After Pita, Pheu Thai gets to run the show

[anchadian]

7 minutes ago, bradiston said:

You may be right. As usual, it's all shrouded in mystery. I use the following source

 

https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/politics/40029285

 

It's interesting they say quite clearly there are no limits on the number of times a candidate can be put forward, completely contradicting the farcical vote taken yesterday.

Thailand’s former constitution writer Borwornsak Uwanno suggests that Move Forward party leader Pita Limjaroenrat seek a ruling from the Constitutional Court over parliament’s decision, by a majority vote on Wednesday, that Pita’s re-nomination falls foul of its Rule 41.

 

He said that he feels sorry for Thailand and is upset with the MPs who joined senators to vote against Pita, noting that the Constitution has a clause specifying the process of the selection of the prime minister, which cannot be overruled by Rule 41.

 

https://www.thaipbsworld.com/pita-advised-to-take-rejection-of-his-re-nomination-to-constitutional-court/

[bradiston]

5 minutes ago, MikeN said:

It is actually a maximum of 3 names that have to be submitted to the EC by the parties, a party can nominate anybody from the published list as long as the party that person belongs to got at least 25 seats.. Pita was actually nominated in Parliament by a Pheu Thai speaker from what I read.

Not sure to whom the candidates' names are submitted. But yes, nominated by Pheu Thai leader Chonlanan Srikaew.

[bradiston]

9 minutes ago, anchadian said:

Thailand’s former constitution writer Borwornsak Uwanno suggests that Move Forward party leader Pita Limjaroenrat seek a ruling from the Constitutional Court over parliament’s decision, by a majority vote on Wednesday, that Pita’s re-nomination falls foul of its Rule 41.

 

He said that he feels sorry for Thailand and is upset with the MPs who joined senators to vote against Pita, noting that the Constitution has a clause specifying the process of the selection of the prime minister, which cannot be overruled by Rule 41.

 

https://www.thaipbsworld.com/pita-advised-to-take-rejection-of-his-re-nomination-to-constitutional-court/

I hope he does. It should never have been put to the vote before the crony court of Senators. It was a parliamentary procedural matter and should have been ruled on by the Speaker, who should have known what the correct ruling is. This one obviously doesn't.

 

MFP is suing the EC for other reasons. Maybe this would fit in nicely in their case alleging unfair treatment of Pita.

[MikeN]

21 minutes ago, bradiston said:

I think Prayuth installed a 10 man committee to select the Senators.

 

"The proposed constitution also allows the NCPO to appoint an eight to ten person panel who will choose Senators,[4] to include six seats reserved for the heads of the Royal Thai Army, Navy, Air Force, and Police, plus the military's supreme commander, and defense permanent secretary."

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Thailand

 

Scroll down to 2017.

 

A military dictatorship posing as a democracy. Of course, with the demise of the NCPO, who knows what will happen in May next year?

https://www.ect.go.th/ect_en/download/article/article_20210806135906.pdf has the 2018 Organic Act on selection of senators, which is as clear as mud in the English translation but sections 10-35 seem to say that qualified people may nominate themselves, selection is whittled down first at amphoe level then by provincial comittees, final selection is done by secret ballot by committee at national level. So it's not a direct peoples choice election,

[bradiston]

24 minutes ago, anchadian said:

Thailand’s former constitution writer Borwornsak Uwanno suggests that Move Forward party leader Pita Limjaroenrat seek a ruling from the Constitutional Court over parliament’s decision, by a majority vote on Wednesday, that Pita’s re-nomination falls foul of its Rule 41.

 

He said that he feels sorry for Thailand and is upset with the MPs who joined senators to vote against Pita, noting that the Constitution has a clause specifying the process of the selection of the prime minister, which cannot be overruled by Rule 41.

 

https://www.thaipbsworld.com/pita-advised-to-take-rejection-of-his-re-nomination-to-constitutional-court/

I would also challenge the legality of Senators rejecting MFP's nomination on the basis of their proposal to modify 112. They are not supposed to take sides or be involved in party policy. Yet many have openly stated they would veto any coalition candidate one of whose constituent members proposed even amending 112. It's blatant interference. Gerrymandering. Call it what you will. It's not legal!

