Thai gov. to tax (remitted) income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024 - Part I

[TroubleandGrumpy]

2 hours ago, BaanOz said:

I always thought it was flexible and you could transfer it back into an Accumulation fund if you like: Converting super into retirement income: What are your options? (superguide.com.au) but as mentioned, while not paying tax in Retirement Phase, this may have some issue with paying Thai tax (to keep on topic!).

I started doing some research on that and it looks like it depends on the Super Fund which you are a member of, and what sort of member account you have, and how they are structured. I remember that my old Super Fund said once it was 'converted' to pension I could not bring it back to accumulation. They also said that once you 'convert' any/all of your account to pension, you cannot add any more funds into that account and must put that in your accumulation account or start a new one.  The ATO website gives good info and it is free - Superguide wants people to pay for giving their advice - many of their articles/reports require you to join before you can read it.  Super | Australian Taxation Office (ato.gov.au)

[CTwelve]

On 10/3/2023 at 9:46 AM, K2938 said:

So the smart thing would be to exempt foreigners from the taxation of foreign earnings just as the Philippines does ("Resident citizens are taxed on their income from all sources. A person who is not a citizen of the Philippines (that is, someone who is defined as an alien), regardless of whether the person is a resident or a non-resident, is taxed only on the individual's income from Philippines sources.").  But who knows what will happen.

That would make a lot of sense. I mean they have just doubled the cost of an Elite Visa to almost 1 million Baht for 5 years. 

 

Then asking them to then pay income tax on all incoming cash? Ok fine, what other questions about that income are the going to ask?

 

Seems a sure way to basically kill the Elite Visa and drive out wealthy tourists.

 

I am suspecting this is not the intention but who knows.

 

[TroubleandGrumpy]

For those interested - I got further replies from that legal/tax firm I have previously mentioned.  I should point out that I disagreed with much of what was stated, and I deliberately asked very provocative questions - I think they are shilling for business from Expats worried about this new tax rule/method.

 

They stated that if you are a tax resident in Thailand and received/earn income abroad, then you have to do a tax return and declare that income.  They stated that even if it has already been taxed in the home country and there is a DTA, you must still lodge a tax return and declare the income no matter how much is involved.

 

They also stated that it is very likely that at some stage in the future Thai Immigration will get involved with this matter and those Expats without a tax clearance/return will have issues getting their 'annual renewal'. 

 

I disagreed and pointed out that according to the Thai RD website you have to complete a tax return IF you have 'taxable income' and are liable to pay income taxes. I pointed out two things:

1. The majority of Thais have never done an annual income tax return (under 150K?);

2. I have no 'taxable income' in Thailand because under the DTA the amount of 'interest' I received in my Super fund in Australia was already taxed in Australia.

 

I pointed out that the 40+ million Thais who earn any income from any job or work, do not complete a taxation return, mainly because they earn less than 150K PA (after deductions, allowances and expenses).

 

I also pointed out that many Expats have bank accounts overseas into which they are paid their pensions and they then transfer them into Thailand from there - immediately or later that week/month.  Those banks pay small amounts of interest, just like the Thai banks do to Thais.  I asked does that mean all foreigners and Thais are required to complete a tax return and declare that $2-5 in interest earnings? 

 

I also stated that because the Age Pension in Australia is listed as 'taxable income' in people's annual tax return statements, does that mean it will be viewed as taxable income by the Thailand RD.  I stated that because it is a Govt Payment it is not taxed (it is a 'tax free' payment), even though the amount paid is over the tax free threshold amount in Australia.  I asked does that mean every Expat receiving a pension is required to complete a Thailand tax return, will Thai RD view that as taxable income, and how will the DTA be applied to that payment.  I also pointed out that there is nowhere on the standard tax return to 'claim' DTA exemptions or how to provide any documents from Aust or what documents are required - so does that mean we will all have to employ a 'tax expert' like yourself to complete our tax returns.  

 

Nothing heard back - and I probably never will. 

