The history of Thailand’s holy-day alcohol ban – and why it could soon be lifted

[Ralf001]

30 minutes ago, sambum said:

And although it is slightly off topic, these "holy days" are often poorly advertised, and Immigration Offices are closed! (OK if you are an ex pat you should know these things, but a normal tourist looking for an extension?) I was subject to a ridiculous scenario a few months ago when my 90 day report date was due on a Saturday - when AFAIK ALL Immigration Offices are closed!!! 

Yeah immi being closed on weekends is not a new thing and actually on Par with pretty much every other government office.

You can do your report 15 days before or 7 days after the due date without penatly so not sure what your concern is.

[kwilco]

49 minutes ago, sambum said:

"Drinkers are a pretty predictable group as are most people dependant of drugs."

 

I think that most people don't stop drinking because they don't WANT to! Most people I know would never say "I can give up whenever I want", because they don't NEED to!

 

(And I presume you mean "dependant ON drugs - not dependant OF drugs?)
 

 

As said it's a matter of realisation and admitting to yourself that comes first.

Over the years, I’ve compiled a list of tropes and clichés that drinkers will find familiar. - The types of excuses alcoholics or drinkers use to justify drinking is many and varied, it’s not possible to list all of them. But some will recognise these in themselves…..

 

“I can take it or leave it and I don’t have cravings.”

“I don’t drink every day.”

“I go to work.”

"I don't care"

“I don’t drink spirits.”

“it feels good”.

“I’m a “functioning” alcoholic”.

Because they are sad.

Because they are happy.

Reward: "I had a tough day, and I deserve a drink to unwind."

“for courage”

It is “fun”.

feel “better”.

Because they don’t care – “I drink, I fall over .. No problem”

They think it will be different the next time.

"I don’t drink in the morning.”

“All my friends do it.”

“Alcohol helps me relax”

“I can’t sleep without it.”

Socializing: "I need to drink to fit in or feel comfortable in social situations."

Celebration: "I'm celebrating a special occasion, so it's okay to drink excessively."

Peer pressure: "Everyone else is drinking, so I don't want to feel left out."

Tradition: "It's a cultural or family tradition to drink, and I don't want to break it."

Self-medication: "Alcohol helps me deal with my emotional pain or mental health issues."

“It helps with my pain.”

Work: "A little alcohol helps me be more creative or productive."

Escape: "Drinking allows me to escape from my problems or reality temporarily."

Not drinking is “boring”

 

 

“addiction” or “alcoholic”? – instinctively most drinker deny they are addicts or alcoholics they do this by defining alcoholism or addiction in a way that excludes themselves.

 

[sambum]

3 minutes ago, kwilco said:

As said it's a matter of realisation and admitting to yourself that comes first.

Over the years, I’ve compiled a list of tropes and clichés that drinkers will find familiar. - The types of excuses alcoholics or drinkers use to justify drinking is many and varied, it’s not possible to list all of them. But some will recognise these in themselves…..

 

“I can take it or leave it and I don’t have cravings.”

“I don’t drink every day.”

“I go to work.”

"I don't care"

“I don’t drink spirits.”

“it feels good”.

“I’m a “functioning” alcoholic”.

Because they are sad.

Because they are happy.

Reward: "I had a tough day, and I deserve a drink to unwind."

“for courage”

It is “fun”.

feel “better”.

Because they don’t care – “I drink, I fall over .. No problem”

They think it will be different the next time.

"I don’t drink in the morning.”

“All my friends do it.”

“Alcohol helps me relax”

“I can’t sleep without it.”

Socializing: "I need to drink to fit in or feel comfortable in social situations."

Celebration: "I'm celebrating a special occasion, so it's okay to drink excessively."

Peer pressure: "Everyone else is drinking, so I don't want to feel left out."

Tradition: "It's a cultural or family tradition to drink, and I don't want to break it."

Self-medication: "Alcohol helps me deal with my emotional pain or mental health issues."

“It helps with my pain.”

Work: "A little alcohol helps me be more creative or productive."

Escape: "Drinking allows me to escape from my problems or reality temporarily."

Not drinking is “boring”

 

 

“addiction” or “alcoholic”? – instinctively most drinker deny they are addicts or alcoholics they do this by defining alcoholism or addiction in a way that excludes themselves.

 

I guess you don't enjoy a glass of wine with your dinner, then?