[bradiston]

4 minutes ago, MikeN said:

https://www.ect.go.th/ect_en/download/article/article_20210806135906.pdf has the 2018 Organic Act on selection of senators, which is as clear as mud in the English translation but sections 10-35 seem to say that qualified people may nominate themselves, selection is whittled down first at amphoe level then by provincial comittees, final selection is done by secret ballot by committee at national level. So it's not a direct peoples choice election,

No, it's unelected. They're selected by a panel of military top brass. The more I read, the more it takes my breath away. Smirking Prayuth seems to have had it away on his toes. Anyone seen him lately?

[Pink Mist]

An overly negative comment regarding Thailand and Thais has been removed 

[MikeN]

28 minutes ago, bradiston said:

No, it's unelected. They're selected by a panel of military top brass. The more I read, the more it takes my breath away. Smirking Prayuth seems to have had it away on his toes. Anyone seen him lately?

No, that was for the current Senate, the link before was for the current process as in the 2018 act. The amphoe level committee is the amphoe head plus 5 others including heads of 3 amphoe agencies. Provincial screening committee is governor plus 5 including heads of 3 provincial agencies.

but when it gets to national level, it seems the Election Commission is also the national committee (section 24 (1), with reference to section 4, https://www.ect.go.th/ect_en/download/article/article_20210806135906.pdf )

"(1) the national committee, with the Commission serving as the national committee; ",

"Section 4.  In this Organic Act:   “Commission” means the Election Commission under the organic law on the Election Commission; "

People can make their own conclusions about how unbiased or otherwise the EC is.

[anchadian]

53 minutes ago, bradiston said:

No, it's unelected. They're selected by a panel of military top brass. The more I read, the more it takes my breath away. Smirking Prayuth seems to have had it away on his toes. Anyone seen him lately?

Yes, you'll find him in the thread  'Protesters Conduct Symbolic Cremation'

[anchadian]

BANGKOK, July 20 (TNA) – Move Forward Party Party leader Pita Limjaroenrat’s status and qualifications as the prime ministerial candidate remain intact and elegible for the renomination in parliament, said Move Forward party-list MP, Natthawut Buapratum during a parliamentary session on Thursday.

 

https://tna.mcot.net/english-news-1210470

[matta]

in simple words everything remains as it is

[Reigntax]

9 hours ago, Dene16 said:

Your  post count indicates you have been here awhile but your thoughts imply that  you are completely new to the experience of Thai politics and culture?

Why do you believe 250 pro junta senators  will vote for a candidate from the opposition?

knowing that their man Prawit will be knocking on the door with 250 votes already in the bag when no one else is able to get the required votes.

The question is, will the remaining MP's vote for Prawit in order to get the country running again, rather than let it stagnate.

Prawit may not be in the equation yet but I'm sure he's just waiting and biding his time.

Just what Thailand needs. The Penguin as it’s PM

He is the Thai equal to Joe Biden.

needs to be put out to pasture with all the buffalos

[Dene16]

4 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

Maybe Prawit wakes up from his sleep and becomes PM. Who can predict that, but he will not be able to rule against a 2/3 majority in parliament. That's just my newbie opinion.

Absolutely, but I believe the prime minister has more sway than what the actual mandate  for the position suggests. We are all guessing at the likely outcomes and reactions of the Thai populace and I've no doubt your reasoning is the ideal/best solution but unfortunately this is Thailand. Only time will tell

If Prawit does make it, what will happen next year when the 250 senators have to relinquish their positions? how much input will he have on the newly installed senators, If any?

There may be trouble ahead?

Just won 1000 baht from my partner who was so adamant that Pita would be prime minister after I stated from day one he would not ???? (another 1000 if Prawit makes it) 

Congratulations on 30 years of bliss with your family, here in Thailand

[Dene16]

58 minutes ago, Reigntax said:

Just what Thailand needs. The Penguin as it’s PM

He is the Thai equal to Joe Biden.

needs to be put out to pasture with all the buffalos

I take it your American

I read that Trump is doing well again in the opinion polls

Neither seem to be the right candidates for the job You would think that common sense would prevail in these elections but , alas, that is rarely the case 

Edited July 20, 2023 by Dene16
wording

[candide]

12 hours ago, scorecard said:

True, I suspect that the regulations in place will mean the senators must be appointed, but by who?

 

Would be nice to get clarity on this point. 