 

IMO the best strategy is to wait and see what deveops during 2024. It will be June 2024 before anyone becomes a tax resident of Thailand, and it will probably be later in 2024 that the Thai RD has provided all the details and processes.  A tax return is required to be lodged by end March 2025 - so it will be quite some time after that before the Thai RD starts investigating/chasing people (Thais and Expats). There is lots of time to pack the bags and get out of Dodge if this thing goes sideways. 

Edited October 4, 2023 by TroubleandGrumpy

[K2938]

12 minutes ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

IMO the best strategy is to wait and see what deveops during 2024. It will be June 2024 before anyone becomes a tax resident of Thailand, and it will probably be later in 2024 that the Thai RD has provided all the details and processes.  A tax return is required to be lodged by end March 2025 - so it will be quite some time after that before the Thai RD starts investigating/chasing people (Thais and Expats). There is lots of time to pack the bags and get out of Dodge if this thing goes sideways. 

Yes, nothing you can really do at the moment, though if you want to avoid tax you really need to make preparations to leave by June 2024.  The worrying thing concerning foreigners however is that they do not really have a lobbying organisation making their voices heard and I doubt that the Thai government reads aseannow.com to find out what they think.  So while foreigners are the unintended collateral damage in all this, they might well stay there for lack of voice.

 

 

[TroubleandGrumpy]

1 minute ago, K2938 said:

Yes, nothing you can really do at the moment, though if you want to avoid tax you really need to make preparations to leave by June 2024.  The worrying thing concerning foreigners however is that they do not really have a lobbying organisation making their voices heard and I doubt that the Thai government reads aseannow.com to find out what they think.  So while foreigners are the unintended collateral damage in all this, they might well stay there for lack of voice.

You are right in that waiting is our only 'solution'.  But although June 2024 is the drop dead date, that does not mean you/I have to leave before that date. As the lawyer advised, it will probably not be until mid-late 2024 that Thai RD will provide the processes and details. Given that March 2025 is when the tax returns are due, and the Thai RD will be VERY busy for the new few months (years?), it would be sometime around March-June 2025 when those who have to decided to leave Dodge must have gotten out.   IMO Thai RD will not be chasing Expats who have left the country for small amounts of tax debts - but you better not go back again ???? 

[TroubleandGrumpy]

31 minutes ago, K2938 said:

Yes, nothing you can really do at the moment, though if you want to avoid tax you really need to make preparations to leave by June 2024.  The worrying thing concerning foreigners however is that they do not really have a lobbying organisation making their voices heard and I doubt that the Thai government reads aseannow.com to find out what they think.  So while foreigners are the unintended collateral damage in all this, they might well stay there for lack of voice.

There are two groups of Expats who live in Thailand that do have a 'representative body' - Koreans and Japanese. The Japanese are the biggst group by a long way. Hopefully, one or both of those groups are seeking an 'audience'. Also, there are a lot of Chinese Expats in Thailand - however many of them are the type that they are targetting to stop avoiding taxation in Thailand. 

 

It has been tried a few times over the years (getting a 'western' Expat Group together) but being so 'individualistic' we are very hard to organise and coordinate.  Unlike the Japanese who take a very 'community' view to things, western Expats tend to want what they want first, and agreement is hard to reach on most subjects.  Just look at the bickering that goes on in this forum - and it is always the loudest who complain the most, so most reasonable people just 'walk away'.

[Happy happy]

2 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

For those interested - I got further replies from that legal/tax firm I have previously mentioned.  I should point out that I disagreed with much of what was stated, and I deliberately asked very provocative questions - I think they are shilling for business from Expats worried about this new tax rule/method.

 

They stated that if you are a tax resident in Thailand and received/earn income abroad, then you have to do a tax return and declare that income.  They stated that even if it has already been taxed in the home country and there is a DTA, you must still lodge a tax return and declare the income no matter how much is involved.

 

They also stated that it is very likely that at some stage in the future Thai Immigration will get involved with this matter and those Expats without a tax clearance/return will have issues getting their 'annual renewal'. 

 

I disagreed and pointed out that according to the Thai RD website you have to complete a tax return IF you have 'taxable income' and are liable to pay income taxes. I pointed out two things:

1. The majority of Thais have never done an annual income tax return (under 150K?);

2. I have no 'taxable income' in Thailand because under the DTA the amount of 'interest' I received in my Super fund in Australia was already taxed in Australia.