 

"Over the years, I’ve compiled a list................" Why on earth would you want to do that, unless you are determined to "have a go" at anybody who drinks? Or maybe you're intent on getting a job with Alcoholics Anonymous? Your opening sentence implies that you are (or would like to be) a Counsellor, or maybe a member of a "Self Help" group?                                         I think you've made your point - you think that drink is evil - up to you - I don't, and maybe I fit into one of your pigeonholes, but one thing's for sure - with your type of bigoted rhetoric, you ain't gonna convince anybody to stop drinking - and let's face it - most people don't want to! Bye - have a nice alcohol free day - I'm going to have a glass of red - "I think I deserve it"! ???? 

[NONG CHOK]

I go to the outskirts of Korat on a regular basis, every Buddhist holiday the males and to a lesser degree females are totally sh*t faced by 10 am. So it appears they buy their booze the day before and getting hammered on Buddhist holidays is ok. It makes me wonder do the politicians who make these rules is their members bar closed too. Sorry I forgot they pay for nothing the tax payers pay.

[kwilco]

13 minutes ago, sambum said:

guess you don't enjoy a glass of wine with your dinner, then?

What an absurd thing to ask - I don't drink.

You are so defensive and so much in denial, I'd seriously consider reviewing your relationship with alcohol....it clearly makes you very aggressive.

[kwilco]

15 minutes ago, sambum said:

I think you've made your point - you think that drink is evil -

Sadly you aren't understanding my point - you just come up with cliched responses - I"ll add "you think drink is evil" to my list

[sambum]

1 minute ago, kwilco said:

Sadly you aren't understanding my point - you just come up with cliched responses - I"ll add "you think drink is evil" to my list

Why would you want to add that to your list od cliched responses

 

3 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Sadly you aren't understanding my point - you just come up with cliched responses - I"ll add "you think drink is evil" to my list

I understand your point exactly - you are the one who's "making lists!" ???? Like I said  - Bye - no point in arguing with a bigot, and my wine is getting warm! ????

[kwilco]

20 minutes ago, sambum said:

Why would you want to add that to your list od cliched responses

 

I understand your point exactly - you are the one who's "making lists!" ???? Like I said  - Bye - no point in arguing with a bigot, and my wine is getting warm! ????

It looks like your posts are like your drinking - you're unaware and you can't stop

[khaowong1]

23 hours ago, Caldera said:

Good move (forward 555). It's really time that the Thai government treats its citizens as adults who can make those choices for themselves, by themselves. 

Have you really seen these adult citizens and the choices they make?  

[jts-khorat]

3 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Further, your underlying assertion appears to be that everyone who drinks, does so to excess and can't do without it.  The vast majority of people don't get drunk but do enjoy a drink.  When people are on holiday they don't want to be restricted by stupid, pointless laws.

This is not my underlying assertion. My underlying assertion is, as people do exactly not drink to excess, not being able to do that on a very few days in the year -- even if it is during a holiday -- would (or should?) not bother them in the slightest.

 

It is you who says that people are bothered by the inability to daily imbibe, or what you call "stupid rules". Maybe they are bothered a tiny bit, but to the point that it ruins their holiday?

 

Frankly, there are many things that bother me about Thailand, and from the look of it, my list would be quite different from yours. What to do about those things? Simply ignore the law because we personally think it is stupid?

 

Maybe one should have at least good arguments, able to convince the locals, why things do not make sense as they are in Thailand, so they might be changed: jet ski and taxi mafia, unsafe driving, arcane immigration rules, double pricing, all senseless and disagreeable much more so than Buddhist holidays.

 

Alas, I am quite open to a discussion if the restricted bying times in the afternoon make any sense (they don't: even though the reasoning had merit, as many things in Thailand, real-world application was and is impossible), or if the state should be enforcing religious beliefs in general (State Sangha) or how far the state should be legislating at all (instead of favoring only certain drugs where the state earns big, then I would rather favor de-criminalization of all drugs and let people behave responsibly on their own acknowledgement of risks).

 

That a small minority of uninfomred and ignorant tourists could be somehow bothered by existing laws in a foreign country is, however, not an argument that I would accept as valid, and as nothing has changed ever, it seems not an argument which the locals -- who depend so much on tourists, if we believe some posters here -- accept either (Move Forward might, but I believe it after it happened! So far it looks like a short straw fire leading to the next coup, nothing more).

[Toolong]

Never liked the ban. Or the idea of any such imposed religious ban. Kind of reveals.....imho.....an inherent weakness of that religion's capacity to hold itself together......stand on its feet as something worth a hill o' beans......blah, blah......something like that.