 

In short, according to the Constitution, the new Senators will be selected by committees and panels, according to a complex system of representation of diverse categories (professions, etc...).

The composition of the committees is defined to give a majority to members of the establishment, ex heads of government agencies.

Now guess who will select the members of the selection committees? The yellow EC! All is under control and the elected government has no influence on the process.

So it will likely be a Senate dominated by the yellow-green establishment. They may not be able to get a 100% yellow Senate as the system is quite complex, but they only need to control more than 2/3 of the Senate in order to block any amendment of the constitution they don't like.

The only good news, if I understand well, is that the new Senate will not participate in the election of a PM any more.

[candide]

Multiple posting 

Edited July 20, 2023 by candide

[zzaa09]

4 minutes ago, candide said:

In short, according to the Constitution, the new Senators will be selected by committees and panels, according to a complex system of representation of diverse categories (professions, etc...).

The composition of the committees is defined to give a majority to members of the establishment, ex heads of government agencies.

Now guess who will select the members of the selection committees? The yellow EC! All is under control and the elected government has no influence on the process.

 

So it will likely be a Senate dominated by the yellow-green establishment. They may not be able to get a 100% yellow Senate as the system is quite complex, but they only need to control more than 2/3 of the Senate in order to block any amendment of the constitution they don't like.

The only good news, if I understand well, is that the new Senate will not participate in the election of a PM any more.

To be pedantic, it's a Yellow/Pink establishment. 

[candide]

Ooops! Again

Edited July 20, 2023 by candide

[khaowong1]

On 7/19/2023 at 9:14 AM, BenStark said:

If that fails there will be no new coalition,  Prayut will remain as caretaker until new elections, which will be delayed and delayed, until both MF and PT are dissolved by a court.

 

You really think they give a damn about that? Read my comment above

Exactly.  This has been the plan since Pita won the votes.  

[onthedarkside]

Off topic post and reply removed. Biden is not the discussion here.

[bristolgeoff]

Maybe the plan all along Thakisim is waiting until the all clear or no arrest .Don,t know what the thai people will do after what hapened but we are guest and watch from the sideline

[scorecard]

21 hours ago, bradiston said:

No, it's unelected. They're selected by a panel of military top brass. The more I read, the more it takes my breath away. Smirking Prayuth seems to have had it away on his toes. Anyone seen him lately?

Yes, breathtaking that this was ever allowed to become an item in the constitution / a law. 

 

Moving forward, it's also now becoming well understand by the younger folks as to it's generic meaning and the way it locks Thailand into a military dominated / controlled government.

 

My uni students talk about it a lot and they are angry that the law exists and they are angry with themselves / their society for allowing it to happen.

 

What seems to also be developing is a strong following of the several well qualified and experienced lawyers in the steeing committee of the move forward.

 

Along with some expectation that the clever young lawyers will eventually find a way get this item cancelled.

 

Let's hope soon.

[thailandsgreat]

4 minutes ago, Slip said:

You speculate on the integrity of the party in your 1st point but offer no actual criticism or evidence, merely idle speculation about what may be. 

 

Next you relay a story which just seems to show an opinionated young lad sounded off publicly, then regretted his ouburst.

 

To follow, a strange anti-woke rant about Europe and non-disclosed fire and brimstone that has resulted.

Finished off with a slur against the Move Forward Party- again with nothing to back it up.

 

Forgive me (and no doubt others) if your post is not taken seriously.

But when the family of another party's politician apologizes for having criticized MFP you know the politicians have joined and there is really only one team on the field.

 

Another party's politician's son is praising MFP and calling himself not qualified to have a political opinion. Then the politicians have joined on the people.

 

...

 

 

“I regret my actions 

 

“To be clear, I think MFP policies are very practical and transformational, very innovative. 

 

“I fully own up that I am very privileged and elitist, that I am inexperienced and uneducated about Thai politics or politics. It is inappropriate and ill-advised of me to comment on politics despite my right to free speech. I am not qualified. 

[Slip]

9 minutes ago, thailandsgreat said:

But when the family of another party's politician apologizes for having criticized MFP you know the politicians have joined and there is really only one team on the field.

 

Another party's politician's son is praising MFP and calling himself not qualified to have a political opinion. Then the politicians have joined on the people.

 

...