 

I pointed out that the 40+ million Thais who earn any income from any job or work, do not complete a taxation return, mainly because they earn less than 150K PA (after deductions, allowances and expenses).

 

I also pointed out that many Expats have bank accounts overseas into which they are paid their pensions and they then transfer them into Thailand from there - immediately or later that week/month.  Those banks pay small amounts of interest, just like the Thai banks do to Thais.  I asked does that mean all foreigners and Thais are required to complete a tax return and declare that $2-5 in interest earnings? 

 

I also stated that because the Age Pension in Australia is listed as 'taxable income' in people's annual tax return statements, does that mean it will be viewed as taxable income by the Thailand RD.  I stated that because it is a Govt Payment it is not taxed (it is a 'tax free' payment), even though the amount paid is over the tax free threshold amount in Australia.  I asked does that mean every Expat receiving a pension is required to complete a Thailand tax return, will Thai RD view that as taxable income, and how will the DTA be applied to that payment.  I also pointed out that there is nowhere on the standard tax return to 'claim' DTA exemptions or how to provide any documents from Aust or what documents are required - so does that mean we will all have to employ a 'tax expert' like yourself to complete our tax returns.  

 

Nothing heard back - and I probably never will. 

 

IMO the best strategy is to wait and see what deveops during 2024. It will be June 2024 before anyone becomes a tax resident of Thailand, and it will probably be later in 2024 that the Thai RD has provided all the details and processes.  A tax return is required to be lodged by end March 2025 - so it will be quite some time after that before the Thai RD starts investigating/chasing people (Thais and Expats). There is lots of time to pack the bags and get out of Dodge if this thing goes sideways. 

Many thanks for this posting which is excellent, and you put to shame the tax firm you are dealing with. I agree we need wait and see. 

That said it makes me upset and angry that for decades those of us on retirement visas have been led to believe and told we do not need to pay tax here or file returns; but just because the government et al need more money to waste they will now try to renege on their previous practice and try to unfairly extract money from us.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

53 minutes ago, Happy happy said:

Many thanks for this posting which is excellent, and you put to shame the tax firm you are dealing with. I agree we need wait and see. 

That said it makes me upset and angry that for decades those of us on retirement visas have been led to believe and told we do not need to pay tax here or file returns; but just because the government et al need more money to waste they will now try to renege on their previous practice and try to unfairly extract money from us.

I hear you mate - it is a very poor decision regarding those Expats who bring a lot of money into Thailand, and have done so for a long time, and intend to do so going forward. 

They are risking losing our 800K to 1 million a year, just to grab a few 10s of thousands in taxes.

Lets face it - Thailand is full of people that can not and do not, plan/think ahead very well.

I think this will work out fine - and there is no way I will be lodging a tax return in Thailand.

But if I am wrong and they demand we all lodge tax returns - then we are leaving Thailand permanently.

Meanwhile, the chances of me/us buying a new car next year or buying a property in the future, are zero.

[samtam]

3 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

 

 

I disagreed and pointed out that according to the Thai RD website you have to complete a tax return IF you have 'taxable income' and are liable to pay income taxes. I pointed out two things:

1. The majority of Thais have never done an annual income tax return (under 150K?);

2. I have no 'taxable income' in Thailand because under the DTA the amount of 'interest' I received in my Super fund in Australia was already taxed in Australia.

 

I pointed out that the 40+ million Thais who earn any income from any job or work, do not complete a taxation return, mainly because they earn less than 150K PA (after deductions, allowances and expenses).

 

 

I refer to the parts of your post which I have made bold. I am not aware of how much Thais get in deductions, allowances or expenses, but I suspect that many receive more than the minimum net income of THB150,000 pa and very few of those pay income tax, especially if a lot/all of that income is paid in cash. On a very simplistic basis, THB150,000 is THB12,500 per month, and, as I stated, although I am not aware of deductions etc, I pay my maid around that per month, in cash, and she probably earns as much again from other part time work. For sure she doesn't pay income tax, and neither am I suggesting that she should. 