 

And anyway, is in practice a means by which its so-called faithful display revolting levels of hypocrisy.

 

My (very dear!) Thai wife, for example, abstains from eating meat at a certain time of year, for just a few days. She clearly figures that the hardship of missing out on khow khar Moo only makes her virtue that much more worthy. And in her mind, sadly it does. 

 

And FGS, the Buddha big-fella only ever advised that intoxication can hinder one's ability to attain calm & insightful degrees of meditation, not that it's in any way wrong. (And tbh, reckon he was wrong about the calm & insightful bit....I can achieve Olympic-gold levels of very calm meditation after some fermented grape  and the insights are off the scale.)

 

Final add-on: while the MFP are at it, ditch the dumb licensing times booze can be sold. (That self-righteous Thai Rak Thai fella Purachai Ponsomboon mandated it way back....) Putting a six-pack of 5% by vol in my shopping trolley at 4.55pm, getting in the checkout line quicktime but actually getting to the cashier at 5.05pm....ain't cool, makes no sense at all and.......is the reason I STOCK my booze like a champion! But I resent having to. End it, please.

 

Soon after the army/establishment coup power grab in 2014, there were army units of (military-uniformed) 'entertainers' tasked with 'bringing happiness to the Thai People'. Surreal nonsense. The wrong people got happy.

 

Hope that 'real happiness' can now be - if not here yet - on its way down the pipes.

 

Can I get anyone a beer? It's on MFP. ???????? 

 

[sezze]

On 6/7/2023 at 3:35 AM, RandolphGB said:

A tourist can survive for a day without booze.

 

Would you go to Saudi Arabia and complain there's no beer? 

 

It's no different for a Buddhist country. 

I will not go to Saudi Arabia , i even do not fly with Qatar airways because i have read about strong alcohol rules at the airport there . Can a tourist survive alcohol for a day , sure , anybody should be able to do that. That doesn't mean people like it , especially if you are on a holiday . I can even relate on voting day alcohol bans . As a holiday destination and Thailand is that and gets a big portion of its GDP on tourism , it would relate on extra money in the bank . You are never obligated to drink .

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, sezze said:

it would relate on extra money in the bank

Tourists actually abstain from coming to Thailand because there are five specific religious holidays where the sale of alcohol is prohibited ?

[sezze]

39 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

Tourists actually abstain from coming to Thailand because there are five specific religious holidays where the sale of alcohol is prohibited ?

Prob not , because they do not know it . However a extra night in town is a extra night in town . There are literally 1000's of people wanting to have a night out in town and while it might not be anything to you , it is to tourism industry ( i imagine , bars want that extra day , even if it is only 5 in 1y). For people living there , sure , 1 day closed should not hurt , in fact should be good for you . For tourists it is a different matter , Thailand is not known for closed bars , all visiting temples (which is nice i admit) , snorkeling in the national water parks ... but it is also known for its famous night life . Just basic facts there ... if you agree or not , doesn't matter , it is what it is . Saying you got a 3 weeks vacation , spending 2 nights in Pattaya or whatever and being closed 1 day will not ruin your holiday , but it is not a nice feeling . I am not saying it ruins the country , history has proven this . However , you must admit that holiday people will spend on this day in a bar more then they do now ( it is basic 0baht , vs 1 drink already finishes the score) .

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, sezze said:

Prob not , because they do not know it . However a extra night in town is a extra night in town . There are literally 1000's of people wanting to have a night out in town and while it might not be anything to you , it is to tourism industry ( i imagine , bars want that extra day , even if it is only 5 in 1y). For people living there , sure , 1 day closed should not hurt , in fact should be good for you . For tourists it is a different matter , Thailand is not known for closed bars , all visiting temples (which is nice i admit) , snorkeling in the national water parks ... but it is also known for its famous night life . Just basic facts there ... if you agree or not , doesn't matter , it is what it is . Saying you got a 3 weeks vacation , spending 2 nights in Pattaya or whatever and being closed 1 day will not ruin your holiday , but it is not a nice feeling . I am not saying it ruins the country , history has proven this . However , you must admit that holiday people will spend on this day in a bar more then they do now ( it is basic 0baht , vs 1 drink already finishes the score) .

I doubt the tourists lock themselves in their hotel room and not spend money because they cannot buy alcohol due a dry religious holiday.

[jacko45k]

4 hours ago, sezze said:

i even do not fly with Qatar airways because i have read about strong alcohol rules at the airport there

You can get a beer there, but for me it was only in one of the Biz Cass lounges.