Crazy electrical usage?

[cola1800]

Hello,
 

My first post on here, so apologies if this isn't the right area.
 

I've just moved into a new 1 room studio apartment in Chiang Mai, and figured I would be diligent about electrical usage.
 

They're charging 8 baht per unit for electric and a flat rate of 200 baht a month for water. Given my rent is in the $250/month range, I thought I'd be looking at another $60/month for electric if I was going to be using the aircon quite a lot.
 

However I've checked my meter after spending 24 hours here and I've already used 19 units (19 x 8 = 152 Baht!)... Surely that can't be right? Granted I've had the aircon on quite a bit, but regardless, at this rate I'm going to be paying nearly 5,000 Baht a month in electric for a freakin' 1 room small apartment?
 

I should add that the property manager/owner has been incredibly professional and courteous. Everything seems completely above board and the meters are on full display for all tenants to check. The property is also 75% full and is a modern build.
 

So what am I missing here? Is it really that expensive in 2023 for a small 1 room apartment? If so, what the heck are people with actual houses and multiple aircons, pool filters and so forth paying? I don't understand.
 

If anyone could share their daily usage amounts and associated costs that would be most appreciated. Perhaps someone can shed some light on this for me?
 

Thank you

[Snugs08]

Turn off the electric at your fuse box for an hour one evening, ensure the meter isn't spinning - note the number so you know it isn't spliced between your fuse box and meter, go for a beer an hour, see if any neighbor is pacing about when you return.

See if you can brace one night with a fan and see how the numbers change.

 

See if they just installed the cheapest grade air con by checking the model number and what energy rating it is - Thai's are superstitious about leaving all nasty yellow labels on everything - so if that's not showing on the aircon on a new build then you probably know it isn't a decent energy rating. It might be underpowered for the room size, check the BTU, calculations can be found online..

2-3k a month seems reasonable, 5k seems high though, what temperature is the aircon set to?

 

[KannikaP]

19 units does seem a lot for just one a/c, and of course your fridge, telly, PC etc etc. And 8 Bht per unit is against the law, they can only charge what the PEA charges them. But as said in another post, pay less for electricity and the rent will go up. I have an app called ECAS and I read my meter (electric & water) every morning as I must pass them to take doggy for his doo doo. Keep an accurate record of what you use. There is a PEA app also into which you can enter your consumption, and it will estimate what your bill should be. Hope this helps.

[Snugs08]

Just now, KannikaP said:

19 units does seem a lot for just one a/c, and of course your fridge, telly, PC etc etc. And 8 Bht per unit is against the law, they can only charge what the PEA charges them. But as said in another post, pay less for electricity and the rent will go up. I have an app called ECAS and I read my meter (electric & water) every morning as I must pass them to take doggy for his doo doo. Keep an accurate record of what you use. There is a PEA app also into which you can enter your consumption, and it will estimate what your bill should be. Hope this helps.

There are several caveats to that law though if I remember rightly, numbers of units, who owns the unit, etc..  and you haven't got a chance in hell of taking punitive action against them where you come out better, an outcome worse than an increase in rent to balance would be more probable.

[gargamon]

18 minutes ago, cola1800 said:

They're charging 8 baht per unit for electric and a flat rate of 200 baht a month for water

There's your problem. Real electric rates are around 4 baht per unit. Hopefully your lease term isn't too long. 

[cola1800]

1 minute ago, Snugs08 said:

Turn off the electric at your fuse box for an hour one evening, ensure the meter isn't spinning - note the number so you know it isn't spliced between your fuse box and meter, go for a beer an hour, see if any neighbor is pacing about when you return.

See if you can brace one night with a fan and see how the numbers change.

 

See if they just installed the cheapest grade air con by checking the model number and what energy rating it is - Thai's are superstitious about leaving all nasty yellow labels on everything - so if that's not showing on the aircon on a new build then you probably know it isn't a decent energy rating. It might be underpowered for the room size, check the BTU, calculations can be found online..

2-3k a month seems reasonable, 5k seems high though, what temperature is the aircon set to?

 

That's a great idea, thank you.