 

So I have no idea how RD is going to enforce extracting tax from this segment of the population, but presumably it is in their sights, rather like Mars through a telescope.

 

Not a vote winner, I suspect.

Edited October 4, 2023 by samtam

[StayinThailand2much]

3 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

There is lots of time to pack the bags and get out of Dodge if this thing goes sideways. 

Great job, and excellent questions asked. I have earmarked early/mid 2025 as the time to leave Dodge. Thankfully, other countries in the region do exchange Thai baht. Ready for a new adventure...

Edited October 4, 2023 by StayinThailand2much

[StayinThailand2much]

1 hour ago, Happy happy said:

(...) but just because the government et al need more money to waste they will now try to renege on their previous practice and try to unfairly extract money from us.

They could have easily gotten 14 billion a year from a miniscule stock trading levy, but it turns out that, instead, they are targeting people with no lobby, i.e. expats, and Thais making a few hundred baht a year in overseas trading. "Smart" move, Thailand. Not! - I wouldn't be surprised if the resulting damage were much larger than the thousands of baht this will generate.

Edited October 4, 2023 by StayinThailand2much

[redwood1]

15 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

They could have easily gotten 14 billion a year from a miniscule stock trading levy, but it turns out that, instead, they are targeting people with no lobby, i.e. expats, and Thais making a few hundred baht a year in overseas trading. "Smart" move, Thailand. Not! - I wouldn't be surprised if the resulting damage were much larger than the thousands of baht this will generate.

The amout of money they will lose from this tax is vast...So many billions that I cant even make a good guess how many...No cars being bought or Condos or houses....And keeping as much money out of Thailand as possible.....The money lost is huge....

 

On top of this they are forcing gas and electric and some food prices lower....Hey Bozos some one some where is going to be paying for this...Plus the 10,000 baht free money give away.....Someones paying for that too...

 

The baht is already saying what it thinks about this money spending orgy..

[SHA 2 BKK]

I (think) I am fortunate I got an LTR Visa last year.  One of its attractions (apart from not doing those stupid 90 reports) was the ability to bring in income and not be taxed on it. 
 

My Australian Pension qualified me for the Visa (when my Elite ran out) and the LTR process was dead easy and quick.  
 

I know not all will qualify for this Visa but I did ask the BOI about about the Royal Decree (743 from memory) which promulgated the LTR in relation to foreign sourced income.  For me their response was quite positive and I have included it below for reference. 
 

“Dear X

 

Thank you for your inquiry. On the note of the recent Revenue Department announcement on the new conditions for oversea income that generate from business/ asset or work abroad to be subject for personal income tax. 

 

We would like to address that for the LTR tax benefits: the revenue department has already announced a royal decree to exempt the LTR- Wealthy Global/ Wealthy Pension/ Work from Thailand from paying the income tax derived from oversea business/ work and assets. Therefore the change in conditions will not effect the exemption of the LTR mentioned group. 

 

Therefore, we can assure you that the incentive of the LTR visa is still the same. We also believe the revenue department will shortly give an official clarification also as it is their main responsibility and we will work with them to get the procedure for future assistance i.e. to address when you wire in the money that it is from the work remotely (same as in LTR application)- the revenue can cross check with us if they want, don't worry. 

 

If you have any further inquiry or find any obstacles, please let us know so we can address the issue with revenue department on your behalf.

 

Kind regards,
LTR Visa Unit

[Dogmatix]

2 minutes ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

I (think) I am fortunate I got an LTR Visa last year.  One of its attractions (apart from not doing those stupid 90 reports) was the ability to bring in income and not be taxed on it. 
 

My Australian Pension qualified me for the Visa (when my Elite ran out) and the LTR process was dead easy and quick.  
 

I know not all will qualify for this Visa but I did ask the BOI about about the Royal Decree (743 from memory) which promulgated the LTR in relation to foreign sourced income.  For me their response was quite positive and I have included it below for reference. 
 