 

 

“I regret my actions 

 

“To be clear, I think MFP policies are very practical and transformational, very innovative. 

 

“I fully own up that I am very privileged and elitist, that I am inexperienced and uneducated about Thai politics or politics. It is inappropriate and ill-advised of me to comment on politics despite my right to free speech. I am not qualified. 

Apologies- I had not grasped your earlier point.  Well met and agreed.

[greeneking]

On 7/20/2023 at 12:15 PM, anchadian said:

BREAKING: Student groups including those from Chulalongkorn & Thammasat are calling people "to rise & fight through every means possible to uphold democracy." Read the full statement in English here.

 

https://twitter.com/PravitR/status/1681874943687168000

Fight for your rights.  Stay safe, if you can.

[thailandsgreat]

14 hours ago, Slip said:

Apologies- I had not grasped your earlier point.  Well met and agreed.

I didn't express it so clearly in the first post. If MFP is "woke" I just compared to what I and many believe the woke agenda is doing in the West. It was just a personal comparison to what is happening in the West, Europe in particular. Pita doesn't give very detailed promises what he would do, from what I have seen.

 

MFP would amend the lèse-majesté is the clearest promise. But that law is just a detail in running a country. I don't think the details of the amendment have been presented, either.

 

Considering the self-annihilating apology the governor’s son just gave for criticizing MFP, I wonder if we will see the lèse-majesté replaced by a lèse-woke  ????

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by thailandsgreat

[bradiston]

49 minutes ago, thailandsgreat said:

I didn't express it so clearly in the first post. If MFP is "woke" I just compared to what I and many believe the woke agenda is doing in the West. It was just a personal comparison to what is happening in the West, Europe in particular. Pita doesn't give very detailed promises what he would do, from what I have seen.

 

MFP would amend the lèse-majesté is the clearest promise. But that law is just a detail in running a country. I don't think the details of the amendment have been presented, either.

 

Considering the self-annihilating apology the governor’s son just gave for criticizing MFP, I wonder if we will see the lèse-majesté replaced by a lèse-woke  ????

 

The details of the proposed amendment have been published. Anybody who thinks this is all part of a conspiracy to overthrow democracy is a complete fool.

 

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by bradiston

[bamnutsak]

1 hour ago, thailandsgreat said:

MFP would amend the lèse-majesté is the clearest promise. But that law is just a detail in running a country. I don't think the details of the amendment have been presented, either.

Yes. They have.

 

Believe me, as simple as these reforms are they can NEVER EVER be allowed to adopted.

 

 

 

MFP also ran on a few other issues: breaking up monopolies, alcohol liberalization, military reduced, military conscription eliminated. Maybe a few more.

 

https://www.thaipbsworld.com/is-move-forward-partys-policy-platform-giving-the-markets-the-jitters

 

And since the election additional things to be done:

 

https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/politics/40028134

 

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by bamnutsak

[bannork]

On 7/20/2023 at 6:49 PM, candide said:

In short, according to the Constitution, the new Senators will be selected by committees and panels, according to a complex system of representation of diverse categories (professions, etc...).

The composition of the committees is defined to give a majority to members of the establishment, ex heads of government agencies.

Now guess who will select the members of the selection committees? The yellow EC! All is under control and the elected government has no influence on the process.

So it will likely be a Senate dominated by the yellow-green establishment. They may not be able to get a 100% yellow Senate as the system is quite complex, but they only need to control more than 2/3 of the Senate in order to block any amendment of the constitution they don't like.

The only good news, if I understand well, is that the new Senate will not participate in the election of a PM any more.

This constitution will be scrapped by the new government 

[thailandsgreat]

41 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

MFP also ran on a few other issues: breaking up monopolies, alcohol liberalization, military reduced, military conscription eliminated. Maybe a few more.

Considering I just saw a weed vending machine at Lotus, I am surprised alcohol needs to be liberalized. But there are curtains over the booze in 7/11 some hours.

 

OK. Mitigating the law against insulting the king, reducing the military and further easing up the selling of alcohol.

 

Those are some details.  But financially, I have read about taxing large corporations, but that was rather vague and without commitment from what I read.

 

I wonder if "breaking up monopolies" will mean selling out governmental enterprise?

 

 

 

Edited July 22, 2023 by thailandsgreat