 

My first step then will be to turn off power at the fuse box and make sure nothing is spliced, although I highly doubt this is the case.

 

The building is only about 6 months old, everything is decent quality. Just checked now and the aircon is a Mitsubishi Electric Super Inverter (MSY-GT18VF) and is rated 2 stars. Seems almost brand new.

 

5,000 a month for a small 1 room seems crazy to me. This is what I'd expect to pay in a full-on 2 room apartment with washing machine/dishwasher etc. The aircon was/is set to 20c

[cola1800]

3 minutes ago, gargamon said:

There's your problem. Real electric rates are around 4 baht per unit. Hopefully your lease term isn't too long. 

Yes I realize the unit price is excessive. Actually finding an apartment you like that will charge the gov rate is not that easy. I saw 3 places (which I would be happy living in) and all were 7-8 Baht a unit. Of course it's not right though.

 

Even if I was being charged 4 per unit, I'd still be looking at a $70/mo electric bill, for what is essentially just a small room and bath. That's ridiculous high, even by Western standards

[h90]

13 minutes ago, Snugs08 said:

Turn off the electric at your fuse box for an hour one evening, ensure the meter isn't spinning - note the number so you know it isn't spliced between your fuse box and meter, go for a beer an hour, see if any neighbor is pacing about when you return.

See if you can brace one night with a fan and see how the numbers change.

 

See if they just installed the cheapest grade air con by checking the model number and what energy rating it is - Thai's are superstitious about leaving all nasty yellow labels on everything - so if that's not showing on the aircon on a new build then you probably know it isn't a decent energy rating. It might be underpowered for the room size, check the BTU, calculations can be found online..

2-3k a month seems reasonable, 5k seems high though, what temperature is the aircon set to?

 

I would keep the fuse box up, unplug everything inside and check if something is moving. I could imagine someone connected after the fuse box (if the wires are not on top of the walls.)

[OneMoreFarang]

Old ACs and bad maintained ACs and undersized AC can use a lot of power. And obviously it makes a difference if you are happy with 36 degrees or want 20 degrees.

Maybe ask the neighbors how much they pay.

 

Once I had an old AC in a rented apartment. One day it didn't work anymore and the owner installed a new inverter AC. The electricity bill was half after that. 

[cola1800]

1 minute ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Old ACs and bad maintained ACs and undersized AC can use a lot of power. And obviously it makes a difference if you are happy with 36 degrees or want 20 degrees.

Maybe ask the neighbors how much they pay.

 

Once I had an old AC in a rented apartment. One day it didn't work anymore and the owner installed a new inverter AC. The electricity bill was half after that. 

I should have mentioned in the first post that it's a Mitsubishi Electric Super Inverter (MSY-GT18VF), which is basically brand new. And judging by the price on Power Buy (31,000 Baht) it's a good model

[Crossy]

How big is the room and what temperature do you have the A/C set to?

 

Your A/C will use about 2kW when running at full chat so 19 units in 24 hours suggests it's running at around 50%, I would expect more like 30% for a correctly sized unit.

 

 

[tweedledee2]

   Either turn off the main electrical supply breaker switch or "unplug" all electrical appliances and then check the meter. The meter wheel should not be moving. If it is, you either failed to unplug something or your meter is being hijacked. 

[cola1800]

6 minutes ago, Crossy said:

How big is the room and what temperature do you have the A/C set to?

 

Your A/C will use about 2kW when running at full chat so 19 units in 24 hours suggests it's running at around 50%, I would expect more like 30% for a correctly sized unit.

 

 

The total size is 33m2, but I think this includes the balcony, so the room itself is probably around 26-28m2.

 

The AC was set to 20c, but I've now set it to 24c. It's on the lowest fan power

[Crossy]

OK, so the A/C is about the right size.

 

At 20C it's no wonder it was working hard, do you have a pet penguin? ???? 

 

I suspect you will see a significant improvement with the increased temperature. 

 

Buy a stand fan, that can help make you feel cooler and so you can wind up the A/C temp even more. We don't bother with A/C in the living spaces, just fans, A/C in the bedroom at 27C (with a fan).