“Dear X

 

Thank you for your inquiry. On the note of the recent Revenue Department announcement on the new conditions for oversea income that generate from business/ asset or work abroad to be subject for personal income tax. 

 

We would like to address that for the LTR tax benefits: the revenue department has already announced a royal decree to exempt the LTR- Wealthy Global/ Wealthy Pension/ Work from Thailand from paying the income tax derived from oversea business/ work and assets. Therefore the change in conditions will not effect the exemption of the LTR mentioned group. 

 

Therefore, we can assure you that the incentive of the LTR visa is still the same. We also believe the revenue department will shortly give an official clarification also as it is their main responsibility and we will work with them to get the procedure for future assistance i.e. to address when you wire in the money that it is from the work remotely (same as in LTR application)- the revenue can cross check with us if they want, don't worry. 

 

If you have any further inquiry or find any obstacles, please let us know so we can address the issue with revenue department on your behalf.

 

Kind regards,
LTR Visa Unit

But the exemption doesn't cover income earned abroad before an LTR visa has been issued.  So the RD inspectors could still go after LTRs who bring in larger amounts to buy condos and ask them to prove they earned the money after they got LTR visas. Since Srettha has said they need to get more tax from foreign sourced income in the interests of fairness and equality, he might decide that maintaining the exemption for one group of expats who are already richer than the others is neither fair nor equal. A Royal Decree can easily be reversed with another Royal Decree without the need for any parliamentary process. 

[SHA 2 BKK]

6 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

But the exemption doesn't cover income earned abroad before an LTR visa has been issued.  So the RD inspectors could still go after LTRs who bring in larger amounts to buy condos and ask them to prove they earned the money after they got LTR visas. Since Srettha has said they need to get more tax from foreign sourced income in the interests of fairness and equality, he might decide that maintaining the exemption for one group of expats who are already richer than the others is neither fair nor equal. A Royal Decree can easily be reversed with another Royal Decree without the need for any parliamentary process. 

Yes.  Anything can be reversed and I guess using your analogy everyone one of us who has spent some years living in Thailand and are tax residents but have relied on the previous interpretations of the tax laws to bring money into Thailand (earned in the previous year) could theoretically be at risk as laws are changed (or interpreted) retrospectively.  
 

There could also be a Royal Decree putting all Rangas (Aussies will know what that means) on the rack. 
 

Personally I can’t see both happening.  
 

Stay safe. 

[moogradod]

6 minutes ago, SHA 2 BKK said:

Yes.  Anything can be reversed ..... as laws are changed (or interpreted) retrospectively.  
...........................................

I believe this cannot happen in any lawful environment. You cannot change any law backwards. This would mean that it would be theoretically possible to double all your taxes ever paid effective from tomorrow and send you a bill over a few millions over the amount thus calculated over the last 30 years.

 

Or send you a traffic ticket for driving on the wrong side (right) of the street yesterday because the law driving on the left side was changed retrospectly. Of course it is possible to change and reverse certain things in laws - like in our current case from Jan 2024 - but not for before that date (backwards).

 

There are countries like North Korea for example where everything might be possible, but only against universal law.

[Hiane]

Long story short : if I plan to stay in Thailand indefinitely, any money I earned in 2022 or before, I should bring it into Thailand before the end of the year.

Correct ?

[fondue zoo]

Anyone manage to listen in on the AMCHAM meeting held some hours ago?

Edited October 4, 2023 by fondue zoo

[stat]

6 hours ago, CTwelve said:

That would make a lot of sense. I mean they have just doubled the cost of an Elite Visa to almost 1 million Baht for 5 years. 

 

Then asking them to then pay income tax on all incoming cash? Ok fine, what other questions about that income are the going to ask?

 

Seems a sure way to basically kill the Elite Visa and drive out wealthy tourists.

 

I am suspecting this is not the intention but who knows.

 

The intention was to create a rush to buy the elite visa and then announce you have to pay income tax ???? So people bought elite visas just before the deadline and after the deadline they released the bad news.

[stat]

6 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

For those interested - I got further replies from that legal/tax firm I have previously mentioned.  I should point out that I disagreed with much of what was stated, and I deliberately asked very provocative questions - I think they are shilling for business from Expats worried about this new tax rule/method.

