efforts.

 

Institutional acceptance of wildlife mitigation technologies for wind energy: The case of Israel

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S030142152200578X

 

Wind Power and Its Impact on Wildlife: A Look at Current Efforts to Minimize Harm

https://www.powermag.com/wind-power-and-its-impact-on-wildlife-a-look-at-current-efforts-to-minimize-harm/

17 hours ago, Hummin said:

I can, but Im on my way out for today and tomorrow, so it have to wait. In the meantime you can if you want to search up the land areal we are giving up for these monsters, not only on flat farmland in Usa, insects and birds massacre, resources used to build and maintain, the whole industry behind how many workplaces it creates to keep on building, and service them and that is my main point. It is good for the economic but for the environment, the win goes up in the spinn. 

 

Need to be realistic because there is better solutions out there. At the same time we are forced to use electric and during the change we are using more on temporary solutions, than necessary. Again to keep the economic sustainable, not the environment.

 

Believe me, I believe human activity is part of clima change we now see, so please to not mistake for someone denying the facts as we know it. 

 

 

If they subsidised solar panel technology so that everyone could put solar on their roofs, would it cost more than using windmills?

17 hours ago, Hummin said:

Believe me, I believe human activity is part of clima change we now see, so please to not mistake for someone denying the facts as we know it. 

It's not so much that I don't believe that humans have altered the atmosphere ( but one volcanic eruption would do more IMO ), rather that I think it's impossible to change it now, whatever we do. The damage is done and can't be rectified, so just learn to live with it- stop building in fire zones and flood areas, build sea walls, stop polluting the oceans with our trash, breed resistant varieties of food plants etc. Most importantly though, stop overpopulating the planet.

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's not so much that I don't believe that humans have altered the atmosphere ( but one volcanic eruption would do more IMO ), rather that I think it's impossible to change it now, whatever we do. The damage is done and can't be rectified, so just learn to live with it- stop building in fire zones and flood areas, build sea walls, stop polluting the oceans with our trash, breed resistant varieties of food plants etc. Most importantly though, stop overpopulating the planet.

False about volcanoes and false about impossible to alter the course of warming. And on the one hand you want to stop building in flood zone but on the other build sea walls? The other actions you mention make sense.

On 2/13/2023 at 10:09 AM, placeholder said:

Another issue is the death of birds and bats due to wind power. There is clearly some basis for this but again the issue is relative. 

 

Donald Trump’s issue with windmills might not be about birds
If the president were really worried about birds, he’d be talking about cats — and probably wouldn’t be trying to scrap penalties for industries that kill birds

"The US Fish and Wildlife Service estimates that cats are responsible for the deaths of 2.4 billion birds each year. After that, collisions with building glass and vehicles are to blame for about another 800 million deaths. By comparison, about 230,000 birds are killed after colliding with a wind turbine every year.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/10/23/21530123/trump-presidential-debate-windmills-kill-birds#:~:text=The US Fish and Wildlife,a wind turbine every year.

 

Of course, this article was written about 2 years ago. As the number of wind turbines increase, the toll might go up. But not in any way that can approach the numbers killed by cats and buildings. Also, mitigaton efforts are under way. For example:

Biodiversity Mitigation Measures are Saving Bats from Wind Turbines

Working in collaboration with local wind farms, the Greater Kromme Stewardship (GKS) initiative, which focuses on conservation in the Kouga region, has noted the positive strides being made by some of the wind farms with regard to creating no net loss to biodiversity from their operations. Through the installation of acoustic deterrent devices on selected turbines, two wind farms in particular are seeing significantly reduced bat fatalities.  For some turbines this reduction can be as much as between 80% and 100%.

https://conservationmag.org/en/wildlife/biodiversity-mitigation-measures-are-saving-bats-from-wind-turbines

 

Here are few links to wider ranging reports of mitigation efforts.

 

Institutional acceptance of wildlife mitigation technologies for wind energy: The case of Israel

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S030142152200578X

 

Wind Power and Its Impact on Wildlife: A Look at Current Efforts to Minimize Harm

https://www.powermag.com/wind-power-and-its-impact-on-wildlife-a-look-at-current-efforts-to-minimize-harm/

Back home, and I see you have covered most of the issues. Building down natural habitats , landscape and create vision and sound noise on top of that, leaving scars in Nature. But as you say, because of high electric prices, emissions numbers, loss of essential local fauna diversity we are willing to sacrifice that in something I mean is short sighted solution, as well investing in bioenergy.

 

 

Edited February 15, 20233 yr by Hummin

On 2/13/2023 at 7:30 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

Plenty of anti man made climate change posters.

there, I fixed it for you.

Most people don't bother drawing the distinction except to die hard anti climate change zealots. The thing is that ship has sailed. Not only are we in a natural cooling phase but natural climate change takes many thousands of years, nothing like the dozens of years that we have witnessed profound changes in climate running counter to the natural cycle. As such, denialists don't need to claim they understand that climate changes but somehow consider that man might have little or nothing to do with it and so need to make the distinction every time. So, should we happen not to mention that the climate change we are discussing is all man made, please don't insult our intelligence by "fixing" our comments. 

Edited February 15, 20233 yr by ozimoron

3 hours ago, Hummin said:

Back home, and I see you have covered most of the issues. Building down natural habitats , landscape and create vision and sound noise on top of that, leaving scars in Nature. But as you say, because of high electric prices, emissions numbers, loss of essential local fauna diversity we are willing to sacrifice that in something I mean is short sighted solution, as well investing in bioenergy.

 

 

It's a question of comparative harm. Fossil fuels are far worse. Some people seem to believe in the relative benefits of natural gas. First off, burning methane creates CO2. So more warning. Not only that, but mining methane results in the release of huge amounts of methane via leaks. Methane is 80 times more potent as a greenhouse gas than is carbon dioxide over the first 20 years of its release into the atmosphere.

 

Stanford-led study: Methane leaks are far worse than estimates, at least in New Mexico, but there’s hope

The amount of methane – a greenhouse gas 30 times more potent at trapping heat than carbon dioxide over 100 years – leaking from a huge U.S. oil and gas producing region is several times greater than the federal government estimates, according to a new study led by Stanford University.
Airplane-mounted sensor used by the researchers to detect methane leaks from oil and natural gas production in the New Mexico half of the Permian Basin. (Image credit: Kairos Aerospace)

Using airborne sensors able to detect methane leaks from individual oil and gas production facilities, the researchers studied the Permian Basin in New Mexico, one of the most expansive and highest-producing oil and gas regions in the world. They estimate that more than 9 percent of all methane produced in the region is being leaked into the skies, several-fold higher than Environmental Protection Agency estimates and well above those in the published literature. 

https://news.stanford.edu/press-releases/2022/03/24/methane-leaks-mues-fix-available/

 

As for uranium...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3653646/

https://www.biologicaldiversity.org/programs/public_lands/energy/dirty_energy_development/uranium/index.html

 

And what about decommissioning nuclear power plants? The costs have been massively underestimated.

https://content.csbs.utah.edu/~mli/Economies 5430-6430/Sovacool-Nuclear Power and Renewable Electricity in Asia.pdf

https://re.public.polimi.it/bitstream/11311/565407/1/Competitiveness of Small Medium New Generation Reactors a Comparative Study on decommissionig.pdf

https://www.letelegramme.fr/ar/viewarticle1024.php?aaaammjj=20071129&article=20071129-2063574&type=ar