 

[Yellowtail]

5 minutes ago, cola1800 said:

The total size is 33m2, but I think this includes the balcony, so the room itself is probably around 26-28m2.

 

The AC was set to 20c, but I've now set it to 24c. It's on the lowest fan power

Turn the fan on high, leave the temp at 24 and check again tomorrow.

 

If you want 20c, get used to paying for electric.  

[Crossy]

Our energy use peaks around April - June, so you are probably approaching worst case.

 

Luckily the output from our solar peaks at the same time ???? 

 

EDIT Let's slide this over to "Electrical" where it will stay on page 1 longer and get more directed input.

[cola1800]

32 minutes ago, Crossy said:

OK, so the A/C is about the right size.

 

At 20C it's no wonder it was working hard, do you have a pet penguin? ???? 

 

I suspect you will see a significant improvement with the increased temperature. 

 

Buy a stand fan, that can help make you feel cooler and so you can wind up the A/C temp even more. We don't bother with A/C in the living spaces, just fans, A/C in the bedroom at 27C (with a fan).

 

haha yeah a penguin probably would have been at home in this place yesterday.

 

Hopefully like you say the increased temp will cut usage down significantly. I'll be sure to get a fan too.

 

Thank you for the advice

[jaideedave]

28 minutes ago, Crossy said:

OK, so the A/C is about the right size.

 

At 20C it's no wonder it was working hard, do you have a pet penguin? ???? 

 

I suspect you will see a significant improvement with the increased temperature. 

 

Buy a stand fan, that can help make you feel cooler and so you can wind up the A/C temp even more. We don't bother with A/C in the living spaces, just fans, A/C in the bedroom at 27C (with a fan).

 

Good advice YT. 20 C is way too low by most standards. I've seen it done a lot in hotel rooms but as you I only use ac in the bedrooms(27) and living areas are covered with fans.

Years ago we met a couple Newfies 1st timers to Asia and they set their ac to the very coldest it would go. The both got pneumonia and one was hospitalized. <deleted>

[spongeworthy]

1 hour ago, cola1800 said:

The total size is 33m2, but I think this includes the balcony, so the room itself is probably around 26-28m2.

 

The AC was set to 20c, but I've now set it to 24c. It's on the lowest fan power

Another thing to consider is cleaning. I was paying gov rate at a condo with a few ACs (plus washer and dryer), only 1 AC running at a time, and it was generally around 4.5k/month. This was on a very high floor so the rooms became hot quite quickly without an AC running. After 3 or 4 months the bill started creeping up, and after 3 months of trending upwards it hit 8k. I had the AC's cleaned and the next month the bill was back down to 4.5k.

 

As you're paying double 8 baht/unit it's certainly possible you're not paying too much, but without a baseline it's hard to tell. Does your lease mention anything about the AC being cleaned?  As it's an apartment, it's possible it hasn't been cleaned in ages. It's also possible the owners are on top of things and clean the units every year or after every move out. Check your rental agreement and inquire with management (who obviously may lie). If they tell you it hasn't been cleaned in ages it may be worth paying for a cleaning, even if just for peace of mind.

Edited March 24, 2023 by spongeworthy

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, cola1800 said:

26-28m2.

 

The AC was set to 20c,

There is the answer, as has been pointed out. Our AC in the daytime is never set under 27C. So you need to dress for the temperatures and use a higher temperature setting so your power consumption will be less than half what it is now. Or decide that you want to were the clothes that you are comfortable in the fridge you are living in and pay the price for your power.

[Elkski]

So many people don't read before posting.   

It's 6 month old building it was his first day and he cranked it to 20c.  I assume he was unpacking and needed it cool.   Maybe the nearby units, sides, below, above are empty? A big factor.  Is it a  Corner unit with more outside walls? South exposure? I'm guessing room was hot?

Remember heat transfer is proportional to the delta T to the 4th power.  

 

 

[spongeworthy]

58 minutes ago, Elkski said:

So many people don't read before posting.

Personally I did read, but forgot that detail about the building being new after getting through the replies.