 

They stated that if you are a tax resident in Thailand and received/earn income abroad, then you have to do a tax return and declare that income.  They stated that even if it has already been taxed in the home country and there is a DTA, you must still lodge a tax return and declare the income no matter how much is involved.

 

They also stated that it is very likely that at some stage in the future Thai Immigration will get involved with this matter and those Expats without a tax clearance/return will have issues getting their 'annual renewal'. 

 

I disagreed and pointed out that according to the Thai RD website you have to complete a tax return IF you have 'taxable income' and are liable to pay income taxes. I pointed out two things:

1. The majority of Thais have never done an annual income tax return (under 150K?);

2. I have no 'taxable income' in Thailand because under the DTA the amount of 'interest' I received in my Super fund in Australia was already taxed in Australia.

 

I pointed out that the 40+ million Thais who earn any income from any job or work, do not complete a taxation return, mainly because they earn less than 150K PA (after deductions, allowances and expenses).

 

I also pointed out that many Expats have bank accounts overseas into which they are paid their pensions and they then transfer them into Thailand from there - immediately or later that week/month.  Those banks pay small amounts of interest, just like the Thai banks do to Thais.  I asked does that mean all foreigners and Thais are required to complete a tax return and declare that $2-5 in interest earnings? 

 

I also stated that because the Age Pension in Australia is listed as 'taxable income' in people's annual tax return statements, does that mean it will be viewed as taxable income by the Thailand RD.  I stated that because it is a Govt Payment it is not taxed (it is a 'tax free' payment), even though the amount paid is over the tax free threshold amount in Australia.  I asked does that mean every Expat receiving a pension is required to complete a Thailand tax return, will Thai RD view that as taxable income, and how will the DTA be applied to that payment.  I also pointed out that there is nowhere on the standard tax return to 'claim' DTA exemptions or how to provide any documents from Aust or what documents are required - so does that mean we will all have to employ a 'tax expert' like yourself to complete our tax returns.  

 

Nothing heard back - and I probably never will. 

 

IMO the best strategy is to wait and see what deveops during 2024. It will be June 2024 before anyone becomes a tax resident of Thailand, and it will probably be later in 2024 that the Thai RD has provided all the details and processes.  A tax return is required to be lodged by end March 2025 - so it will be quite some time after that before the Thai RD starts investigating/chasing people (Thais and Expats). There is lots of time to pack the bags and get out of Dodge if this thing goes sideways. 

Thanks for this info! No way I could file a potential thai tax declaration by end of march as I get my annual tax statements from the banks between April and September.

[redwood1]

3 minutes ago, stat said:

The intention was to create a rush to buy the elite visa and then announce you have to pay income tax ???? So people bought elite visas just before the deadline and after the deadline they released the bad news.

 

Yea.... Anyone who cant see the very very very lucky timing on push for the elite sales before the income announcement , was a set up.....Well they are just dumb...

[stat]

2 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

They could have easily gotten 14 billion a year from a miniscule stock trading levy, but it turns out that, instead, they are targeting people with no lobby, i.e. expats, and Thais making a few hundred baht a year in overseas trading. "Smart" move, Thailand. Not! - I wouldn't be surprised if the resulting damage were much larger than the thousands of baht this will generate.

Ahem there are some expats I know making high 6 digits USD every year with investing, so those are the people that will leave after 6 months.

[stat]

1 hour ago, moogradod said:

I believe this cannot happen in any lawful environment. You cannot change any law backwards. This would mean that it would be theoretically possible to double all your taxes ever paid effective from tomorrow and send you a bill over a few millions over the amount thus calculated over the last 30 years.

 

Or send you a traffic ticket for driving on the wrong side (right) of the street yesterday because the law driving on the left side was changed retrospectly. Of course it is possible to change and reverse certain things in laws - like in our current case from Jan 2024 - but not for before that date (backwards).

 

There are countries like North Korea for example where everything might be possible, but only against universal law.

Trust me it happened in Germany several times. The law in itself is not changed but the interpretation of the law and the moment the gavel drops it is applied retrospectivly. Example: A court declared that having an empty unused appartment in Germany makes you liable to german income tax as you have a permanent abode. Even if you had not been in Germany for 10 years but had an empty appartment you had to pay up. So you had to pay taxes 11 years in arrears if you lived in Thailand like a late friend of mine. Perfectly legal in GERMANY so sure as hell it is possible in Thailand. I would also not recommend to leave Thailand with a tax debt. One diverted plane with you on board could book you a long term stay in a thai prison or some hefty tea money along with the payment of the taxes owed.

Edited October 4, 2023 by stat

[CTwelve]

13 minutes ago, redwood1 said:

 

Yea.... Anyone who cant see the very very very lucky timing on push for the elite sales before the income announcement , was a set up.....Well they are just dumb...

I am fairly certain they are targeting tax evasion loopholes and this issue has been blown up out of proportion.

 

What about those Elite Visa holders who have income from businesses abroad, taxed abroad. Are they going to allow those 'tax residents' to setup and migrate their business to Thailand? I highly doubt it. 

 

I would imagine any income that comes into Thailand that has already been taxed will not be liable again. However, the info that has been released so far has been sketchy at best.

Edited October 4, 2023 by CTwelve

[stat]

5 minutes ago, CTwelve said:

I am fairly certain they are targeting tax evasion loopholes and this issue has been blown up out of proportion.

 

What about those Elite Visa holders who have income from businesses abroad, taxed abroad. Are they going to allow those 'tax residents' to setup and migrate their business to Thailand? I very highly doubt it. 

 

I would imagine any income that comes into Thailand that has already been taxed will not be liable again. However, the info that has been released so far has been sketchy at best.

If you could be liable for millions of USD in taxes you simply do not take this (albeit very low) risk.

[retiree]

56 minutes ago, Hiane said:

Long story short : if I plan to stay in Thailand indefinitely, any money I earned in 2022 or before, I should bring it into Thailand before the end of the year.

Correct ?

One would think so.   Or simply keep a copy of your bank statement, have future withdrawals match any remittance to Thailand, and put 2023 and future income into a separate account. 

Edited October 4, 2023 by retiree

[CTwelve]

28 minutes ago, stat said:

If you could be liable for millions of USD in taxes you simply do not take this (albeit very low) risk.

I agree, but those same people can easily avoid such problems by staying out of the country for half a year. 

 

Let's wait and see what actually happens. I suspect it will be an additional declaration form at the annual visa renewal counter and the concierge will swiftly bundle you through with very little questioning.

 

If I am wrong then there's going to be an incredible amount of work for the Thai Inland Revenue service making endless paper trails for the estimated 5-6 million foreigners who live there.

 

It will also drive out all external wealth / investment coming into the country and nobody will touch the Elite Visa with a bargepole.

 

Edited October 4, 2023 by CTwelve

[StayinThailand2much]

1 hour ago, stat said:

Ahem there are some expats I know making high 6 digits USD every year with investing, so those are the people that will leave after 6 months.

I was referring to an article from BP that talked about 'the average Thai overseas investor just making a few hundred baht from such investments'... Anyhow, even if I made 6-digit USD every year, I wouldn't want the Thai revenue department laying their greedy hands on my money, as soon as it reached my bank account, either. Making that kind of money, I'd probably pick and choose, perhaps just spending a couple weeks or months a year in Thailand and, in the future, transfer zilch...

Edited October 4, 2023 by StayinThailand2much

[Hiane]

52 minutes ago, retiree said:

One would think so.   Or simply keep a copy of your bank statement, have future withdrawals match any remittance to Thailand, and put 2023 and future income into a separate account. 

Maybe I wasn't specific enough, I'm talking about offshore money that hasn't been taxed. As I understand, until the end of this year I can remit it into Thailand tax-free, and starting January 1st 2024 this won't be the case anymore ?

 

[retiree]

2 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Making that kind of money, I'd probably pick and choose,

Folks with plenty o' plenty,

They got a lock on the door,

'Fraid somebody's gonna rob 'em while,

They're out a'making' more ....