 

@cola1800 if you're running your AC most of the day the meter usage is probably accurate. If you were paying gov rate you'd be under 2.5k which sounds about right for one room. I had 1 AC running all day every day and was looking at 4.5k at the best of times.

[Kwasaki]

Check if the air-con is clean.

Check if your power isn't being used someone else. 

Found 2 places where we live and friends renting and found wire going to other peoples places.

[Pouatchee]

3 hours ago, gargamon said:

There's your problem. Real electric rates are around 4 baht per unit. Hopefully your lease term isn't too long. 

What he said! I use a lot of electricity in my house. 2 fridges, a freezer, a fish pond, fans on all day, ac on all night, 52 inch led on almost all day, washing machine twice a day everyday and my bill is around 3.400 bht a month. The extra price you pay for electricity could be spent on a small house where your landlord won't fleece you for your electricity. 

[Pouatchee]

2 hours ago, jaideedave said:

Years ago we met a couple Newfies

555 Newfoundlanders 1st time I ever saw anyone use the term here. Ya got any other good newfie jokes? 

 

-One day a newfie goes to a carpenter and asks how much it would cost to build a wooden crate that is 1 inch tall, 1 inch wide, and 50 feet long. When the carpenter asks what he needs it for, the newfie replies, "The wife snapped her clothesline the other day, and I have to send it to Toronto to get it fixed."

 

 

https://www.vice.com/en/article/avjxj5/10-newfie-jokes

Edited March 24, 2023 by Pouatchee

[soi3eddie]

Seems a lot of usage for 1 room. With an inverter A/C use should be lower. As others have said 20c is chilly. I keep mine on 26c and use a fan too. 

Is the room in direct sun for much of the day - that can have a big effect.

Also, and this may seem silly, but is the OP wearing long trousers and longsleeve shirts or sweats in order to need that much cooling? First thing I do when returning home is change into T shirt and shorts. Makes a big difference.

As for the rate of 8 Baht Kwh, then that's been discussed often here and nothing can be done to lower that. Just use less energy.

I would also turn off everthing and check closely to see if meter is still spinning - there is chance of some rogue wiring connected where it shouldn't be ????  

Hope your new place finally works out for you.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

So many people don't read before posting.   

 

Congratulations! It looks as if you have done exactly what you are criticising  others for

 

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

It's 6 month old building

That is the one correct point

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

it was his first day and he cranked it to 20c.

Your assumption with nothing to back it up. Yes it was at 20C for the first day, but no information about how many days this continued.

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

I assume he was unpacking and needed it cool.

Again an assumption with nothing to back it up. Maybe he is an aficionado of polar bears 

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

Maybe the nearby units, sides, below, above are empty? A big factor.  Is it a  Corner unit with more outside walls? South exposure? I'm guessing room was hot?

5 more assumptions with nothing to back it up

 

6 hours ago, Elkski said:

Remember heat transfer is proportional to the delta T to the 4th power.  

While this may possibly be correct it has no relevance in the way it has been stated to anyone I know of.

 

So you have made 7 assumptions that may or may not be true but you have no information to support them true or not.

Edited March 24, 2023 by sometimewoodworker

[Seeall]

When its been resold 2,7thb/unit (they have a system where this depends on how much you use as to what level they charge you at.. less usage the less rate)

then to you at 6THB/unit it does add up.  My first bill was 9000 thb or so..  with lounge-kitchen-stairway open..  then blocked off the rooms and insulated the ceiling, but still 3000-4000 .. then got own PEA meter then around 2000

and I am sure I read a few years back its ollegal to resell utilities at a higher rate than the gov supplies...

(I seen an apartment block collects rain then sells it at above water truck prices)

 

what to do... I guess check it out before renting...

[Liverpool Lou]

9 hours ago, cola1800 said:

I should add that the property manager/owner has been incredibly professional and courteous. Everything seems completely above board and the meters are on full display

Of course he'll be courteous, he's charging you almost double the actual rate for electricity and everything definitely is not above board, it's illegal, even though many renters do it.

[Liverpool Lou]

9 hours ago, Snugs08 said:

see if any neighbor is pacing about when you return.

What would be the significance of that?